Official AvidGaMeR444 Gives Sheep a Dose of Reality Thread. The truth sheep...

Ok, I know most of you who have read my threads think I only bash Nintendo. I bash all systems. Lately, yes...it has been Nintendo. And I really :lol: at anyone who thinks I hate the Wii or don't own one. That is where all of you who say I'm a "Wii hater" are wrong. People saying I don't own a Wii are wrong. I can fully see why it would appear that way though.I know I'm a very negative person. Unfortunately, I can't help that.I'm going to explain why I make negative threads about a system I own.

I have negative threads about Wii because I am frustrated. Do I like the games? Yes, some of them. But the reason I am frustrated is becausea majority of the ones I've played are, IMO, terrible. And it is not the Wii's fault. I fully recognize that. It is the 3rd party devs fault for not putting forth the effort to make decent games on Wii. There are exceptions, but the bad games far outweigh the good. Whether it is sloppy controls, worse graphics than PS2, whatever...it is always something. I can't help but be negative.

And what is up with Nintendo saying "We are serious about online but gamers haven't recognized it yet" or something to that effect at E3? That is BS, and most people know that. Having the next Mario Kart be online is great and all. But don't think for a solitatry second that Nintendo is serious about online when that game doesn't even come out until 2008. Maybe by then they will be serious. But, seriously...it is getting ridiculous now. I want Wii to succeed. I just want 2 things to happen, and that is it. I don't feel like I'm being harsh or picky.

Here are the 2 things I want to happen...1 of those things has already happened...

1.I want Wii to sell well.

2. I want Wii to have a great variety of games in all genres and I want games in all genres to have great titles.

Is my number 2 point too dang much to ask for? Is it really?PS2 had a huge library of games. It looks like Wii is set to have a huge library of games. PS2 does have a whole lot of bad games. But you know what? In nearly every genre, PS2 has great titles to choose from...especially RPGs (which I really like). Now, Wii is going to have a huge library of games...no doubt. But I really worry thatthe majority ofgames are going to be half-assed attempts from 3rd parties.

And this is why I worry about this. This is my opinion.

There are4 reasons IMO that 3rd parties don't want to develop for Wii, or putnearas much effort into Wii development as 360 and/or PS3

1.I think that 3rd parties want to utilize the power of the 360 and PS3 knowing that those platforms have better physics, graphics, sound, etc. Developers want to use their talents to broaden the horizon of gaming. I know it can be broadened by Wii controls. Developers feel like they are taking a step BACKWARDS in time. They know fullwel that porting 3rd party games for Wii is a pain in the ass. It HAS TO BE. "But, but, but Wii is sooooo easy to develop for AvidGamer!". It may be easier to develop for than 360 and PS3 when a game is EXCLUSIVE TO WII, but what about ports? I don't think so...I think it would be much harder to develop ports for Wii having to downgrade everything (except for controls...but even those end up downgraded thanks to 3rd parties), graphics, sound, etc.

2. The Wii controls. I like Wii controls when developers try. That means, basically, 1st party devs. I know full well that Wii has all the potential in the world with the controls. I honestly think Wii controls are more fun to use than 360 controls when those controls are 1st party tailored. I don't own a PS3, so I can't judge that. HOWEVER...3rd party devs MUST IMO have something against Wii controls. Most 3rd party devs don't put forth NEAR as much effort as a 360 and/or PS3 game. Not even close. Just look at Ubisoft. Sheep should be very angry with Ubisoft. Other than Rayman, what other Wii games has Ubisoft offered that are even on the verge of just "average". NONE. The other games are very, very bad. You can argue that Ubisoft has bad ports in general, but come on now. Ubisoft ports for Wii are MUCH, MUCH worse than their other ports.

3.Developers are scared to death of competing with Nintendo 1st party software to begin with and are afraid of bad 3rd party software sales. Just look at what happened to Gamecube. You can argue all you want that 3rd party devs left Gamecube because it was in last place in sales. Ok...but Gamecube was barely behind Xbox when 3rd parties abandoned Gamecube. That is the truth. Just look at the hardware sales. So, why did 3rd parties leave GC? Why was there no Burnout 3 on GC or other hot 3rd party games during that time? Because 3rd parties recognized that they COULD NOT COMPETE WITH THE SALES OF NINTENDO'S 1st party software!

