GTA IV delay --- It is because of the Xbox 360

I think RockStar having to make a huge streaming world with no load times run smoothly on a no-hardrive 360 on a DVD9is actually hurting the quality of the overall game. I'm sure they are having no problems with the PS3 version of GTA IV. Yes, apparently PS3 is a pain to develop for. So? So was the PS2 compared to the other consoles from what I've read. Developers get used to it. PS3 might be hard to develop for, but it doesn't hold the developers back. Yes, I think the 360 is holding RockStar back. I'm sure RockStar has had plenty of time to get used to the architecture of the PS3. What RockStar is not used to is having to compress, compress, compress some more and worry about whether their games will run smoothly. I'm sure they are having this very concern with the 360 version of GTA IV.

This is what they have to do to get GTA IV to run smoothly on the 360. This is why there is a delay, just like there was a delay with Oblivion. Oblivion had plenty of load times, and Bethesda still had problems getting this game to run smoothly. Lots and lots of fade in on the 360 version when it 1st released. Lots of framerate issues as well. Now, imagine a game that is a huge streaming world with no load times at all trying to run on a harddrive-less 360. It has to be horribly difficult to accomplish this. Sure, it can and will be done and GTA IV will finally release. But don't think for a second that the PS3 version of this game is the main reason for the delay. Blame the 360 folks.

You have to ask what you think is more difficult for a developer. Learningdifferent coding to make a game for the PS3, or having tocompress a game over and over, learn many different graphical tricks to make a game run smoothly, make a game run on no harddrive, and make a game fit on a DVD9. Now, which sounds more difficult...

*Puts up big flame shield.* And yes, I've made a similar thread to this acouple ofmonths ago.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=27326

Analyst Michael Pachter believes Rockstar has delayed the release of Grand Theft Auto IV because it is struggling with development on the PlayStation 3.

And the Xbox 360 version of the game has suffered at least a six month delay as a result, due to contractual obligations that will have prevented the publisher from releasing the game first on Microsoft's machine, says the analyst.

Saint's Row and Crackdown are proof 360 can handle games like these while there is no similar game on the PS3. Even with use of cel shading for the citizens and main characters Crackdown still pulls off a pretty impressive cityscape and Saint's Row was obviously rushed a bit but it's extremely playable even with all the graphical problems.

I think RockStar having to make a huge streaming world with no load times run smoothly on a no-hardrive 360 on a DVD9is actually hurting the quality of the overall game. I'm sure they are having no problems with the PS3 version of GTA IV. Yes, apparently PS3 is a pain to develop for. So? So was the PS2 compared to the other consoles from what I've read. Developers get used to it. PS3 might be hard to develop for, but it doesn't hold the developers back. Yes, I think the 360 is holding RockStar back. I'm sure RockStar has had plenty of time to get used to the architecture of the PS3. What RockStar is not used to is having to compress, compress, compress some more and worry about whether their games will run smoothly. I'm sure they are having this very concern with the 360 version of GTA IV.

This is what they have to do to get GTA IV to run smoothly on the 360. This is why there is a delay, just like there was a delay with Oblivion. Oblivion had plenty of load times, and Bethesda still had problems getting this game to run smoothly. Lots and lots of fade in on the 360 version when it 1st released. Lots of framerate issues as well. Now, imagine a game that is a huge streaming world with no load times at all trying to run on a harddrive-less 360. It has to be horribly difficult to accomplish this. Sure, it can and will be done and GTA IV will finally release. But don't think for a second that the PS3 version of this game is the main reason for the delay. Blame the 360 folks.

You have to ask what you think is more difficult for a developer. Learningdifferent coding to make a game for the PS3, or having tocompress a game over and over, learn many different graphical tricks to make a game run smoothly, make a game run on no harddrive, and make a game fit on a DVD9. Now, which sounds more difficult...

*Puts up big flame shield.* And yes, I've made a similar thread to this acouple ofmonths ago.

AvIdGaMeR444

i could probably ride with yah until i read the BS about Obilvion. Oblivion is rated higher on the 360, making it the better game. so that kind of killed ur whole lil thing there in itself.if any of that was true Oblivion on the ps3 would be hailed as the better version. and like the guy said, MS ok'd it being hard drive required...which isn't a big deal to buy one for GTA4. in a business sense, great move by MS. even added a cherry on top with the DLC in the future.

How can it be fact when the first 2 words in your post are "I think"? Plus, several sources have already confirmed that the PS3 development was the reason GTA4 was being pushed back.

I like to see how Rockstar will try to top Crackdown or Saints Row, GTAIV will flop.c_smithii

Wanna bet?

Crackdown and Saints Row say NO to your wild cow theories.

Crackdowns graphics and draw distance still STUN-WOW me to this day!

