RPG Cliches That Need To Die

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jazreal

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#1 jazreal
Member since 2006 • 2736 Posts

Heres something I thought that every RPG fan, and even non fans alike, might enjoy :P peace and Godspeed Ya'll!!!

Humble Beginnings
Though I am but a simple pig farmer, it appears that I have the potential to become the most powerful hero the world has ever known. Don't let my youth and inexperience fool you; my destiny will carry me to far greater heights than my lowly origins might suggest. At least that's what the mysterious stranger who has only just now dropped into my life is saying. The timing is perfect too; it seems that the world is currently being confronted with a cataclysmic danger that only I can prevent. While it seems odd that I should suddenly be hailed as "The Chosen One," I can only assume that my potential has merely gone unnoticed until now. Perhaps I am suffering from amnesia. Perhaps I have been adopted. That no one seemed to expect much of me will make it all the sweeter when I get to rub my newfound fame in their stupid faces.






Caveat Neighbor
Looks like I'll have to wait in line, though; my neighbors' faces are currently being rubbed in the ashes of their homes (or rapidly being smashed against the business end of a goblin's morning star). Had my family and friends but known that my own auspicious destiny would mean a quick and fiery end for my hometown and its residents, I'm certain they'd have sent me packing long ago. Nevertheless, the unfortunate destruction of my past life provides a handy motivation for me to go seek my destiny in the wider world. If I can also manage to track down those who visited such ruin on my home, so much the better. Who knows? Perhaps this objective will also overlap with saving the world. Time will tell.






The Errand Boy
The mighty task of saving the world has fallen on my shoulders and every person I meet reminds me of the urgency of my task. Strangely, I'm not finding the very citizens I'm trying to save particularly helpful. In fact, the only way I can get these ingrates to actually help me defeat the Dark Lord is by running a seemingly endless series of menial chores. The fat innkeeper, for example, knows where the Dark Lord is hiding but he won't give up the info until I agree to kill the rats that are infesting his cellar. He doesn't seem the least bit concerned that the Dark Lord's minions are raping and pillaging the land while I'm busy stomping rats downstairs. I'm beginning to suspect that "Chosen One" is a fancy way of saying "gopher."






Rampant Gigantism
There's something in the water here. These rats are frickin' huge! And it's not only the rats; it seems that everything down here is suffering from some sort of pituitary condition that causes them to be not only gigantic but also incredibly hostile. In addition to the rats I've been confronted by enormous wolves, bats, beetles, and spiders, all of whom are universally, unashamedly hostile. I guess the "They're just as afraid of you as you are of them" crap my mom used to tell me only applies to things you can actually step on.






Equally Rampant Pouchism
What's even weirder is that these horrible creatures seem to be carrying the most odd assortment of items. So far I've managed to collect 12 arrows from a wolf, a handful of coins from a giant spider and a pair of magic boots from a rat. I'm not quite sure just how these animals are carrying these things around. I'd understand if I found some loot on a giant kangaroo or a were-pelican, but I'm really at a loss to explain how or why a beetle is carrying a magic potion.


An Apple a Day, or As Needed
Not surprisingly, the battle against the giant, boot-hoarding rats has left me with numerous lacerations, contusions and broken bones. Eschewing the more traditional forms of professional medical care, I find instead that I can cure all my ills by simply eating different types of food. A tasty apple heals the cut above my eye and a succulent ham mends my broken ankle. When I inevitably find myself poisoned by giant spiders, I can remedy that by eating a piece of nasty cheese found in the sewer. Who needs activated charcoal when you've got cheese?




The Crate and Barrel Gift Card
It's frustrating to have to perform tedious odd jobs in order to gain the cooperation of the local populace ("Oh, I'd be happy to give you the herbs required to cure the bishop's illness. Would you mind grabbing me a sandwich first? And run get me some stamps?"), so I've decided to start helping myself to whatever items happen to be lying around. Fortunately the townspeople here don't even bother to lock their doors, making it as easy as can be to walk in and steal everything I can get my hands on. I suppose the residents don't worry about locking their doors because they've cleverly hidden most of their valuables in crates and barrels. Too bad for them I just looted an Axe of Crate Smashing +1 from a giant otter I slaughtered in the woods.