4. Not facing the reality of the situation...

Do you understand this? The damage from that has come to the Wii era, and 3rd parties are still afraid of their software selling vastly inferior to Xbox 360 and PS3. And why shouldn't they be? This has been the trend since N64. So...in essence, this is yet ANOTHER REASON for the crappy graphics that aren't even PS2 quality most of the time, as well as sloppy controls.

Understand this...MANY 3RD PARTIES DON'T WANT TO EVER PUT IN NEAR AS MUCH EFFORT INTO A WII GAME AS THEY WOULD A 360 GAME AND/OR PS3 game. It doesn't matter that PS3 is selling the worst. The stigma from last generation is still ingrated into the 3rd party devs' minds. And that is this...PS1 and PS2 3rd party software sold AMAZINGLY WELL. Xbox and Xbox 360 software is selling AMAZINGLY WELL. N64 and GC software sold VERY POORLY.

Therefore, 3rd parties who are developing for Wii are FEARFUL ofpoor sales. So, they DON'T WANT TO SPEND THE TIME, EFFORT, OR MONEY on Wii games. They FEAR that 1st party software...just like with N64 and GC era...will once again rule the roost and that their own 3rd party games will sell poorly. There it is is folks, like it or not. This explains sloppy ports, bad controls, bad graphics, etc. This is different than my number 3 point, because it has to do with the stigma of Sony and Microsoft consoles having amazing 3rd party sales, while Nintendo in the past has not.

"We don't care AvidGamer!" "You take this way too seriously AvidGamer!" That's fine...You are entitled to your opinion as I am entitled to mine. But don't think for a second I have no clue what I'm talking about. I know I bring up good points. And if I really didn't give a crap about Nintendo, do you REALLY think I would put in this much time and effort to post about them here? Think about that...and think about this. Consider that 3rd party devs feel like they are "being held back" by developing for Wii. Consider that 3rd party devs are "fearful of 1st party Nintendo 1st party sales and are afraid they can't compete". Consider that PS1, PS2, Xbox, and Xbox 360 ALL HAD GREAT SALES FROM 3RD PARTIES WHILE NINTENDO DID NOT. Consider that analysts are STILL UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT PS3 will sell the best when it is all said and done. Maybe 3rd parties are under that same impression? Consider that sheep...

I've read this before on both fronts..."Aren't you a sheep?" is what is asked when I'm "bashing" the Wii. Then the other 2 statementsare..."You are a fanboy who doesn't even own a Wii" and "You hate the Wii". Guess what? You are all wrong...

So, go ahead and flame this thread...heck...all my other threads have been lately anyway. Go ahead and tell me I'm sooooo wrong about my opinion on all this. But, PLEASE DO THIS! PLEASE tell me WHY my opinion is wrong. Flame me all you want, but give a GOOD EXPLANATION of why my opinion is ridiculous and why I'm sooooo off-base here. I'd like to here it. Because, lately...at least in most of my threads as of late...I just get flamed with no good comeback. I just get called names and whatnot or my favorite..."Another AvidGamer Nintendo-hating thread". Fine if you feel that way, but back up your claims. Back up the reasons why I'm soooo wrong about everything, then give me feedback. Or are you just going to flame me again as usual without any feedback or worthwhile response?

My threads may or may not be absolutely ridiculous. My opinions may not be "the norm". You may HATE my threads with a passion. But PLEASE!! While flaming me...give me solid reasons WHY I AM WRONG instead of this...."I HATE YOUR THEADS AvidGaMeR444!" without any explanation at all. Or my favorite..."AvidGamer claims to have a crystal ball".Geez! It is another way of saying that I have an opinion! See, when most people give their opinions in System Wars, it is fine and dandy. But not with my threads! Oh no...not with AvidGamer's awful, awful threads of ridiculousness. When I say "I have a crystal ball" it is a joke! Get it? I am being sarcastic or whatever you want to call it. I am not being serious. I try not to be too serious in System Wars. But occasionally, I feel like I have to be to get my point across.

Yes,this is a HUGE WALL OF TEH DREADED TEXT! OH NOEZ!At least I have paragraphs...

Uh... that's too much to read. I'll just say...

Crysis

Wow you really know what all the devs think? It isn't like every dev likes working on the PS3.

I agree with all of your points about the shortcomings of the Wii.

Ok, I know most of you who have read my threads think I only bash Nintendo. I bash all systems. Lately, yes...it has been Nintendo. And I really :lol: at anyone who thinks I hate the Wii or don't own one. That is where all of you who say I'm a "Wii hater" are wrong. People saying I don't own a Wii are wrong. I can fully see why it would appear that way though.I know I'm a very negative person. Unfortunately, I can't help that.I'm going to explain why I make negative threads about a system I own.

