MGS4 the Ps3s last hope?

NO....nuff said

wow that was the shortest discussion ever

nope

The system isn't dead and it wont die. Its just losing its chance of being on top of the hill. Sony made some bad decisions when this system was being blue-printed and I think they did the same with the PSP. IMO they tried to hard with their media formats and did some late thinking with the games itself. PSP had some great hand held capabilities but while gamers wanted games the PSP was not the answer and the DS had a decent variety. Same goes for the PS3.

EDIT: oops... 1st was gamespot error second was my stupidity on typing.

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

PoppaLemming

It won't go multi-plat. It just isn't possible from a hardware perspective.

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

PoppaLemming

[QUOTE="PoppaLemming"]

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

-Spock-

It won't go multi-plat. It just isn't possible from a hardware perspective.

Dude just hush with that fanboy BS. 360 and PS3 graphics are the damn same. They could put MGS4 on the Wii if they wanted too. That'swhat you have computer programmers for

[QUOTE="PoppaLemming"]

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

-Spock-

It won't go multi-plat. It just isn't possible from a hardware perspective.

unless you are working on the game you don't know that

it was said about other games "they need the cell" but they came 360's way

I'm not saying its coming to the 360 but I think it could

Discuss.jarhead1990

Neh, life ain't that bad for PS3 as-is.

My prognosis is: PS3 can survive, because Gamecube survived.

It's last hope at survival? no

It's last hope at taking first? no

People seem to forget that the big system movers on the Playstations have always been Gran Turismo and platformers

[QUOTE="-Spock-"][QUOTE="PoppaLemming"]

Agreed. If MGS4 were to go multi-plat... it would be a disaster for the PS3 of astronomical proportions.

And what does a strong E3 showing have to do with anything? Only serious video game hardcore players follow E3. Casuals don't even know what the heck E3 is

PoppaLemming

It won't go multi-plat. It just isn't possible from a hardware perspective.

Dude just hush with that fanboy BS. 360 and PS3 graphics are the damn same. They could put MGS4 on the Wii if they wanted too. That'swhat you have computer programmers for

It's not fanboy BS. There's always going to be the rare game which you just have to say "this isn't possible on the 360" or even "this isn't possible on the PS3". Not all games can work on both platforms. MGS4 is such a game. Kojima has already voiced his concerns about disc space, even going as far as saying that Blu-ray may not be enough for what he wants to achieve. He goes on to say that Solid Snake's Octocamo, a main gameplay and story feature might I add, is specially suited for the Cell processor. Sure, it could come to the 360, but quoting Kojima itself: "it wouldn't be the same game".

Back in the days when I was working on 8-bit, 1 MB ROMs came out and I thought, "wow, great!" But it wasn't enough. When the CD-ROM came out, we thought we had so much space. But when we started to add sound, there was a lack of storage already. Even Blu-ray, I don't even feel that it expanded data so much. With cinematic, the space fills up right away. You may hear Blu-ray is huge, gigantic, 20 GB or so, but that's not really that big to us. One basic [gameplay] frame with HD and 5.1 takes up so much space that the capacity will become too small in no time. If we maintain the same level of graphics and sound as the PS2, then Blu-ray is spacious. But that's not the case.Kojima

http://www.gamepro.com/news.cfm?article_id=94011

Even if it WAS the PS3's last hope. said console would be utterly screwed, as the MGS series has NEVER been a system-seller franchise.Verge_6

Metal Gear Solid 2 on the PS2 sold 7 million copies worldwide. That means that there must have been as many PS2 systems out there to play the game. Sure, MGS3 only sold half that figure, but you cannot deny that MGS was at one time as big a system seller as the original Halo or Gears of War.

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]Even if it WAS the PS3's last hope. said console would be utterly screwed, as the MGS series has NEVER been a system-seller franchise.-Spock-

Metal Gear Solid 2 on the PS2 sold 7 million copies worldwide. That means that there must have been as many PS2 systems out there to play the game. Sure, MGS3 only sold half that figure, but you cannot deny that MGS was at one time as big a system seller as the original Halo or Gears of War.

Ah, but if you look at the attach-rate (which I was using from the start), you'll see that even MGS2 wasn't that big of a system-seller. However, I AM glad that it got a great amount of people into the Zone of the Ender franchise.

[QUOTE="-Spock-"]

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]Even if it WAS the PS3's last hope. said console would be utterly screwed, as the MGS series has NEVER been a system-seller franchise.Verge_6

Metal Gear Solid 2 on the PS2 sold 7 million copies worldwide. That means that there must have been as many PS2 systems out there to play the game. Sure, MGS3 only sold half that figure, but you cannot deny that MGS was at one time as big a system seller as the original Halo or Gears of War.

Ah, but if you look at the attach-rate (which I was using from the start), you'll see that even MGS2 wasn't that big of a system-seller. However, I AM glad that it got a great amount of people into the Zone of the Ender franchise.

If you look at the attach rate, virtually no game on the PS2 can be considered a system-seller.

