Final Fantasy looks to be in serious trouble.

https://www.ign.com/articles/square-enix-admits-final-fantasy-16-and-7-rebirth-profits-did-not-meet-our-expectations

And seriously they hit everything but the point.

They blame cannibalism, but fans would buy both games. They blame exclusivity, but so far the Steam launch of FFXVI is tepid. And poor marketing cannot be blamed here unlike say Visions of Mana and other games they released because Rebirth hype was very strong in the media.

The real problem is lack of appeal, a problem that is not easily fixed and could be fatal for the franchise. Square Enix doesn't get this. And with the PS brand crashing and burning in Japan, competitors just bringing out games with more appeal, and much of the fanbase alienated, there is no real fix for this. Single player FF is not a powerhouse anymore.

Phony just needs to Pony up mooaar $$$$$$$$$$$$ for keeping the games off Xbox. lol :P

Things continue to look dire for PlayStation :(

Why am I not surprised at WHO made this thread?

TC nailed it. Final Fantasy isn’t what it used to be. The younger generations don’t have the nostalgia for the series, and those who grew up loving the series have jobs/kids/things to do besides playing a long ass RPG. So dressing FF7 up, and spending hundreds of millions of dollars on production and marketing isn’t going to yield the return they think it is.

And this game serves as yet another example of releasing games on PC not moving the needle. PC folks are over there doing their own thing. They don’t want all your console games. Putting console games on phones isn’t doing anything either.

What? Another game didn't meet Square's expectations?

I was a fan of the series but didn't buy FF16, it didn't feel like an FF game to me, or at least not what I wanted out of one. I don't really even want to play it. FF15 wasn't that great either IMO and 16 strayed even further.

FF7:R is a lot better than those attempts and I enjoyed the first one more than I thought so I will probably pick that up. I still want a more traditional FF game though, hopefully that's what they do next.

Oh no.

Anyway..

100% on Square Enix.

Sony did what they thought would help their platform. Sure, it didn't do what they hoped, but still a great investment.

Stop signing exclusivity deals in this climate. Sony didn't FORCE you to limit your potential profits, you agreed to it

Good thing they are waking up.

PC and Xbox will easily move the needle when it is day and date. When it's years later, the demand plummets. Just like Helldivers 2 on PC decimated PS5.

May never see another Final Fantasy game ever remade on such a grand scale as FFVII again sadly but I’m incredibly happy that we were able to get something like FFVII Remake, FFVII Rebirth, and the upcoming third part.

I’ve been a fan of the series since day one on the NES and the original FFVII is easily one of my all time favourites. I’m amazed at how great the remaking of this game has turned out so far. FFVII Rebirth isn’t just my favourite FF game to date or my GotY for 2024 but it’s my favourite game of all time. Wish they’d hurry up and put it on other platforms so more people can enjoy this game.

Also did quite enjoy FFXVI. Thought the grittier story was interesting. The combat was great and it had a bunch of fantastic boss fights.

Helldivers 2 was the perfect PC game. A single player FF game won’t do that on PC. And Xbox… I’ll just leave that alone.

And let’s not forget Squares delusional expectations. They out here thinking their Rockstar or something.

This was already explained and talked about. The original FF7 Remake was released at the tail end of the PS4’s lifecycle when it had 100+million console units. This is another recycled news bit meant to garner clicks.

@kvallyx: Helldivers 2 is a MP focused game and those tend to have a higher appeal on PC. I doubt a same day release single player game would fare better on PC than on PS

Mad that Xbox has games?

None that sold better than Astro Bot apparently

Signs were there in how it performed. It launched very well, but had a weak tail.

Cows are only interested in cod, Minecraft,sea of thieves and fallout.

Personally I have had a very checkered run with FF. Loved 7, hated 8. Keep bouncing off 9 but liked it. No interest in 10 or 11. Bounced off 12 too but got quite a ways in. No too keen on the 13 games. No to 14. 15 is on the backlog. Enjoyed 7 remake and am looking forward to rebirth. Reunion is installed on my PC, just need to start it. Tried the demo of 16 and no! Soo many cutscenes...it doesn't stop! I also have 6 on the backlog: apparently a classic.