I have negative threads about Wii because I am frustrated. Do I like the games? Yes, some of them. But the reason I am frustrated is becausea majority of the ones I've played are, IMO, terrible. And it is not the Wii's fault. I fully recognize that. It is the 3rd party devs fault for not putting forth the effort to make decent games on Wii. There are exceptions, but the bad games far outweigh the good. Whether it is sloppy controls, worse graphics than PS2, whatever...it is always something. I can't help but be negative.

And what is up with Nintendo saying "We are serious about online but gamers haven't recognized it yet" or something to that effect at E3? That is BS, and most people know that. Having the next Mario Kart be online is great and all. But don't think for a solitatry second that Nintendo is serious about online when that game doesn't even come out until 2008. Maybe by then they will be serious. But, seriously...it is getting ridiculous now. I want Wii to succeed. I just want 2 things to happen, and that is it. I don't feel like I'm being harsh or picky.

Here are the 2 things I want to happen...1 of those things has already happened...

1.I want Wii to sell well.

2. I want Wii to have a great variety of games in all genres and I want games in all genres to have great titles.

Is my number 2 point too dang much to ask for? Is it really?PS2 had a huge library of games. It looks like Wii is set to have a huge library of games. PS2 does have a whole lot of bad games. But you know what? In nearly every genre, PS2 has great titles to choose from...especially RPGs (which I really like). Now, Wii is going to have a huge library of games...no doubt. But I really worry thatthe majority ofgames are going to be half-assed attempts from 3rd parties.

And this is why I worry about this. This is my opinion.

There are4 reasons IMO that 3rd parties don't want to develop for Wii, or putnearas much effort into Wii development as 360 and/or PS3

1.I think that 3rd parties want to utilize the power of the 360 and PS3 knowing that those platforms have better physics, graphics, sound, etc. Developers want to use their talents to broaden the horizon of gaming. I know it can be broadened by Wii controls. Developers feel like they are taking a step BACKWARDS in time. They know fullwel that porting 3rd party games for Wii is a pain in the ass. It HAS TO BE. "But, but, but Wii is sooooo easy to develop for AvidGamer!". It may be easier to develop for than 360 and PS3 when a game is EXCLUSIVE TO WII, but what about ports? I don't think so...I think it would be much harder to develop ports for Wii having to downgrade everything (except for controls...but even those end up downgraded thanks to 3rd parties), graphics, sound, etc.

2. The Wii controls. I like Wii controls when developers try. That means, basically, 1st party devs. I know full well that Wii has all the potential in the world with the controls. I honestly think Wii controls are more fun to use than 360 controls when those controls are 1st party tailored. I don't own a PS3, so I can't judge that. HOWEVER...3rd party devs MUST IMO have something against Wii controls. Most 3rd party devs don't put forth NEAR as much effort as a 360 and/or PS3 game. Not even close. Just look at Ubisoft. Sheep should be very angry with Ubisoft. Other than Rayman, what other Wii games has Ubisoft offered that are even on the verge of just "average". NONE. The other games are very, very bad. You can argue that Ubisoft has bad ports in general, but come on now. Ubisoft ports for Wii are MUCH, MUCH worse than their other ports.

3.Developers are scared to death of competing with Nintendo 1st party software to begin with and are afraid of bad 3rd party software sales. Just look at what happened to Gamecube. You can argue all you want that 3rd party devs left Gamecube because it was in last place in sales. Ok...but Gamecube was barely behind Xbox when 3rd parties abandoned Gamecube. That is the truth. Just look at the hardware sales. So, why did 3rd parties leave GC? Why was there no Burnout 3 on GC or other hot 3rd party games during that time? Because 3rd parties recognized that they COULD NOT COMPETE WITH THE SALES OF NINTENDO'S 1st party software!

4. Not facing the reality of the situation...

Do you understand this? The damage from that has come to the Wii era, and 3rd parties are still afraid of their software selling vastly inferior to Xbox 360 and PS3. And why shouldn't they be? This has been the trend since N64. So...in essence, this is yet ANOTHER REASON for the crappy graphics that aren't even PS2 quality most of the time, as well as sloppy controls.

