Suit: Microsoft knew Xbox could damage discs

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loco145

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#1 loco145
Member since 2006 • 12226 Posts

A document unsealed in a lawsuit last week suggests that Microsoft employees knew before putting the Xbox 360 on the market in November 2005 that the video game console could damage game discs.

Several ongoing lawsuits charge that the Xbox 360 is defectively designed because tilting or swiveling the video game console can scratch game discs playing inside.

Plaintiffs in a July 2007 case filed in U.S. District Court in Seattle are seeking ****action status on behalf of all those who purchased Xbox 360s.

Most of the declarations in the court case are sealed, but a newly unsealed motion (read it here) seeking ****status quotes from the sealed declarations of Microsoft employees.

The motion says that Microsoft knew that when the Xbox 360 was reoriented with a disc playing inside, the disc could be damaged.

It quotes Hiroo Umeno, a Microsoft program manager, who said in a declaration, "This is ... information that we as a team, optical disc drive team, knew about. When we first discovered the problem in September or October (2005), when we got a first report of disc movement, we knew this is what's causing the problem."

Source.

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BioShockOwnz

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#2 BioShockOwnz
Member since 2006 • 52901 Posts
I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.
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lebanese_boy

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#3 lebanese_boy
Member since 2003 • 18050 Posts
Of course they knew, they're telling you not to move the console while a disc is spinning. Frankly if anybody moves their console with the disc spinning and complain to Microsoft about it, they'd be pretty stupid themselves. Then again Microsoft should have done a more reliable console. I've moved my Wii accidentaly many times with a disc spinning and there was absolutely no damage done.
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MTBare

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#4 MTBare
Member since 2006 • 5176 Posts
Well, there IS a warning about not moving the console in the manual, so I would assume they knew about it..
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Heydanbud92

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#5 Heydanbud92
Member since 2007 • 4464 Posts
that's a genius way to sell more games on your system, it's terrible, yes, but genius.
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Dante2710

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#6 Dante2710
Member since 2005 • 63164 Posts
never had any of discs scratched
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Heydanbud92

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#7 Heydanbud92
Member since 2007 • 4464 Posts

I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.BioShockOwnz

Yeah, see TC? M$ doesn't make faulty hardware!

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GinoNYC

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#8 GinoNYC
Member since 2008 • 470 Posts
I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs.
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loco145

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#9 loco145
Member since 2006 • 12226 Posts
Guys, the 360 was (or still is :question: ) one of the few modern electronics that scratch disc because of moving it. And im using the term modern loosely here, since not even my launch PSX did that....
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Dreams-Visions

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#10 Dreams-Visions
Member since 2006 • 26578 Posts
never a damaged disc in this house.
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chansaet

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#11 chansaet
Member since 2003 • 6282 Posts
My first X360 damage my games (NBA 2K7 was damaged beyond repair)
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Heydanbud92

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#12 Heydanbud92
Member since 2007 • 4464 Posts
I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. GinoNYC
as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.
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Dahaka-UK

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#13 Dahaka-UK
Member since 2005 • 6915 Posts
Doesn't it say in the manual not to tilt the console. Therefore it was pretty obvious Microsoft new it would damage the disc.
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GinoNYC

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#14 GinoNYC
Member since 2008 • 470 Posts
[QUOTE="GinoNYC"]I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. Heydanbud92
as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.

You know, when I get my PS3, I'm just gonna throw discs around. I'll go to Central Park and play Frisbee Golf with my copy of MGS 4. I'll use it as a batarang if I get mugged on the subway. Then I'll go home and load it up with NO worries about DRE. The one thing I'm looking forward to about Blu-Ray: my option to be totally careless about how I handle my discs.
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theMarshell

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#15 theMarshell
Member since 2008 • 602 Posts
There sueing because because they moved the console, both the PS3 and 360 manuals say not to mave the the console while the disc is spining. How is this a problem they said not to and the people didn't listen so its MS's fault come on at least come up with a better excuse than that. I have 21 360 games and outside of the used games not one of them are scratched to the poit were I can't play them.
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Alpha-Male22

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#16 Alpha-Male22
Member since 2008 • 3782 Posts

Holy hotdog buns, FOURTEEN Xboxes??

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hopesfall2own

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#17 hopesfall2own
Member since 2008 • 2714 Posts

Several ongoing lawsuits charge that the Xbox 360 is defectively designed because tilting or swiveling the video game console can scratch game discs playing inside.



