Squaresoft and Enix vs SquareEnix

Do you feel that Squaresoft and Enix are just not up to the same quality they were at before the merger?

I believe so.  I have not played one game put out by SquareEnix I can safely say I love as much as many classic SNES, PSX, and early PS2 Squaresoft and Enix titles.

What happened to these two companies outside of a lack of competition in the genre?  This is why I hope Blue Dragon is good, so hopefully we can get some new competition in a genre that has gone straight to hell from it's heyday 

Do you feel that Squaresoft and Enix are just not up to the same quality they were at before the merger?

I believe so. I have not played one game put out by SquareEnix I can safely say I love as much as many classic SNES, PSX, and early PS2 Squaresoft and Enix titles.

What happened to these two companies outside of a lack of competition in the genre? This is why I hope Blue Dragon is good, so hopefully we can get some new competition in a genre that has gone straight to hell from it's heyday

rond5566

I think Final Fantasy XII was the closest I've come to liking a SquareEnix game, but it didn't blow me away like the standards I felt the game needed to meet to save the companies opinion.

I'm officially done with them.  I'll stick to their classics 

you got your square soft in my enix

you got your enix in my square soft

As Jim Gaffigan said,

Fruit = good

Cake = good

Fruitcake = nasty crap 

Coming from my own personal experience (which admittedly is lacking in the newer generations), I would definitely say Square and Enix were better apart than they are together.

When FF8 came around, I loved it, but to me that was the true beginning of the end for the Final Fantasy series. Before that the series was always built around a great fantasy setting (with some technology thrown in), with solid RPG gameplay and a Nobuo Uematsu soundtrack. Square knew what worked, and they stuck with it. Even FF7 was an amazing game, even when they threw in new gameplay concepts like the limit break and materia. Like I said, FF8 was great, but it started the trend we have now, where the FF games are thrown into increasingly ornate and abstract (futuristic a lot of the time) worlds, with extremely twisting plots, and a host of characters who all look like girls, and have blond hair (this is more FFX and XII than VIII). I have no problem with any of these things by themselves, but when taken together, they start to degrade the "tried and true" feeling the FF series always had. The reason FF was popular was because it took a proven formula, and kept making small improvements across the board (the job system, active time battle, graphics, etc.). SquareEnix now seems to be more interested in seeing how different they can make their FF games, and I think this is a mistake. There's a reason the rumored FFVII remake is more lusted after than FFXIII--People know the old Square games are gold, but they're not quite as sure what they'll get with the new ones.

As for Enix, I can't honestly say I remember all the games I've played by them, but their RPGs for the SNES were all unique and stellar in their own ways. They went down a path that was a lot less mainstream than Square (Dragon Ques/Warrior notwithstanding), but their games still had a unique feel and polish to them that made them stand out from the crowd. Now that Enix has been thrown in with Square (which has become the Capcom of these past two generations, with all the spinoffs and sequels they've created), their uniqueness is lost.

The last thing I have to offer as proof is this: How can SquareEnix be better off now, if Square no longer has the FATHER of the modern JRPG (Hironobu Sakaguchi)? This man created Final Fantasy, which many consider the Holy Grail of RPG series. The fact that he has a company no longer associated with SquareEnix at all should speak to the fact that they are a completely different company now than they were in the past. And for those of us who loved the past, this isn't a positive thing.

Coming from my own personal experience (which admittedly is lacking in the newer generations), I would definitely say Square and Enix were better apart than they are together.

When FF8 came around, I loved it, but to me that was the true beginning of the end for the Final Fantasy series. Before that the series was always built around a great fantasy setting (with some technology thrown in), with solid RPG gameplay and a Nobuo Uematsu soundtrack. Square knew what worked, and they stuck with it. Even FF7 was an amazing game, even when they threw in new gameplay concepts like the limit break and materia. Like I said, FF8 was great, but it started the trend we have now, where the FF games are thrown into increasingly ornate and abstract (futuristic a lot of the time) worlds, with extremely twisting plots, and a host of characters who all look like girls, and have blond hair (this is more FFX and XII than VIII). I have no problem with any of these things by themselves, but when taken together, they start to degrade the "tried and true" feeling the FF series always had. The reason FF was popular was because it took a proven formula, and kept making small improvements across the board (the job system, active time battle, graphics, etc.). SquareEnix now seems to be more interested in seeing how different they can make their FF games, and I think this is a mistake. There's a reason the rumored FFVII remake is more lusted after than FFXIII--People know the old Square games are gold, but they're not quite as sure what they'll get with the new ones.