Understand this...MANY 3RD PARTIES DON'T WANT TO EVER PUT IN NEAR AS MUCH EFFORT INTO A WII GAME AS THEY WOULD A 360 GAME AND/OR PS3 game. It doesn't matter that PS3 is selling the worst. The stigma from last generation is still ingrated into the 3rd party devs' minds. And that is this...PS1 and PS2 3rd party software sold AMAZINGLY WELL. Xbox and Xbox 360 software is selling AMAZINGLY WELL. N64 and GC software sold VERY POORLY.

Therefore, 3rd parties who are developing for Wii are FEARFUL ofpoor sales. So, they DON'T WANT TO SPEND THE TIME, EFFORT, OR MONEY on Wii games. They FEAR that 1st party software...just like with N64 and GC era...will once again rule the roost and that their own 3rd party games will sell poorly. There it is is folks, like it or not. This explains sloppy ports, bad controls, bad graphics, etc. This is different than my number 3 point, because it has to do with the stigma of Sony and Microsoft consoles having amazing 3rd party sales, while Nintendo in the past has not.

"We don't care AvidGamer!" "You take this way too seriously AvidGamer!" That's fine...You are entitled to your opinion as I am entitled to mine. But don't think for a second I have no clue what I'm talking about. I know I bring up good points. And if I really didn't give a crap about Nintendo, do you REALLY think I would put in this much time and effort to post about them here? Think about that...and think about this. Consider that 3rd party devs feel like they are "being held back" by developing for Wii. Consider that 3rd party devs are "fearful of 1st party Nintendo 1st party sales and are afraid they can't compete". Consider that PS1, PS2, Xbox, and Xbox 360 ALL HAD GREAT SALES FROM 3RD PARTIES WHILE NINTENDO DID NOT. Consider that analysts are STILL UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT PS3 will sell the best when it is all said and done. Maybe 3rd parties are under that same impression? Consider that sheep...

I've read this before on both fronts..."Aren't you a sheep?" is what is asked when I'm "bashing" the Wii. Then the other 2 statementsare..."You are a fanboy who doesn't even own a Wii" and "You hate the Wii". Guess what? You are all wrong...

So, go ahead and flame this thread...heck...all my other threads have been lately anyway. Go ahead and tell me I'm sooooo wrong about my opinion on all this. But, PLEASE DO THIS! PLEASE tell me WHY my opinion is wrong. Flame me all you want, but give a GOOD EXPLANATION of why my opinion is ridiculous and why I'm sooooo off-base here. I'd like to here it. Because, lately...at least in most of my threads as of late...I just get flamed with no good comeback. I just get called names and whatnot or my favorite..."Another AvidGamer Nintendo-hating thread". Fine if you feel that way, but back up your claims. Back up the reasons why I'm soooo wrong about everything, then give me feedback. Or are you just going to flame me again as usual without any feedback or worthwhile response?

My threads may or may not be absolutely ridiculous. My opinions may not be "the norm". You may HATE my threads with a passion. But PLEASE!! While flaming me...give me solid reasons WHY I AM WRONG instead of this...."I HATE YOUR THEADS AvidGaMeR444!" without any explanation at all. Or my favorite..."AvidGamer claims to have a crystal ball".Geez! It is another way of saying that I have an opinion! See, when most people give their opinions in System Wars, it is fine and dandy. But not with my threads! Oh no...not with AvidGamer's awful, awful threads of ridiculousness. When I say "I have a crystal ball" it is a joke! Get it? I am being sarcastic or whatever you want to call it. I am not being serious. I try not to be too serious in System Wars. But occasionally, I feel like I have to be to get my point across.

Yes,this is a HUGE WALL OF TEH DREADED TEXT! OH NOEZ!At least I have paragraphs...

AvIdGaMeR444

Half assed ports from third party neve expected the wii to be so popular...

And us sheep ripped on Ubisoft so hard. RS2 was promised to be way better quality.. and if not.. us sheep will run them down..

umm... yea.... i don't think it was ninty's first party stuff, ttytt i think it was the fact of the gamecubes disc format.. an 8 cm disc ?? WTF NINTY !!

Ur number 4... nah.. if they produced actual games that are GOOD quality, not average.. but GOOD, software sales would be higher... If you think about it.. Wii has better third party, then Both GC, and N64. now that the disc format isn't some.. crap 8cm disc, or an old cartridge..

