How can people like No More Heroes?

I just don't understand it. I've never thought something was a garbage title as much as I thought No More Heroes was.

The plot was so over the top and ridiculous, the start of the game was a sad attempt at backstory. I mean, come on, a gamer who gets a sword and becomes a master hitman? It's just stupid.

How the combat was used with the Wii remote felt good at first, but then it just got old. There was FAR too much blood. It just screamed "12 year olds will love this with a passion" I can honestly tell you I felt sick after playing that game. Not because of the blood, but because everything seemed so cheesy.

The free roam was pointless in every way. I don't enjoy playing an attempted GTA ripoff with a virtually empty world.

The language was terrible. Now don't get me wrong, I don't mind a game that has strong language at various points to describe emotion, but to just use curses gratuitously throughout the game for no reason other than to attempt to sound cool. It felt like the entire point of the game was to try to make younger gamers say "Oh boy! He said a curse word! Hehehehehe!"

Those guitar sounds I heard at various points were so ridiculous, it felt like I was watching some early 90's teen movie where some teen hero crashes through a window to the sound of some guitar riffs in the background.

Getting to the point, after playing this game I assumed it would be a complete flop. Then I come to various forums and see that people actually enjoyed it.

All I have to say is.... How?

Something tells me you also don't like the Devil May Cry series.ice144

I've never really tried it. From what I've seen it kind of seems like one of those "Overly Grimdark" games. I wouldn't know though, since I've never played any of them.

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

bf2nutta

I've heard the excuses from "Attempting to be over the top" all the way to "Artistic satire based on modern games"

Every excuse was just as pointless as the last. That video you linked is pretty much a man describing every single horrible quality of that game in a happy voice.

Because that hack Suda set out to make terrible satire of real games, does not make it an artsy "Alternative" game. It's just intentional garbage.

The game is crazy and so is Travis.I love it and I can't wait for desperate struggle.

[QUOTE="ice144"]Something tells me you also don't like the Devil May Cry series.LittleHands134

I've never really tried it. From what I've seen it kind of seems like one of those "Overly Grimdark" games. I wouldn't know though, since I've never played any of them.

Devil may cry is in no way grimdark.

The hight of grimdark is Warhammer 40000, with Tiberium Sun coming in a distant second.

Its one of the most light hearteduniversesI can think of without being all rainbows and sunshine.

I just don't understand it. I've never thought something was a garbage title as much as I thought No More Heroes was.

The plot was so over the top and ridiculous, the start of the game was a sad attempt at backstory. I mean, come on, a gamer who gets a sword and becomes a master hitman? It's just stupid.

How the combat was used with the Wii remote felt good at first, but then it just got old. There was FAR too much blood. It just screamed "12 year olds will love this with a passion" I can honestly tell you I felt sick after playing that game. Not because of the blood, but because everything seemed so cheesy.

The free roam was pointless in every way. I don't enjoy playing an attempted GTA ripoff with a virtually empty world.

The language was terrible. Now don't get me wrong, I don't mind a game that has strong language at various points to describe emotion, but to just use curses gratuitously throughout the game for no reason other than to attempt to sound cool. It felt like the entire point of the game was to try to make younger gamers say "Oh boy! He said a curse word! Hehehehehe!"

Those guitar sounds I heard at various points were so ridiculous, it felt like I was watching some early 90's teen movie where some teen hero crashes through a window to the sound of some guitar riffs in the background.

Getting to the point, after playing this game I assumed it would be a complete flop. Then I come to various forums and see that people actually enjoyed it.

All I have to say is.... How?

LittleHands134

You just dont understand the mind of Suda51. I so far loved every game hes made that I was abel to play. His story and characters are always full of personality. He is hands down my favorite developer.

[QUOTE="bf2nutta"]

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

LittleHands134

I've heard the excuses from "Attempting to be over the top" all the way to "Artistic satire based on modern games"

Every excuse was just as pointless as the last. That video you linked is pretty much a man describing every single horrible quality of that game in a happy voice.

