Let's discuss Bloodborne (open spoilers)

Bloodborne was one of the first big releases of this year, the first major and highly acclaimed exclusive for the PS4, and still ranks as one of the highest rated games of this generation. Plenty of people are still calling it a frontrunner for Game of the Year.

It's been long enough since the game was out that I think we can take a reasoned look at it, devoid of all the honeymoon period hype. What did you think about Bloodborne? And why?

Personally, Bloodborne was the first Souls game I ever really got into and finished- I believe the extremely fast paced and aggressive combat may have had a lot to do with that. The combat in Bloodborne was simply perfect, and might be my favorite in a game yet. Everything about it just worked, and made the moment to moment gameplay and encounters of Bloodborne a joy to play through,

Another aspect of Bloodborne I really enjoyed was its story, and how it told that story. Though it might not be apparent to the average player right away, there was a deep, highly disturbing, lore heavy story in Bloodborne. It was a good story, philosophically and metaphysically provocative, and as good an adaptation of Lovecraftian mythos as any- the way Bloodborne told that story, however, which was entirely passive, requiring active engagement from the player, either by going out of their way to retrieve and examine key items, or simply through the environment itself, was what set it apart in my opinion- Bloodborne took full advantage of its medium and its strengths, and uniquely told a story that would not have been as effective if told via any other medium.

The environments were something else that were immediately arresting. Visually stunning, they set up the perfect atmosphere and backdrop to our story that was unfolding in the game. But their real strength came from the absolutely excellent level design of the game- in many cases, Bloodborne featured pitch perfect level design, a masterpiece of player engagement. When I think back to Hermwick Charnel Lane or the Forbidden Woods, my mind still reels at how great and well designed those areas really were.

There were numerous smaller things I appreciated about the game, too- how much it respects the player, and gives them agency, for example, or just how well the bosses are often designed. How the game is not really difficult once you get the hang of it, just at the right cusp of challenging and achievable. In fact, for a while, it was easy for me to believe that outside of the framerate drops (an admittedly egregious issue) and maybe the long loading times were the only problems with the game.

If Bloodborne had continued down that path, it would have ended as one of my all time favorite games. Unfortunately, the game has an inflection point, a sort of volta, from where it generally turns to shit. My issue is with everything that follows Rom, which is just poorly designed- Nightmare Frontier, Nightmare of Menses, and Yahar Gul are the absolute antithesis of the game's good design that has preceded it so far. Poor area layouts, poor encounter design (they aim to overwhelm the player, rather than presenting the legitimate challenge the earlier areas tried to), poor boss design, and a general emphasis on avoidingcombat rather than engaging in them makes these areas absolutely terrible- and single handedly drags down everything that Bloodborne has accomplished right until then. The fact that they come right after the high of Forbidden Woods also does not help.

The Chalice Dungeons are pretty terrible too- they take away the best parts about Bloodborne, similar to the three areas listed above (good encounter design, good area design, atmosphere), and their novelty factor is not enough to compensate for that. The frustrating thing is, I am pretty sure that some of the most important bosses and lore are all hidden away in these dungeons.

It also hurts the game that its metagame is generally poor. There are only two or maybe three viable builds, which means that the game, played properly once, does not lend itself to subsequent replays as well as an RPG really should. I really want to get back to Bloodborne, but in terms of actual moment to moment gameplay, I am pretty sure it would be a repeat of my first playthrough- same build, same play style, same results.

Bloodbore was rushed near the end of its development, and that shows. These issues do mark it down- but really, as a game, it is still a stunning achievement and should be celebrated. Game of the Year? Nah. Not even the best game on PS4 of this year, to be honest. Its issues ultimately did hold it back from all time greatness. But an amazing and stunning game regardless- I am so glad I gave it some time under the sun... or moon.

I have zero interest in playing BB or any souls game for that matter. I don't like the slow combat and long animations and replaying the same areas over and over to memorize where enemies are. Also don't like the artstyle for BB, it looks all black and gray and bland and boring.

Dat wall!!! But yes, i'm hyped for the dlc, its just that i feel like it takes them waaaay too long. I haven't played the game since mid June but when the dlc comes out, ill be back. I hope they do something with the bell maidens because when im done with the new campaign, i'd like to do multiplayers and in its current state its simply not working.

Yeah I'd have to agree the combat feels so much better now, and that was one of my biggest gripes about the previous souls games.

Bloodborne is the one shining light in a very dim 2015 for PS4 owners. Enjoy it for everything that it is. It's just not GOTY.

Wasn't good enough to keep me interested from beginning to end. Luckily I only rented it because I would have been very disappointed if I paid $60 for it.

