The story standards of gamers are low
This topic is locked from further discussion.
Oh right sure guys. Let me see...
Planescape: Torment
Deus Ex (not invisible War)
Second sight
Breakdown
Metal Gear solid 2
Half Life 1/2 (it goes downhill at episode 1)
Fallout
StarCraft + expansion
afew others that I can't remember
actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
cheapness1
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
I see what you mean, films and books have been around far longer though. But as gaming becomes more popular and widespread, i gaurantee we will see devs employing more artists and directors as well as professional writing teams to make the story of the game stand out in an interactive environment.hongkingkong
around far longer means nothing... Don quixote is still one of the greatest stories and it was one of the first novels EVER. film had great stories almost from the beginning too...
Halo has good story :oops:mingo123
not really... it is decent but not that great. 3 was the best storywise and it was not terribly standout...
Oh right sure guys. Let me see...
Planescape: Torment
Deus Ex (not invisible War)
Second sight
Breakdown
Metal Gear solid 2
Half Life 1/2 (it goes downhill at episode 1)
Fallout
StarCraft + expansion
afew others that I can't remember
FlockofSpagheti
Unfortunately, out of that list, the only one I've had a chance to play is Starcraft and Brood War. And I definitely agree that it had a good story and I'm interested what Starcraft 2 will do with it. I've heard good things about Fallout and Planescape: Torment.
The three example you used: Final Fantasy 7 and 10, and Knights of the Old Republic. I'm not going to say they have the best stories ever, or anything like that; but they have fairly good stories--well, Final Fantasy 10 not so much. But the other two have stories that were entertaining and interesting.
Besides that little thing I felt like saying, I do agree with you that game stories do need some work. While I did like Final Fantasy 7 and Knights of the old Repubic, they could have been better.
Games are an artform, one that is really maturing, but it needs to find that balance with great gameplay and an intriguing story. While there probably are games out there that have that, I have not played many of them since I lack the resources and time.
FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.haris12121212
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
[QUOTE="cheapness1"]actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
FlockofSpagheti
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
All I see is that you're close minded to what a good story is. God of War certainly has a good story. It's simple, paced well, and most importantly, lends itself to the game. Final Fantasy X, in my opinion, has the best story of any Final Fantasy. I don't judge it on the same standards I would a movie, and I hate fantasy and other heavily story driven literature, so I wouldn't use any standards for that either. The standards really have to flow with the game and you can't evaluate it on script and scene direction alone. I hated the story in FFXII because half of it just left you running on a wild goose chase with no end in sight. Final Fantasy X is structured at first, putting you on a set journey but the plot development is rich enough so that it doesn't feel like one long sidequest. It's also a nice touch that the main character is as unfamiliar to the fantasy world as the player is (except blitzball).
Where do you get that God of War, FFVII and FFX have bad stories? You're not explaining anything, and while of all the games i've played on your list, I agree with you on, nothing you say has any objective weight...AT ALL. It's just a rant.
[QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.FlockofSpagheti
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
The FF Tactic story, non exitent? Ahh come on now... You made your whole arugments of before look bad with that statement... Why do critics claim Tactics to have a great story?[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"]Oh right sure guys. Let me see...
Planescape: Torment
Deus Ex (not invisible War)
Second sight
Breakdown
Metal Gear solid 2
Half Life 1/2 (it goes downhill at episode 1)
Fallout
StarCraft + expansion
afew others that I can't remember
Phantom_Menace
Unfortunately, out of that list, the only one I've had a chance to play is Starcraft and Brood War. And I definitely agree that it had a good story and I'm interested what Starcraft 2 will do with it. I've heard good things about Fallout and Planescape: Torment.
The three example you used: Final Fantasy 7 and 10, and Knights of the Old Republic. I'm not going to say they have the best stories ever, or anything like that; but they have fairly good stories--well, Final Fantasy 10 not so much. But the other two have stories that were entertaining and interesting.
Besides that little thing I felt like saying, I do agree with you that game stories do need some work. While I did like Final Fantasy 7 and Knights of the old Repubic, they could have been better.
Games are an artform, one that is really maturing, but it needs to find that balance with great gameplay and an intriguing story. While there probably are games out there that have that, I have not played many of them since I lack the resources and time.
