Nvidias Big Trouble In Little China

Good news, after a bunch of Ubisoft plebs got downgraded to serving fries at Mcdonalds, China has wiped the floor with America, a side project no less, he wasn't even using his full power.

Nvidia Stock Price Colossally Crashes After New DeepSeek AI Model Emerges

Nvidia remains one of the world's largest companies by market cap, but the chip-maker is having a tough day on the stock market today. The company's share price slid by nearly 17% today, wiping out more than $500 billion in market cap. Should this hold through the end of the trading day, it would be far and away the biggest single-day trading loss for a company in history. Nvidia's previous $279 billion one-day dip is the existing record-holder.

Why is Nvidia stock tanking? The stock price had been surging for the past two years as investors felt bullish on the company's fortunes due to excitement in the market about artificial intelligence. Nvidia sells the necessary GPUs to train large-language models and for general AI use, after all.

But at the end of last week, Chinese AI start-up DeepSeek launched a new model, R1, that the company claims is far cheaper than other models out there, including Open AI's o1. The fear from investors, it seems, is that AI companies may not actually require as much computing power as it was once believed. This, in turn, could have spooked investors and sent Nvidia's stock price down.

Some of Nvidia's rivals in the AI space, including Arm and Broadcom, also saw their share prices slump on Monday. Stock prices regularly move, sometimes dramatically so, in response to relevant market announcements.

DeepSeek is not new, but instead was founded after a spin-out from hedge fund High-Flyer in 2023. DeepSeek's own paper said its R1 model was trained for a cost of about $5.6 million, which is just a small percentage of what OpenAI and others are said to have spent on their systems. Because DeepSeek's systems have made strides in software, they could be less reliant on hardware like the GPUs that Nvidia sells, and some experts believe DeepSeek might signal a sea-change in the AI landscape.

The emergence of DeepSeek's new model comes not long after President Trump announced a $500 billion AI infrastructure program, Stargate, led by investments from OpenAI, Oracle, and SoftBank. At least some of that appears to consist of existing investments that were previously announced.

As Motley Fool points out, there are some that believe DeepSeek is not being totally honest in explaining the true costs of its systems. AI researcher Nathan Lampert estimates DeepSeek's true training costs as being as high as $1 billion. Other AI experts, like Scale AI CEO Alexandr Wang, believe DeepSeek and others actually have more Nvidia chips than they may be allowed to disclose given export rules.

From last week: Scale AI CEO Alexandr Wang says that DeepSeek and other Chinese AI labs have more Nvidia chips than they can talk about because of current US export controls pic.twitter.com/tPzmdEvvik

— Morning Brew ☕️ (@MorningBrew) January 27, 2025

The launch of DeepSeek hasn't gone totally smoothly for the company. DeepSeek's own website states that it's facing "large-scale malicious attacks" on its services just days after releasing.

Nvidia is the No. 3 company worldwide based on market cap, only trailing behind Apple and Microsoft. The company's next move is launching its new GTX 50-series GPUs, which go on sale this week.

You won buy RTX?

Deepseek is pretty cool. I have installed the China spyware. I am complete.

Wonder if politicians sold stock before this 😁

Nvidia regretting those 5 series prices right now.

@lundy86_4: The kick up the ass they needed.

Gotta start using that Pelosi tracker.

Frankly after the USA government has started threatening every other country, I have become less anti China. Seems they seem in a similar way.

Let them sort it out. Whoever wins, it's equally bad for the rest of the wrong.

At the moment, America is more likely to start a war than China.

They voted for Trump knowing what he is and what he's about, they are unfit to be the Wests leader, and deserve to lose.

A disaster is coming, possibly bigger than we imagined.

The Chinese also make better action movies.

Nvidia has become too lenient after being the market leader for quite some time. They need to be taken down a notch. Good thing Intel is slowly making its way into the market with its new GPUs

@uninspiredcup: I just see them as the same now.

With trump just being a considerably less intelligent version of Xi, but shares same views and objectives.

This is good news because Nvidia needs to be put in check. They have become too dominant and make so much money from AI. They neglect the gaming side of the business as a result. Seriously, the RTX 5000 series is a joke and Nvidia has taken the piss out of gamers for 2 gens now.

@lundy86_4 said:

Nvidia regretting those 5 series prices right now.

The RTX 5090 pricing is the biggest problem. The rest like both the 5070Ti & 5070 are just fine. That 5080 should have been $899 IMO.

