History Lesson on FPS games before Half Life

Half Life basically allowed first person shooter games to take themselves seriously. Before HL almost all shooters with very few exceptions compensated by being either very arcade influenced being level orientated and jumping you straight into the action without a precursor level featuring lots of power ups and a rigid hierarchy of weapons and enemies leading up to a predictable end game boss, or they where all of those things plus a bit of camp humour. Personally I preferred the latter category.

The sad thing about shooters post-Half Life is that the idea of a first person shooter that does not take itself very seriously has all but died. To give you an example of a shooter with a bit of tounge in cheek see Shadow Warrior. Made by 3D realms who also created Duke Nukem 3D along with it's follow up legacy of non-funny third person sequels.

Luckily pre-Half Life arcade shooters are still around, like Pain Killer and Serious Sam. But the extra mile of making an game humerus like Redneck Rampage is a lost art. Game reviewers began to clamp down on games that didn't take themselves seriously once the new breed of serious, story driven shooter started to emerge.

If a developer made a first person shooter that favoured entertaining the player using humour rather than immersian, would you find it possible to hype yourself for that game?

I disagree. Quake 2 came out before Half-Life, and has very advanced level design, one of the best I've seen in any game. It only had a few bosses, and the level required you to use your mind an re-tread various areas, with some levels being massive hubs for several other areas, and having power plants, mining areas, prison areas and everything. No game has yet to surpass Quake 2 level design, and it was pre-Half Life.

But yeah, meaningless shotters are fun, but meaningless.

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

Most definitely, which is why I'm always hyped about games from id. In the current trend of slow-moving "realistic" shooters, they constantly make fast-paced in-your-face games. In fact, playing Doom3 nowadays makes it feel more novel than the now-popular Halo/CoD-type games. The story may be shallow, but it's one hell of a ride.

I guess peeps like us are lucky Quake Live is coming soon (Quake3 is still the "purest" deathmatch game, sorry UT2004), and that id already said Rage will have their typical "fun over function" style. Games like that will probably never have the same hayday as they once did, but there will always be people who just want to frag.

I disagree. Quake 2 came out before Half-Life, and has very advanced level design, one of the best I've seen in any game. It only had a few bosses, and the level required you to use your mind an re-tread various areas, with some levels being massive hubs for several other areas, and having power plants, mining areas, prison areas and everything. No game has yet to surpass Quake 2 level design, and it was pre-Half Life.

But yeah, meaningless shotters are fun, but meaningless.

ClawKiller

Yeah Quake 2 was one of the exceptions. It also innovated graphics being the first game to use fully rendered environments. I do not think it innovated level design quite as much as Half Life did though, and it still had things like floating weapons and secrets hidden under stairs that videogame developers would not use by todays standards.

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

-GhostMLD-

Actually game developers still use many of the standards that where set by Half Life. It was a ground breaking moment in the genre on a scale that has never been repeated.

It's sad though, since videogame humour was proven to be classic in 1991 when The Secret of Monkey Island first came out.

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

-GhostMLD-

Actually, I think many FPSs could take a hint from that "old gameplay". Halo destroyed the idea of carrying around many weapons, which leaves fun weapons out of the question on the idea of carrying functional and borring weapons in pure want of realism. Many FPSs now try to include gimmicks like slow motion and crazy suits to cover up for their poor enemy design and craptacular repetition.

Finally, bosses contribute quite a lot to a game, it really gives the player motivation to reach the end, as oppose to games that have a final level consisting of 20 of the same enemy you've been fighting for the last 10 hours.

[QUOTE="ClawKiller"]

I disagree. Quake 2 came out before Half-Life, and has very advanced level design, one of the best I've seen in any game. It only had a few bosses, and the level required you to use your mind an re-tread various areas, with some levels being massive hubs for several other areas, and having power plants, mining areas, prison areas and everything. No game has yet to surpass Quake 2 level design, and it was pre-Half Life.

But yeah, meaningless shotters are fun, but meaningless.

Tony-Harrison

Yeah Quake 2 was one of the exceptions. It also innovated graphics being the first game to use fully rendered environments. I do not think it innovated level design quite as much as Half Life did though, and it still had things like floating weapons and secrets hidden under stairs that videogame developers would not use by todays standards.