I think the ONLY SINGLE reason third party devs are giving us sloppy ports is because they rushed to get stuff out to us after wii's popularity was confirmed. I've been on the wii's side since announcement. Seriously. I'm glad you have your own oppinion on ninty and all, cause the drones seem to destroy all haters.. lol. but i think ninty's first party is going to take a HUGE slide for hardcore gamers.. what is this crap... Wii Fit ?! come ON. I think this " Wii *insert something* is already getting outta hand... why not just.. make a tred-mill, hook it to wii, and call it wii-run ? I'm starting to not like ninty with their stuff.

I feel that i am going to give the hardcore titles a chance, meaning the big 3, and 3rd party titles and what not. but if they keep going with this " RE4 dumbed down for the casuals" crap.. I will give up on nintendo. I WANT HARDCORE GAMES, NOT WII FIT !

BTW, good rant bud.

Nice post. It's a bit long, but well worth the read.

I essentially agree with everything you've said. Hell, I play my ps3 more than my Wii because of the lack of games, and all I do on my ps3 is use the BC to catch up on ps2 titlesI missed. :(

I hope 3rd parties step up their game on the way, but in the endI probably wouldn't mind if they didn't. I bought my Wii mainly for 1st party games (specifically Mario, Zelda, Kart, and SSB), and, of course, the slight possibility of a cool Star Wars lightsaber game.

The only people who are going to read that are the people who agree with you from the start and just want to stroke their own egos.iunderstand

They probably won't even read. They'll just flood this thread with "I agree" and it'd end up looking like Subrosian's 1100 post thread.

I read 3 paragraphs of that wall of text because you just seemed to keep repeating yourself. So to summarize it, the wii sucks. Don't count on the wii to change it's ways any time soon. Not after the tons of cash they've been making. I would have sold mine if it wasn't for the virtual arcade. Games like Punch Out, Mario 64/Kart and StarFox 64 are still fun. 4_Horsemen

He didn't repeat himself through all of it. He also said that he has amazing insight to what the devs are actually thinking. I mean his powers of mind reading are amazing.

The bad and mediocre games outweigh the good on every system.elmoXPXP

Yep. The only difference with the Wii is that it's something different compared to the competition. That's why it's getting all of this negative attention by fanboys.

They are scared, whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

They are scared, whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

slothboyadvance

[QUOTE="slothboyadvance"]

They are scared, whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

Teufelhuhn

[QUOTE="slothboyadvance"]

They are scared, whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

Teufelhuhn

Fanboys are scared because after this Gen, the industry is all in Nintendo's hands. The Wii will undoubtably have a stranglehold on this Gen.

"Undoubtabley" huh? I had a Wii for a week. Then I sold it. Itwas boring. Every game was the same. You shake your hand like a goon until something happens on screen. And yes, I did try a fair sampling of games before I gave up (working at Blockbuster has its advantages). I tried Madden, Warioware, Twilight Princess, Wii sports, and Far Cry (or dear god that last one made my eyes want to cry). All of which felt the same to me with Twilight Princess being the only stand out and proof that, yes, the wii has the potential to be really fun. But the rest......meh. Do I think that the Wii will realize that potential? Maybe. But by the time it does, Sony or Microsoft will have come out on top. And, for the people who complain about the high price of the PS3, I don't think the Wii is worth $250 right now with all the crappy games it has out right now. At least the PS3 has other things to offer. And at least Microsoft really IS serious about online play.

And to those who keep commenting on AvidGamer's "insight" into 3rd party dev's motives for not wanting to put as much effort into Wii titles as for the other next gen consoles, it takes a the same amount of insight to think he is wrong.

And yes, we are scared. We are scared that Nintendo is taking gaming backwards, we are scared that gaming is going to be taken over by the casual gamer. We are scared that the hardcore, who make up 90% of all gaming purchases, are being ignored because of Nintendo's bottom line. Because that is all the Wii is. Nintendo trying to recoup its losses from its last two failures.

Wow you really know what all the devs think? It isn't like every dev likes working on the PS3.

books83

Ok, I know most of you who have read my threads think I only bash Nintendo.AvIdGaMeR444

who cares about third party support for the Wii... i don't. if they take the effort, i'm interested: "DEWY' adventures" and "no more heroes"

look like solid titles. Keep those ports far from Wii please.

also, if nintendo wants third party support, they better start sharing their controller data....

[QUOTE="elmoXPXP"]The bad and mediocre games outweigh the good on every system.slothboyadvance

Yep. The only difference with the Wii is that it's something different compared to the competition. That's why it's getting all of this negative attention by fanboys.