Nvidia wishes the Mining craze would be back anytime now😅

With the lack of high-end competition, this is the result of Nvidia got really out of control. Jensen's gonna have to start selling his fine Leather Jackets real soon😂

🤣😂

Please tell me this is fake.

It's beyond a joke. There are a number of politicians who beat out the S&P 500 fairly consistently. Link.

@ghostofgolden said:

🤣😂

It's such a joke at this point.

@ghostofgolden: do you prefer the trump meme currency scam ?

I mean there are degrees of corruption.

We have the leader of the "free world" banking from meme coins and other conflicts of interests but "teh nancy of teh polozi".😂

Good time to buy some Nvidia stock!

It'll be back up soon enough.

AMD is fairing off better.

This situation is particularly precarious for Nvidia, whose chips have been considered instrumental for cutting-edge AI applications. Adding more weight to market sentiment, billionaire investor Chamath Palihapitiya pointed out on social media how DeepSeek has managed to achieve sophisticated reasoning without relying on massive supervised datasets. This, he argued, could signal transformative progress within AI technology.

On another front, AMD isn’t sitting idly by. The company has announced the integration of the DeepSeek-V3 model within its Instinct MI300X GPU. This initiative reflects AMD's commitment to advancing artificial intelligence technologies. The DeepSeek-V3 model, widely recognized as the most powerful open-source large language model, is specially optimized for enhancing AI inference, which could bolster AMD’s performance through its GPUs.

The new model features advanced architecture known as the mixture of experts (MoE) with 671 billion parameters—a deep learning innovation activating 37 billion parameters per token. The architecture is complemented by multi-head latent attention (MLA) and unique load balancing strategies aimed at enhancing training cost-effectiveness and inference efficiency. Collaborations with the DeepSeek and SGLang teams have been noted as pivotal, allowing AMD to attain peak performance on its hardware.

AMD's ROCm platform supports FP8 (8-bit floating-point), which optimizes data transfer and minimizes latency issues. The Instinct MI300X GPU stands as a cornerstone for accelerating AI processes, paving the way for developers focusing on projects involving large language models, image recognition, and natural language processing.

Despite AMD’s advancements, market reactions remain mixed. While some financial analysts advocate for investing in competitors like NVIDIA and TSMC, others, such as Barclays, have recommended acquiring AMD shares, signifying diverse perspectives on the company’s AI competitiveness moving forward.

These interconnected developments highlight the dynamic and often volatile nature of the tech stock market amid the rapidly changing AI sector. Investors are left to navigate shifting landscapes as they anticipate upcoming reports and meetings, including the Federal Reserve's discussion slated for this week.

All I know is that dude you posted in the OP looks like JB Pritzker.. lol.

I’m not buying anything unless Nancy does

@ghostofgolden: you should get some Melania coin. I heard it will go up anytime now.

@nirgal: You think cause he points that out he likes Trump 😅

Politics are like System Wars. If you point out the faults of one team, that means you must belong to the other. I called out Trumps tariffs and the MAGA goofs came after me. I discuss Pelosi’s insider trading and I’m a Trump supporter. Tribalism ruins everything

Speaking of Trump and tariffs, he plans on targeting TSMC with tariffs as high as 100%. That $700 PS5 Pro price tag is about to look like a bargain real soon. Better hurry up and grab those 5090’s and upgrade your cell phones. Shit is about to get crazy

And now Zuckbot is panicking. Lol! With the tariffs coming, those tech bros are really going to inch towards the edge.

Oh, thank you China. Thank you, CCP. You are temporarily in my cool book just for this day of entertainment.

Lol.

I for one accept our new chinese overlords.

This is pretty funny though

@ghostofgolden: sorry for my binary view of politics.

I am overreacting because I am still shocked about the meme coins situation.

Anyway, this topic goes to show how much the higher population and higher average education level of china matters, that's probably why many tech companies were looking to import more technical personnel from abroad with the visa changes.

But I guess nativism is even more important than winning.

We're beginning to see China not only catch up but overtake the west in technological advancement. When you consider how far they have come in such a small amount of time it's intriguing to see how they accelerate away and become a true technological powerhouse.

With trump making enemies of the west I can see a lot of allies strengthening their relationship with china.

That whole less power to produce equal or better results is very questionable. Especially when its coming from China.

lol :P

I think this is just more a shock. At the end of the day, you still need lots of processing power to actually run and train these things. I suspect stocks for hardware vendors will return to normal.