Don't get me wrong, I didn't hate it or anything, and it had its moments, but I felt the game became incoherent somewhere around the middle and did a very poor job at pacing and hinting you were to go. I got tired of roaming the streets and not knowing where a password and key was to open up doors to bosses. I think a game fails when you have to look up stuff on the net to advance after repetitive exhaustion sets in. I don't want to be hand held, but at least give a vague idea of where I'm supposed to go in some fashion.

@mems_1224: To be fair, a whole lot of your complaints no longer apply with bloodborne.

Wait, you're one of the biggest critics of those games here and you never played any of them? Lulz!

Anyway, Bloodborne is all right but the worst of the Souls games to me. Not enough loot, no real magic or useful long range attacks, only possible play style is aggressive melee, environments all look too similar and the chalice dungeons completely killed my urge to ever play it again.

Nightmare Frontier was so bad. other areas of the game you mentioned felt incomplete, rushed, and empty. like they forgot to do something with them. like they were in Alpha state and left it that way. after running through Yahar gul so many times and talking to one of my buddies who also posts here on Gamespot we also shared some thoughts on this area and we totally agreed on that area being so empty and poorly designed. the enemy placement too. later when it opens up after time changes it gets better but it felt lacking still. like is there more to it?

The chalice dungeons got repetitive especially the early easy ones but the more challenging ones were fun to go through. abhorrent beast boss fight was a freaking challenging. he never gives room to breathe and just pushes you into corners until he destroys you (by the i'm talking the tough abhorrent beast, not the weakling beast. amygdalla was like two hits and boom you're dead. the chalice dungeons had the most challenging bosses in a souls game (the higher level dungeons of course). and later they take half if your health and force you to fight with skill and learn from your mistakes vs early dungeons where you feel overpowered, at least in my experience because i went into the dungeons before the final boss fight gate opens. I have videos on my PS4 beating those bosses and it was a great feeling. i recommend you rush through the dungeons quickly and just head to the bosses because that's where the fun is. and later in those dungeons you'll encounter some tough as shit enemies that could kill you with two hits as well. great, fun challenge. just stick with it if you love the combat so much.

overall I agree but I would say it does deserve to be nominated for GOTY because it was an excellent game and well designed and has combat that makes you feel like you're in castlevania and shit. seriously that satisfying feeling when you parry some enemy and then punch a hole in them and dodge around. fucking felt like alucard and it was cool as shit (sorry for the hyperbole, love the feeling parry and combat gives.:P) . give me an RPG that had combat as good as Bloodborne this year? Not the Wicther 3 Lol.

Demon's Souls remains the best of the series to me and Dark souls 2 the worst. So Demon's > Dark Souls 1 > Bloodborne > Dark Souls 2. btw i forgot almost everything about DS2, it's just not as memorable as the other games other than a few bosses and the dragon slayer. it also had that dark area where i kept falling which I hated lol.

if only bloodborne has more variety in it's builds and more weapons and equipment and just more in general that helps with the replay value, I think it would have ended up an even more amazing game. it felt like Miyazaki was sort of testing something with bloodborne. kinda get that feeling like it could have been more to it. it's excellent of course. I hope for a sequel someday or a spiritual successor.

NOW FROM SOFTWARE give me a Ninja Souls game with even faster combat or even a castlevania like game. even better a Berserk game.

Phenomena game and is my runner-up to GOTY. I highly anticipate the expansion and a sequel hopefully. I did enjoy Demons Souls more though.

It's weakest in the series , lost interest in its way too repetitive game play and lack of variety in weapons and it's armor/clothing. Ds3 now please

Really liked it, yeah I had to farm like a little ***** at times but I managed, really looking forward to that DLC. TW3 stole my personal GOTY from it though, hardly had any fate in it after trying out TW1/2, man was I wrong.

After hearing you and @darkspineslayer play the one boss and knowing @TheEroica will never finish the game, I'll never buy it. :P

If the game didn't have respawning enemies with a more A to B form of progression I could dig it, but the entire game to me feels like a repetitive grind. I've tried to force myself multiple times to get into it but it's just never going to happen.

With some tweaks I could like it, say it we're more like Sword of the Berserk: Guts' Rage, I love that game, but this has just enough things I dislike to drive me away completely.

where did i say i never played one?

It's nice.

loved it. thought it was the 2nd best game from Miyzaki just behind Dark Souls.. didnt care for the Chalice Dungeons though, they are really repetitive and i only went through them for the platinum. Cant wait for news on the DLC

It's impossible for me not to compare it to the past entries a bit, and in that case, it as an overall package doesn't hold up to the past three games (admittedly I'm lenient towards DS2 despite its glaring flaws because it was my first Souls game).

The combat is absolutely fantastic, but it lacks the variety found in games that made me want to replay them. It definitely has depth, just not variety. And as much as streamlining weapon upgrades was a good idea, I liked the different rocks from the past games adding a sense of liveliness to the their worlds.

