Is Denuvo DRM ruining gaming industry?

So my friends, today I was searching on internet and I found another game using denuvo DRM is bieng cracked. it make me think again what is the point of this shitty DRM when is going to effect nothing but legit customers?

Lets face it. its very anti consumer practice and proof are as bellow

Batman Arkham knights - Ruined by Denuvo

Just cause 3 - unoptimize game

Deus Ex Mankind divided - another game that was additional work by nixxies who are PC expert yet its not optimize well because of denuvo

Dishonored 2 - Another unoptimize game. remember how PC friendly Dishononred was.

I mean all these games has predecessor that were very PC friendly and also sold alot

Now witcher 3 (even im not a fan) sold lot more than all those games above combine and that game do not use Denuvo DRM.

Only games i think that were not effected by denuvo are Doom and rise of tomb raider (even thought i hate it). and Im very surprised when i found out Doom use denuvo.

Lets analyse now

http://kotaku.com/in-a-twist-game-update-drops-denuvo-anti-piracy-tech-o-1789341761

A game formally had denuvo but they had to drop the denuvo because they know its useless, costly and pirates will play regardless

another reason is pirates getting more advantage than legit customers. How??

because they are hackers, they remove DRM and thus play non DRM version that is run and perform better than us Legit Customers?? we are getting screwed over and over again.

Ever since denuvo came into existance. we see more and more of shit ports and unoptimization that we have ever had.

but ''Hur Hur company has rights to protect thier product'' you wanna protect your product?? remove microtransactions, remove paid DLC, remove selling map packs, release full games instead of half assed. this is how you protect your product.

Denuvo did more harm to sell than protect.

so what do you think my friends?

lets discuss

It exists because of pirates. Wither piracy actually is an issue or not, all the things inflicted on pc gaming is a result of them.

Their little robin hood Mel Gibsons Freedoms act, which is also the excuse Pirate Bay attempted to use, is utter tripe.

It's easy and you have almost 0 chance of getting caught. That's the extent of it., you're freeloaders.

Having said that, Publishers are cocks of the highest order. Unfinished buggy messes, dlc cut out at launch, microtransactions in a fully priced product. It's like trying to defend an enthusiastic member of ISIS.

No, it's doing nothing, it's done nothing, people dramatize it at great lengths and nearly everything surrounding it is hyperbole.

It's the in thing to do right now, like people incessantly bitching about Uplay when it's completely non-invasive..

The Dark Knight is a horrible port, that is its problem, Just Cause 3 is the opposite of unoptimized, my 290X runs that game at 4K maxed out with north of 30 FPS...

Hell, look at Doom for example, a fantastic looking game that can be maxed out very easily with phenomenal performance, your disdain is completely misplaced, performance issues in games are the result of shoddy development, not anti-piracy measures like Denuvo.

You like the bulk of the "PC gamer" community are ignorant beyond belief because you know **** all about it.

Why games that before Denuvo got MILLIONS of downloads on torrents but AFTER Denuvo suddenly dont break sales records?

I know you will not answer my question

you have no capacity to

I can answer that and it's simple to, most of these people never had intent to purchase in the first place, it cuts those unwilling to pay for a product and willing to infringe copyrights from gaining access to the game content.

This isn't about boosting sales, it's about forced removal of unentitled users breaking the law.

and by punishing legit customers.

No one is being punished, your argument is founded completely on bullshit, it's something operating that has absolutely zero measurable effect on games.

it changes nothing at all! hence utterly pointless.

It needs an online reactivation after some period of time so i'd say it's kinda against the legit customers, granted it doesn't affect the masses but it's obviously a flaw.

really? so we never got unoptimize Deus Ex and Dishonored??

we are definitely bieng punish by evil corporates in suit and tie.

Out of 56 Denuvo titles only 8 have actually been cracked and are operational, that's an 85.72% failure rate for pirates and only a 14.28% success rate, it's most certainly not pointless.

the only major game has not been cracked is just cause 3, far cry primal and hitman. 2 because of online only and one because it has triple DRM (steam, uplay and denuvo)

Battlefield 1 and titanfall 2 will be crack in months watchout except they dont waste time with BF because people play those games for MP.

Denuvo do more harm to product than protect it. thats why Inside developers remove denuvo on game with patches.

Your logic is fundamentally unfounded and frankly stupid, you speak of Denuvo being the culprit of games being unoptimized, if that's the case then all games encompassing it would be subject to it.

Yet there are games like Mad Max, Just Cause 3, Star Wars Battlefront, Battlefield 1, Doom, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Need for Speed and so on and so forth that offer amazing performance, hell even Arkham Knight has great performance.

Did it ever cross your mind for even a second that these games you're bitching about being destroyed by Denuvo are actually just unoptimized development? What a fucking concept that would be... No, you're trying to place inane blame on something that is affecting game performance in zero capacity, something that is strengthening the PC community for developers and consumers alike, something that has no perceivable functions of effects of any kind on a game itself.

i meant in terms of sales, pirates don't have any intention of buying to begin with, they simply can't afford it, now you invest on Denovu (for like 100K) expecting to see some surge on sales while nothing changes noticeably.