What it does disrupt is the business model American AI companies were hoping to use to rope people into the AI eco system. Deepseek is open source and it's very effective by every measurement I have seen. That means the cat is out of the bag. The cost of entry into the AI market has dropped massively. Open AI and co are going to have a much harder time pulling the ladder up.

...Not that China are altruistic of course. Chinese companies would really struggle to get into the AI service games if their models are locked down. Right or wrong, trust for Chinese companies remains low. So if you can't beat the competition at their own game then pull the rug out from under them.

The fallout from this will be interesting.

It’s amazing what they’re accomplishing even with the entire west tarrifing the crap out of them.

China is more educated overall. Plus they don’t have to worry about moronic population voting for someone like trump. Of course their system has faults too, if the leader at the top is a moron, it could turn out bad, ie the Putin situation. I would hope the CCP has checks and balances to prevent that kind of situation, but nobody really knows. End of the day democracy only works when the population is educated. But in the west there are a ton of dumb mother fuckers who shouldn’t be allowed to vote. They are our weakness unfortunately and dragging our countries down.

Another issue with china is that they need to be more lenient with immigration to prevent a population collapse, which is what’s happening currently there.

Speaks more to volatility of the stock market, even more so when you look at all the meme coin pump and dumps. Gonna get worse likely with the elimination of the FDIC and the creation of a strategic coin reserve.

We need to bring back Voodoo cards.

So happy that I just bought 4k$ worth of nvidia shares last week, best investment ever!

Alibaba releases AI model it says surpasses DeepSeek

BEIJING, Jan 29 (Reuters) - Chinese tech company Alibaba (9988.HK), opens new tab on Wednesday released a new version of its Qwen 2.5 artificial intelligence model that it claimed surpassed the highly-acclaimed DeepSeek-V3.The unusual timing of the Qwen 2.5-Max's release, on the first day of the Lunar New Year when most Chinese people are off work and with their families, points to the pressure Chinese AI startup DeepSeek's meteoric rise in the past three weeks has placed on not just overseas rivals, but also its domestic competition."Qwen 2.5-Max outperforms ... almost across the board GPT-4o, DeepSeek-V3 and Llama-3.1-405B," Alibaba's cloud unit said in an announcement posted on its official WeChat account, referring to OpenAI and Meta's most advanced open-source AI models.The Jan. 10 release of DeepSeek's AI assistant, powered by the DeepSeek-V3 model, as well as the Jan. 20 release of its R1 model, has shocked Silicon Valley and caused tech shares to plunge, with the Chinese startup's purportedly low development and usage costs prompting investors to question huge spending plans by leading AI firms in the United States.But DeepSeek's success has also led to a scramble among its domestic competitors to upgrade their own AI models.Two days after the release of DeepSeek-R1, TikTok owner ByteDance released an update to its flagship AI model, which it claimed outperformed Microsoft-backed OpenAI's o1 in AIME, a benchmark test that measures how well AI models understand and respond to complex instructions.This echoed DeepSeek's claim that its R1 model rivalled OpenAI's o1 on several performance benchmarks.

DEEPSEEK VERSUS DOMESTIC COMPETITORS

The predecessor of DeepSeek's V3 model, DeepSeek-V2, triggered an AI model price war in China after it was released last May.The fact that DeepSeek-V2 was open-source and unprecedentedly cheap, only 1 yuan ($0.14) per 1 million tokens - or units of data processed by the AI model - led to Alibaba's cloud unit announcing price cuts of up to 97% on a range of models.Other Chinese tech companies followed suit, including Baidu (9888.HK), opens new tab, which released China's first equivalent to ChatGPT in March 2023, and the country's most valuable internet company Tencent (0700.HK), opens new tab.Liang Wenfeng, DeepSeek's enigmatic founder, said in a rare interview with Chinese media outlet Waves in July that the startup "did not care" about price wars and that achieving AGI (artificial general intelligence) was its main goal.OpenAI defines AGI as autonomous systems that surpass humans in most economically valuable tasks.While large Chinese tech companies like Alibaba have hundreds of thousands of employees, DeepSeek operates like a research lab, staffed mainly by young graduates and doctorate students from top Chinese universities.Liang said in his July interview that he believed China's largest tech companies might not be well suited to the future of the AI industry, contrasting their high costs and top-down structures with DeepSeek's lean operation and loose management style."Large foundational models require continued innovation, tech giants' capabilities have their limits," he said.

