The Escapist hates on Phantom Hourglass

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/11/07/zero-punctuation-hates-on-zelda-phantom-hourglass/

I haven't played the game so I can't comment on it, but I do agree with him about Nintendo making the same freaking games every gen.

there's already a thread on this but whatever:

He's as funny as ever, and i too agree with the nintendo stuff.

omfg.

ANYONE that hasn't yet realized that the Zero Punctuation reviews are SATIRE, and MEANT TO BE SHARP AND BITING need a serious wakeup call.

the guy makes money by being witty in a negative way about games. have you ever seen a really positive escapist review?

seriously... calm the **** down, he's paid to get your blood boiling.

omfg.

ANYONE that hasn't yet realized that the Zero Punctuation reviews are SATIRE, and MEANT TO BE SHARP AND BITING need a serious wakeup call.

the guy makes money by being witty in a negative way about games. have you ever seen a really positive escapist review?

seriously... calm the **** down, he's paid to get your blood boiling.

3picuri3

portal

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

omfg.

ANYONE that hasn't yet realized that the Zero Punctuation reviews are SATIRE, and MEANT TO BE SHARP AND BITING need a serious wakeup call.

the guy makes money by being witty in a negative way about games. have you ever seen a really positive zero punctuation review?

seriously... calm the **** down, he's paid to get your blood boiling.

samusarmada

portal

everyone loves portal.

I agree with him almost all the time, but I think he should finish a game before he reviews it. Thats pretty sad.

Anyway - Nintendo has the same plot in all of their games... that doesn't mean they are the same. They are constantly throwing you incredible level design that has never been seen before. I'm sick of people thinking that just because link saves zelda.... again.... it = the SAME GAME.

Guess what.... its not. Different gameplay and level design is a much better way of changing a game than throwing in a new story. :|

anybody who played the game disagree with his assessments.too_much_eslim

I didnt really find it funny

His MOH Airborne/Orange Box reviews were much funnier.

I agree with him almost all the time, but I think he should finish a game before he reviews it. Thats pretty sad.

Anyway - Nintendo has the same plot in all of their games... that doesn't mean they are the same. They are constantly throwing you incredible level design that has never been seen before. I'm sick of people thinking that just because link saves zelda.... again.... it = the SAME GAME.

Guess what.... its not. Different gameplay and level design is a much better way of changing a game than throwing in a new story. :|

kansasdude2009

Indeed. Simply having the same (or similar) plot does not make two things the exact same. For example, one needst look no further than that pair of books: War and Peace and the memoirs of Napoleon. While they both have extremely similar plots as far as significant events are concerned, one simply must look at the portrayal of Napoleon in both to see that they are very different, as they are told from extremely different points of view.

I'm mad at the end when he starts describing Okami I was like "YEAH!! Nintendo should totally make a game like that!!!...Wait...wow I'm dumb".cyborgjak427

yea... I thought the same thing. This is definitely the worst of his reviews imo .... oh well.

i liked the first review i saw of him, i liked the second, didn't finish the third and now couldc't even watch for 15 seconds. if anything gets old fast, it's this reviewer.

Zelda uses the same stuff in different ways. true. fans love it. i'm a fan.

I agree with him almost all the time, but I think he should finish a game before he reviews it. Thats pretty sad.

Anyway - Nintendo has the same plot in all of their games... that doesn't mean they are the same. They are constantly throwing you incredible level design that has never been seen before. I'm sick of people thinking that just because link saves zelda.... again.... it = the SAME GAME.

Guess what.... its not. Different gameplay and level design is a much better way of changing a game than throwing in a new story. :|

kansasdude2009

How different is the gameplay? You're mostly getting the same items through the same gameplay systems that have existed in Zelda since Link to the Past, basically. All that has really changed is the dungeon design, and the addition of one or two new items. A bit more with Phantom Hourglass, because the controls are different, but not much more.

At least when Valve rehashes the same gameplay systems (Episode 1, 2), they give us a new, different story to go with it, and don't charge full price.