[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="-Spock-"]

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]Even if it WAS the PS3's last hope. said console would be utterly screwed, as the MGS series has NEVER been a system-seller franchise.fuzzysquash

Metal Gear Solid 2 on the PS2 sold 7 million copies worldwide. That means that there must have been as many PS2 systems out there to play the game. Sure, MGS3 only sold half that figure, but you cannot deny that MGS was at one time as big a system seller as the original Halo or Gears of War.

Ah, but if you look at the attach-rate (which I was using from the start), you'll see that even MGS2 wasn't that big of a system-seller. However, I AM glad that it got a great amount of people into the Zone of the Ender franchise.

If you look at the attach rate, virtually no game on the PS2 can be considered a system-seller.

Pretty much...which is the consequence of having the best selling console in history.

Discuss.jarhead1990

Considering MGS3 sales, I doubt it will move many consoles. The PS3 savior is Final Fantasy since it can move consoles world wide and not just in the U.S. but..................... it won't be here until 2008 ....... my guess is toward the end of 2008 and by that time it might be too late.

Pretty much...which is the consequence of having the best selling console in history.

Verge_6

Which I'd have to disagree with. I don't mean to be insistent, but this is a point that often gets overlooked.

Of course the PS2 had system sellers. A "system seller", though definitionally vague, roughly refers to a highly successful game that helps move consoles. What helped the PS2 was the quality, but also the sheer number of big titles. Combined together, all of these titles helped moved PS2's, but it was the biggest ones that had the biggest impact.

A 7 million-unit selling game, by any standard on any console, ought to be considered a system seller. Indeed, few games on the PS2 have surpassed MGS2's sales.

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]

Pretty much...which is the consequence of having the best selling console in history.

fuzzysquash

Which I'd have to disagree with. I don't mean to be insistent, but this is a point that often gets overlooked.

Of course the PS2 had system sellers. A "system seller", though definitionally vague, roughly refers to a highly successful game that helps move consoles. What helped the PS2 was the quality, but also the sheer number of big titles. Combined together, all of these titles helped moved PS2's, but it was the biggest ones that had the biggest impact.

A 7 million-unit selling game, by any standard on any console, ought to be considered a system seller. Indeed, few games on the PS2 have surpassed MGS2's sales.

But if you just look at the grand scheme of things, the MGS series is just one fish in 50 gallon tank. Yes, if you combine all the other great series, you have a hell of alot of console moviers. But alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically. And even if it did, the decline of sales post-MGS2 doesn't really bode well either.

[QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Verge_6"]

Pretty much...which is the consequence of having the best selling console in history.

Verge_6

Which I'd have to disagree with. I don't mean to be insistent, but this is a point that often gets overlooked.

Of course the PS2 had system sellers. A "system seller", though definitionally vague, roughly refers to a highly successful game that helps move consoles. What helped the PS2 was the quality, but also the sheer number of big titles. Combined together, all of these titles helped moved PS2's, but it was the biggest ones that had the biggest impact.

A 7 million-unit selling game, by any standard on any console, ought to be considered a system seller. Indeed, few games on the PS2 have surpassed MGS2's sales.

But if you just look at the grand scheme of things, the MGS series is just one fish in 50 gallon tank. Yes, if you combine all the other great series, you have a hell of alot of console moviers. But alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically. And even if it did, the decline of sales post-MGS2 doesn't really bode well either.

Not a whole lot of fish can live in a 50 gallon tank, at least not a lot of medium-sized fish. MGS isn't exactly a small fish.

Neh, life ain't that bad for PS3 as-is.

My prognosis is: PS3 can survive, because Gamecube survived.

alzdaman

Logic Sony Fanboys can not comprehend...Just because your in last. Doesn't mean its dead. Just means it sold the least...

[QUOTE="Verge_6"][QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Verge_6"]

Pretty much...which is the consequence of having the best selling console in history.

alzdaman

Which I'd have to disagree with. I don't mean to be insistent, but this is a point that often gets overlooked.

Of course the PS2 had system sellers. A "system seller", though definitionally vague, roughly refers to a highly successful game that helps move consoles. What helped the PS2 was the quality, but also the sheer number of big titles. Combined together, all of these titles helped moved PS2's, but it was the biggest ones that had the biggest impact.

A 7 million-unit selling game, by any standard on any console, ought to be considered a system seller. Indeed, few games on the PS2 have surpassed MGS2's sales.

But if you just look at the grand scheme of things, the MGS series is just one fish in 50 gallon tank. Yes, if you combine all the other great series, you have a hell of alot of console moviers. But alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically. And even if it did, the decline of sales post-MGS2 doesn't really bode well either.

Not a whole lot of fish can live in a 50 gallon tank, at least not a lot of medium-sized fish. MGS isn't exactly a small fish.

I meant 500, actually. I wasn't saying it was a 'small fish', but it is by no means the Playstation consoles' Halo (sales-wise, I mean).

But if you just look at the grand scheme of things, the MGS series is just one fish in 50 gallon tank. Yes, if you combine all the other great series, you have a hell of alot of console moviers. But alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically. And even if it did, the decline of sales post-MGS2 doesn't really bode well either.

