LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
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I don't understand what exactly it is he's suing over? But whatever it is I hope he wins. Class compensation!
He had points left on his account.
????
Unprofit.
Did the points just disappear without him purchasing anything? Incomplete/partial downloads? What's he mean?
LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math. its just that there is absolutely no need for it, and it is a blatant method of tricking consumers out of their money. whether it works or not is irrelevant. it just leaves a bad impessionLINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math. its just that there is absolutely no need for it, and it is a blatant method of tricking consumers out of their money. whether it works or not is irrelevant. it just leaves a bad impession Its all spelled out to consumers how the system works. Like it or not, there's nothing illegal about it.[QUOTE="DumbDubya"]80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
gamer620
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.[QUOTE="gamer620"][QUOTE="DumbDubya"]
LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
DumbDubya
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
80:1 is not that bad. How much is 5 dollars in MS points? 5*80 = 400. See, simple, even for an engineer.
What a stupid lawsuit, anyone with very little knowledge of math can just convert it. here is a simple way to do it.
1200 ----------- $15
400 -------------- x? cross multiply, solve for x and voila its $5.
Even though i dislike the MS point system, it doesnt take a genius to convert from points to currency :|
This is what's confusing me. If he bought a game and the download got interrupted for whatever reason, you can just re-download the thing. But I expect Gamespot would've mentioned the ability to re-download if that's what this is about. Or not mention the lawsuit at all, as it would then be completely stupid.Wow, that dude fails hard, you can redownload and the points system isn't that hard.
:lol:
Dark5tar1
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.[QUOTE="gamer620"][QUOTE="DumbDubya"]
LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
DumbDubya
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
but what about people outside the US ?[QUOTE="DumbDubya"][QUOTE="gamer620"] 80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.chris_yz80
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
but what about people outside the US ? Exactly... XBL isn't a US only system.. its a global system, in such a global economy. Itd be stupid to cater only to Americans.[QUOTE="gamer620"][QUOTE="DumbDubya"] 80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.DumbDubya
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
you're an engineer w/ math skills better than a fellowSW poster, and you mention having to pull out a calculator to use to figure it out... ya, im sure[QUOTE="skrat_01"]Points = a currency MS can put its own value on. Fundamentally it is a bit shifty. yup, exactly cant blame a business trying to make extra bucks where they can...and im sure they're bringin in a nice amount of the point systemi guess people here dont know what the lawsuit is for?
basically, the guy says there's a minimum of purchaseable points from MS.i.e. a game is worth 800 MS points but the minimum is like 1000 so you have an extra hanging even though you only wanted to spend 800 points from it. this, in turn, will push the consumer to purchase more, but as he purchases more, there will still be leftovers from the point system. it means this is a hideous way of charging consumers for something that they initially wouldnt buy. i know you guys will say, 'then just dont spend it!' but the logic here is that MS knows that you either have to buy more points, or you can just leave it there with the extra points. at a consumer's point of view, you'd think it'd be better if you just spend more since you already have a 'downpayment' but that leads to more and more leftovers leading to more purchases. get it?
1. the person instigating this lawsuit has sued and been ignored by the courts google, and 3 other comapnies.
2.I've never had a problem with MS points, I use the xbox 360 it self the xbox.com site and zune software between them i can individually get points with no tax that match most every thing i want on xbox live, i dont need to do any figures, i can buy the points i want that i can directly buy xbox live arcade games and DLC without overspending, I all so use amazon.com when they offer xbla games and DLC for straight up money. MS points aren't that hard the only time i've ever had a problem is when an item on xbox live had an odd point number like 480 or 420 points.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.gamer620
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
but what about people outside the US ? i beleive in here in the UK its around 17 quid for 1200 although i could be wrong, the only reason i have any interest in ms points is so i can download Braid and Castlevania:SOTN ,point is ,gamers in the uk get shafted for this kind of thing more than most nations so this guy can shove his lawsuit. quit yer whining lawsuit guy!Wow another stupid class action suit. The only people that win on those is the lawyers. Say MS did have to pay 10 million. The Lawyers will make 9.5 million and all the class members will get a month of Live for free or something stupid like that. I've been a part of quite a few class action lawsuits, and usually it is settled for a few bucks or a coupon towards future purchases from the same company.
I agree MS's point system is stupid, but so is Nintendo's, and last I heard Sony doesn't give you back left over balances either. It's not really hard to figure out. 80 MS points = $1. I wish they would switch over to a money value like Sony's cards, and allow you to buy points in $1 increments, but I doubt this lawsuit will change anything.
[QUOTE="DumbDubya"]
[QUOTE="gamer620"] 80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.dream431ca
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
80:1 is not that bad. How much is 5 dollars in MS points? 5*80 = 400. See, simple, even for an engineer.