As for Enix, I can't honestly say I remember all the games I've played by them, but their RPGs for the SNES were all unique and stellar in their own ways. They went down a path that was a lot less mainstream than Square (Dragon Ques/Warrior notwithstanding), but their games still had a unique feel and polish to them that made them stand out from the crowd. Now that Enix has been thrown in with Square (which has become the Capcom of these past two generations, with all the spinoffs and sequels they've created), their uniqueness is lost.

The last thing I have to offer as proof is this: How can SquareEnix be better off now, if Square no longer has the FATHER of the modern JRPG (Hironobu Sakaguchi)? This man created Final Fantasy, which many consider the Holy Grail of RPG series. The fact that he has a company no longer associated with SquareEnix at all should speak to the fact that they are a completely different company now than they were in the past. And for those of us who loved the past, this isn't a positive thing.

SeanBond

What happened to these two companies outside of a lack of competition in the genre? This is why I hope Blue Dragon is good, so hopefully we can get some new competition in a genre that has gone straight to hell from it's heyday

rond5566

What are you talking about? Level 5 and Nippon Ichi (also NIS America) both compete with SE in certain fields, they are just specialized towards ARPGs and SRPGs respectively. Sting is also a talented if decidedly niche developer, as is Quest (which is legendary among SRPG diehards but unknown elsewhere).

Theres still lots of competition, its just mostly overlooked.

Squaresoft shot its own foot with the disaster of a "Final Fantasy" movie: The Spirits Within. It was a big slap to anyone who was a fan of all things Final Fantasy, and really, I feel they deserve their current fate.RahnAetas

My whole time watching "Spirits Within", I kept asking, "where's the Final Fantasy?". I couldn't find it. You could tell they slapped the name "Final Fantasy" on the movie so more people would watch it. The movie wasn't that bad though. I think people didn't like it because they didn't get what they expected. Still, not a bad movie. The CGI was incredible; way ahead of its time. 

Nippon Ichi, Level 5, and Sting make good games, but they are hardly the commercial success of Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior.

In Japan at least, Namco is the only real competition since the Tales series is much more popular over there than it is here. 

[QUOTE="RahnAetas"]Squaresoft shot its own foot with the disaster of a "Final Fantasy" movie: The Spirits Within. It was a big slap to anyone who was a fan of all things Final Fantasy, and really, I feel they deserve their current fate.16bitkevin

My whole time watching "Spirits Within", I kept asking, "where's the Final Fantasy?". I couldn't find it. You could tell they slapped the name "Final Fantasy" on the movie so more people would watch it. The movie wasn't that bad though. I think people didn't like it because they didn't get what they expected. Still, not a bad movie. The CGI was incredible; way ahead of its time. 

No it's not a bad movie if you have no clue what Final Fantasy is.  However, it was supposed to be a Final Fantasy movie, not a movie with the words "Final Fantasy" slapped on it like you said.  A cheap trick to try and draw in fans, only to have it explode in their face.

Nippon Ichi, Level 5, and Sting make good games, but they are hardly the commercial success of Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior.

In Japan at least, Namco is the only real competition since the Tales series is much more popular over there than it is here.

rond5566

Nippon Ichi has very low operating costs considering how low-tech their games tend to be and have often done well in Japanese retail, their limitation is more due to how niche the genre is than anything, they aren't going anywhere.

Level 5 likewise has done good numbers (Dark Cloud did better than a million, don't yet know the sales numbers on Rogue Galaxy but Professor Layton has been doing well).  Sony and others have reason to support them.

I'll give you Namco, though Tengai Makyo is VERY popular in Japan and offering such as Suikoden and Lunar tend to do much better there as well. Overall Japan has a much more diverse JRPG culture than elsewhere where the RPG culture essentially consists of Final Fantasy and everything else. 

Ultimately the end sales numbers don't matter that much (though I still say Square-Enix has lots of competition I didn't even get into Shadow Hearts for instance) so long as profitability remains and many RPG developers have been able to remain so.

The competition against S-E is only increasing as I type this with more RPG startups and more RPG developers gaining wider recognition in Japan and elsewhere.

Do you feel that Squaresoft and Enix are just not up to the same quality they were at before the merger?

I believe so. I have not played one game put out by SquareEnix I can safely say I love as much as many classic SNES, PSX, and early PS2 Squaresoft and Enix titles.

What happened to these two companies outside of a lack of competition in the genre? This is why I hope Blue Dragon is good, so hopefully we can get some new competition in a genre that has gone straight to hell from it's heyday

rond5566

same thing i said.. exact same thing word by word.

Nippon Ichi, Level 5, and Sting make good games, but they are hardly the commercial success of Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior.