Morality, Schmorality!
Just as everyone is willing to turn a blind eye towards my compulsive pilfering and enthusiastic crate-smashing, they also seem relatively unconcerned with the fact that I've had to kill hundreds of people and animals in my quest to confront the Dark Lord. Like the man said, in order to make un omelet, you've got to break a few ouefs. To put it in more literal terms: sometimes you have to kill a dude because he has a magic hat that totally goes with your boots.




A Boss So Nice, We Fought Him Twice
After braving tremendous dangers and accomplishing countless tasks, I have finally managed to find my way into the Dark Lord's lair. After taunting me with a tiresomely thorough explanation of his plan, the Dark Lord made ready to do battle with me. Taking full advantage of his obvious vulnerability (and a backpack full of hams), I was able to dispatch him quite easily. Unfortunately, this wasn't his "true" form. Looks like I'll have to battle him all over again in this new, more powerful form. Apparently, this "true" form is some winged mish-mash floating around in some alternate dimension. It also happens to be a hell of a lot more powerful. Once he's destroyed for real, his lair will inexplicably collapse.




All's Well that Ends Well
Now that the Dark Lord has been destroyed, the whole institution of evil that grew up around him pretty much vanishes. The monsters and mercenaries in his employ (those that you didn't kill yet) seem to go off and live perfectly respectable lives. The Dark Lord also happened to be holding onto a very powerful weapon that's pretty much pointless now that he's already dead. Also, it turns out that he was my father.


Whatever. The important thing is that, now that his evil influence has been wiped from the land, there aren't any other problems to deal with -- no poverty, no illness, no wickedness of any kind. Everything's fine...unless of course the game sells well enough to justify a sequel.

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Blackbond

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#2 Blackbond
Member since 2005 • 24516 Posts

There are too many RPGS that don't have established Hero's as their main character. For example. Final Fantasy IV's main character was Cecil he was already the best Knight of the Kingdom. He wasn't some kid, or some pre-teen who all of a sudden became the savior of the world. He was already an established Hero and Icon within his own Country.

More games need to have main characters like this. Squall was an okay example of this seeing as how he was at the top of his class so the potential was there for him to be strong. But characters like Cloud, Zidane, Tidus, Lloyd, and many others suffer this same fate.

  1. Grandia II's Ryuudo = an already established Mercenary fighter.
  2. Final Fantasy VIII's Sqaull = Graduate of the top of his class.
  3. Final Fantasy IV's Cecil = Strongest Knight and most Loyal Knight of the Kingdom.

I can't stand little kids saving the world. Its seriously embarrassing. I mean at least Ike from Fire Emblem Path of Radience grew in his father's mercenary company learning the tricks of the trade Its not like he was all of sudden thrown into battle with little or no combat expereience.

My point is this. Okay I don't mind having kids or teens save the world. But at least make it so they have pre-established ties to being great combatatents leading to great potential other then that he is the son of (insert great warrior). I have trouble believing that a character like Tidus could save the world.

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martin_f

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#3 martin_f
Member since 2005 • 2605 Posts

I agree, thats why I don't really like Fantasy RPG's anymore par Elder Scrolls.

Im pleased to see none fot his applies to KOTOR or Mass Effect :)

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DaysAirlines

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#4 DaysAirlines
Member since 2006 • 9537 Posts
The Midgar Method: One city can be super high tech but the next village over are dirt farmers living in broken down village still using swords and axes or whatever.
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Gunraidan

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#5 Gunraidan
Member since 2007 • 4272 Posts

There are only 3 RPG cliches that need to die in my opinion.