I think he's got a point at the end. What if, instead of making a Zelda game, they made a different kind of game, where they didn't have to adhere to the same conventions they always do? Twilight Princess had better design, but Okami felt much, much fresher. If Nintendo brought their design prowess that they give to a Zelda title to a new IP, it could be something really special.

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/11/07/zero-punctuation-hates-on-zelda-phantom-hourglass/

I haven't played the game so I can't comment on it, but I do agree with him about Nintendo making the same freaking games every gen.

too_much_eslim

Umm, all developers do that dude, why stop making franchisesthatsell well ya know? It would be stupid of Nintedo to try and keep producing new franchises every gen, they would not be able to get a fanbase because the content they would provide winds up being extremely random. As they say, if it ain't broken, don't fix it. At least Nintendo has not turned into a milkage company and they are reviving franchises or making them available to everyone around the world.

i dont really agree with his points about reusing the same franchises. yea they do it but it doesent change the fact that almost every zelda game is great and generally tries something new. yes the overall story is the same but thats not the point. zelda isnt about story, its about exploration. in every zelda game the dungeons are different, the puzzels are different, the bosses are different. its not like there just completly rehashing the same game over and over again. many other companies also do the exact same thing...like square enix or EA. ninty also have their fair share of new franchises. the wii games series, nintendogs, animal crossing, pikmin, disaster and so on.

however i do agree with alot of his complaints about phantom hourglass. its comendable that ninty decided to use the touch screen for 99% of the controls but sometimes its counter intuitive. most of the time its great (moving around, fighting, drawing, all great there) but sometimes it can be a real pain. especially when using the boat. drawing from one place to another is fine and dandy, but when u need to constantly redraw for whatever reason then it becomes torture. a second touch screen would have sorted that out but alas the DS lacks a second touch screen.

the whole trudging back to the main dungeon and being timed is also an absolute, complete and utter disaster. the peripheral dungeons are great and the bosses are excellent (so far anyway) but that main dungeon and the way its done is probably nintys worst idea for a zelda game since making it 2d side scrolling for zelda 2. seriously take that out and id give it a 9. but that dungeon, unfortunately, just ruins the game for me (as in 7.5). its a chore and a pain. for me that makes it the second worst zelda game ever created by ninty (its better than 2 in fairness).

:lol: I'm a Zelda fan, but he does make some good aruments and of course... humor is great. :P

I think he's really accurate in what he says. Zelda is becoming way too formulaic but regardless it isn't worse then any other company in the game industry so I don't blame Nintendo as much.

i dont really agree with his points about reusing the same franchises. yea they do it but it doesent change the fact that almost every zelda game is great and generally tries something new. yes the overall story is the same but thats not the point. zelda isnt about story, its about exploration. in every zelda game the dungeons are different, the puzzels are different, the bosses are different. its not like there just completly rehashing the same game over and over again. many other companies also do the exact same thing...like square enix or EA. ninty also have their fair share of new franchises. the wii games series, nintendogs, animal crossing, pikmin, disaster and so on.

osan0

Halo 3 has different weapons, different levels, and even some new enemies. People still call it a rehash. People call Ratchet and Clank a rehash, even though it has new weapons, new levels, new minigames, and new bosses. If a game plays the same way every time, the developers are making the same game over and over, even if they add new dungeons and puzzles.

[QUOTE="too_much_eslim"]

http://www.joystiq.com/2007/11/07/zero-punctuation-hates-on-zelda-phantom-hourglass/

I haven't played the game so I can't comment on it, but I do agree with him about Nintendo making the same freaking games every gen.

DSgamer64

Umm, all developers do that dude, why stop making franchisesthatsell well ya know? It would be stupid of Nintedo to try and keep producing new franchises every gen, they would not be able to get a fanbase because the content they would provide winds up being extremely random. As they say, if it ain't broken, don't fix it. At least Nintendo has not turned into a milkage company and they are reviving franchises or making them available to everyone around the world.

