There's no such thing as a Hardcore game...

Everytime I come to this board I see people talking about the Hardcore Gamer and the Casual Gamer. People say the Wii sucks because it doesn't have hardcore games, or this game is a hardcore game while someone calls it casual. So I thought I'd help people out, there is no such thing as a "Hardcore" game. Now before you rip my head off listen to me.

Whether or not a game is "hardcore" is up to the person that plays it. I play Halo 3 a couple hours a year, so to me Halo 3's a casual game. While some other people play Halo for 6 hours a day everyday. Now to the person Halo 3's a hardcore game. I know people that play Wii Sports like theres no tomorrow. So thats a hardcore game to them. I myself buy about 30-40 games a year, and I consider myself as casual as they come. I play no game "hardcorely". Hell look at Peggle. Very simple game but look at how many hours people put into that game.

So what determines a Casual game or a Hardcore game completely depends on you. If you dedicate yourself to a game thats what makes it hardcore. If you play thought a game once and never though it again, you were casual to that game. Look at people that play CS:S and Madden professionally, they're very hardcore. While I'll play a couple games with my friends, that makes me casual.

Just because a games got blood and vilence doesn't make it "Hardcore", it just makes it appeal to a different audience. I'm all good with violence and everything, but when I saw the new GoW 3 trailer and I saw Kratos tearing off that gods head, I didn't think wow that hardcore, I thought wow thats really immature.

So what you put into the game either makes if a hardcore game or a casual game. Hopefully this translates well...

While you bring up some interesting points, and i agree with you on a lot of points, i do in fact think there are distinctions between hardcore and casual gaming. I don't think it has so much to do with the type of games you play or how long you play them. It has more to do with how serious you take the medium as a whole.

Casuals, as a whole think of gaming a novelty, whether they are playing Wii Sports or Halo 3. THe Hardcore crowd (most ppl on this board) generally eat, sleep and dream about games, not literally but you get my point. We on this boad take gaming pretty seriouly and we take pride in our gaming possesions and accomplishments. That is what i think separates the two.

STALKER /thread kthxby

STALKER /thread kthxby

swazidoughman

[QUOTE="swazidoughman"]

STALKER /thread kthxby

mo0ksi

Its pretty damn hardcore if you don't know Russian.

Half the time I have no idea what anyone is saying, sometimes that works against me.

i don't consider most myself hardcore or casual..but just a guy who plays videogames more than the average person does

I Came to this thread thinking Has the the TC played ARMA2 yet?

but, on topic i do agree its up to the player to decide what games hardcore, but i think there is a general definition of a hardcore game, and its certainly not blood and gore

I don't see myself as a casual or hardcore gamer im just a gamer that likes to have fun and relax playing video games

No casual gamer is going to enjoy a game like Radiant Silvergun... or spend the time and money tracking it down.

No casual gamer is going to enjoy a game like Radiant Silvergun... or spend the time and money tracking it down.

foxhound_fox

I think that this is the key, Gamer, from my point of view, there is no Hardcore game or Casual Game, instead there are Casual Gamers and Hardcore Gamers.

The TC is objectively right.

I have the exact same opinion. Except I also believe that a lot of people around here have a superiority complex which is projected in the form of Hardcore VS Casual. It's all sadly ironic to me.

Good thread TC.

Arma 2, shumps/bullet-hells, Virtual on, flight sims all disagree with you

Arma 2, shumps/bullet-hells, Virtual on, flight sims all disagree with you

Rougehunter

I guarentee I could get a casual gamer to find some sort of "****ing cool" factor from Arma 2.

Casual is a broad term you see. Just the same there are many hardcore COD4 players.

Everytime I come to this board I see people talking about the Hardcore Gamer and the Casual Gamer. People say the Wii sucks because it doesn't have hardcore games, or this game is a hardcore game while someone calls it casual. So I thought I'd help people out, there is no such thing as a "Hardcore" game. Now before you rip my head off listen to me.

Whether or not a game is "hardcore" is up to the person that plays it. I play Halo 3 a couple hours a year, so to me Halo 3's a casual game. While some other people play Halo for 6 hours a day everyday. Now to the person Halo 3's a hardcore game. I know people that play Wii Sports like theres no tomorrow. So thats a hardcore game to them. I myself buy about 30-40 games a year, and I consider myself as casual as they come. I play no game "hardcorely". Hell look at Peggle. Very simple game but look at how many hours people put into that game.

So what determines a Casual game or a Hardcore game completely depends on you. If you dedicate yourself to a game thats what makes it hardcore. If you play thought a game once and never though it again, you were casual to that game. Look at people that play CS:S and Madden professionally, they're very hardcore. While I'll play a couple games with my friends, that makes me casual.