And you seriously think these idiots will win this case? I think I'll sue Microsoft because I hit my 360 with a bat and now it doesn't turn on, the hardware MUST be faulty right? :roll:
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noswear

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#18 noswear
Member since 2008 • 3263 Posts

Holy hotdog buns, FOURTEEN Xboxes??

Alpha-Male22
Each one more reliable than the last. ;)
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Locke562

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#19 Locke562
Member since 2004 • 7673 Posts

Holy hotdog buns, FOURTEEN Xboxes??

Alpha-Male22
And I thought I was unlucky with my four broken 360's.
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littlestreakier

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#20 littlestreakier
Member since 2004 • 2950 Posts
well my 360 has never scartched a disc...i remember all the bad buzz about discs getting scratched when the 360 was moved from vertical to horizontal (vice-versa) and thought to myself "how did that seem like a good idea?" as far as i know none of my friends 360's has scratched their games either.
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hopesfall2own

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#21 hopesfall2own
Member since 2008 • 2714 Posts
[QUOTE="Locke562"][QUOTE="Alpha-Male22"]

Holy hotdog buns, FOURTEEN Xboxes??

And I thought I was unlucky with my four broken 360's.

I'm pretty sure Bioshock was not serious about 14 xbox's..come on..
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Sully28

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#22 Sully28
Member since 2003 • 5097 Posts
I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.BioShockOwnz
lol you cant be serious.
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FunkyHeadHunter

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#23 FunkyHeadHunter
Member since 2007 • 1758 Posts

[QUOTE="GinoNYC"]I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. Heydanbud92
as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.

A disc is a disc inst it? How can one scratch and one not? Please inform me on this..tks

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Heydanbud92

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#24 Heydanbud92
Member since 2007 • 4464 Posts
[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"][QUOTE="GinoNYC"]I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. GinoNYC
as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.

You know, when I get my PS3, I'm just gonna throw discs around. I'll go to Central Park and play Frisbee Golf with my copy of MGS 4. I'll use it as a batarang if I get mugged on the subway. Then I'll go home and load it up with NO worries about DRE. The one thing I'm looking forward to about Blu-Ray: my option to be totally careless about how I handle my discs.

you'd be surprised at the amount of people who, it looks like, actually do this... either that or they use sandpaper on them. And then they wonder why it didn't play. Anyways, I would also like to say that at my store, we get a few people come in a day that request we resurface their discs for a small fee. I kid you not, about 3/4 or more of those discs are xbox 360 discs.... /anecdotal evidence
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Heydanbud92

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#25 Heydanbud92
Member since 2007 • 4464 Posts

[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"][QUOTE="GinoNYC"]I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. FunkyHeadHunter

as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.

A disc is a disc inst it? How can one scratch and one not? Please inform me on this..tks

it has a thin layer of super hard plastic on the bottom that is nearly impossible to scratch accidentally. you'de have to use a knife or really rough sandpaper to scratch it enough to the point where it doesn't play without needing resurfaced.
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rolo107

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#26 rolo107
Member since 2007 • 5469 Posts
Um.... Of course a console can damage the disc. It's a spinning drive, inside of a machine. If you move that machine, there is a chance it will get scratched, rather high in this case, etc. Could is a rather subjective term to use there.
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GinoNYC

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#27 GinoNYC
Member since 2008 • 470 Posts
[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"][QUOTE="GinoNYC"][QUOTE="Heydanbud92"] as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.

You know, when I get my PS3, I'm just gonna throw discs around. I'll go to Central Park and play Frisbee Golf with my copy of MGS 4. I'll use it as a batarang if I get mugged on the subway. Then I'll go home and load it up with NO worries about DRE. The one thing I'm looking forward to about Blu-Ray: my option to be totally careless about how I handle my discs.

you'd be surprised at the amount of people who, it looks like, actually do this... either that or they use sandpaper on them. And then they wonder why it didn't play. Anyways, I would also like to say that at my store, we get a few people come in a day that request we resurface their discs for a small fee. I kid you not, about 3/4 or more of those discs are xbox 360 discs.... /anecdotal evidence