They are somewhat entertaining I agree... however they are entertaining in the sense of a hollywood action movie. They are not enriching or thought provoking in the slightest I am afraid. While I admit that some of the stories on my list suffer from this... they are better told and more clearly constructed than either of those. I can completely understand how you do not have the time and money to play all of this stuff though... it took me years myself lol.
I liked Bioshock's story.
The story in Mass Effect is also looking good.The prequel book was surprisingly good for a videogame book.
[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
ace52387
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
All I see is that you're close minded to what a good story is. God of War certainly has a good story. It's simple, paced well, and most importantly, lends itself to the game. Final Fantasy X, in my opinion, has the best story of any Final Fantasy. I don't judge it on the same standards I would a movie, and I hate fantasy and other heavily story driven literature, so I wouldn't use any standards for that either. The standards really have to flow with the game and you can't evaluate it on script and scene direction alone. I hated the story in FFXII because half of it just left you running on a wild goose chase with no end in sight. Final Fantasy X is structured at first, putting you on a set journey but the plot development is rich enough so that it doesn't feel like one long sidequest. It's also a nice touch that the main character is as unfamiliar to the fantasy world as the player is (except blitzball).
Where do you get that God of War, FFVII and FFX have bad stories? You're not explaining anything, and while of all the games i've played on your list, I agree with you on, nothing you say has any objective weight...AT ALL. It's just a rant.
They are bad stories for complicated reasons that would take awhile to explain. God of war for example is a bad story because it is meaningless greek mythology fanfiction. They just stuck a heartless aggro main character into the setting and let him run wild. There is just no point. that is the short version. the others would take much longer as they are bad in more complex ways.
[QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.FlockofSpagheti
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
You're giving nothing but impressions. I'm thinking the one who needs to expand his horizons is you. I can tell you a dozen things that are good about FFVII's story. I'll just start with 2: Cloud is one of the deepest characters in a video game ever. The spectrum of emotions he highlights, from jealousy, to sulking, to helplessness is wider than anything i've seen before. Within the Fantasy, is a character centered story that is very personal. Looking at childhood is something that people can easily relate to, which adds something to a save-the-world story.
[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.haris12121212
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
The FF Tactic story, non exitent? Ahh come on now... You made your whole arugments of before look bad with that statement... Why do critics claim Tactics to have a great story?Because in case you have not noticed... and I hate to put it like this... but 99% of game critics should are terrible at their job.
[QUOTE="haris12121212"][QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.FlockofSpagheti
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
The FF Tactic story, non exitent? Ahh come on now... You made your whole arugments of before look bad with that statement... Why do critics claim Tactics to have a great story?Because in case you have not noticed... and I hate to put it like this... but 99% of game critics should are terrible at their job.
And your good? 99% of people think the games you dont think have a good story are good.Mabye your wrong.[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.ace52387
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
You're giving nothing but impressions. I'm thinking the one who needs to expand his horizons is you. I can tell you a dozen things that are good about FFVII's story. I'll just start with 2: Cloud is one of the deepest characters in a video game ever. The spectrum of emotions he highlights, from jealousy, to sulking, to helplessness is wider than anything i've seen before. Within the Fantasy, is a character centered story that is very personal. Looking at childhood is something that people can easily relate to, which adds something to a save-the-world story.
Cloud is a deep character?? not in at all. What is his reaction at the end of disc 1 (to avoid spoilers)? nothing. he just continues on and occasionally mentions it. Cutting it short that is a sure sign of poor character design.
Halo has good story :oops:mingo123
Ew, GOD no. Halo has a plot hole bigger than the Ark running through its whole narrative.
And your good? 99% of people think the games you dont think have a good story are good.Mabye your wrong.tman93
I am a game critic?? lol. anyway 99% of people think I am wrong... no... maybe closer to 90% of GAMERS think I am wrong. But then like I said... gamers have low story standards. why do you think people do not take games seriously... there are many reasons but here is a big one: GAMES HAVE BAD STORIES. they exist almost solely as either an excuse for the gameplay or to try convincing gamers that they are playing some sort of masterpiece. Outsiders can see this more clearly than most gamers can...