The game is also way too samey in terms of level theming, which can be annoying when reflecting on some of the best levels. I think the individual level design is very good and most of the time it's up there with the best of the series. As a Metroidvania it's absolutely lacking because the levels just mostly loop back on themselves like Demon's Souls, usually in less creative ways. Dark Souls and Lordran are fucking awesome at how organic and surprising the world loops were. Dark Souls 2 was Dark Souls 2 in that regard.

Overall I'll definitely play it again, hopefully at a higher frame rate down the line. It just doesn't beckon me to go back at it like other Souls games, and it's really a game that feels like the sum of its parts and not much more. Hopefully the DLC lives up to From's excellent standards in that regard.

If you get it, I will help you via co-op :D

@Heil68: @charizard1605: Heil's mad I beat demon souls without getting hit.

People saying its the weakest in the series don't know crap. BB has the best campaign of the series, what's lacking is customization.

It's the strongest single player and the weakest multiplayer is the way I always look at it.

You what?!?

@charizard1605: that is the case.

Bloodborne > Dark Souls (1 and 2) > Demon Souls

GOTY. Still gotta go through other's dungeon chalices to get me some free loot for when I bag the game.

Demons' Souls 4

with

Demons' Souls 5 coming in 2016

From's one trick pony is getting boring.

Lied..he hated Tower Knight..lolz

I go back and forth on my opinions of Bloodborne.

Talking strictly combat mechanics, how enemies are designed, how bosses are made up, and how the level design works it has the best moment to moment gameplay in a RPG period of any kind, barring a tactical rpg. The game feel is exactly where I want it where the hits have some real umph to them, the stagger system/parry system feels fantastic given the timing windows, the dodge move and re-heal up if you counterattack your hits quickly is all smart and makes the game more active. And the part where it all keeps it reasonable with the stats where they matter, but not enough that they over value personal skill at the mechanics is a balancing act From Software is top notch at. So at it's core it feels great. However while I'm not the biggest fan of loot stuff, and Dark Souls had so much filler useless shit, that I'm reminded the RPG fanbase will tolerate whatever bullshit because "RPG", there was still more build variety in Dark Souls. Arcane builds simply aren't all that fun to do in Bloodborne, and it feels like your go to stats are always vit, endur, strength, or skill. So you're making power builds or dex builds. And that is a little limiting.

Also the PvP being limited to a few areas is a mistake, it takes out one of the core pillars of what has made Demon's Souls and Dark Souls special.

On the other hand, Bloodborne's ability to make this labyrinth like levels that fall back in on themselves is a masterclass of exceptional level design, that the open world RPGs really can't compete with Bloodborne gets in on a strong run. It's something Demon's Souls and Dark Souls stack up favorably against, but that's the same dev, so it makes sense. I know some people got lost and needed the internet at times, but I'm of the opinion that you're either on some level incompetent, because it's pretty straight forward as far as Soulsy stuff has ever been. That and for the most part that's what exploration should be, it should be you discovering things more or less on your own, not having it spoon fed to you. I could understand if it made you do some castlevania 2 bullshit, but it really doesn't, except for like 1 or 2 secret areas.

The narrative aspect of the Souls games I have a love/hate relationship with. I am of the opinion that video games need to begin finding ways to tell the story through gameplay, through interactive means, and that their reliance on cutscenes, text, and all that jazz is a detriment in the long run. It's aping better mediums that do that type of story telling and the plots in general, better. So in that context I appreciate a lot about the souls games. The plot is usually straight forward and understood within the first few minutes in the case of Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne. Dark Souls 2 is bullshit, but that's because that game is underwhelming (although it has the most build variety for PvP). The lore and story telling however are legit, as discovering things about the world if you want to is fascinating, it's what i like about Metroid Prime. It highlights a strength of this medium as far as story telling, it's something a book, a movie, a tv show, music, theater, or a fucking ballet can't do in comparison.

However making it all item descriptions is a little too silly. Maybe something other than my weapon descriptions would be more ideal.

Chalice Dungeons were also fucking boring after a certain point. The game is already repetitive in the sense that well you mostly go kill things in the same slashy manner, but chalice dungeons are procedural levels so the usual brand of sophisticated level design that I really like about these games is lost in those dungeons. Plus there is a lot of repeating areas, repeating bosses, and it all feels like a grind, and I'm glad I didn't do much of it during my main playthrough.

I also can't stand at least one of the major areas in the game, I've grown to appreciate what the Mother Brain area is doing.