Verge_6

I grant you the last point, but keep in mind that MGS3 was the first MGS to not debut on a next-generation system, and historically MGS titles have been the trailblazers in Playstation technology and thus were highly hyped. MGS3 did not receive this level of hype because it came out relatively late in the life of PS2.

And I still have to disagree with you on the point that "alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically." No one would deny that GTA III was a system seller for the PS2. But based on attach rate, the game sold to less than 10% of the final PS2 userbase. One might well argue that that's "statistically insignificant" and that GTA III did not do much on its own.

Yet this is clearly flawed, as industry experts universally consider GTA III as one of the PS2's biggest movers. And considering that MGS2 is much closer to GTA III sales than 99% of the thousands of other PS2 titles, MGS2 was certainly a system-mover. Thus, in my opinion, it is incorrect to say that the MGS series has "never been" a system seller.

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]

But if you just look at the grand scheme of things, the MGS series is just one fish in 50 gallon tank. Yes, if you combine all the other great series, you have a hell of alot of console moviers. But alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically. And even if it did, the decline of sales post-MGS2 doesn't really bode well either.

fuzzysquash

I grant you the last point, but keep in mind that MGS3 was the first MGS to not debut on a next-generation system, and historically MGS titles have been the trailblazers in Playstation technology and thus were highly hyped. MGS3 did not receive this level of hype because it came out relatively late in the life of PS2.

And I still have to disagree with you on the point that "alone, the MGS series didn't do much statistically." No one would deny that GTA III was a system seller for the PS2. But based on attach rate, the game sold to less than 10% of the final PS2 userbase. One might well argue that that's "statistically insignificant" and that GTA III did not do much on its own.

Yet this is clearly flawed, as industry experts universally consider GTA III as one of the PS2's biggest movers. And considering that MGS2 is much closer to GTA III sales than 99% of the thousands of other PS2 titles, MGS2 was certainly a system-mover. Thus, in my opinion, it is incorrect to say that the MGS series has "never been" a system seller.

I guess we just have different view-points on what a system-seller really is. Granted, MGS2 did extremely well in sales, but none of the other games in the series fared nearly as well, which is the main reason why I think MGS4 isn't the 'saving grace' of the PS3.

I guess we just have different view-points on what a system-seller really is. Granted, MGS2 did extremely well in sales, but none of the other games in the series fared nearly as well, which is the main reason why I think MGS4 isn't the 'saving grace' of the PS3.

Verge_6

I have to disagree with that statement as well. The original MGS sold 6.6 million units compared to MGS2's 7 million, so I would consider that faring "nearly as well."

According to this list, MGS is the seventh highest selling Playstation game of all time, and MGS2 is the fifth highest selling PS2 game of all time. If those aren't system sellers, I don't know what are.

But like I said before, I grant you the point that MGS3 didn't sell as well as its predecessors, with 3.7 million units. However, MGS3 did not receive nearly the same level of hype that MGS4 currently has, primarily because of the technology factor I pointed out earlier. On the other hand, MGS2's console wasn't nearly as expensive as MGS4's, so we shall have to wait and see.

FFXIII?

God of War 3?

Tekken 6?

Jak & Daxter: The Lost Frontier?

There's a lot more out there than MGS to save the day.

[QUOTE="Verge_6"]

I guess we just have different view-points on what a system-seller really is. Granted, MGS2 did extremely well in sales, but none of the other games in the series fared nearly as well, which is the main reason why I think MGS4 isn't the 'saving grace' of the PS3.

fuzzysquash

I have to disagree with that statement as well. The original MGS sold 6.6 million units compared to MGS2's 7 million, so I would consider that faring "nearly as well."

According to this list, MGS is the seventh highest selling Playstation game of all time, and MGS2 is the fifth highest selling PS2 game of all time. If those aren't system sellers, I don't know what are.

But like I said before, I grant you the point that MGS3 didn't sell as well as its predecessors, with 3.7 million units. However, MGS3 did not receive nearly the same level of hype that MGS4 currently has (primarily because of the technology factor I pointed out earlier) so we shall have to wait and see.

I meant with the PS2, sorry. I should have clarified that.

[QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Verge_6"]

I guess we just have different view-points on what a system-seller really is. Granted, MGS2 did extremely well in sales, but none of the other games in the series fared nearly as well, which is the main reason why I think MGS4 isn't the 'saving grace' of the PS3.

Verge_6

I have to disagree with that statement as well. The original MGS sold 6.6 million units compared to MGS2's 7 million, so I would consider that faring "nearly as well."

According to this list, MGS is the seventh highest selling Playstation game of all time, and MGS2 is the fifth highest selling PS2 game of all time. If those aren't system sellers, I don't know what are.

But like I said before, I grant you the point that MGS3 didn't sell as well as its predecessors, with 3.7 million units. However, MGS3 did not receive nearly the same level of hype that MGS4 currently has (primarily because of the technology factor I pointed out earlier) so we shall have to wait and see.

I meant with the PS2, sorry. I should have clarified that.

Oh, okay.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on what a "system seller" is. I would consider any console title that sells over 5 million units a "system seller".