You didn't take into account that those points change price if you purchase more or less. But yeah, lawsuit won't win. Only MS changing out of generosity.On PSN they're is not need for money left over. I never add funds to my PSN wallet, but buy when i see something and PSN only takes out what is required.Wow another stupid class action suit. The only people that win on those is the lawyers. Say MS did have to pay 10 million. The Lawyers will make 9.5 million and all the class members will get a month of Live for free or something stupid like that. I've been a part of quite a few class action lawsuits, and usually it is settled for a few bucks or a coupon towards future purchases from the same company.
I agree MS's point system is stupid, but so is Nintendo's, and last I heard Sony doesn't give you back left over balances either. It's not really hard to figure out. 80 MS points = $1. I wish they would switch over to a money value like Sony's cards, and allow you to buy points in $1 increments, but I doubt this lawsuit will change anything.
coasterguy65
Good. I hate this system, and it's even worse on the 360 than onthe wii. They shouldn't be able to mask the price of their games behind a terrible conversion system. 1400 points for $20? That crap needs to end.
And while we're on the subject, you should be able to buy points in bulk. That goes for the Wii, too. If I want a super nintendo game, I should be able to buy 800 wii points, instead of having to buy 1000 and then have a useless 200 left over.
i guess people here dont know what the lawsuit is for?
basically, the guy says there's a minimum of purchaseable points from MS.i.e. a game is worth 800 MS points but the minimum is like 1000 so you have an extra hanging even though you only wanted to spend 800 points from it. this, in turn, will push the consumer to purchase more, but as he purchases more, there will still be leftovers from the point system. it means this is a hideous way of charging consumers for something that they initially wouldnt buy. i know you guys will say, 'then just dont spend it!' but the logic here is that MS knows that you either have to buy more points, or you can just leave it there with the extra points. at a consumer's point of view, you'd think it'd be better if you just spend more since you already have a 'downpayment' but that leads to more and more leftovers leading to more purchases. get it?
roddollente
Ooh. I fail at reading.
"Further, Microsoft only sells point packs in multiples of 400, often leaving gamers with excess points after purchasing content that they want. This last point is the subject of a new class action lawsuit..."
While Microsoft's system is intentionally stupid, unfair, misleading, shady, anti-consumer and annoying, I don't know if what they're doing is illegal. I hope it is.
Most of the time if you're going to buy an item you're forced to pay a downpayment on the next item you're going to purchase, and so on and on, really difficult to end this cycle.
Imagine if this was a real physical store. It would make no god damn sense and no sane person would shop there. But for some reason this is deemed acceptable in the digital world. Imagine if it wasn't, maybe you'd be awarded points for purchasing stuff like what a normal store does to encourage you to come back?
"But it's only 250 points or whatever."
So effing what? Imagine the accumulated sum of all XBL users. Microsoft is getting millions of dollars in interest free loans.
And I once did buy something I wasn't planning on just to get rid of the leftovers. Bought the Pure theme. Since you can't preview themes I didn't know that it was a piece of crap. I'd want a refund, but since this is the digital world that's not possible.
Digital distribution can suck so hard.
80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.[QUOTE="gamer620"][QUOTE="DumbDubya"]
LINK
This is one lawsuit against a video game company that I hope actually wins. I'm tired of Microsoft's stupid point system. Show it in dollar bills or a conversation rate that makes sense! Like 1.00 = 100 points.
DumbDubya
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
What kind of engineer are you that you need a calculator to figure out 400 ms = 5 dollars? I took art school math... Maybe i can get a job at nasa!Its a crafty system meant to confuse the customer into impulse buying, its a lot easier to do that when you don't advertise content in real money.
[QUOTE="DumbDubya"][QUOTE="gamer620"] 80 ms pts = 1 dollar... how is that so complicated? The only thing wrong with the system is that you can't buy it in dollar intervals. The fact that people have such a hard time comprehended their pt system is beyond me. Go back to first grade math.gamer620
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
What kind of engineer are you that you need a calculator to figure out 400 ms = 5 dollars? I took art school math... Maybe i can get a job at nasa! You should be re-taking english, he was speaking of the average consumer not himself personally needing to rely on a calculator.[QUOTE="roddollente"]
Ooh. I fail at reading.
"Further, Microsoft only sells point packs in multiples of 400, often leaving gamers with excess points after purchasing content that they want. This last point is the subject of a new class action lawsuit..."
While Microsoft's system is intentionally stupid, unfair, misleading, shady, anti-consumer and annoying, I don't know if what they're doing is illegal. I hope it is.
Most of the time if you're going to buy an item you're forced to pay a downpayment on the next item you're going to purchase, and so on and on, really difficult to end this cycle.