Just because a games got blood and vilence doesn't make it "Hardcore", it just makes it appeal to a different audience. I'm all good with violence and everything, but when I saw the new GoW 3 trailer and I saw Kratos tearing off that gods head, I didn't think wow that hardcore, I thought wow thats really immature.

So what you put into the game either makes if a hardcore game or a casual game. Hopefully this translates well...

SexySasquatch11

NO, NO, and another NO to emphasise.

Casual Games Assosiation FAQ

All of this, if you are referring to proper hardcore or core games and casual games. I have noticed that people use the term Casual here in a derogative and insulting way that is totally improper, and hardcore could also mean hard or something related to an expert or something similar.

[QUOTE="mo0ksi"][QUOTE="swazidoughman"]

STALKER /thread kthxby

swazidoughman

Its pretty damn hardcore if you don't know Russian.

Half the time I have no idea what anyone is saying, sometimes that works against me.

On Topic: I disagree TC. Your point is well made and thought out but you are ignoring a few aspects here and there. While "hardcore" is a pretty sad word to use, if for you gaming is a hobby that takes up a considerable chunk of your time and you go out to find out more and experience more of what the hobby has to offer then you are "hardcore" or, to quote Crysis Warhead, Enthusiast, which is a much better term..

Calling my buddy that can religious play sports games as long as he has a beer in hand a "hardcore" gamer of those games would be a bit of a misnomer as he could give two poos about gaming in general (all IMO)

I just dont believe in the term Hardcore gamers and casual gamers entirely. There are those who game, and those who dont. Simple as that.

[QUOTE="SexySasquatch11"]

Everytime I come to this board I see people talking about the Hardcore Gamer and the Casual Gamer. People say the Wii sucks because it doesn't have hardcore games, or this game is a hardcore game while someone calls it casual. So I thought I'd help people out, there is no such thing as a "Hardcore" game. Now before you rip my head off listen to me.

Whether or not a game is "hardcore" is up to the person that plays it. I play Halo 3 a couple hours a year, so to me Halo 3's a casual game. While some other people play Halo for 6 hours a day everyday. Now to the person Halo 3's a hardcore game. I know people that play Wii Sports like theres no tomorrow. So thats a hardcore game to them. I myself buy about 30-40 games a year, and I consider myself as casual as they come. I play no game "hardcorely". Hell look at Peggle. Very simple game but look at how many hours people put into that game.

So what determines a Casual game or a Hardcore game completely depends on you. If you dedicate yourself to a game thats what makes it hardcore. If you play thought a game once and never though it again, you were casual to that game. Look at people that play CS:S and Madden professionally, they're very hardcore. While I'll play a couple games with my friends, that makes me casual.

Just because a games got blood and vilence doesn't make it "Hardcore", it just makes it appeal to a different audience. I'm all good with violence and everything, but when I saw the new GoW 3 trailer and I saw Kratos tearing off that gods head, I didn't think wow that hardcore, I thought wow thats really immature.

So what you put into the game either makes if a hardcore game or a casual game. Hopefully this translates well...

glez13

NO, NO, and another NO to emphasise.

Casual Games Assosiation FAQ

All of this, if you are referring to proper hardcore or core games and casual games. I have noticed that people use these terms here in a derogative and insulting way that is totally improper.

That link does not cancel out an opinion.

He is perfectly right anyway...

It's not the games, it's the only variable that counts; the user. More accurately, it is the manner in which they are played.

I completely agree with the TCs post..its how you play the game. I made a blog once on this exact subject, dont know if I can link it though cause I dont want it to be counted as "Disruptive Posting".

you try making the typical madden gamer sit down in front of hearts of iron...wolverine4262

ArmA II

Me and 3 of my friends just played a custom mission where we were Special Forces HALOed into a zone with a mission to destroy bridges, railways, power stations, bunker complexes and other targets of opportunity in preparation for a full scale invasion fleet coming in behind us. After 5 hours of play, we successfully blew up the power station, ambushed a squad of 10 men riding in a transport truck escorted by a GAZ-3937 Vodnik and wiped them out, then crawled up a stream for almost an hour to reach the railroad bridge, which we also managed to blow up. We also destroyed a lighthouse nearby after killing the lone guard by slipping up to his foxhole and tossing in a grenade.

On the way out from the burning bridge to our next objective, we got spotted by a patrol responding to the explosions and before we managed to kill them all, they had radioed in and alerted the main garrison of the enemy. We got out of the area fast and after a 4km march we arrived at the main city and attempted to infiltrate into the docks to blow up a ship unloading weapons there along with the dock facilities (cranes, etc). The garrison was ready for us though and after a ferocious firefight we lost 2 men and the remaining 2 were forced to steal a rubber boat and evacuate.