So yeah: some class games and a lot of meh too. Square may need to put a cap on the costs though. The productions are clearly quite large. They may be best pegging the tech to the Switch 2 and focus on better ideas and execution instead. Also multiplat day 1 Square...what are you doing?

I'll say this, if they ever come to Xbox I won't be jumping on them after having waited so long. I'll wait for Game Pass or for a substantial holiday sale.

How about releasing games people actually want to play? Just a thought.

FF has been bad for pretty much two decades (I don't really count 14 as it's an MMO)

I am more interested in playing games. Quantity sold doesn’t do anything for me.

Ok, well if we’re talking quality, Astro Bot > Hellblade 2.

Opinion noted.

Must be because of Gamepass or being too woke.

This is probably the biggest thing. Sure, going mulitplat day one would help, build hype and spend their marketing money on everyone all at once instead of on one group at a time. But really, Square has had trouble aligning their expectations with reality for over a decade at this point.

Edit: 2 major FF games within a few months of each other was also stupid.

Their big FF releases need to be on the Switch 2; it would make a world of a difference. The IP simply isn't big enough to only be on PlayStation and PC.

@Nonstop-Madness: They could make a "Pocket" version like they did for FF15 for mobile and Switch, it seemed to be well received on those platforms.

I'm in this boat actually. I'm interested in the game but wasn't going to spend half a grand on a console to play it so I waited on the PC release, and quickly forgot about it. I just noticed last night that the game released on PC, player reviews say it's optimized extremely well, and it released at $50. That's a great release that fell under the radar because it tied itself down to a single console.

PC gamers will pay for console games as well lol, it's more like console gamers don't want their games on PC. Case in point: Sony made $250 million in game sales on PC in one fiscal year. Last of Us 2 was one of Sony's most expensive games ever to develop, and it cost $220 million and six years to make.

May never see a JRPG in general made on this kind of scale again considering nothing ever meets Square's expectations.

I have to be very selective with RPGs considering the time commitment they require, but I really want to try and get through these. Or at the very least, play the best one and look up a story synopsis of the other two. Especially with someone like you, a guy who has played through so many games in his life, calling Rebirth the best game of all time. Better than even Chrono Trigger. Shit, I can't ignore that.

Here's a list of games that has met Square's expectations:

I will never understand why they went exclusive with FF VII and FF XVI. As a PS4/5 owner, I would rather see this on other platforms to raise the sales to ensure the developer made what was needed to ensure the series stays important to them. It seems like just leaving money on the table by releasing it only on one platform.

Does any game ever meet their expectations?

@judaspete: Yeah, I had a fantastic time with FFVII Rebirth. Loved what they’re doing with the story so far. Combat is a blast. Massive game with tons of stuff to do. That may put off some though with all the mini games and what not but I loved it. Queen’s Blood is the best mini game the franchise has had. Could actually be it’s own game.

Isn't this old? What were their expectations?

Agree on most points (except I started as a fan since the PS1 not the NES; I'm not that hardcore even though I did go back and play most of the older titles)

Rebirth definitely isn't my favourite game of all time but I absolutely loved the effort and heart put into it. They tried so damn hard and while it has some serious low points I'd take it over safe more uniform games any day. Rebirth is definitely my goty. There is something really depressing about the market rejecting it and I really don't think releasing on all platforms would help. The fanbase is likely to be concentrated on Playstation anyways and I'd expect the sales made up for a day 1 pc release are probably similar to the amount of money brought in by sony's moneyhat anyways.

Switch 2 could move the needle though.