Imagine if this was a real physical store. It would make no god damn sense and no sane person would shop there. But for some reason this is deemed acceptable in the digital world. Imagine if it wasn't, maybe you'd be awarded points for purchasing stuff like what a normal store does to encourage you to come back?
"But it's only 250 points or whatever."
So effing what? Imagine the accumulated sum of all XBL users. Microsoft is getting millions of dollars in interest free loans.And I once did buy something I wasn't planning on just to get rid of the leftovers. Bought the Pure theme. Since you can't preview themes I didn't know that it was a piece of crap. I'd want a refund, but since this is the digital world that's not possible.
Digital distribution can suck so hard.
InsaneBasura
[QUOTE="roddollente"]
i guess people here dont know what the lawsuit is for?
basically, the guy says there's a minimum of purchaseable points from MS.i.e. a game is worth 800 MS points but the minimum is like 1000 so you have an extra hanging even though you only wanted to spend 800 points from it. this, in turn, will push the consumer to purchase more, but as he purchases more, there will still be leftovers from the point system. it means this is a hideous way of charging consumers for something that they initially wouldnt buy. i know you guys will say, 'then just dont spend it!' but the logic here is that MS knows that you either have to buy more points, or you can just leave it there with the extra points. at a consumer's point of view, you'd think it'd be better if you just spend more since you already have a 'downpayment' but that leads to more and more leftovers leading to more purchases. get it?
InsaneBasura
Ooh. I fail at reading.
"Further, Microsoft only sells point packs in multiples of 400, often leaving gamers with excess points after purchasing content that they want. This last point is the subject of a new ****action lawsuit..."
While Microsoft's system is intentionally stupid, unfair, misleading, shady, anti-consumer and annoying, I don't know if what they're doing is illegal. I hope it is.
Most of the time if you're going to buy an item you're forced to pay a downpayment on the next item you're going to purchase, and so on and on, really difficult to end this cycle.
Imagine if this was a real physical store. It would make no god damn sense and no sane person would shop there. But for some reason this is deemed acceptable in the digital world. Imagine if it wasn't, maybe you'd be awarded points for purchasing stuff like what a normal store does to encourage you to come back?
"But it's only 250 points or whatever."
So effing what? Imagine the accumulated sum of all XBL users. Microsoft is getting millions of dollars in interest free loans.
And I once did buy something I wasn't planning on just to get rid of the leftovers. Bought the Pure theme. Since you can't preview themes I didn't know that it was a piece of crap. I'd want a refund, but since this is the digital world that's not possible.
Digital distribution can suck so hard.
Pretty much sums up my problem with the point system.How can anyone get it? Every single time something seems unfair during a transaction people should file a lawsuit? The system isn't perfect, but there isn't anything hidden here & by buying the points you are agreeing to the terms of the points system.i guess people here dont know what the lawsuit is for?
basically, the guy says there's a minimum of purchaseable points from MS.i.e. a game is worth 800 MS points but the minimum is like 1000 so you have an extra hanging even though you only wanted to spend 800 points from it. this, in turn, will push the consumer to purchase more, but as he purchases more, there will still be leftovers from the point system. it means this is a hideous way of charging consumers for something that they initially wouldnt buy. i know you guys will say, 'then just dont spend it!' but the logic here is that MS knows that you either have to buy more points, or you can just leave it there with the extra points. at a consumer's point of view, you'd think it'd be better if you just spend more since you already have a 'downpayment' but that leads to more and more leftovers leading to more purchases. get it?
roddollente
[QUOTE="roddollente"]
i guess people here dont know what the lawsuit is for?
basically, the guy says there's a minimum of purchaseable points from MS.i.e. a game is worth 800 MS points but the minimum is like 1000 so you have an extra hanging even though you only wanted to spend 800 points from it. this, in turn, will push the consumer to purchase more, but as he purchases more, there will still be leftovers from the point system. it means this is a hideous way of charging consumers for something that they initially wouldnt buy. i know you guys will say, 'then just dont spend it!' but the logic here is that MS knows that you either have to buy more points, or you can just leave it there with the extra points. at a consumer's point of view, you'd think it'd be better if you just spend more since you already have a 'downpayment' but that leads to more and more leftovers leading to more purchases. get it?
InsaneBasura
Ooh. I fail at reading.
"Further, Microsoft only sells point packs in multiples of 400, often leaving gamers with excess points after purchasing content that they want. This last point is the subject of a new class action lawsuit..."
While Microsoft's system is intentionally stupid, unfair, misleading, shady, anti-consumer and annoying, I don't know if what they're doing is illegal. I hope it is.