[QUOTE="ace52387"][QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
FlockofSpagheti
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
All I see is that you're close minded to what a good story is. God of War certainly has a good story. It's simple, paced well, and most importantly, lends itself to the game. Final Fantasy X, in my opinion, has the best story of any Final Fantasy. I don't judge it on the same standards I would a movie, and I hate fantasy and other heavily story driven literature, so I wouldn't use any standards for that either. The standards really have to flow with the game and you can't evaluate it on script and scene direction alone. I hated the story in FFXII because half of it just left you running on a wild goose chase with no end in sight. Final Fantasy X is structured at first, putting you on a set journey but the plot development is rich enough so that it doesn't feel like one long sidequest. It's also a nice touch that the main character is as unfamiliar to the fantasy world as the player is (except blitzball).
Where do you get that God of War, FFVII and FFX have bad stories? You're not explaining anything, and while of all the games i've played on your list, I agree with you on, nothing you say has any objective weight...AT ALL. It's just a rant.
They are bad stories for complicated reasons that would take awhile to explain. God of war for example is a bad story because it is meaningless greek mythology fanfiction. They just stuck a heartless aggro main character into the setting and let him run wild. There is just no point. that is the short version. the others would take much longer as they are bad in more complex ways.
Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
[QUOTE="cheapness1"]actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
FlockofSpagheti
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
just because someone has a different opinion than you it doesn't mean they have low standards. is it that hard to believe that people actually like these stories?
[QUOTE="tman93"] And your good? 99% of people think the games you dont think have a good story are good.Mabye your wrong.FlockofSpagheti
I am a game critic?? lol. anyway 99% of people think I am wrong... no... maybe closer to 90% of GAMERS think I am wrong. But then like I said... gamers have low story standards. why do you think people do not take games seriously... there are many reasons but here is a big one: GAMES HAVE BAD STORIES. they exist almost solely as either an excuse for the gameplay or to try convincing gamers that they are playing some sort of masterpiece. Outsiders can see this more clearly than most gamers can...
One thing you are doing that I really disagree with is the fact that you make your self on the top, saying those people have bad taste in story only 'cause for you it was a bad story, doesn't mean for others it is also.Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
ace52387
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
[QUOTE="ace52387"][QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="haris12121212"]FF7 isn't claimed to have the best story for nothing, maybe you don't agree. But a lot of people do. Actually I'm replaying the game... and dunno if it's 'cause I forogot, but many "small" points of the game just made me realize I didn't understand the story the first 4-5-6 times I played the game... (I guess it's due to the AC movie, Last Order that I found out) anyways. FF7 has a great story. Wanna know another game with an awesome story. Final FAntasy Tactics.FlockofSpagheti
I have played Final fantasy 7 at least 3 times and read countless theories about its story... its a good game but the story is just bad. it is not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing... if you think the story is good, then you need to expand your horizons. as for Final fantasy tactics the story in that was not even worth mentioning... it was almost nonexistent (yes I have played it as well).
You're giving nothing but impressions. I'm thinking the one who needs to expand his horizons is you. I can tell you a dozen things that are good about FFVII's story. I'll just start with 2: Cloud is one of the deepest characters in a video game ever. The spectrum of emotions he highlights, from jealousy, to sulking, to helplessness is wider than anything i've seen before. Within the Fantasy, is a character centered story that is very personal. Looking at childhood is something that people can easily relate to, which adds something to a save-the-world story.
Cloud is a deep character?? not in at all. What is his reaction at the end of disc 1 (to avoid spoilers)? nothing. he just continues on and occasionally mentions it. Cutting it short that is a sure sign of poor character design.
I don't remember the exact event that happens at the end of disc 1. I'm talking about his interaction with Tifa. What got cut short? Are you referring to his general tendency to be a little stoic? I would say that's great character design. He starts off looking like a cliche silent lead, but after like 2/3 of the story, you see that he is rather emotional, and his silence is part of his antisocial, and bitter nature, not because he's cool like that.
[QUOTE="Phantom_Menace"][QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"]Oh right sure guys. Let me see...
Planescape: Torment
Deus Ex (not invisible War)
Second sight
Breakdown
Metal Gear solid 2
Half Life 1/2 (it goes downhill at episode 1)
Fallout
StarCraft + expansion
afew others that I can't remember
FlockofSpagheti
Unfortunately, out of that list, the only one I've had a chance to play is Starcraft and Brood War. And I definitely agree that it had a good story and I'm interested what Starcraft 2 will do with it. I've heard good things about Fallout and Planescape: Torment.