So all in all it's still in my opinion the 2nd best exclusive these consoles have to offer (Bayonetta 2 being my pick for the best), but I go back and forth whether or not I think the game is really good (lazy it up, a Champ 8/10) or actually great (a champ 9/10). Semantics sure, but while I was absorbed by the game for the first playthrough, that 2nd go around I just got a bit tired and din't give a **** as much. Demon's Souls and Dark Souls I replayed, and I value my ability to replay a game. It's why Bayonetta and Bayonetta 2 do rank so highly for me, it's why I do think a game like Mario Galaxy 2 is special and what have you. Anything can be great once, but like a great book or a great movie, I should be able to go back to it...and I'm not sure how much of me not wanting to back to Bloodborne was how exhausted I got after one playthrough, or how the lack of build variety and the chalice dungeons being my new content is the real issue.

The core gameplay loop and dungeon crawling aspect of the game I absolutely love. Most of the boss fights are rad, and since my 2nd playthrough is lazy I'm summoning people mode I get to have a lot of fun looking at other peoples hunters...who all wear the same 4 or 5 outfits. I do dig those Vatividyas on the game, so that aspect is always enjoyable.

As it stands it should be a contender for GOTY, but my 40 hours of MGSV have floored me and I love me some Rocket League. Part of the issue for Bloodborne is that, as much as it tweaks things, it's more or less Demon's Souls 4 (really 3, because I really can't stand what I've played of Dark Souls 2). And I've played enough of that, MGSV feels a bit evolutionary for its franchise in comparison. Mother Base stuff not with standing.

I played for about an hour and then stopped, it was too boring for me personally. There is a reason people stopped talking about it. hell nobody even mentioned it a week after it's released. there are a niche group of people that loved it, but for the most part It wasn't very good

Still my personal GOTY. Have yet to beat phantom pain though. W3 was also very good but the gameplay puts it down of BB on my personal GOTY candidates. Still love Bloodborne to pieces

@darkangel115: why dafuq people come with that stupid argument? "No one talked about it the week after so nobody cares"... guess what? The vast majority of games aren't talked about after the initial hype. Gamers are always hyping the next thing. The witcher 3 was also barely talked about the week after either. You mean no one cares about it as well? Get a grip

Possibly yes, games that continued to get talked about are generally liked. Or they were good but people are generally done playing them at that point

Personally found it lacking, combat was boring and customization was bare bones at best it definity a weaker game than the soul series the only thing I think it did better was the world setting.

@darkangel115: that's b.s. of the highest grade. Barely any game is talked about soon after release. Don't be naive. The hype dies, it just that simple. Or, never ocurred to you that people, ya know, are actually playing the game?

@FoxbatAlpha: oh yes, because Xbox owners had plenty to play this year... /sarcasm

Oh, and lets forget everybody's gone to the rapture (AAAE) and until dawn (AAE)

edit: aaaaannnnd until dawn just won game of the month btw

It's not being naive, a week is very small for hype to die down. at worst the best argument you could make against me is that people who enjoy things generally don't comment, it's the people the hate something that go to the internet to complain. Truthfully, there is no way to know how many people who purchased it enjoyed it, both myself and you are just speculating.

There is much to say

• PS4's only game. (more than xbone)
• Some of the best level design I have ever fucking seen.
• Parrying is almost 100% necessary
• Faster
• Only fun for one playthrough
• sickdark, lovecraftian edgefest
• shallowest lore
• Shortest lived souls-esque game
• Literally zero fucking build variety
• Bloodvial farming simulator
• The worst souls PvP (thanks bloodvials)
• CHALICE DUNGEONS LOOOOOOL
• 2 minute wait death-punishment-screens
• Better than DS2
• Worse than DS1, Demons and (probably) DS3
• Shittiest, most barebones souls game
• Yet the only deserving GOTY candidate, too bad it will get cucked out of it by FO4, MGSV OR TW3, BB deserves it more simply for being a souls game.
• I fucking liked it ok? Go away.

Mine do.

And now I expect everyone to fall to their knees and say:

"Oh, Skelly34, how very right you were!"

I don't go all into my head to analyze the game. I had a great time playing it. I will play it some more soon.

I kinda disagree about the post-Rom content, but I can see your point. It's quite true that there are only 2-3 viable builds in the whole game and certain weapons are miles ahead of others. I put a little over 200 hours into BB and I am level 180ish so all my stats have hit the point of diminishing returns. Of course I beat it and was trudging thru NG+ thinking to myself the blood gems would scale.

They. Did. Not.

So I started to plunder the Chalice Dungeons. I got stuck on the one where you fight the big fire dog thing with half life. Even with 2 of the max life runes equipped he could still one shot from across the room when he gets down to 1/4 life or so. It takes soooo long to get him to this point my brain is just numb by the time he one shots me at full life.

I put the controller down 3 months ago and haven't picked the game up since. It had turned into a blood gem farming simulator except 99% of gems you do get are absolute shit.

It's probably the best ps4 has to offer but it's a niche game and probably won't appeal to as many people as Tomb Raider or Halo. It's far from goty but the people who love it really do. This site gave Demons' Souls goty so it's still possible.