I think a huge thing to help would be rebranding the 3rd entry in the trilogy to Final Fantasy XVII. I think a lot of people bought Remake, then didn't finish it and thus wouldn't buy rebirth because it's existence is like a reminder that you haven't gotten around to finishing remake yet. Just freeing themselves of that burden in the title might be enough to eek a few more sales. Also calling the 3rd remake game XVII kind of fits because the title would still have a seven in it so it works aesthetically. Also the budget and scale of these remake entries is each mainline worthy.

They already did something similar with FF Versus XIII to FF XV so there's some precident.

FF16 sold 3 million in its first month. They need a reality check. Not everything is going to hit 10+ million copies.

FF needs to go back to its more RPG like roots. The FF-fantasy is quite appealing with the chocobos, moogles and cactuars. And iconic jobs like Black Mage and Red Mage... yet they keep distancing themselves from everything like that. To end up making what is ultimately fairly generic products.

FF14 maintains the spirit of the franchise and sees great success thanks to it. SE should replicate what people love about FF, rather than make random games and then slap the FF label on them.

1. Party Based combat, make it either ATB, RTwP or Turn Based.
2. Give it the FF11 job system.
3. Give players the tools to customize their own playstyle.
4. Consider WRPG'ifying the game. Let players create their own protagonist like in 11 and 14 (the 2 most commercially successful FF games), then have 8 companions or so,
5. Give players plenty of side quests to do.

Basically, if they are making FF17, give it the Fire Emblem Awakening treatment. Make an effort to bring in everything people loved in the first place.

FF16 just released on PC. Despite being a new AAA release, it is 7th place.

@Maroxad: Looks like Dragon Quest did things the right way. Hopefully Square's FF team will learn from the Enix side.

I hope 16 sells well on steam, but if I am honest, I am much more interesting in their hd 2d games. I find them just much more appealing.

Hopefully we will see FF8, FF9 and FF10 remaked or sequels

But is he wrong though?

All they have to do is stop allowing Sony to buy exclusivity. I don't buy their games even when they do come to Xbox because of their shitty exclusivity deals with Sony.

They treat me like a second-class citizen I will return the favour and not buy their games whenever they do decide to put one on Xbox.

And to be honest FF is a boring franchise now. That and they have taken remakes to stupid levels by expecting the public to buy 3 remakes of the same game broken up in bits and filled to the brim with filler.

Also turning 16 into a hack n slash game to try and capitalise on the current genre craze with the likes of Olden Ring was just silly.

@Maroxad: I think you are looking at your country steam sales, at a global level, it's second now, and it was first yesterday.

@Naylord: Yeah they definitely put a ton of effort, heart, and soul into Final Fantasy VII Remake and Rebirth and it really shows.

While you make an interesting case for the third game in the trilogy to be Final Fantasy XVII I don’t really think that would be a good idea. Best just to keep all three together as their own thing. Much easier for consumers to follow and understand. Plus I think they’ll want to sell them as a package after all is said and done.

A port for the Switch 2 would very likely sell quite well.

Sony fannies not buying games is the problem.🤷‍♂️

It's almost like people are kind of tired of the same shit, year after year, coming from the same franchises from the same companies.

But...that couldn't be true. That'd be preposterous...wouldn't it?!

@mrbojangles25: So in other words, Sony fannies not buying games.😏

Wellllll...

...Yes, I s'pose so.

@mrbojangles25: 😂

Some day they gonna tell what those expectations were and why they were set that high... i'm sure.

How would bringing the game to xbox solve the problem? Xbots buy and play FF games even less. Significantly less. Only a tenth. So instead of 7.000.000, it would be 7.700.000. Well, maybe they expected to hit that number, because it has two 7s.

Rebirth is hardly the same shit year after year. I guess it got a bit of an Ubislop injection but the core gameplay, story and overall heart and effort in the game isn't the type of thing we see much these days.

I think the failure is just being a sequel to a remake. the remake 1 gets people to buy it because they liked the first, BUT they have to have beaten it in order for this game to be bought. It's existence is merely a reminder to the casual FF enjoyer that "oh shit I still need to finish remake part 1"