They are scared, whether they choose to acknowledge it or not.

What if this difference is not that good? To me it is in't. I would like the Wii a lot better if the Wii-mote, the Wii's only outstanding feature IMO, made most games better (like what Wii-fanboys claim), but from what we've seen, this is far from the case. The Wii-mote is mostly a gimmick.

just like with N64 and GC era...will once again rule the roost and that their own 3rd party games will sell poorly.

True. Wii gamers want to play Nintendo games. What are they hyping by those times.... let me think... Super smash brso (nintendo), Super Mario Galaxy (Nintendo), Metroid Prime 3 (Nintendo), Mario Kart Wii (nintendo), those are the one they hype NOW, but wait a little, the next games they hype will be : "StarFox Wii", "Zelda Wii", "Wario sumthing", "Mario Tennis Wii".....

Honestly, I know some are looking at other game like Resident evil 5, sports game.... but I talk about the majority of what I see here. Wii players play ninty games...

Wow...

To read an Avidgamer's wall of text or not to read .... my I.Q is at stake :lol:Meu2k7

Ok, I know most of you who have read my threads think I only bash Nintendo. I bash all systems. Lately, yes...it has been Nintendo. And I really :lol: at anyone who thinks I hate the Wii or don't own one. That is where all of you who say I'm a "Wii hater" are wrong. People saying I don't own a Wii are wrong. I can fully see why it would appear that way though.I know I'm a very negative person. Unfortunately, I can't help that.I'm going to explain why I make negative threads about a system I own.

I have negative threads about Wii because I am frustrated. Do I like the games? Yes, some of them. But the reason I am frustrated is becausea majority of the ones I've played are, IMO, terrible. And it is not the Wii's fault. I fully recognize that. It is the 3rd party devs fault for not putting forth the effort to make decent games on Wii. There are exceptions, but the bad games far outweigh the good. Whether it is sloppy controls, worse graphics than PS2, whatever...it is always something. I can't help but be negative.

And what is up with Nintendo saying "We are serious about online but gamers haven't recognized it yet" or something to that effect at E3? That is BS, and most people know that. Having the next Mario Kart be online is great and all. But don't think for a solitatry second that Nintendo is serious about online when that game doesn't even come out until 2008. Maybe by then they will be serious. But, seriously...it is getting ridiculous now. I want Wii to succeed. I just want 2 things to happen, and that is it. I don't feel like I'm being harsh or picky.

Here are the 2 things I want to happen...1 of those things has already happened...

1.I want Wii to sell well.

2. I want Wii to have a great variety of games in all genres and I want games in all genres to have great titles.

Is my number 2 point too dang much to ask for? Is it really?PS2 had a huge library of games. It looks like Wii is set to have a huge library of games. PS2 does have a whole lot of bad games. But you know what? In nearly every genre, PS2 has great titles to choose from...especially RPGs (which I really like). Now, Wii is going to have a huge library of games...no doubt. But I really worry thatthe majority ofgames are going to be half-assed attempts from 3rd parties.

And this is why I worry about this. This is my opinion.

There are4 reasons IMO that 3rd parties don't want to develop for Wii, or putnearas much effort into Wii development as 360 and/or PS3

1.I think that 3rd parties want to utilize the power of the 360 and PS3 knowing that those platforms have better physics, graphics, sound, etc. Developers want to use their talents to broaden the horizon of gaming. I know it can be broadened by Wii controls. Developers feel like they are taking a step BACKWARDS in time. They know fullwel that porting 3rd party games for Wii is a pain in the ass. It HAS TO BE. "But, but, but Wii is sooooo easy to develop for AvidGamer!". It may be easier to develop for than 360 and PS3 when a game is EXCLUSIVE TO WII, but what about ports? I don't think so...I think it would be much harder to develop ports for Wii having to downgrade everything (except for controls...but even those end up downgraded thanks to 3rd parties), graphics, sound, etc.

2. The Wii controls. I like Wii controls when developers try. That means, basically, 1st party devs. I know full well that Wii has all the potential in the world with the controls. I honestly think Wii controls are more fun to use than 360 controls when those controls are 1st party tailored. I don't own a PS3, so I can't judge that. HOWEVER...3rd party devs MUST IMO have something against Wii controls. Most 3rd party devs don't put forth NEAR as much effort as a 360 and/or PS3 game. Not even close. Just look at Ubisoft. Sheep should be very angry with Ubisoft. Other than Rayman, what other Wii games has Ubisoft offered that are even on the verge of just "average". NONE. The other games are very, very bad. You can argue that Ubisoft has bad ports in general, but come on now. Ubisoft ports for Wii are MUCH, MUCH worse than their other ports.