And it's story still played last in line to everything else, being told through simple logs instead of interactive npcs and such. The idea of a scripted sequence was still not around.

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

-GhostMLD-

Half Life 2?

[QUOTE="-GhostMLD-"]

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

kittykatz5k

Actually, I think many FPSs could take a hint from that "old gameplay". Halo destroyed the idea of carrying around many weapons, which leaves fun weapons out of the question on the idea of carrying functional and borring weapons in pure want of realism. Many FPSs now try to include gimmicks like slow motion and crazy suits to cover up for their poor enemy design and craptacular repetition.

Finally, bosses contribute quite a lot to a game, it really gives the player motivation to reach the end, as oppose to games that have a final level consisting of 20 of the same enemy you've been fighting for the last 10 hours.

Most underrated FPS of all-time:

[QUOTE="-GhostMLD-"]

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

kittykatz5k

Actually, I think many FPSs could take a hint from that "old gameplay". Halo destroyed the idea of carrying around many weapons, which leaves fun weapons out of the question on the idea of carrying functional and borring weapons in pure want of realism. Many FPSs now try to include gimmicks like slow motion and crazy suits to cover up for their poor enemy design and craptacular repetition.

Finally, bosses contribute quite a lot to a game, it really gives the player motivation to reach the end, as oppose to games that have a final level consisting of 20 of the same enemy you've been fighting for the last 10 hours.

Bungie was only trying to be realistic with making two weapons, while also balancing the gameplay. I like the idea, but I do miss games where you could reek absolute havoc with 20 weapons :D

Most underrated FPS of all-time:

Zeliard9

Don't hot link duuuuuuuuuuuuuude.

[QUOTE="kittykatz5k"][QUOTE="-GhostMLD-"]

ok so half life kick started the genre.

now, its gameplay is too oldschool and doesnt contribute to the growth of the fps gameplay.

TMontana1004

Actually, I think many FPSs could take a hint from that "old gameplay". Halo destroyed the idea of carrying around many weapons, which leaves fun weapons out of the question on the idea of carrying functional and borring weapons in pure want of realism. Many FPSs now try to include gimmicks like slow motion and crazy suits to cover up for their poor enemy design and craptacular repetition.

Finally, bosses contribute quite a lot to a game, it really gives the player motivation to reach the end, as oppose to games that have a final level consisting of 20 of the same enemy you've been fighting for the last 10 hours.

Bungie was only trying to be realistic with making two weapons, while also balancing the gameplay. I like the idea, but I do miss games where you could reek absolute havoc with 20 weapons :D

Don't get me wrong, you can make an FPS many ways, just I don't feel halo should be the "what every fps should be" game. No FPS should, devs should build their own ideas. Just people take ideas when they shouldn't and apply them poorly ot games that shouldn't need it.

Well, your history lesson is pretty far off. You are correct that games like redneck rampage, duke nukem, etc. aren't really around anymore. What you got wrong: Games that didn't take themselves too seriously were the norm (they weren't). Here are a few games off the top of my head that did take themselves seriously prior to the 1998 release of HL1.

Dark Forces (1995) / Jedi Knight (1997), System Shock (1994), Heretic (1994) /Hexen (1996), Blood (1997)...

Timesplitters!!! Crazy FPS action that's insanely funny too. Ever had a snowman, giant squid, robot, stone golem, rotting zombie, 1920s gangster and the Gingerbreadman fight each other with miniguns and flamethrowers? Cos I have!locopatho

lol good times :)

Well, your history lesson is pretty far off. You are correct that games like redneck rampage, duke nukem, etc. aren't really around anymore. What you got wrong: Games that didn't take themselves too seriously were the norm (they weren't). Here are a few games off the top of my head that did take themselves seriously prior to the 1998 release of HL1.

Dark Forces (1995) / Jedi Knight (1997), System Shock (1994), Heretic (1994) /Hexen (1996), Blood (1997)...

juno84

Correct me if i'm wrong, but those games weren't as popular. Then again I was 10 in 95 and spent most of my time away from games so I may not know. I just knew of Duke, Redneck, wolfenstein, and those types of games more than the serious ones.