1) Stop remaking or releasing games under the same IP

2) Stop dumbing down your estabilshed IP's for newbies

3) Stop making them suck

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shiram

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#6 shiram
Member since 2005 • 672 Posts
im tired of having effiminate, child looking heroes in rpgs
if some dude is able to kill dragons and whatnnot, he shouldnt like a 12 year old girl...
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rhaigun

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#7 rhaigun
Member since 2005 • 3019 Posts
You guys are both right on. That's why I prefer WRPGs right now. Well, that and the lack of random encounters and turn-based combat.
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froidnite

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#8 froidnite
Member since 2006 • 2294 Posts
Wow! You almost told the entire NWN2 story:lol:
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Verge_6

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#9 Verge_6
Member since 2007 • 20282 Posts
Wow, this is one of the best threads I've read all month. Seriously.
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GARRYTH

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#10 GARRYTH
Member since 2005 • 6870 Posts
lol my last glitch was in oblivion and i killed a goblin and got stuck in the door. it was such a funny and disurbing sound. the rag doll affect happen over and over again. thud thud thud the sound was so disurbing that my 6 year old daughter was scared. the goblin was spazzing in the door and would not stop. i can even go back to that cave and it still stuck in it spazzing away.
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_BlueDuck_

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#11 _BlueDuck_
Member since 2003 • 11986 Posts

You should probably atleast credit your source.

I agree mostly with the humble beginnings point. Someone else mentioned that more heroes should be like Cecil Harvey, and I agree fully with that. He's probably one of my favorite RPG characters ever. As for the other points such as the food that cures all, unlocked doors, loot from crates and enemies and such.. that doesn't bother me that much. I don't need full realism in my games.

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Drizzt13

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#12 Drizzt13
Member since 2005 • 1676 Posts
Hey that Neverwinter Nights 2 story.
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martin_f

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#13 martin_f
Member since 2005 • 2605 Posts
lol my last glitch was in oblivion and i killed a goblin and got stuck in the door. it was such a funny and disurbing sound. the rag doll affect happen over and over again. thud thud thud the sound was so disurbing that my 6 year old daughter was scared. the goblin was spazzing in the door and would not stop. i can even go back to that cave and it still stuck in it spazzing away.GARRYTH


Happened to me many a time, Human(oids) are better tho its so funny to see a Clothless man stuck, spazzing in a Gate.
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stika

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#14 stika
Member since 2005 • 2628 Posts

well as far i can remember here are the clichés that you missed:

amnesia

characters that will constantly cry about everything

discovering that the bad guy or one of the bad guys is you dad, or uncle or aunt, and as you defeat him in that very last moment suddenly he´s sorry for all he did

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blue_hazy_basic

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#15 blue_hazy_basic  Moderator
Member since 2002 • 30854 Posts

Hey that Neverwinter Nights 2 story.Drizzt13

Or Fable

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redCloudJ7

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#16 redCloudJ7
Member since 2007 • 1004 Posts

Best thread in months.

I can not stand the "save the world" cliche. It makes me freaking sick. Possibly the WORST cliche ever.

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deactivated-5f89ab8e63049

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#17 deactivated-5f89ab8e63049
Member since 2007 • 3182 Posts

One I've noticed isthat whoever is presented as the bad guy right at the start of the story will inevitably end up being controlled by an even more evil bad guy, or will entirely different motives to the ones you've been told throughout the start of the story.

EDIT: And the large empty circular room = a boss fight cliche. I've noticed that one quite a bit recently.

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Pessu

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#18 Pessu
Member since 2007 • 944 Posts
They dont need to die. In fact they are a necessary to give you that classic rpg feeling that I would say most people look for in rpgs. Especially in J-RPG's.
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Lilac_Benjie

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#19 Lilac_Benjie
Member since 2006 • 12287 Posts

It doesn't matter if the game is good. Take Divine Divinity for example.

Just don't try to oversimplify everything.

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Bgrngod

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#20 Bgrngod
Member since 2002 • 5766 Posts

well as far i can remember here are the clichés that you missed:

amnesia

characters that will constantly cry about everything

discovering that the bad guy or one of the bad guys is you dad, or uncle or aunt, and as you defeat him in that very last moment suddenly he´s sorry for all he did

stika

Your third one is a direct tie in to Japanease culture. They have a strong belief, with their story telling, that the villian should ultimately discover their wrong doings and apologize for it, thus achieving a small amount of redemption for at least recognizing that they were wrong.