3.Developers are scared to death of competing with Nintendo 1st party software to begin with and are afraid of bad 3rd party software sales. Just look at what happened to Gamecube. You can argue all you want that 3rd party devs left Gamecube because it was in last place in sales. Ok...but Gamecube was barely behind Xbox when 3rd parties abandoned Gamecube. That is the truth. Just look at the hardware sales. So, why did 3rd parties leave GC? Why was there no Burnout 3 on GC or other hot 3rd party games during that time? Because 3rd parties recognized that they COULD NOT COMPETE WITH THE SALES OF NINTENDO'S 1st party software!

4. Not facing the reality of the situation...

Do you understand this? The damage from that has come to the Wii era, and 3rd parties are still afraid of their software selling vastly inferior to Xbox 360 and PS3. And why shouldn't they be? This has been the trend since N64. So...in essence, this is yet ANOTHER REASON for the crappy graphics that aren't even PS2 quality most of the time, as well as sloppy controls.

Understand this...MANY 3RD PARTIES DON'T WANT TO EVER PUT IN NEAR AS MUCH EFFORT INTO A WII GAME AS THEY WOULD A 360 GAME AND/OR PS3 game. It doesn't matter that PS3 is selling the worst. The stigma from last generation is still ingrated into the 3rd party devs' minds. And that is this...PS1 and PS2 3rd party software sold AMAZINGLY WELL. Xbox and Xbox 360 software is selling AMAZINGLY WELL. N64 and GC software sold VERY POORLY.

Therefore, 3rd parties who are developing for Wii are FEARFUL ofpoor sales. So, they DON'T WANT TO SPEND THE TIME, EFFORT, OR MONEY on Wii games. They FEAR that 1st party software...just like with N64 and GC era...will once again rule the roost and that their own 3rd party games will sell poorly. There it is is folks, like it or not. This explains sloppy ports, bad controls, bad graphics, etc. This is different than my number 3 point, because it has to do with the stigma of Sony and Microsoft consoles having amazing 3rd party sales, while Nintendo in the past has not.

"We don't care AvidGamer!" "You take this way too seriously AvidGamer!" That's fine...You are entitled to your opinion as I am entitled to mine. But don't think for a second I have no clue what I'm talking about. I know I bring up good points. And if I really didn't give a crap about Nintendo, do you REALLY think I would put in this much time and effort to post about them here? Think about that...and think about this. Consider that 3rd party devs feel like they are "being held back" by developing for Wii. Consider that 3rd party devs are "fearful of 1st party Nintendo 1st party sales and are afraid they can't compete". Consider that PS1, PS2, Xbox, and Xbox 360 ALL HAD GREAT SALES FROM 3RD PARTIES WHILE NINTENDO DID NOT. Consider that analysts are STILL UNDER THE IMPRESSION THAT PS3 will sell the best when it is all said and done. Maybe 3rd parties are under that same impression? Consider that sheep...

I've read this before on both fronts..."Aren't you a sheep?" is what is asked when I'm "bashing" the Wii. Then the other 2 statementsare..."You are a fanboy who doesn't even own a Wii" and "You hate the Wii". Guess what? You are all wrong...

So, go ahead and flame this thread...heck...all my other threads have been lately anyway. Go ahead and tell me I'm sooooo wrong about my opinion on all this. But, PLEASE DO THIS! PLEASE tell me WHY my opinion is wrong. Flame me all you want, but give a GOOD EXPLANATION of why my opinion is ridiculous and why I'm sooooo off-base here. I'd like to here it. Because, lately...at least in most of my threads as of late...I just get flamed with no good comeback. I just get called names and whatnot or my favorite..."Another AvidGamer Nintendo-hating thread". Fine if you feel that way, but back up your claims. Back up the reasons why I'm soooo wrong about everything, then give me feedback. Or are you just going to flame me again as usual without any feedback or worthwhile response?