Hong Kong definitely used to make better action movies back in the '80s and '90s... But do they still? I remember HK action movies declining in the 2000s. Have Chinese action movies recovered since then?

I've been saying for years now that China is leading the AI field. But so many Westerners refused to acknowledge such an obvious fact... only to end up losing money because they couldn't see it coming.

Ask DeepSeek about The Tank Man.

This

Dumb western and American media outlets still don't get it. The Sinophobia is so strong.

This whole episode shows how arrogant Americans are.

They are still better, yes. They just aren't as trendy in the West now. Half the releases don't even get a mention.

In China they kill at the box office.

America in full cope mode.

It's over, go have a corn dog.

DeepSeek forced to pause new signups following large scale cyberttack

• DeepSeek says it is suffering from a huge cyberattack
• The attack has prevented new users from registering
• A DDoS attack is rumored to be the cause of the outage

DeepSeek has had to temporarily pause new signups to its generative AI chatbot due to “large-scale malicious attacks” against the platform.

The open source model was recently released to the public, causing ripples across the technology industry, sending US markets into freefall.

The relatively new platform has shot to number one on the US app store, replacing ChatGPT as the most popular free app, and has been rumored to have cost as little as $5.6 million to develop.

No new users

This growth has apparently resulted in some unwanted attention, and DeepSeek has not shared any details about the attack, but due to the systems the attack is affecting, it is possibly a distributed denial of service (DDoS) attack against the platform’s API and Web Chat services.

Continue reading

The DeepSeek status page simply states, “Due to large-scale malicious attacks on DeepSeek's services, we are temporarily limiting registrations to ensure continued service. Existing users can log in as usual. Thanks for your understanding and support.”

While registering for new users is currently unavailable the service can still be accessed by signing in with a Google account, with a user's email, language preference and profile picture being shared with DeepSeek in return.

That China did this so much more cheaply, using raw fucking math, is the result of the owner class wanting an uneducated (thereby easier to manipulate) populace. Underfunded schools for decades and gave so much of the money to useless administration. Can't have your cake (concentrate so much capital), etc.

Underfunded schools????

Look how much money goes into public education!

I just heard some yapping head calling this a "Sputnik moment," and I just had to laugh. If they think this is the 1950s again, they have another thing coming. China is a vastly different adversary to the USSR, and the context of this technological race is very different.

The USSR had to squeeze blood out of a stone from their unproductive economic system just to get a leg up on the US. The Russians' engineering and technological tradition is far more recent; their heroes were theorists who discovered things like Mendeleev and cultural icons like Dostoevsky. They are also culturally anti-capitalist; the merchant class were often treated with suspicion, and often seen as a Jewish vocation. Moreover, the American public were fully in support of the effort to catch up and win the Space Race.

Whereas China have an ancient and proud tradition of technological and engineering achievements; they invented things like the seismograph, printing press with moveable type, drilling rig and cruise missile. They are also culturally natural capitalists, with a similarly long and proud tradition with commerce and trade. They created the Silk Road, invented the bank note, founded the first modern restaurants, and once unleashed a huge treasure fleet to secure their trade route through the Indian Ocean that became a stuff of legend they tell to this day. Every Chinese village has that veteran merchant who is respected by the rest of the village as someone who is clever, worldly and formidable.

China is therefore fiercely motivated to reclaim what they see as their rightful place as a technological superpower and economic centre of the world, whereas I don't think most Americans gives a flying somersaulting toss about any of this. Only the tech bros truly seem to give a shit, and for all of their obnoxious hype mongering, all they actually care about is making as much money as quickly as possible.

So the US faces a highly motivated, far more inventive adversary who can exploit capital just as well as they do, while their own population is apathetic and distracted. Not saying the US can't win; China has its own myriad of problems it has to sort out, and perhaps the sheer brute force of American capital can push them over the line. I'm just saying; they face a vastly different fight, and they're going to need all the luck they can get.

It's very much like Rocky 3 where at the start Clubber Lang is sitting in the background watching him become comfy and lazy and then beats the shit out of him.

Actually, it's exactly like this. This is a good analogy I made.

Good job.

@Chutebox: Underfunded, and look at how much goes to administration. Incidentally, they stopped teaching civics because of the Vietnam protests.

Not a chance in hell education is underfunded.