I don't see why there'd be a space problem when both console have harddrives. I mean, even if the DVD9 was insufficient, couldn't they just require the gamer to download some content? Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't DVD9 used with Xbox games? They're starting to be downloadables now. I remember GTASA had no loading times because it streamed off the disc, but wouldn't streaming from a HDD be, in theory, quicker? Also, it's not like there's be issues with HDD space when both consoles have harddrives well over 100GB.theheavydrinker

^Microsoft is making Rockstar make the game so it only fits on the DVD, to accustom the people who dont have the hardrive 360, the core users.

I do believe its the 360's fault, Assassins Creed was done on PS3, the "cell hard to develop for" crap is done already, a big company like Rockstar should already have it figured out, the more logical reasoning for the delay is simply trying to fit it all on the dvd without the kinda problems Mass Effect had, thanks for the downgrade Microsoft.

one thing dont fit in your theory all the footage of gtaIV show by rockstar was running on the 360 !legol1

+1

[QUOTE="AvIdGaMeR444"]

I think RockStar having to make a huge streaming world with no load times run smoothly on a no-hardrive 360 on a DVD9is actually hurting the quality of the overall game. I'm sure they are having no problems with the PS3 version of GTA IV. Yes, apparently PS3 is a pain to develop for. So? So was the PS2 compared to the other consoles from what I've read. Developers get used to it. PS3 might be hard to develop for, but it doesn't hold the developers back. Yes, I think the 360 is holding RockStar back. I'm sure RockStar has had plenty of time to get used to the architecture of the PS3. What RockStar is not used to is having to compress, compress, compress some more and worry about whether their games will run smoothly. I'm sure they are having this very concern with the 360 version of GTA IV.

This is what they have to do to get GTA IV to run smoothly on the 360. This is why there is a delay, just like there was a delay with Oblivion. Oblivion had plenty of load times, and Bethesda still had problems getting this game to run smoothly. Lots and lots of fade in on the 360 version when it 1st released. Lots of framerate issues as well. Now, imagine a game that is a huge streaming world with no load times at all trying to run on a harddrive-less 360. It has to be horribly difficult to accomplish this. Sure, it can and will be done and GTA IV will finally release. But don't think for a second that the PS3 version of this game is the main reason for the delay. Blame the 360 folks.

You have to ask what you think is more difficult for a developer. Learningdifferent coding to make a game for the PS3, or having tocompress a game over and over, learn many different graphical tricks to make a game run smoothly, make a game run on no harddrive, and make a game fit on a DVD9. Now, which sounds more difficult...

*Puts up big flame shield.* And yes, I've made a similar thread to this acouple ofmonths ago.

ChartTopper93

i could probably ride with yah until i read the BS about Obilvion. Oblivion is rated higher on the 360, making it the better game. so that kind of killed ur whole lil thing there in itself.if any of that was true Oblivion on the ps3 would be hailed as the better version. and like the guy said, MS ok'd it being hard drive required...which isn't a big deal to buy one for GTA4. in a business sense, great move by MS. even added a cherry on top with the DLC in the future.

i think its because the of the ps3 because it is way harder to develope games for the ps3 then the xbox360.
but if the developers werent in such a rush they would also be able to make ot better graphics then the x360/

I'm not sure if the delay was caused by the 360 but like lazyboy said, GTAIV would of been much better if it was PS3 exclusive.butteater86

Just like all the timeless PS3 exclusives so far, right ? :roll:

[QUOTE="theheavydrinker"]I don't see why there'd be a space problem when both console have harddrives. I mean, even if the DVD9 was insufficient, couldn't they just require the gamer to download some content? Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't DVD9 used with Xbox games? They're starting to be downloadables now. I remember GTASA had no loading times because it streamed off the disc, but wouldn't streaming from a HDD be, in theory, quicker? Also, it's not like there's be issues with HDD space when both consoles have harddrives well over 100GB.shadyd1717

^Microsoft is making Rockstar make the game so it only fits on the DVD, to accustom the people who dont have the hardrive 360, the core users.

I do believe its the 360's fault, Assassins Creed was done on PS3, the "cell hard to develop for" crap is done already, a big company like Rockstar should already have it figured out, the more logical reasoning for the delay is simply trying to fit it all on the dvd without the kinda problems Mass Effect had, thanks for the downgrade Microsoft.

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developement.

And how does the framerate and texture pop-ins have anything to do with the disc format? It's the Unreal Engine.

