mjarantiala, look>
As a short one;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ujq1e4ig4d8
Please abserve all the micro techniques in this video;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wh6JPbIWNU0
I am sorry but I doubt that you play StarCraft or follow professional games.
Nikalai_88
It's obvious that you don't realize that everything employed in those videos are of rather BASIC tactical maneuvers that rely on only four factors:
* unit placement
* special abilities
* timing
* weapon type
In Company of Heroes, tactics rely on:
* unit placement
* special abilities
* timing
* weapon type
* cover (complete/incomplete/exposed)
* unit posture (crouching, standing, kneeling, in a building
* building destructibility (a shell of a building provides much less cover to units inside than a complete building)
* direction of fire (units have narrow fields of fire; some have to be manually pointed)
* elevation (higher elevation penetrates more cover)
* sectional targeting (targeting wheels, engines, weapons, side/back/top armor, etc.)
* armor type (different values for front armor, back armor, side armor, top armor, turret armor, etc.)
* unit accuracy (depends on whether units are in cover, moving, standing, crouching, kneeling, under fire, in a building, etc.; also, tank shells and artillery are highly inaccurate)
* retrievable weapons (your units can retrieve the special weapons of enemies they've killed, e.g. squad machine guns, bazookas, etc.)
Granted, you can pull off some amazing tactical maneuvers in StarCraft, but that doesn't make it a more tactical game. StarCraft relies on a relatively simple tactical model, which is why battles are so fast and fierce in StarCraft. In Company of Heroes, battles are long and drawn out affairs, but are incredibly tense because there are so many factors at play all at once.
its a game of hard counters and positioning with plenty of special abilities. Nikalai_88
So? How would that make it less tactical?
A rifleman squad without sticky bombs simply can't take on a tank and a greyhound (without mines) won't take on a Panthern.Nikalai_88
This is true, but it's also a given. You still cannot deny the fact that a rifleman squad in CoH is a FAR more versatile unit than the basic infantry units in StarCraft, especially given the fact that such squads can pick up weapons and man emplacements on the battlefield as they are needed.
There are certainly more 'systems' in CoH but they are not as versetile as in SC. Most tank/small arms fire is calculated with simple 'to hit chances'- a model simpler than StarCraft's.Nikalai_88
Wrong. StarCraft's damage modeling is FAR simpler. In StarCraft, units ALWAYS hit their targets, with the exception of units which have a time-on-target delay that can be exploited (siege tanks in siege mode, lurkers, etc.).
If the 'to hit chance' is calculated as positive than you will see the shell curve towards your units no matter how you move it. Nikalai_88
Yes, but the number of variables/modifiers in that calculation is what requires tactical compensation.
CoH's damage modeling may be straightforward, but it's anything but simple. Having half a dozen modifiers to the hit-chance, and then another half-dozen modifiers to the damage calculation is not simple, especially when you're the one that has to keep track of them all.
However, having one modifier to the hit-chance (time on target) and one modifier to the damage calculation (armor/weapon type), as in StarCraft, is simple.
Other aspects, like elevation are present in SC (and not in CoH) and coupled with air units has great affect. Also Movement speeds play a more important role, I mean in SC you have units like the Reaver and abilities like Recall creating truly opposite ends;Nikalai_88
That only means that StarCraft's tactics are more dynamic, but the number of simultaneous factors that need to be monitored in each tactical maneuver is still smaller than in CoH.
in CoH most combat units either have the games generic 'normal' speed or 'slightly faster',Nikalai_88
CoH compensates for a lack of variety in movement speeds by giving those movement speeds a direct effect on other factors, such as enemy accuracy and your own units' accuracy.
true arty is slow, but its range makes up for it.Nikalai_88
Which is the case in CoH, but NOT in StarCraft. Most artillery emplacements are immobile in CoH, and mobile artillery is either weak (mortars) or a limited unit (rocket tanks).
There is certainly more to it, I mean how would you lay your vulture mines to stop enemy goons? Or to counter dark templars or to protect your siege against speed zealots?Nikalai_88
Again, those involve basic tactical thinking. The speed at which actions occur in StarCraft preclude any sort of complex tactical models.
You mentioned the rifleman example but I do not know (or remember) any 1v1 maps that are urban,Nikalai_88
"Urban" was a wrong choice of words because it's too specific. I meant terrain with plenty of intermediate and impassable obstacles and occupiable shelters (e.g. bunkers).
Log in to comment