Because that hack Suda set out to make terrible satire of real games, does not make it an artsy "Alternative" game. It's just intentional garbage.

again you missed the point again.... I found the game enjoyable,fun and different to normal generic gta clones(even though it isn't really a GTA clone)..... even with the flaws so did that reviewer and so did alot of people who played the game.

As I mentioned what were your thoughts when you saw Kill Bill???

But then the main point to this game is its FUN and Refreashing, which doesn't seem to be enough these days for some people and then being different scares them

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"]

I just don't understand it. I've never thought something was a garbage title as much as I thought No More Heroes was.

The plot was so over the top and ridiculous, the start of the game was a sad attempt at backstory. I mean, come on, a gamer who gets a sword and becomes a master hitman? It's just stupid.

How the combat was used with the Wii remote felt good at first, but then it just got old. There was FAR too much blood. It just screamed "12 year olds will love this with a passion" I can honestly tell you I felt sick after playing that game. Not because of the blood, but because everything seemed so cheesy.

The free roam was pointless in every way. I don't enjoy playing an attempted GTA ripoff with a virtually empty world.

The language was terrible. Now don't get me wrong, I don't mind a game that has strong language at various points to describe emotion, but to just use curses gratuitously throughout the game for no reason other than to attempt to sound cool. It felt like the entire point of the game was to try to make younger gamers say "Oh boy! He said a curse word! Hehehehehe!"

Those guitar sounds I heard at various points were so ridiculous, it felt like I was watching some early 90's teen movie where some teen hero crashes through a window to the sound of some guitar riffs in the background.

Getting to the point, after playing this game I assumed it would be a complete flop. Then I come to various forums and see that people actually enjoyed it.

All I have to say is.... How?

KungfuKitten

How does that make it a good game though? It seems like Suda intentionally made the game to be satirical, but I don't understand how that makes the game any good. It's like saying anything intentionally poor quality is going to be good because it's what the person was hoping to make.

I think if we saw a game very much like this, but the developer wasn't saying that he was intentionally making satire, it would be laughed out of the forum. For a lot of people, I think it's just "edgy" to like No More Heroes.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="bf2nutta"]

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

bf2nutta

I've heard the excuses from "Attempting to be over the top" all the way to "Artistic satire based on modern games"

Every excuse was just as pointless as the last. That video you linked is pretty much a man describing every single horrible quality of that game in a happy voice.

Because that hack Suda set out to make terrible satire of real games, does not make it an artsy "Alternative" game. It's just intentional garbage.

again you missed the point again.... I found the game enjoyable,fun and different to normal generic gta clones(even though it isn't really a GTA clone)..... even with the flaws so did that reviewer and so did alot of people who played the game.

As I mentioned what were your thoughts when you saw Kill Bill???

But then the main point to this game is its FUN and Refreashing, which doesn't seem to be enough these days for some people and then being different scares them

A different game doesn't scare me. I look for quality in my games, and No More Heroes had none of this. It's like those kids you see in the goth clothing at the malls, they look terrible, but the only reason they're wearing it is to be "Different" and "Unique", I think the same works for a lot of Suda fans. It's cool to like alternative games and disregard the glaring flaws, I guess.

[QUOTE="bf2nutta"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="bf2nutta"]

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

LittleHands134

I've heard the excuses from "Attempting to be over the top" all the way to "Artistic satire based on modern games"

Every excuse was just as pointless as the last. That video you linked is pretty much a man describing every single horrible quality of that game in a happy voice.

Because that hack Suda set out to make terrible satire of real games, does not make it an artsy "Alternative" game. It's just intentional garbage.

again you missed the point again.... I found the game enjoyable,fun and different to normal generic gta clones(even though it isn't really a GTA clone)..... even with the flaws so did that reviewer and so did alot of people who played the game.

As I mentioned what were your thoughts when you saw Kill Bill???