Thanks for the post blind fanboy.

key word "i think"Sir-Conker

but everyone knows that the ps3 is more powerful then the x360
plus its cheaperthen getting an xbox360

[QUOTE="shadyd1717"]

[QUOTE="theheavydrinker"]I don't see why there'd be a space problem when both console have harddrives. I mean, even if the DVD9 was insufficient, couldn't they just require the gamer to download some content? Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't DVD9 used with Xbox games? They're starting to be downloadables now. I remember GTASA had no loading times because it streamed off the disc, but wouldn't streaming from a HDD be, in theory, quicker? Also, it's not like there's be issues with HDD space when both consoles have harddrives well over 100GB.thirstychainsaw

^Microsoft is making Rockstar make the game so it only fits on the DVD, to accustom the people who dont have the hardrive 360, the core users.

I do believe its the 360's fault, Assassins Creed was done on PS3, the "cell hard to develop for" crap is done already, a big company like Rockstar should already have it figured out, the more logical reasoning for the delay is simply trying to fit it all on the dvd without the kinda problems Mass Effect had, thanks for the downgrade Microsoft.

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developement.

yer because it is easy to make games on the 360 cause it has no real potential

whatevas inside the 360 wont last long that why there already bringing out another freakin console with things build in cause ppl were like wtf i dnt want all these add ons around my 360

I highly doubt that DVD9 is holding back the X360. In addition, the lack of a harddrive is meaningless for consoles. If a single game can't fit in RAM, virtual RAM on harddrive will be ineffective. For a single program, loading data to the harddrive only improves the file access time, not size of available RAM.

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developementAnd how does the framerate and texture pop-ins have anything to do with the disc format? It's the Unreal Engine.

Thanks for the post blind fanboy.

[QUOTE="Sir-Conker"]key word "i think"bufu21

but everyone knows that the ps3 is more powerful then the x360
plus its cheaperthen getting an xbox360

Everyone knows the ps3 is more powerful??? good one!

Since when a computer with more processing power and a lesser graphic card runs game better than a computer with lesser processing power BUT better graphic card??? considering both have sufficient processing power for today's game...

The PS3 is like a racing car with skateboard wheels... lol

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developementAnd how does the framerate and texture pop-ins have anything to do with the disc format? It's the Unreal Engine.

Thanks for the post blind fanboy.shadyd1717

lol @ blind fanboy, I have nothing against the 360 until it comes to stuff like this where I feel like dvd is holding back developers, well I wouldnt say holding back 100%, but its making them work harder to try to compress it, which shouldnt have to happen when Blu Ray is available to do as they wish, even if it costs more.

If Assassins Creed, Oblivion, Fight Night, and Rainbow Six was fine if not better on the PS3, then theres no such thing as "hard to develop for" stuff, Rockstar is making a game bigger then all of those combined, I honestly dont believe programming is as big a problem as fitting everything from a next-gen game on the same disc that San Andreas almost took up.

Nope rainbow six is a horrible example...super late and with crappier graphics... check on any website...

I think

AvIdGaMeR444

You have no idea why the game is delayed.

[QUOTE="theheavydrinker"]I don't see why there'd be a space problem when both console have harddrives. I mean, even if the DVD9 was insufficient, couldn't they just require the gamer to download some content? Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't DVD9 used with Xbox games? They're starting to be downloadables now. I remember GTASA had no loading times because it streamed off the disc, but wouldn't streaming from a HDD be, in theory, quicker? Also, it's not like there's be issues with HDD space when both consoles have harddrives well over 100GB.shadyd1717

^Microsoft is making Rockstar make the game so it only fits on the DVD, to accustom the people who dont have the hardrive 360, the core users.

I do believe its the 360's fault, Assassins Creed was done on PS3, the "cell hard to develop for" crap is done already, a big company like Rockstar should already have it figured out, the more logical reasoning for the delay is simply trying to fit it all on the dvd without the kinda problems Mass Effect had, thanks for the downgrade Microsoft.

Well the game is almost 100% being shown on the 360.

Wow it looks awful.

NOT!

The game will be good and all the haters will find yet another reason to hate!

Nope rainbow six is a horrible example...super late and with crappier graphics... check on any website...

one thing dont fit in your theory all the footage of gtaIV show by rockstar was running on the 360 !legol1

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developementAnd how does the framerate and texture pop-ins have anything to do with the disc format? It's the Unreal Engine.

Thanks for the post blind fanboy.shadyd1717

lol @ blind fanboy, I have nothing against the 360 until it comes to stuff like this where I feel like dvd is holding back developers, well I wouldnt say holding back 100%, but its making them work harder to try to compress it, which shouldnt have to happen when Blu Ray is available to do as they wish, even if it costs more.

If Assassins Creed, Oblivion, Fight Night, and Rainbow Six was fine if not better on the PS3, then theres no such thing as "hard to develop for" stuff, Rockstar is making a game bigger then all of those combined, I honestly dont believe programming is as big a problem as fitting everything from a next-gen game on the same disc that San Andreas almost took up.