My threads may or may not be absolutely ridiculous. My opinions may not be "the norm". You may HATE my threads with a passion. But PLEASE!! While flaming me...give me solid reasons WHY I AM WRONG instead of this...."I HATE YOUR THEADS AvidGaMeR444!" without any explanation at all. Or my favorite..."AvidGamer claims to have a crystal ball".Geez! It is another way of saying that I have an opinion! See, when most people give their opinions in System Wars, it is fine and dandy. But not with my threads! Oh no...not with AvidGamer's awful, awful threads of ridiculousness. When I say "I have a crystal ball" it is a joke! Get it? I am being sarcastic or whatever you want to call it. I am not being serious. I try not to be too serious in System Wars. But occasionally, I feel like I have to be to get my point across.

Yes,this is a HUGE WALL OF TEH DREADED TEXT! OH NOEZ!At least I have paragraphs...

AvIdGaMeR444

Hey. I agree with most of what you say.

I am a long time Nintendo fan and I too have been complaining a lot about Nintendo recently, for exactly the same reason as you...Frustration.

It's the fact that the potential is there with Wii but it is just not being realised fully, in graphics, in controls, in 3rd party game development and support, in VC pricing, in the online, etc etc etc.

I too get called a fakeboy and so on but I know for a fact I'm a bigger Nintendo fan than most people in here (I'm just not a blind fanboy), and that is why I get so passionate when I see them making lots of silly little decisions with how to handle the Wii and so on.

I suppose that is just the nature of the beast, so I say go for it man...have your say...and everyone else be damned!

Until Nintendo drops the price of the Wii, drops the price of VC games, gets fully behind online; until 3rd parties start supporting the Wii with decent games, that look good and play/control even better, until Nintendo finally sees fit to offer downloadable demos and previews of upcoming games etc etc etc, well, I think we have every right to complain as much as we want to.

And I WILL!

Developers are scared to death of competing with Nintendo 1st party software to begin with and are afraid of bad 3rd party software sales. Just look at what happened to Gamecube. You can argue all you want that 3rd party devs left Gamecube because it was in last place in sales. Ok...but Gamecube was barely behind Xbox when 3rd parties abandoned Gamecube. That is the truth. Just look at the hardware sales. So, why did 3rd parties leave GC? Why was there no Burnout 3 on GC or other hot 3rd party games during that time? Because 3rd parties recognized that they COULD NOT COMPETE WITH THE SALES OF NINTENDO'S 1st party software!AvIdGaMeR444

This is Nintendos biggest issue IMO, but at the same time they can't just stop making their first party games and pray that the third party support will come - that would be suicide. Their shift to appeal to seniors och women doesn't help either, they won't buy as much software as young-middle agesmales and the thrid party developers know this. I bought my Wii for the first party titles and view everything else (GameCube had some good third party titles after all)as a bonus, otherwise I would be setting myself up for disappointment.

I read 3 paragraphs of that wall of text because you just seemed to keep repeating yourself. So to summarize it, the wii sucks. Don't count on the wii to change it's ways any time soon. Not after the tons of cash they've been making. I would have sold mine if it wasn't for the virtual arcade. Games like Punch Out, Mario 64/Kart and StarFox 64 are still fun. 4_Horsemen

just like with N64 and GC era...will once again rule the roost and that their own 3rd party games will sell poorly.general_KDI

True. Wii gamers want to play Nintendo games. What are they hyping by those times.... let me think... Super smash brso (nintendo), Super Mario Galaxy (Nintendo), Metroid Prime 3 (Nintendo), Mario Kart Wii (nintendo), those are the one they hype NOW, but wait a little, the next games they hype will be : "StarFox Wii", "Zelda Wii", "Wario sumthing", "Mario Tennis Wii".....

Honestly, I know some are looking at other game like Resident evil 5, sports game.... but I talk about the majority of what I see here. Wii players play ninty games...

I miss the days of succinct posts.

Now it seems as if everyone feels the need to write a novel, which contains a lot of words, but little real content.

At what point in life does one realize that things rarely fully satisfy? That's what I feel is the best reality check anyone can get.

YOU'RE JUST JEALOUS OF THE WII!

Have fun playing the same old games while i'll be experiencing the revolution.

Well, all I know is, is that the Wii has a pretty good line-up of games coming out now, and I'm going to be enjoying every one of those games, like many others. People saying that the Wii has no future, well....the Wii is pretty much going to be a mainstream success because of WiiFit. So it looks like the Wii won't be dead for a good long time, since many more people that never get into games will show some respect to them.

Back to the thread though, I say IDC.

You shouldve just said " wii sucks " and it wouldve had the same result rather than making a wall of text.Tamarind_Face

Not reading FTW?