Ha. Rock Band got damaged so easily. I mean..I accidentally bumped into the 360, not even a hard bump, and it didn't even tip over all the way, it was more like diagonal. And yet I still got the ring scratch on the disk and had to re-buy the game. It's funny, I have a version of Vice City on my XBox 1, it's scratched beyond belief yet it still works perfectly 4 years later.
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kyacat

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#28 kyacat
Member since 2003 • 4408 Posts

There sueing because because they moved the console, both the PS3 and 360 manuals say not to mave the the console while the disc is spining. How is this a problem they said not to and the people didn't listen so its MS's fault come on at least come up with a better excuse than that. I have 21 360 games and outside of the used games not one of them are scratched to the poit were I can't play them.theMarshell

Exactly all game consoles manuals ps1,ps2.xbox,gamecube,xbox 1,360,ps3,wii say do not move console while disc is spinning.

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loco145

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#29 loco145
Member since 2006 • 12226 Posts
Um.... Of course a console can damage the disc. It's a spinning drive, inside of a machine. If you move that machine, there is a chance it will get scratched, rather high in this case, etc. Could is a rather subjective term to use there. rolo107
The chance is significantly lower on every other console made by man (Well, im not sure in the case of a shoddy Chinese 3D0 SKU :( ).
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Kickinurass

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#30 Kickinurass
Member since 2005 • 3357 Posts

[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"][QUOTE="GinoNYC"] You know, when I get my PS3, I'm just gonna throw discs around. I'll go to Central Park and play Frisbee Golf with my copy of MGS 4. I'll use it as a batarang if I get mugged on the subway. Then I'll go home and load it up with NO worries about DRE. The one thing I'm looking forward to about Blu-Ray: my option to be totally careless about how I handle my discs. GinoNYC
you'd be surprised at the amount of people who, it looks like, actually do this... either that or they use sandpaper on them. And then they wonder why it didn't play. Anyways, I would also like to say that at my store, we get a few people come in a day that request we resurface their discs for a small fee. I kid you not, about 3/4 or more of those discs are xbox 360 discs.... /anecdotal evidence

Ha. Rock Band got damaged so easily. I mean..I accidentally bumped into the 360, not even a hard bump, and it didn't even tip over all the way, it was more like diagonal. And yet I still got the ring scratch on the disk and had to re-buy the game. It's funny, I have a version of Vice City on my XBox 1, it's scratched beyond belief yet it still works perfectly 4 years later.

My copy of Phantom Crash survived a four foot fall inside my Xbox 360 from a poorly placed shelf ( I did it myself... :P) and kept working fine. Now it sits on the ground because if I lost that game... I don't know what I'd do.

I must be luckiest guy in the world...:)

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verbtex

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#31 verbtex  Moderator
Member since 2006 • 9196 Posts

I don't move my consoles while playing.

And none of my 360 games have been scratched by anything than when I dropped one one time at a friends house.

I've had the RRoD on me, but I'm pretty careful with my gaming equipment, so no scratched disks on the consoles fault.

By the way microsoft, good luck. :)

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fbigent34

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#32 fbigent34
Member since 2007 • 2389 Posts
link to a blog kindof hard for me to trust sites like that.
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FunkyHeadHunter

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#33 FunkyHeadHunter
Member since 2007 • 1758 Posts
[QUOTE="FunkyHeadHunter"]

[QUOTE="Heydanbud92"] as someone who works at a video rental store, I fully agree my friend. they NEVER need to be resurfaced, no matter what.Heydanbud92

A disc is a disc inst it? How can one scratch and one not? Please inform me on this..tks

it has a thin layer of super hard plastic on the bottom that is nearly impossible to scratch accidentally. you'de have to use a knife or really rough sandpaper to scratch it enough to the point where it doesn't play without needing resurfaced.

WOW...that is nice then. Cool

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Pariah_001

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#34 Pariah_001
Member since 2003 • 4850 Posts

[QUOTE="BioShockOwnz"]I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.Heydanbud92

Yeah, see TC? M$ doesn't make faulty hardware!

Yep! Microsoft is infallible!
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Blue_Blaz3

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#35 Blue_Blaz3
Member since 2008 • 96 Posts

I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.BioShockOwnz

now I know why I don't have 360

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Blue_Blaz3

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#36 Blue_Blaz3
Member since 2008 • 96 Posts
[QUOTE="Locke562"][QUOTE="Alpha-Male22"]

Holy hotdog buns, FOURTEEN Xboxes??

hopesfall2own

And I thought I was unlucky with my four broken 360's.