You do know San Andreas for the Xbox was only 3.5 gb because of various compression methods the Xbox was capable of that the PS2 wasn't, right?

I think RockStar having to make a huge streaming world with no load times run smoothly on a no-hardrive 360 on a DVD9is actually hurting the quality of the overall game. I'm sure they are having no problems with the PS3 version of GTA IV. Yes, apparently PS3 is a pain to develop for. So? So was the PS2 compared to the other consoles from what I've read. Developers get used to it. PS3 might be hard to develop for, but it doesn't hold the developers back. Yes, I think the 360 is holding RockStar back. I'm sure RockStar has had plenty of time to get used to the architecture of the PS3. What RockStar is not used to is having to compress, compress, compress some more and worry about whether their games will run smoothly. I'm sure they are having this very concern with the 360 version of GTA IV.

This is what they have to do to get GTA IV to run smoothly on the 360. This is why there is a delay, just like there was a delay with Oblivion. Oblivion had plenty of load times, and Bethesda still had problems getting this game to run smoothly. Lots and lots of fade in on the 360 version when it 1st released. Lots of framerate issues as well. Now, imagine a game that is a huge streaming world with no load times at all trying to run on a harddrive-less 360. It has to be horribly difficult to accomplish this. Sure, it can and will be done and GTA IV will finally release. But don't think for a second that the PS3 version of this game is the main reason for the delay. Blame the 360 folks.

You have to ask what you think is more difficult for a developer. Learningdifferent coding to make a game for the PS3, or having tocompress a game over and over, learn many different graphical tricks to make a game run smoothly, make a game run on no harddrive, and make a game fit on a DVD9. Now, which sounds more difficult...

*Puts up big flame shield.* And yes, I've made a similar thread to this acouple ofmonths ago.

AvIdGaMeR444

Nope, if anything the PS3 is holding it back.

All GTA4 footage has been running on the 360 plus Rockstar stated the 360 version was 2 weeks ahead in developementAnd how does the framerate and texture pop-ins have anything to do with the disc format? It's the Unreal Engine.

Thanks for the post blind fanboy.shadyd1717

lol @ blind fanboy, I have nothing against the 360 until it comes to stuff like this where I feel like dvd is holding back developers, well I wouldnt say holding back 100%, but its making them work harder to try to compress it, which shouldnt have to happen when Blu Ray is available to do as they wish, even if it costs more.

If Assassins Creed, Oblivion, Fight Night, and Rainbow Six was fine if not better on the PS3, then theres no such thing as "hard to develop for" stuff, Rockstar is making a game bigger then all of those combined, I honestly dont believe programming is as big a problem as fitting everything from a next-gen game on the same disc that San Andreas almost took up.

Filled up? GTA: SA is only 4.7GB. Both versions textures would have to be compressed to save RAM and I guess compressing data is a whole lot easier than programming for the PS3 since the 360 version was two weeks ahead.

Filled up? GTA: SA is only 4.7GB. Both versions textures would have to be compressed to save RAM and I guess compressing data is a whole lot easier than programming for the PS3 since the 360 version was two weeks ahead.

You know what? Who actually cares, the game got delayed, deal with it. GazzaB

Because caring about things no one else on the planet cares about is System Wars contribution to humanity.

[QUOTE="locopatho"]Could be disc size of 360 or complicated PS3. We don't know do we....WuTangG

Dude, I am sick of reading your posts, just stop it.

Nope rainbow six is a horrible example...super late and with crappier graphics... check on any website...shadyd1717

k? i said fine, i didnt say with Crysis graphics, that still doesnt excuse oblivion, assassins creed, and fight night

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=27326

Analyst Michael Pachter believes Rockstar has delayed the release of Grand Theft Auto IV because it is struggling with development on the PlayStation 3.

And the Xbox 360 version of the game has suffered at least a six month delay as a result, due to contractual obligations that will have prevented the publisher from releasing the game first on Microsoft's machine, says the analyst.

Yellow_Rose

well that was quick..

Filled up? GTA: SA is only 4.7GB. Both versions textures would have to be compressed to save RAM and I guess compressing data is a whole lot easier than programming for the PS3 since the 360 version was two weeks ahead.shadyd1717

If it was 4.7 why did it need to be dual layer =/

No clue, I'm going by the hard drive install space needed for the PC version.

Just my two-cents, but I think that the real reason for the delay has more to do with R* waiting for Sony to sell more PS3's over the past Holiday Season so they can release to a larger installed-base.

It's possible - no, make that highly likely - that GTA4 has been ready to ship for both consoles for some time now.

Also, I believe that MGS4 has likely been finished for many months - they too, have just been waiting for Sony to sell more consoles...

okay, so maybe that's more like five-cents...