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hongkingkong

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#21 hongkingkong
Member since 2006 • 9368 Posts
After playing FF12 and Eternal Sonata and feeling almost sick on both occassions, i think i'll stay away from the whole JRPG genre for atleast another century.
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Blackbond

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#22 Blackbond
Member since 2005 • 24516 Posts

They dont need to die. In fact they are a necessary to give you that classic rpg feeling that I would say most people look for in rpgs. Especially in J-RPG's.Pessu

And this is exactly why JRPG's have become stale, boring, and repeitive lately. Thank god for Altus and Nippon Ichi.

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Verge_6

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#23 Verge_6
Member since 2007 • 20282 Posts

They dont need to die. In fact they are a necessary to give you that classic rpg feeling that I would say most people look for in rpgs. Especially in J-RPG's.Pessu

Which would quite possibly explain why the JRPG genre has become a mockery of what it once was.

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Madsucktion

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#24 Madsucktion
Member since 2003 • 2079 Posts
Curious, has there ever been a game where the point was to destroy the world instead of saving it? Only things I can think of are those Strategy RPGs where you were Satan. Disgaea or something like that?
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Verge_6

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#25 Verge_6
Member since 2007 • 20282 Posts

Curious, has there ever been a game where the point was to destroy the world instead of saving it? Only things I can think of are those Strategy RPGs where you were Satan. Disgaea or something like that?Madsucktion

What about Black and White? Spawn, I think, had you destrpying the world as well...I THINK.

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ghostofzabis

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#26 ghostofzabis
Member since 2005 • 2601 Posts

Lol at Errand boy & The Crate and Gift Card!

touche.

----

Was NWN2 really that bad? :? (my pc cannot run it)

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froidnite

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#27 froidnite
Member since 2006 • 2294 Posts

Was NWN2 really that bad? :? (my pc cannot run it)

ghostofzabis
Who said NWN 2 was a bad game. It had a lot of bugs. I replayed it last week when I bought the expansion and almost all bugs and performance issues are fixed. It's story was okay,but MoB has a more interesting story.
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ghostofzabis

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#28 ghostofzabis
Member since 2005 • 2601 Posts
[QUOTE="ghostofzabis"]

Was NWN2 really that bad? :? (my pc cannot run it)

froidnite

Who said NWN 2 was a bad game. It had a lot of bugs. I replayed it last week when I bought the expansion and almost all bugs and performance issues are fixed. It's story was okay,but MoB has a more interesting story.

Well, when talking about cliche that need to die and posters replied that's nwn2, I automatically thought nwn2 (storywise) was bad. Should put (storywise) at my first reply, my bad. :S

-- I just checked info on mask of betrayer.. Still no master of many forms. :cry:

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TalesofRaGnArOk

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#29 TalesofRaGnArOk
Member since 2007 • 3189 Posts
You might want to throw in an example, at least 3 to back this up. Just running through my RPG's, I only see one that starts off with a kid as the main protaganist, which Is Final Fantasy tactics: advanced. Which by the way, is an awsome game
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project343

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#30 project343
Member since 2005 • 14106 Posts

Trying to think of the game that fits the list the most. I've got Fable, which has Humble Beginnings, Caveat Neighbor, The Errand Boy, Equally Rampant Pouchism, An Apple a Day, or As Needed, The Crate and Barrel Gift Card, Morality, Schmorality!, and A Boss So Nice, We Fought Him Twice.

That's 8 out of 10.