Most of the time if you're going to buy an item you're forced to pay a downpayment on the next item you're going to purchase, and so on and on, really difficult to end this cycle.
Imagine if this was a real physical store. It would make no god damn sense and no sane person would shop there. But for some reason this is deemed acceptable in the digital world. Imagine if it wasn't, maybe you'd be awarded points for purchasing stuff like what a normal store does to encourage you to come back?
"But it's only 250 points or whatever."
So effing what? Imagine the accumulated sum of all XBL users. Microsoft is getting millions of dollars in interest free loans.
And I once did buy something I wasn't planning on just to get rid of the leftovers. Bought the Pure theme. Since you can't preview themes I didn't know that it was a piece of crap. I'd want a refund, but since this is the digital world that's not possible.
Digital distribution can suck so hard.
Another quote to add from the article:
"Lassoff's filing states that Microsoft contractually agreed to only charge for 'the complete, whole, and or actual digital goods and services purchased.'" This may or may not be true... I didn't read the ToS but i guessthis statementcan be read two different ways. You are purchasing their MS points which is their service/digital good or they are failing at this contractual agreement. I had around $10 worth of points which I lost and probably can never get back.
It does suck to have leftover points and are left with a decision to either buy more points or take the loss. Either way, MS wins. I took the loss and MS won.
What kind of engineer are you that you need a calculator to figure out 400 ms = 5 dollars? I took art school math... Maybe i can get a job at nasa! You should be re-taking english, he was speaking of the average consumer not himself personally needing to rely on a calculator. And you have statistics to prove that the average consumer is mentally retarded?Its a crafty system meant to confuse the customer into impulse buying, its a lot easier to do that when you don't advertise content in real money.
[QUOTE="gamer620"][QUOTE="DumbDubya"]
I'm an engineer and I know my math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumer can think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
tomarlyn
And perhaps YOU should re-read his post. He doesn't mention anything about the "average" consumer, he specifically just says "consumer" which includes HIMSELF.
And you have statistics to prove that the average consumer is mentally retarded? And perhaps YOU should re-read his post. He doesn't mention anything about the "average" consumer, he specifically just says "consumer" which includes HIMSELF.gamer620
I'm an engineer and I knowmy math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumercan think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
DumbDubya
''The consumer'' implies consumers on the whole.
Why would MS not use $1.00 = 100 points and let a person only buy as many as they needed to buy content? I think they need to be sued because their system seems to favor them and ripoff the consumer. Sony uses dollar amounts and only charges the exact amount from your credit card each time you buy.
Why would MS not use $1.00 = 100 points and let a person only buy as many as they needed to buy content? I think they need to be sued because their system seems to favor them and ripoff the consumer. Sony uses dollar amounts and only charges the exact amount from your credit card each time you buy.
patriots7672
Because, as a previous poster stated, it's a win win situation for M$. If you want 1200 msp piece of DLC you have to pay (minimum) $25 for 1600 points (excluding taxes). Now after purchasing and DL that piece of content you're left with 400 msp. You don't want or need those points because you simply wanted that 1200 msp piece of content. Now either you leave those points on your account (in limbo) or you buy some silly avatar pet or something.. < Something you'd never do if you didn't have excess points. It's dirty IMHO but not illegal.. However I hope this does make M$ re think the point system (most likely won't).
And to those fanboys spouting numbers left and right.. You're not understanding what the lawsuit is about. I'm shocked that no one else is admitting what M$ is doing here...
[QUOTE="gamer620"]And you have statistics to prove that the average consumer is mentally retarded? And perhaps YOU should re-read his post. He doesn't mention anything about the "average" consumer, he specifically just says "consumer" which includes HIMSELF.tomarlyn
I'm an engineer and I knowmy math probably better than you and this is a stupid conversation rate. Instead of making it a logical conversation rate that the consumercan think through their head, they have to pull out their calculator.
DumbDubya
''The consumer'' implies consumers on the whole.
Yes, including HIMSELF as he would be part of that "on the whole". If he isn't a consumer than why would he care? You would be a consumer as well. Are you stupid? Do you need to help of a calculator to process that 80 ms = $1? can you seriously not process that in your head? That is what he is implying and which you are defending. That the consumer is to stupid to process simple math. Everyone that buys stuff off of the marketplace on these boards are to stupid to process simple math functions in there head. Microsoft makes us all feel dumb because of their global approach to spending. That is exactly what he is stating.But i will gladly eat my words if you can supply statistics that the majority of xbox live users ARE indeed to stupid to process this math in their head because out side of like 2 people in this thread i don't know ANY SINGLE PERSON online or in real life, that struggles to comprehend this. Ask the engineer here for help if you are struggling with the math side of the statistics because clearly the rest of us are to stupid to.
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