The three example you used: Final Fantasy 7 and 10, and Knights of the Old Republic. I'm not going to say they have the best stories ever, or anything like that; but they have fairly good stories--well, Final Fantasy 10 not so much. But the other two have stories that were entertaining and interesting.
Besides that little thing I felt like saying, I do agree with you that game stories do need some work. While I did like Final Fantasy 7 and Knights of the old Repubic, they could have been better.
Games are an artform, one that is really maturing, but it needs to find that balance with great gameplay and an intriguing story. While there probably are games out there that have that, I have not played many of them since I lack the resources and time.
They are somewhat entertaining I agree... however they are entertaining in the sense of a hollywood action movie. They are not enriching or thought provoking in the slightest I am afraid. While I admit that some of the stories on my list suffer from this... they are better told and more clearly constructed than either of those. I can completely understand how you do not have the time and money to play all of this stuff though... it took me years myself lol.
This is a discussion that I think is unsuited for this place, because while most gamers enjoy a story with their games, they are looking for that Hollywood entertainment, just spending a few hours killing things or blowing things up with a little story thrown in.
I admit that I like that sort of thing too.
There is nothing wrong with an enriching or thought provoking story, and I definitely wouldn't mind more of them in games. But then, I'm not sure if games are the best medium for such stories anyway; I suppose that's something I can't really argue until I see it.
But for now if I'm looking for a good story, I'm going to read a book.
[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="cheapness1"]actually i think games like...God of War, Metal Gear Solid, Heavenly Sword, The Darkness, Resistance, Bioshock have pretty good stories...and prefer them to loadsa (good) movies OR books...plus they're more fun!
Some games do seem to have the story tacked on tho like Gears of Wargood game...dull story
Just my opinion tho...
ItalStallion777
This is exactly what i'm talking about...
just because someone has a different opinion than you it doesn't mean they have low standards. is it that hard to believe that people actually like these stories?
No it is not hard to believe...because gamers have low standards when it comes to storytelling. Just look at all this god of war hype... that story would not even pass as a decent backdrop for a Hollywood action movie... it would be laughed out of the theatres.
[QUOTE="ace52387"]Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
FlockofSpagheti
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
Everyone can resume a game story in "save the world" Thats lame, cause I can do that in every single movie and book... In lord of the rings (which is claimed to be a brilliant book due to it's story) I can make it look bad because the plot is "Save the World" Orc versus humans, gotta save the kingdom from Orcs bla bla... people that do that, don't even look in the motivations of that... Yes in FF7 Sephiroth tries to destroy the world. But his motivations for doing that are far from being lame.
I don't remember the exact event that happens at the end of disc 1. I'm talking about his interaction with Tifa. What got cut short? Are you referring to his general tendency to be a little stoic? I would say that's great character design. He starts off looking like a cliche silent lead, but after like 2/3 of the story, you see that he is rather emotional, and his silence is part of his antisocial, and bitter nature, not because he's cool like that.
ace52387
no I mean when (SPOILER: aeris dies :SPOILER)... his reaction is NOTHING. Sometimes he sort-of notices that shes gone but his personality has no obvious changes because of it.
[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="ace52387"]Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
haris12121212
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
Everyone can resume a game story in "save the world" Thats lame, cause I can do that in every single movie and book... In lord of the rings (which is claimed to be a brilliant book due to it's story) I can make it look bad because the plot is "Save the World" Orc versus humans, gotta save the kingdom from Orcs bla bla... people that do that, don't even look in the motivations of that... Yes in FF7 Sephiroth tries to destroy the world. But his motivations for doing that are far from being lame.
Errrr, no one claims LotR has a good story. What makes LotR good is the detail in the world and the prose Tolkien uses. The story itself is pretty basic.
But I think a "save the world" story can still be a great story. It just takes some finessing now, since people are so jaded.
[QUOTE="ace52387"]Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
FlockofSpagheti
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
Again, another game I haven't had the chance to play.
But I agree that the "save-the-world" stories are not that great. Though the problem I think with them is that they are overdone and have become very hollow, the characters are just a means to an end, they don't really matter.
I think there is the possibility for a good "save-the-world" story, but there are better ways to go.