All developers dont do that, Metroid, Zelda, and Mario have the exact same stories...its not a sequel, they change the place, the time, and one or 2 minor plot points every new mario game buts its all the same...personally i dont care ive loved every metroid, mario, and zelda game ive played but a change in pace would be nice

[QUOTE="kansasdude2009"]

I agree with him almost all the time, but I think he should finish a game before he reviews it. Thats pretty sad.

Anyway - Nintendo has the same plot in all of their games... that doesn't mean they are the same. They are constantly throwing you incredible level design that has never been seen before. I'm sick of people thinking that just because link saves zelda.... again.... it = the SAME GAME.

Guess what.... its not. Different gameplay and level design is a much better way of changing a game than throwing in a new story. :|

sonicmj1

How different is the gameplay? You're mostly getting the same items through the same gameplay systems that have existed in Zelda since Link to the Past, basically. All that has really changed is the dungeon design, and the addition of one or two new items. A bit more with Phantom Hourglass, because the controls are different, but not much more.

At least when Valve rehashes the same gameplay systems (Episode 1, 2), they give us a new, different story to go with it, and don't charge full price.

I think he's got a point at the end. What if, instead of making a Zelda game, they made a different kind of game, where they didn't have to adhere to the same conventions they always do? Twilight Princess had better design, but Okami felt much, much fresher. If Nintendo brought their design prowess that they give to a Zelda title to a new IP, it could be something really special.

Okami.... felt like a Zelda title. :/

Nintendo creates games that have a solid foundation when it comes to gameplay and then they switch up the environments to make the gameplay different. Take the iron boots. What can you do with them? Cling to magnetized walls, sink under water, and keep in one place easily. Nintendo will start off slow introducing you to these ideas and then let it go wild and make you do all these at once.

Same thing with Mario - gameplay has not changed, but the environments have. That solid gameplay transforms into crazy level design that makes a game feel fresh by itself.

Both create an experience that feels familiar but also different at the same time. I understand why some people would be upset by it... but Nintendo is REALLY GOOD at level design. They are not good story tellers (EAD atleast), not too good a creating characters, but they rely on their strengths. Gameplay and level design.

I think it is brilliant... but whatever.

Yeah man, this guy is great.

However, PH is a pretty good game, and it's a triple A title.

If you guys actually think you are gonna use him to flame Nintendo, you should check out his other reviews:

Halo 3

The Next Gen Consoles

In the Halo 3 one he talks about how bad the game is, yet he didn't give props to bungie like he does to Nintendo in the PH review.

In the Next Gen Console review, he completely flames all three consoles.

So, if you think he has just singled out Nintendo, you are missing a few steps. This is just the latest in a line of flaming on fantastically reviewed games.

The temple of the Ocean King is annoying, sailing isn't bad at all, and yelling into the Microphone is kinda cool, but not recommended in public, lol. All of his opinions are answered by me in that one sentance. The vid is hilarious, all of his are, but lemmings or cows shouldn't point to this as a degradation to the sheep, cause they can use the same ammo against you and it hits home a lot harder than a handheld Zeldas commentary every could. Watch the system wars one, lol.

[QUOTE="osan0"]

i dont really agree with his points about reusing the same franchises. yea they do it but it doesent change the fact that almost every zelda game is great and generally tries something new. yes the overall story is the same but thats not the point. zelda isnt about story, its about exploration. in every zelda game the dungeons are different, the puzzels are different, the bosses are different. its not like there just completly rehashing the same game over and over again. many other companies also do the exact same thing...like square enix or EA. ninty also have their fair share of new franchises. the wii games series, nintendogs, animal crossing, pikmin, disaster and so on.

sonicmj1

Halo 3 has different weapons, different levels, and even some new enemies. People still call it a rehash. People call Ratchet and Clank a rehash, even though it has new weapons, new levels, new minigames, and new bosses. If a game plays the same way every time, the developers are making the same game over and over, even if they add new dungeons and puzzles.

those games do not rely on their environment for their gameplay. Zelda is walking all over his environment with puzzles and ticks all over the place. Those are very different things. Different weapons in Halo 3 makes it different just like how different environments in games like Mario and Zelda make it different.