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mistervengeance

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#32 mistervengeance
Member since 2006 • 6769 Posts
i would rather have those than play garbage games like oblivion and fable
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pis3rch

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#33 pis3rch
Member since 2006 • 1695 Posts
congrats on an A+ outline of fable, with a few exceptions. still a fun game though.
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project343

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#34 project343
Member since 2005 • 14106 Posts
i would rather have those than play garbage games like oblivion and fablemistervengeance


Um... we'ved concluded that Fable (and Oblivion as well) contain most of those cliches. Your remark wasn't needed, as this was an attack on the RPG genre as whole.
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VanHelsingBoA64

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#35 VanHelsingBoA64
Member since 2007 • 5455 Posts
If there is a direct sequal you start of at level one, no matter how powerful you were when you beat that final boss.
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ParkCarsHere

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#36 ParkCarsHere
Member since 2004 • 3556 Posts
Heh heh heh, awesome thread. I hope a new RPG comes out that takes away all these cliches! *hopes for Mass Effect*
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TEH_rankie

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#37 TEH_rankie
Member since 2007 • 344 Posts
*claps* 

That was beautiful, good sir
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agentfred

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#38 agentfred
Member since 2003 • 5666 Posts

[QUOTE="Drizzt13"]Hey that Neverwinter Nights 2 story.blue_hazy_basic

Or Fable

Yeah, I think Fable fell victim to each and every one of those, without any exceptions.

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project343

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#39 project343
Member since 2005 • 14106 Posts
Heh heh heh, awesome thread. I hope a new RPG comes out that takes away all these cliches! *hopes for Mass Effect*ParkCarsHere


Well, some of those cliches are required for the genre to "worK," traditionally.
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glitchgeeman

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#40 glitchgeeman
Member since 2005 • 5638 Posts
Ha, this is hilarious! A lot of those are pretty true, but there are definitely some exceptions. As for the humble beginnings one, Cecil FF4 is pretty much known as the most powerful and famous knight in the world right from the beginning. I honestly wish more RPG's had characters like these. The other cliche that needs to die is that male characters being so annoyingly feminine. I can't really think of any demographic other than anime fangirls who like this so I don't know why they keep doing it.
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naval

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#41 naval
Member since 2003 • 11108 Posts

[QUOTE="ParkCarsHere"]Heh heh heh, awesome thread. I hope a new RPG comes out that takes away all these cliches! *hopes for Mass Effect*project343


Well, some of those cliches are required for the genre to "worK," traditionally.

yeah few of theese stuff may be cliched but they save lot of tedious work

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Hewkii

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#42 Hewkii
Member since 2006 • 26339 Posts
I think technically, in BG2 you were reasonably well known at the beginning...
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BambooBanger

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#43 BambooBanger
Member since 2007 • 1360 Posts

The Phantasy Star series dealt with these cliches fairly well.

But I agree with this thread, 16 year old boy armed with a stick and cloth shoes becomes the worlds saviour in 40 hours... all fairly ridiculous and tired.

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redCloudJ7

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#44 redCloudJ7
Member since 2007 • 1004 Posts

Heh heh heh, awesome thread. I hope a new RPG comes out that takes away all these cliches! *hopes for Mass Effect*ParkCarsHere

Mass Effect is going to possess RPG cliches. The story is based around it.

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Hewkii

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#45 Hewkii
Member since 2006 • 26339 Posts
one cliche I personally don't like is how either you're in space or you're in a medieval setting.
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TheEndBoss

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#46 TheEndBoss
Member since 2007 • 856 Posts

I hate how so many games promise you can be either Good or Evil, but the game ends up being constructed around you taking the Good path. You can be as bad as you want. But you're still going to have to kill that Dark Lord guy, regardless of whether or not you're the good guy. Usually there's not a completely opposite choice for saving the world. You can go and slaughter entire villages, but does that really get you anywhere in the game? The game gives me the choice to be Evil, so why then is the game's actual story constructed around me doing good?

RPGs, if they promisemorality, need to deliver. I have tobe at least somewhat good in eveyr RPG game or I won't get anywhere. Some might argue becoming a ridiculously powerful serial killer is the opposite of saving the world from the Dark Lord, but the only partthere's a plot to is the saving the world part. Why can't there be a seperate plot to being evil, too?