[QUOTE="ace52387"]Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
FlockofSpagheti
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
That's not a logic flaw. That's you not seeing that a save the world story can be good. Are you telling me that Spiderman 2 had a bad story? I'm not a big fan of lord of the rings myself, but you'd be saying that's bad too. Just because the plot is centered around saving the world, doesn't mean the characters can't be deep and powerful. Of course, I wouldn't say that's a strong suit of God of War, but it has plenty of other things going for it.
This is a discussion that I think is unsuited for this place, because while most gamers enjoy a story with their games, they are looking for that Hollywood entertainment, just spending a few hours killing things or blowing things up with a little story thrown in.
I admit that I like that sort of thing too.
There is nothing wrong with an enriching or thought provoking story, and I definitely wouldn't mind more of them in games. But then, I'm not sure if games are the best medium for such stories anyway; I suppose that's something I can't really argue until I see it.
But for now if I'm looking for a good story, I'm going to read a book.
Phantom_Menace
You are probably right about this being the wrong place but oh well... anyway I would say that games are perfect for that kind of story but developers are too busy cashing in on the action movie appeal of God of war-like stories. I have only seen it a few times but it works so well that it convinced me...
[QUOTE="Phantom_Menace"]This is a discussion that I think is unsuited for this place, because while most gamers enjoy a story with their games, they are looking for that Hollywood entertainment, just spending a few hours killing things or blowing things up with a little story thrown in.
I admit that I like that sort of thing too.
There is nothing wrong with an enriching or thought provoking story, and I definitely wouldn't mind more of them in games. But then, I'm not sure if games are the best medium for such stories anyway; I suppose that's something I can't really argue until I see it.
But for now if I'm looking for a good story, I'm going to read a book.
FlockofSpagheti
You are probably right about this being the wrong place but oh well... anyway I would say that games are perfect for that kind of story but developers are too busy cashing in on the action movie appeal of God of war-like stories. I have only seen it a few times but it works so well that it convinced me...
I'd really like to see a game with a great story like that.
[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="ace52387"]Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
ace52387
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
That's not a logic flaw. That's you not seeing that a save the world story can be good. Are you telling me that Spiderman 2 had a bad story? I'm not a big fan of lord of the rings myself, but you'd be saying that's bad too. Just because the plot is centered around saving the world, doesn't mean the characters can't be deep and powerful. Of course, I wouldn't say that's a strong suit of God of War, but it has plenty of other things going for it.
Like that other guy above me said... Lord of the Rings story is not so impressive... it is everything else. The basic plot is just that... basic. SpiderMan 2 was agood story but that was because of its characters... also it had nothing to do with saving the world.
[QUOTE="ace52387"][QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"][QUOTE="ace52387"]
Ok. Your logic has to apply to 95% of all RPG's then? It's just rehashed Tolkein based fantasy. This is why you're closed minded. You don't go into how the story telling or even the plot itself is bad. Ok the main character is heartless. It's an action game where you rip people apart. I'm not catching how using greek mythology as a backdrop is wrong. Does a fantasy world have to be created from scratch always?
They didn't let him run wild, and there is a point to the story. He's trying to save his soul and defeat Ares. A valid point would be that it's not all that unique outside the backdrop. Saying there's no point is no valid, because frankly, it has as much of a point as any save the world story. It also happens the voice acting is extremely good for a video game, and the scene direction is of a high quality as well.
FlockofSpagheti
The big flaw in your logic... is that save-the-world stories are almost automatically bad. and yes almost all RPGs have terrible stories INCLUDING the much-overhyped Baldur's gate 2. Like i said only around 20 games or less actually have good stories.
That's not a logic flaw. That's you not seeing that a save the world story can be good. Are you telling me that Spiderman 2 had a bad story? I'm not a big fan of lord of the rings myself, but you'd be saying that's bad too. Just because the plot is centered around saving the world, doesn't mean the characters can't be deep and powerful. Of course, I wouldn't say that's a strong suit of God of War, but it has plenty of other things going for it.
Like that other guy above me said... Lord of the Rings story is not so impressive... it is everything else. The basic plot is just that... basic. SpiderMan 2 was agood story but that was because of its characters... also it had nothing to do with saving the world.
Are you seriously saying that Spiderman 2 had a better story than Lord of the Rings beause it didnt have a save the world story? Actually, if I recally Spiderman did have to save the world in #2. Lord of the Rings was saving their land, not the world.Please Log In to post.
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