I'm pretty sure Bioshock was not serious about 14 xbox's..come on..

1 is good enough for me

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WilliamRLBaker

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#37 WilliamRLBaker
Member since 2006 • 28915 Posts
I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. GinoNYC
that was actually TDK, and the blu ray consortium ordering that coating. P.S: i've had no scratched discs and every disc based system says do not tilt or move the system while the disc is spinning Centrifical force and all that dont ya know?
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Delsage

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#38 Delsage
Member since 2004 • 3355 Posts
I've gone through 14 Xbox 360's and not one damaged a disc.BioShockOwnz
14 Seriously! I wont buy a 360 until they fix their hardware issues, and from the seems they probably aren't going to.
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Rodneythepom

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#39 Rodneythepom
Member since 2008 • 178 Posts
not surprised in the least.
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f50p90

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#40 f50p90
Member since 2008 • 3767 Posts
buh buh teh microsoft cares about teh gamerz! Anyway only one of my discs got a nice little ring aroung it. Still plays fine though
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Nagidar

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#41 Nagidar
Member since 2006 • 6231 Posts
This lawsuit will get thrown out quicker than a cheating wife, there is a warning in the manual for the 360 to NOT move the console when a disc is spinning in the drive.
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f50p90

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#42 f50p90
Member since 2008 • 3767 Posts
[QUOTE="GinoNYC"]I've already had to re-buy 4 games for the 360 because of this crap. If there's one thing Sony got right this generation, it's the protective surfaces on Blu-Ray discs. WilliamRLBaker
that was actually TDK, and the blu ray consortium ordering that coating. P.S: i've had no scratched discs and every disc based system says do not tilt or move the system while the disc is spinning Centrifical force and all that dont ya know?

I don't know too much about centrifical force, but I don't see what centripetal force has to do with moving the console while it's going
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Soulja_West

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#43 Soulja_West
Member since 2003 • 15084 Posts
I've damage about 4 games due to people bumping my 360. The 360 was poorly made and I think MS did this for a reason.
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RonnieLottinSF

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#44 RonnieLottinSF
Member since 2007 • 1474 Posts
I never had a damaged disc and I have had an XBOX360 since launch. Also it says in the manual not to move the console while a disc is in the system. Yet another lawsuit that will lose and is pointless.
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Phazevariance

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#45 Phazevariance
Member since 2003 • 12356 Posts
Well, there are different brands of drives used in the 360 out on the market, so my guess is that its a specific brand of optical drive thats doing the scratching.
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f50p90

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#46 f50p90
Member since 2008 • 3767 Posts
I never had a damaged disc and I have had an XBOX360 since launch. Also it says in the manual not to move the console while a disc is in the system. Yet another lawsuit that will lose and is pointless.RonnieLottinSF
Of course your not supposed to move the console. but 'stuff' happens. that''s like saying you dont need a seatbelt because your not supposed to crash.. A disc=/= your life, so these issues don't mean you should be scared of the 360, but there's no denying M$ made some atrocious hardware
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dotWithShoes

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#48 dotWithShoes
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I've damage about 4 games due to people bumping my 360. The 360 was poorly made and I think MS did this for a reason.Soulja_West
Why do you have a rather expensive piece of electronics where someone can 'bump' it while you're playing? Its not exactly the smallest piece of equipment, nor the quietest, so its not hard to see... I don't understand this? You just have idiots for friends/family? My Wii got knocked over one time by a friend of mine, while it was on the floor(short gamecube controller cord)... He got scared, not of the system but of me.
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Soulja_West

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#49 Soulja_West
Member since 2003 • 15084 Posts
[QUOTE="Soulja_West"]I've damage about 4 games due to people bumping my 360. The 360 was poorly made and I think MS did this for a reason.dotWithShoes
Why do you have a rather expensive piece of electronics where someone can 'bump' it while you're playing? Its not exactly the smallest piece of equipment, nor the quietest, so its not hard to see... I don't understand this? You just have idiots for friends/family? My Wii got knocked over one time by a friend of mine, while it was on the floor(short gamecube controller cord)... He got scared, not of the system but of me.

I have kids in the house. Things like that happen you know.
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Faulttt

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#50 Faulttt
Member since 2005 • 549 Posts
My xbox 360 murdured my gears of war disk