And they've cracked the majority of AAA titles, the latest ones will get cracked as well.

And 27 games have remained uncracked, 5 of which are Online so it doesn't matter, 2 of them have been released recently, and the rest are not popular or good, except for Total War Hammer and FIFA 17, which they could've cracked the latter way sooner but they decided to do PES 2017 first. It only took 12 days for them to crack Deus Ex Mankind Divided, they waited for the game to get patched up to the latest version, being bug-free with great performance.

I'm not downplaying the accomplishment of denovu tho, they've done a great job (however, i still believe nothing significant has happened in terms of sales), but like all the other DRMs, they're about to see their demise, which was inevitable.

Prove to me, prove to all of us that Denuvo has negative performance effects, all you've done is spout baseless nonsense predicated on ignorance.

I dont know about Denuvo, but uplay sucks

It's not a perfect system and they've been making great strides, some games have been completely impossible for these people to crack while others have been trying but possible. It's a work in progress but they're gaining ground and success moving forward, Doom and Tomb Raider for example were not exactly cracked, there was an oversight involving the Doom demo that led to people to gain access to those games through it, a loophole. However things like that are being shut down, eventually they will hit a state of almost perfect reliability, and they've hit it in certain games, they just need to figure out how to translate that to all games.

@ghosts4ever: That negative effect on performance has not been proved, Doom and BF1 are great examples of why that can't be true, and there's no way to find out exactly if it affects performance or not, but as of now, i don't think that's true.

.. The gaming/software industry treats its customers like shit compared to basically any other consumer industry.. The amount of shit these companies get away with, and just how little power the consumer has compared to any other consumer industry is staggering..

Op this thread is a remarkable display of ignorance.

And I believe that is the exact thing that causes unoptimized mess indirectly. I'm no expert and I have no proof but the little I understood is that it's not a simple DRM where devs add it at the end of development. To work effectively it needs to be distributed along the entirety of game code by the game developers, adding significant work. Of course, good developers like ID, Nixes and DICE implemented it flawlessly but I think, key work I think not every developer is capable enough to handle the overwork caused by it. Another reason I think this is the case is because every indie game with Denuvo is cracked almost with hours of release, further proving my theory that in the end it's all come down to development resources.

Total war warhammer uses devuvo as well and I have no issues whatsoever with this game. Denuvo is used as a tool by developers to protect themselves from piracy. The reason why CA decided to use denuvo for the first time on a total war game was because a lot of people threatened to pirate their game due to the heavily criticized preorder incentive.

I can't say I verified all of that but I'm almost sure most of these games aside from Arkham Knight have/had issues on all platform which points to dev incompetence rather than Denuvo which seems to be used as a scapegoat for botch ports/optimization.

Now witcher 3 (even im not a fan) sold lot more than all those games above combine and that game do not use Denuvo DRM.

Because it was good and marketed well. Also didn't have any major issue on any platform.

More people playing your games, more profit made, more good will garnered are possible successes. I don't see the prevention of piracy as one of those things because there is no clear relation. It's easy to tell from past games sales that casual appeal (marketing), release date and the online mindset/awareness around your game are infinitely more important than pirates if you want to sell more copies. As a businessman that is what I would spend my resources on, aside from making a slightly unique, excellent game.

I bet it's scary. To be responsible for a multi million project and maybe hundreds of people that depend on this being a success with no control over who just grabs it and copies it for other people. If I were in that position I would be very scared of that. So I understand them being really paranoid about these things. But it doesn't look like it's helping. Convenience sells, Steam got big, but aside from that: the delivery method of your game, I just don't see the results you'd need.

But I don't see Denuvo ruining games. that is still on the publisher/developer. I bet you can make a good game run well while it's using Denuvo.

People shouldn't criticize the DRM if console ports run bad. MGS5 uses Denuvo and it was great.

Only people who truly go apeshit over drm are pirates.

lol that make no sense since pirates are the one who remove drm from a game. and us legit customers who spent money bieng screwed.

Exactly.

In true "we have no dignity", pc pirates couldn't beat Denuvo, so they resorted (pathetically) to spreading false propaganda that it would cripple games and blow up computers.

In reality it has no practically no effect, it simply deters disgusting crooks trying to steal 1000ths of hours of hard work for free.

For a people who declarations the greatest of pc gaming, they have no respect for it, the developers or the themselves.

All in all a pitiful, and expected state of affairs.

How are you being screwed exactly

Fact: The only people that complain about Denuvo are scum pirates.

Denuvo is non-intrusive to customers. It has not caused any issues to any of us who are legitimate. The games that were listed are unoptimized games in general, not a cause of Denuvo. Now sales haven't spiked because of it. Pirates are pirates and most of them won't give a penny over, but some of the minority have caved in and bought the game because they had no other choice.

I know some people personally who refuse to support developers because "Why? I can get the game for free". Hopefully the anti-tamper software becomes more advanced and is used more.