Could Nintendo get more imaginative with Links weapons? YES!!! THEY COULD. I'm not arguing with that ;)

:lol:

Hilarious!

This is comedy people!

This is just like X-Play, but without the credibility!

This sheep found it funny.

As long as no one claims it gospel like with the Halo review.

Noooo, I love Phantom Hourglass!!!:cry:

But I love this guy too...he's really funny.

Legend of Zelda plot line.

Evil guy (usually called Ganondorf) kidnaps Zelda and takes over Hyrule.

Link, our young hero who never has mastered the art of speech, goes on a long quest to save said princess, along the way he must enter a varied number of dungeons (invariably including a forest, volcano and water dungeon) each of which posess some shiny thing you have to collect for some obscure reason and an even shinier new tool.

After getting said tool it's respective dungeon becomes a wonderful tutorial for it, even killing the boss involves it.

Lather, Rinse Repeat until you collect all the shiny things. Collect a few meaningless items from the overworld and pieces of heart to turn yourself into a damage-soaking-sword-wielding maniac.

Kill Ganondorf.

Zelda games are great but to call them innovative or different is just plain wrong. They have a set gameplay method which changes only in the sense that the dungeons look different and from time to time Nintendo throw in a new tool. It's a formula that works but it pretty much means the game always plays the same.

Despite the fact that it's satyrical in nature. All the things he lists on the games I've played myself are actually true.

I almost always agree with this guy and he's funny as hell.

Zelda games are great but to call them innovative or different is just plain wrong. They have a set gameplay method which changes only in the sense that the dungeons look different and from time to time Nintendo throw in a new tool. It's a formula that works but it pretty much means the game always plays the same.

covhunter

Well, Majora's Mask was a whole lot less formulaic than the rest of the series, and also it's the lowest rated console Zelda game on Gamerankings, so do people really like innovation?

Anyway, great review, as usual.

Yahtzee >>>> All of you. Yahtzee is a god and should not be questioned. EntwineX

Don't go too far now.

omfg.

ANYONE that hasn't yet realized that the Zero Punctuation reviews are SATIRE, and MEANT TO BE SHARP AND BITING need a serious wakeup call.

the guy makes money by being witty in a negative way about games. have you ever seen a really positive escapist review?

seriously... calm the **** down, he's paid to get your blood boiling.

3picuri3

You know, I find it funny that the first person to type with Caps Lock on is the one telling people to calm down.

[QUOTE="covhunter"]

Zelda games are great but to call them innovative or different is just plain wrong. They have a set gameplay method which changes only in the sense that the dungeons look different and from time to time Nintendo throw in a new tool. It's a formula that works but it pretty much means the game always plays the same.

Planeforger

Well, Majora's Mask was a whole lot less formulaic than the rest of the series, and also it's the lowest rated console Zelda game on Gamerankings, so do people really like innovation?

Anyway, great review, as usual.

MM is my favorite Zelda game, but people bash it. It is so far from the "Zelda" style that it could get away with a different title. People just like to complain. Nintendo changes it up, they feel they need to scream and rant, bring back OoT. They bring it back "Nintendo doesn't have innovation, they just keep putting out the same thing." People are hypocrites and I will stand with that.

This kind of talk never occured until TP was out. People screamed and whined, and when they got what they wanted...

Whatever, Zelda will always be my favorite series.

[QUOTE="3picuri3"]

omfg.

ANYONE that hasn't yet realized that the Zero Punctuation reviews are SATIRE, and MEANT TO BE SHARP AND BITING need a serious wakeup call.

the guy makes money by being witty in a negative way about games. have you ever seen a really positive escapist review?

seriously... calm the **** down, he's paid to get your blood boiling.

samusarmada

portal

Addendum: Portal and Psychonauts

[QUOTE="Planeforger"][QUOTE="covhunter"]

Zelda games are great but to call them innovative or different is just plain wrong. They have a set gameplay method which changes only in the sense that the dungeons look different and from time to time Nintendo throw in a new tool. It's a formula that works but it pretty much means the game always plays the same.

thegame27_basic

Well, Majora's Mask was a whole lot less formulaic than the rest of the series, and also it's the lowest rated console Zelda game on Gamerankings, so do people really like innovation?