In Japan at least, Namco is the only real competition since the Tales series is much more popular over there than it is here.

rond5566

Do you feel that Squaresoft and Enix are just not up to the same quality they were at before the merger?

I believe so.  I have not played one game put out by SquareEnix I can safely say I love as much as many classic SNES, PSX, and early PS2 Squaresoft and Enix titles.

What happened to these two companies outside of a lack of competition in the genre?  This is why I hope Blue Dragon is good, so hopefully we can get some new competition in a genre that has gone straight to hell from it's heyday 

rond5566

Squaresoft > Square >> SquareEnix.

That's the way I see it. Ever since the merger with Enix the Final Fantasy brand name is being whored out on every platform they can get their money grubbling hands on.

What happened Square, I used to love you! 

Yeah i completely agree..  Square soft and Enix is greater the Square enix....

I think Square Enix > Squaresoft. I was so happy to hear the maker of Grandia and the maker of the Final Fantasy series merge. Square Enix really just destroys the competition. Square Enix has not been together that long. I think Square Enix could have its own console and give Nintendo and PS3 competition big time. majadamus

**** that, learn more sometime..they didn't make it they didn't even publish the best one (meaning the original) or second-best (meaning Grandia II). They didn't make Lunar either...those were both Game Arts.

If you loved FF8 i highly recommend playing Chrono Cross and Xenogears . Xenogears you might love if you liked FF8 it's got an awsome story about a God theme and killing him it's just an amazing adventure. Also has the Love feeling and great music like FF8 Chrono Cross is just a well made adventure but those 2 titles were the best of the PS era.
peacebringer

I actually own both games, and agree with you that Chrono Cross and Xenogears are amazing. I'm huge fan of the anime series Neon Genesis Evangelion, which I believe influenced Xenogears a lot, so there's no way I'd have missed that game.

you got your square soft in my enix

you got your enix in my square soft

MorisUkunRasik

stop playing with your WiiWii 

As Jim Gaffigan said,

 

Fruit = good

Cake = good

 

Fruitcake = nasty crap

16bitkevin

lol :lol: 

I disagree. It's only been ..what, four years since they merged? and during that time they released  Dragon Quest VIII, FFXII, Valkyrie Profile 2, KH II , Radiata Stories and Star Ocean III.

All excellent games IMO. 

On a side note, where the hell is Terranigma 2, Enix? :(

On a side note, where the hell is Terranigma 2, Enix? :(

Jagazaar

 Actually, Terranigma is the third game in the Soul Blazer series 

[QUOTE="Jagazaar"]

On a side note, where the hell is Terranigma 2, Enix? :(

rond5566

Actually, Terranigma is the third game in the Soul Blazer series

Oh, heh, whoops. Forgot about Soul Blazer and Illusion of Gaia there, my bad. Still, another game in the series sure would be nice. Better an action-RPG along the same sort of lines than some of the stuff they're producing nowadays.

Cynicism aside, Dawn of Mana looks like it might just fit that bill, hopefully. 

Squaresoft > Square >> SquareEnix.

That's the way I see it. Ever since the merger with Enix the Final Fantasy brand name is being whored out on every platform they can get their money grubbling hands on.

What happened Square, I used to love you!

Raidea

What? Squaresoft was just a brand name for Square Co., Ltd. Square Soft, Inc. was the company's original North American subsidiary.  

[QUOTE="rond5566"][QUOTE="Jagazaar"]

On a side note, where the hell is Terranigma 2, Enix? :(

Jagazaar

Actually, Terranigma is the third game in the Soul Blazer series

Oh, heh, whoops. Forgot about Soul Blazer and Illusion of Gaia there, my bad. Still, another game in the series sure would be nice. Better an action-RPG along the same sort of lines than some of the stuff they're producing nowadays.

Cynicism aside, Dawn of Mana looks like it might just fit that bill, hopefully.

ummm wth? illusion of gaia had 2 sequels? when did this happen. 

I disagree. It's only been ..what, four years since they merged? and during that time they released Dragon Quest VIII, FFXII, Valkyrie Profile 2, KH II , Radiata Stories and Star Ocean III.

 

All excellent games IMO.

 

Nex_Ownage

They didn't make Dragon Quest VIII that credit goes to Level 5, nor did they make Valkyrie Profile 2, Radiata Stories, or Star Ocean III. In Total all of two games there were actually made by them. 

all I have to say is Enix got more out of the merger than Squaresoft ever could.Shazenab

You are aware that Tri Ace games used to be exclusively published by Enix and now are published by Square-Enix (though not all anymore) which means that now Square also gets profits from being part of Enix and that Squaresoft was on the verge of bankruptcy prior to merging with Enix?