*** Games that rely on mods as its lure shouldn't use Denuvo. It would put too many restrictions on modders. BUT.... a lot of games don't rely or don't need mods. So use away.

I doubt that even a complete lawschool dropout will call copyright infringement "stealing"

But you avoided to answer me....

Uninspiredtroll is scared? Heheheheh

Lol, you're just as delusional as ever I see.

Since when was Batman Arkham Knights being so terrible at launch that WB removed it from sale for two months, offered full refunds and then continued to offer full refunds for a further month after it re-launched, the fault of Denuvo? I think it was far more likely due to a second rate company being given a week to port the game to PC. (even a first rate company wouldn't have managed it). You know it now runs better on PC than it does on the consoles?

Deus Ex is a game lacking in so many ways, mostly on the very obvious fact that a shit ton of content has been removed to sell later as DLC or further expansions. Performance wise, for me any way, it was pretty much flawless, don't think I had a single crash in my entire play through, the graphics and Frame rates were excellent.

As for The Witcher 3 selling more than the other two combined, well that comes down to the simple fact that it's a far, far better game than the other two combined.

Now a Denuvo protected game that I've spent a lot of time on, and still isn't cracked, is Total War Warhammer. The most glaring thing about this title over any other previous Total War game, is it's performance. Again for me, this game has never crashed and FPS is always over 60fps with maxed graphics and 1440p res and that does not change whether I'm zoomed right in to a goblin's face or over looking a battle field with several thousand units present.

Yeah Denuvo is really shit, it stops people pirating games during the first few months when game sales are highest. They need to get rid of that crap altogether. /sarcasm

Guys, it's not that simple, we can't simply rule out the probability that it might affect the performance

As Inside has recently removed the Denovu, one of my friends has compared the two versions and the results are interesting, take a look.

Inside WITH Denuvo :

Inside WITHOUT Denuvo

As you can see, it affects the performance in a negative way (Look at the GPU usage, temps, etc)

If a few more titles remove the Denovu, we can draw some definite conclusions by comparing the two versions, as of now, i hold my judgement regarding the mater.

I am still waiting for laundry list of how gamers are being screwed.

witcher 3 is not better than Deus Ex MD. not in any shape or form and its incredibly overrated game.

I disagree

Your opinion means very little here...

lolSniperThread

I need to stay far away from games with DRM. I wont be able to play them at all if I didn't pay to play online or if I don't have internet. Even if your internet goes down for maintenance you'd be forced to wait for it to come back to play them at all.

DRM is balls.

@ghosts4ever: You're an idiot and I respect you.

Denuvo does not need an online connection.

Dragon Age: Inquisition, Mad Max, Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain, Star Wars Battlefront, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Far Cry Primal, DOOM, Total War: Warhammer and Battlefield 1, all which uses Denuvo in some form as protection. They all work great and there's no epidemic of issues with any of the games I listed. I don't think it's Denuvo that is the issue here.

Yeah, that worked so well in the past when all there was were CD keys to worry about and people were basically making one to one copies of games.

I've never heard of this DRM as being the reason for bad ports. Arkham Knight had a team of under 20 people porting it from what I heard. If the DRM caused development problems, developers wouldn't use it, they aren't contracted to.

That's good to know.

This is coming from the guy with both Deus ex and DOOM in his sig

Avadon fan is here I disagree.

I'm GOG lover and believe in DRM free PC gaming.

Fun Fact: Ubisoft stole pirate crack and used as patch to fix R6 Vegas 2.

If CPY never cracked it, I doubt they would have removed denuvo. Don't kid yourselves into thinking they had a change of heart.

They saw a great chance to remove Denuvo. They lost popularity, game is a few months old. So how to get more sales out of it?

That's right, REMOVE DENUVO. Game is cracked anyways, so no point stopping pirates, but you can make them think you're good and hate DRM and Denuvo as you removed it.

Get more popularity again = More sales from also those people who wouldn't buy denuvo games and from people who think it's very awesome of them to remove Denuvo.

Profit. It's pretty much just marketing.

Methinks people who would so happily promote false information just to throw shade at Denuvo are just desperate pirates.

Denuvo doesn't affect performance, doesn't break SSD, nor murder kittens on launch. All of that has long been debunked. If someone truly cares about the controversies surrounding Denuvo, and are not in it to spread disrepute against a product and hope that it stops gaining in popularity like it has been, surely they would have done enough research to realise the fallacies of their claims.

You can claim you are anti-DRM because... you just are, even if it doesn't affect legitimate users. That's fine. I think it's a silly opinion but I can't do much about that. However, if you start pulling Sean Murrays just to make your stance look good, that only serve to make you look like a desperate pirate.

Don't go full desperate pirates.

ADD: By the way, even Denuvo themselves promote themselves as "launch day protection". It was only ever intended to protect a game for the couple weeks of launch and then fade into irrelevance. The fact that so many games remain uncracked due to a launch day protection says a great deal about just how greatly Denuvo over-estimated the pirates.

Buy games legimately snipes :P