Anyway, great review, as usual.

MM is my favorite Zelda game, but people bash it. It is so far from the "Zelda" style that it could get away with a different title. People just like to complain. Nintendo changes it up, they feel they need to scream and rant, bring back OoT. They bring it back "Nintendo doesn't have innovation, they just keep putting out the same thing." People are hypocrites and I will stand with that.

This kind of talk never occured until TP was out. People screamed and whined, and when they got what they wanted...

Whatever, Zelda will always be my favorite series.

MM would have been 100x more loved if it replaced TP(in terms of when they came out) coz OoT was so impactuas and influential in creating a new era of fans that MM was too different TOO SOON to be considered as highly(still amazing i loved it).

[QUOTE="osan0"]

i dont really agree with his points about reusing the same franchises. yea they do it but it doesent change the fact that almost every zelda game is great and generally tries something new. yes the overall story is the same but thats not the point. zelda isnt about story, its about exploration. in every zelda game the dungeons are different, the puzzels are different, the bosses are different. its not like there just completly rehashing the same game over and over again. many other companies also do the exact same thing...like square enix or EA. ninty also have their fair share of new franchises. the wii games series, nintendogs, animal crossing, pikmin, disaster and so on.

sonicmj1

Halo 3 has different weapons, different levels, and even some new enemies. People still call it a rehash. People call Ratchet and Clank a rehash, even though it has new weapons, new levels, new minigames, and new bosses. If a game plays the same way every time, the developers are making the same game over and over, even if they add new dungeons and puzzles.

theres a subtle difference though between H3 and zelda.

now before i continue, let me say that i have halo 3 and enjoyed it quite alot. but the difference is that, imho at least, the challenges in zelda are constantly changing, halos stays very much the same. what i mean is, basically, that if ure very good at halo 1 then u would be very good at halo 3. the same cant really be said for zelda. H3 consists of running from point A to point B and killing everything along the way. good mindless fun with big splosions, love it to bits :D. the levels are different, theres some new weapons and vehicles but the way u achieve ure objective is very much the same, kill everything and reach point B.

in contrast, if ure a zelda veteran, it really doesent help that much when playing the latest. the dungeons and puzzles are all different. the obsticals the game throws at u changes from game to game quite alot. just because u completed the water dungeon in OOT, doesent mean ure going to have an advantage when playing the water dungeon in TP for example. boss fights all change from game to game (i can think of only 1..maybe 2 reuses of a boss strategy in zelda since it began). the overall template remains the same (do some dungeons, get bigger sword, more dungeons, save princess) but its the way that u do it that changes quite alot from game to game.

halo doesent change nearly as much. u shoot everything, it dies. theres no puzzle or horizontal thinking to the game. even the final boss? get a bigger gun and shoot it a few times, all done. no figuring out a pattern or finding and exploiting a weekpoint. just avoid shots and fire ure weapon. not necessarily a bad thing (Halos great for switching the brain off and just causing mayhem) but it doesent change nearly as much as the different zelda games. personally i wouldnt call it a rehash (a rehash in my book would be Halo1 redone in HD) but its alot more similar to H1 and 2 than zelda games are similar to each other.

on another note though, i do think they need to go back to the drawing board now with zelda and really start mixing it up again. brand new item set, brand new dungeon themes and ideas (like a dungeon thats completly puzzle based, or maybe a more role playing type dungeon where u have to solve a mystery to progress or something), new overall story and such like. ninty did say that TP would be the last zelda as we know it so heres hoping.

same applies to halo too mind....bungie gotta start thinking outside the box more imho (assuming there doing a halo 4).