[QUOTE="juno84"]

Well, your history lesson is pretty far off. You are correct that games like redneck rampage, duke nukem, etc. aren't really around anymore. What you got wrong: Games that didn't take themselves too seriously were the norm (they weren't). Here are a few games off the top of my head that did take themselves seriously prior to the 1998 release of HL1.

Dark Forces (1995) / Jedi Knight (1997), System Shock (1994), Heretic (1994) /Hexen (1996), Blood (1997)...

scottie300z

Correct me if i'm wrong, but those games weren't as popular. Then again I was 10 in 95 and spent most of my time away from games so I may not know. I just knew of Duke, Redneck, wolfenstein, and those types of games more than the serious ones.

Duke Nukem 3d was pretty popular. I think redneck rampage was more of a niche game. I can't speak a lot on the popularity/sales of different games. I was thinking more in terms of major releases (ie what was being made at the time) as opposed to how well recieved the games were.

Here are a few games off the top of my head that did take themselves seriously prior to the 1998 release of HL1.

Dark Forces (1995) / Jedi Knight (1997), System Shock (1994), Heretic (1994) /Hexen (1996), Blood (1997)...

juno84

You also missed Strife. Heretic and Hexen where both incredibly arcade influenced though. Blood was as camp as hell you obviously didn't get it. :P

Half Life basically allowed first person shooter games to take themselves seriously. Before HL almost all shooters with very few exceptions compensated by being either very arcade influenced being level orientated and jumping you straight into the action without a precursor level featuring lots of power ups and a rigid hierarchy of weapons and enemies leading up to a predictable end game boss, or they where all of those things plus a bit of camp humour. Personally I preferred the latter category.

The sad thing about shooters post-Half Life is that the idea of a first person shooter that does not take itself very seriously has all but died. To give you an example of a shooter with a bit of tounge in cheek see Shadow Warrior. Made by 3D realms who also created Duke Nukem 3D along with it's follow up legacy of non-funny third person sequels.

Luckily pre-Half Life arcade shooters are still around, like Pain Killer and Serious Sam. But the extra mile of making an game humerus like Redneck Rampage is a lost art. Game reviewers began to clamp down on games that didn't take themselves seriously once the new breed of serious, story driven shooter started to emerge.

If a developer made a first person shooter that favoured entertaining the player using humour rather than immersian, would you find it possible to hype yourself for that game?

Tony-Harrison

Quake 1 was damn awesome, Quake 2 was damn awesome.

Marathon was also fantastic, as was System Shock 1.

Doom 2 also had phenominal level design.....

Of course you cant forget about multiplayer shooters like the original Team Fortress

edit* cant beleive I forgot the Jedi Knight series, they were fantastic

I see somebody didn't play No One Lives Forever 1-2 :)AdrianWerner

Then everything went way ward with Contract JACK....

Well, your history lesson is pretty far off. You are correct that games like redneck rampage, duke nukem, etc. aren't really around anymore. What you got wrong: Games that didn't take themselves too seriously were the norm (they weren't). Here are a few games off the top of my head that did take themselves seriously prior to the 1998 release of HL1.

Dark Forces (1995) / Jedi Knight (1997), System Shock (1994), Heretic (1994) /Hexen (1996), Blood (1997)...

juno84

True those are amongst the best FPS ever espaecially the later 3

[QUOTE="Tony-Harrison"][QUOTE="ClawKiller"]

I disagree. Quake 2 came out before Half-Life, and has very advanced level design, one of the best I've seen in any game. It only had a few bosses, and the level required you to use your mind an re-tread various areas, with some levels being massive hubs for several other areas, and having power plants, mining areas, prison areas and everything. No game has yet to surpass Quake 2 level design, and it was pre-Half Life.

But yeah, meaningless shotters are fun, but meaningless.

kittykatz5k

Yeah Quake 2 was one of the exceptions. It also innovated graphics being the first game to use fully rendered environments. I do not think it innovated level design quite as much as Half Life did though, and it still had things like floating weapons and secrets hidden under stairs that videogame developers would not use by todays standards.

And it's story still played last in line to everything else, being told through simple logs instead of interactive npcs and such. The idea of a scripted sequence was still not around.

Umm ya quake 2 rocked. Singleplayer and online, it was just a great run and gun shooter,