But then the main point to this game is its FUN and Refreashing, which doesn't seem to be enough these days for some people and then being different scares them

A different game doesn't scare me. I look for quality in my games, and No More Heroes had none of this. It's like those kids you see in the goth clothing at the malls, they look terrible, but the only reason they're wearing it is to be "Different" and "Unique", I think the same works for a lot of Suda fans. It's cool to like alternative games and disregard the glaring flaws, I guess.

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

[QUOTE="bf2nutta"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="bf2nutta"]

you missed the point of it didn't you... Its supposed to be over the top, ever watched a Tarrentino film??

watch this as well... http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/33-No-More-Heroes

LittleHands134

I've heard the excuses from "Attempting to be over the top" all the way to "Artistic satire based on modern games"

Every excuse was just as pointless as the last. That video you linked is pretty much a man describing every single horrible quality of that game in a happy voice.

Because that hack Suda set out to make terrible satire of real games, does not make it an artsy "Alternative" game. It's just intentional garbage.

again you missed the point again.... I found the game enjoyable,fun and different to normal generic gta clones(even though it isn't really a GTA clone)..... even with the flaws so did that reviewer and so did alot of people who played the game.

As I mentioned what were your thoughts when you saw Kill Bill???

But then the main point to this game is its FUN and Refreashing, which doesn't seem to be enough these days for some people and then being different scares them

A different game doesn't scare me. I look for quality in my games, and No More Heroes had none of this. It's like those kids you see in the goth clothing at the malls, they look terrible, but the only reason they're wearing it is to be "Different" and "Unique", I think the same works for a lot of Suda fans. It's cool to like alternative games and disregard the glaring flaws, I guess.

We could keep going like this for hours lol.... Your Opinion is yours, I love the game and as I said before it was refreashing and fun.... Too many have a played games like Mercs2, Haze, The Club and other shooter/slasher/violent games which have been generic and dull and this just something different....

Its like a B Movie it knows it the storyline is crap and thats why its good.... Its not a game which has it head stuck up its own @r*e to miss the point of video games which are for them to be enjoyable.

Have you ever watched Kill Bill, Planet Terror e.t.c?? What did you think of those?

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

rumtumtugger

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

How about we stop using these huge quotes?me

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

LittleHands134

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I give up with this..... Alot reviewers like it and Alot of Gamers... you don't, we have told you why we enjoy it and for some reason you can't seem to except it...

We could keep going like this for hours lol.... Your Opinion is yours, I love the game and as I said before it was refreashing and fun.... Too many have a played games like Mercs2, Haze, The Club and other shooter/slasher/violent games which have been generic and dull and this just something different....

Its like a B Movie it knows it the storyline is crap and thats why its good.... Its not a game which has it head stuck up its own @r*e to miss the point of video games which are for them to be enjoyable.

Have you ever watched Kill Bill, Planet Terror e.t.c?? What did you think of those?

bf2nutta

I saw Kill Bill, but it felt cheesy to me. I agree when this comes to movies it's a situation of opinion, but I don't think it's too much to ask for basic quality in my games, even when they are trying to be satirical. With movies you sit and back enjoy whatever is on the screen, it doesn't really matter too much if the acting is terrible or if the storyline is garbage.

In a game though, something you're going to investing a lot of time into, I would want the gameplay to at least not be repetitive. I could even deal with the poor storyline and low quality characters if the gameplay didn't feel so terrible.

The game is crazy and so is Travis.I love it and I can't wait for desperate struggle.

Lto_thaG

^^What he said.

The games crazy, theres a lot of swearing but its mainly from travis which just shows what his character is like.

It does get slightly repetitive but there are a lot of wrestling moves which gives the game some diversity during the combat.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

bf2nutta

A lot of gamers didn't like it though, in Japan it didn't do very well at all. I think that says a lot about a Japanese fascination Americans seem to have. A lot of times they'll just eat up whatever someone from Japan shovels out.

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I give up with this..... Alot reviewers like it and Alot of Gamers... you don't, we have told you why we enjoy it and for some reason you can't seem to except it...

A lot of gamers didn't like it though, in Japan it didn't do very well at all. I think that says a lot about a Japanese fascination Americans seem to have. A lot of times they'll just eat up whatever someone from Japan shovels out. ~

Messed up the quote a bit, sorry, I'm tired.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

LittleHands134

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

A lot of gamers didn't like it though, in Japan it didn't do very well at all. I think that says a lot about a Japanese fascination Americans seem to have. A lot of times they'll just eat up whatever someone from Japan shovels out. ~

Messed up the quote a bit, sorry, I'm tired.

LittleHands134

I think that's one reason why it didn't appeal to Japanese gamers. Travis was very much a stereotype of an American gamer. The kind that have a fascination of all things from Japan. It would be hard for a Japanese audience to really understand that, and that Travis is ultimately the butt of a joke.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

rumtumtugger

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

I see your point, but I don't like to consider most video games a form of art. Similar things can even be seen in modern art especially. With the modern art crowd, a black canvas with a white dot in the middle could be hugely successful as long as the artist imposed some sort of after thought "Deep Meaning" to it.

I don't think it's good that art has lowered its standards so much, and I don't think it's good that people are willing to accept low quality games.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

rumtumtugger

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

Gameplay is where I thought NMH shined. Love the wiimote gestures and hack n slash gameplay. Compare it to Killer 7 which had a better story and concept...but the gameplay was just horrible.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

Bread_or_Decide

I agree that No More Heroes had a lot gameplay potential with the Wii remote, I just don't think Suda capitalized on it. It managed to turn a potentially very fun fighting system into very annoying because of the repetitive and nearly identical enemies.

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

Gameplay is where I thought NMH shined. Love the wiimote gestures and hack n slash gameplay. Compare it to Killer 7 which had a better story and concept...but the gameplay was just horrible.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

LittleHands134

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

I see your point, but I don't like to consider most video games a form of art. Similar things can even be seen in modern art especially. With the modern art crowd, a black canvas with a white dot in the middle could be hugely successful as long as the artist imposed some sort of after thought "Deep Meaning" to it.

I don't think it's good that art has lowered its standards so much, and I don't think it's good that people are willing to accept low quality games.

If Suda 51 could have given NMH a GTAIV style budget I'm sure he would have. I think the reality is that games with these kinds of concepts can't get big budgets so they have to make do with what they have the same way art house movies don't look as polished because they also have small budgets. Its about the ideas and the execution rather than the supposed quality of the product. Granted I agree that the HUB world should have taken a point away from NMH's score on gamespot. The game should have done away with the hub world, made it linear with level style gameplay, and then it would have been a faster paced more well rounded game. Still as someone who hated Killer 7's gameplay I believe Suda 51 is getting better at marrying his concepts with fun gameplay.

I agree that No More Heroes had a lot gameplay potential with the Wii remote, I just don't think Suda capitalized on it. It managed to turn a potentially very fun fighting system into very annoying because of the repetitive and nearly identical enemies.

Ugh. And I messed up the quote again.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

Bread_or_Decide

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

Gameplay is where I thought NMH shined. Love the wiimote gestures and hack n slash gameplay. Compare it to Killer 7 which had a better story and concept...but the gameplay was just horrible.

I liked Killer7 too. :( Especially the story.

As for modern art lowering it's standards: personally I don't think much of white dots on a black canvas either. However NMH is exactly the opposite. A simple dot is a expression of remarkable laziness; it's an unwillingness to make "art". NMH, on the other hand, is just bursting with unique things. It doesn't innovate much in gameplay, but the game is not about gameplay; it's about immersing yourself in a satrical and hilairious world.

Now that I say that it occurs to me how much like South Park it is. Make love...not Warcraft.

[QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

Bread_or_Decide

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

I see your point, but I don't like to consider most video games a form of art. Similar things can even be seen in modern art especially. With the modern art crowd, a black canvas with a white dot in the middle could be hugely successful as long as the artist imposed some sort of after thought "Deep Meaning" to it.

I don't think it's good that art has lowered its standards so much, and I don't think it's good that people are willing to accept low quality games.

If Suda 51 could have given NMH a GTAIV style budget I'm sure he would have. I think the reality is that games with these kinds of concepts can't get big budgets so they have to make do with what they have the same way art house movies don't look as polished because they also have small budgets. Its about the ideas and the execution rather than the supposed quality of the product. Granted I agree that the HUB world should have taken a point away from NMH's score on gamespot. The game should have done away with the hub world, made it linear with level style gameplay, and then it would have been a faster paced more well rounded game. Still as someone who hated Killer 7's gameplay I believe Suda 51 is getting better at marrying his concepts with fun gameplay.

I agree that with a better budget the game could have been very enjoyable, but at the same time he should be able to realize that what he wants isn't really possible with the budget he has. Honestly, I don't think he's a very good developer. Seems like he's a visionary, which is good, but he doesn't have the skill yet to form it into a great game.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

I agree that with a better budget the game could have been very enjoyable, but at the same time he should be able to realize that what he wants isn't really possible with the budget he has. Honestly, I don't think he's a very good developer. Seems like he's a visionary, which is good, but he doesn't have the skill yet to form it into a great game.

LittleHands134

NMH's graphics engine is pretty remarkable, and I doubt most devs could think up any of the bosses.

I agree that with a better budget the game could have been very enjoyable, but at the same time he should be able to realize that what he wants isn't really possible with the budget he has. Honestly, I don't think he's a very good developer. Seems like he's a visionary, which is good, but he doesn't have the skill yet to form it into a great game.

LittleHands134

Suda 51 is like Richard Kelly (director of Southland Tales and Donnie Darko.) Sometimes ones ambition gets in the way of their ability craft their art. One can't help but admire what they're trying to do but you also realize theirs much room for improvement. I'd rather have someone who shoots for the stars and misses than someone who wants to create generic mainstream crap. That alone doesn't make up for a dud offering but what Suda manages to do with what he's given is enough to raise a few eyebrows in this industry. Granted he's going for a very niche audience but I think he realizes this fact. I think he will continue to divide gamers with his games as love or hate affairs. Thats what any good artist should do if you ask me.

[QUOTE="rumtumtugger"][QUOTE="LittleHands134"][QUOTE="rumtumtugger"]

Or maybe they and most other people have different tastes than you?

Bread_or_Decide

I can accept that, but not when the fans themselves tell me they liked the game because it was different and unique but never give me gameplay reasons to support it. In a pure gameplay sense, No More Heroes is garbage. Even the sword combat, which is the best feature the game has, becomes repetitive considering each mission feels exactly the same.

The only appeal of No More Heroes is its alternative gimmick, which seems to be a running theme of Suda's, probably to cover his own developer inadequacies.

I disagree strongly with you. In this day of "Are games art?", I think it's completely viable for a game to have garbage gameplay, yet have a great amount of unique heart and still be "art", ie. a great game. Not to mention the gameplay isn't bad at all. Maybe I just don't really mind somewhat repetitive games so long as they're "well-made"; I also enjoyed Assassin's Creed a lot.

Gameplay is where I thought NMH shined. Love the wiimote gestures and hack n slash gameplay. Compare it to Killer 7 which had a better story and concept...but the gameplay was just horrible.

Do you hate on rail games? Im guessing that could be the only reason to call it "horrible" I thought it was great.

The gameplay needs alot of work no doubt about that. The game is a parody. Plain and simple. It's supposed to be over the top and ridiculous.

I mean how can you not love the opening http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncuR0qZpglc

No More Heroes is not only hilarious its charming and has a unique s t y l e. The characters are very entertaining and different from your average game.

The game is simply a breath of fresh air.

I was more impressed with No More Heroes story than Mass Effect and Bioshock.

Can't wait for the sequel.