This was at night, the moon didn't rise until 3 hours into the mission. Our navigation was done with a map, watch and compass. No crosshairs, healthbars, or anything. If you get hit once in the head, you're dead, hit in the arm, you can march out but you cant use your weapons, hit in the leg and you have to be carried out by one of your squad.

Hardcore? I think so.

[QUOTE="glez13"]NO, NO, and another NO to emphasise.

Casual Games Assosiation FAQ

All of this, if you are referring to proper hardcore or core games and casual games. I have noticed that people use the term Casual here in a derogative and insulting way that is totally improper, and hardcore could also mean hard or something related to an expert or something similar.

Leejjohno

That link does not cancel out an opinion.

He is perfectly right anyway...

It's not the games, it's the only variable that counts; the user. More accurately, it is the manner in which they are played.

Yes, but it shows that there is a proper meaning for hardcore games and casual games in the industry, thus a "casual game" is not the same as a game that is too casual, and the same for hardcore ones. Thus it's not up to the player to decide what is a casual game, but he can decide if a game is too casual, noob friendly, or whatever he likes to call it.

[QUOTE="wolverine4262"]you try making the typical madden gamer sit down in front of hearts of iron...surrealnumber5

It's like lemmings and cows. They aren't ACTUALLY cows, it's just a stupid title people give themselves. Kinda like how "hardcore" gamers gave themselves the title, hardcore gamers. It makes them feel good about something in their lives.

You spend 3+ hours in a mission in ArmA 2 and have only killed 3-4 enemies. You tell me thats not "hardcore".

Fun? Depends on who plays it. Fun is in the eye of the beholder. There is a reason why ArmA 2 doesn't sell millions and is on the cover of ever magazine and frontpage of every gaming website.

The term hardcore gamer has more to do with the person themselves, and not a particular game or how much time they spend playing a certain game.

Most of us in here consider games our obsession and not just an occasional hobby that we pick up once every other month.

So it's not that the Wii is a casual system and the PS3 and 360 are hardcore, but it's the people who buy them and devote endless amounts of hours into playing them that makes them the hardcore gamers.

The casuals are the people who were looking for something to buy for a couple hundred bucks and figured they try a few video games on a particular system and then actually only play those games like 2 hours a week, those are the casual gamers.

[QUOTE="Leejjohno"]

[QUOTE="glez13"]NO, NO, and another NO to emphasise.

Casual Games Assosiation FAQ

All of this, if you are referring to proper hardcore or core games and casual games. I have noticed that people use the term Casual here in a derogative and insulting way that is totally improper, and hardcore could also mean hard or something related to an expert or something similar.

glez13

That link does not cancel out an opinion.

He is perfectly right anyway...

It's not the games, it's the only variable that counts; the user. More accurately, it is the manner in which they are played.

Yes, but it shows that there is a proper meaning for hardcore games and casual games in the industry, thus a "casual game" is not the same as a game that is too casual, and the same for hardcore ones. Thus it's not up to the player to decide what is a casual game, but he can decide if a game is too casual, noob friendly, or whatever he likes to call it.

Of course it's up to the player to determine what type of player they are. Why do you think online gameing it becoming huge now? Make a good online means what people will keep there games instread of trading them in so others can buy them used, and now that some games have advertasing in it, the amount of money they make from that reflects the user base. Why you think people call Call of Duty 4 a cop-out and a noob game. They dumbed it down so people can play it and enjoy themselfs, so it wasn't difficult people can jump into a game have fun and come back for more. Devolpers are trying to pull the people that play their games casualy, into people that play them hardcorely. And I'd have to say I hate online gaming but I did get sucked into CoD 4 for a month or two...

I Came to this thread thinking Has the the TC played ARMA2 yet?

but, on topic i do agree its up to the player to decide what games hardcore, but i think there is a general definition of a hardcore game, and its certainly not blood and gore

I don't see myself as a casual or hardcore gamer im just a gamer that likes to have fun and relax playing video games

SaintJimmmy

I have to say that I haven't played it. Whats it stand for and I'll give it a run through.

And I have to say I'm rather shocked that some people sorta agreed with me.

Play Counter-Strike: Source on a VAC server with proper maps, then ask your topic question again please, OP.Zythyl

learning curve=hardcore pick up and play=noobcore videogamesdead6

You can stick me on any FPS, RTS, RPG ext and I can pick up and play them. So all those games are noobcore. And I can't pick up and play Madden effectively since I don't know proper plays, what defense if good against what. So Madden is offically hardcore.

Learning curve is completely depent on the user. Whats an easy game to you is hard to someone else, and whats are to you is cake to someone else.

But I will say that Fifa '08 is the hardest game I've played this gen

It's like lemmings and cows. They aren't ACTUALLY cows, it's just a stupid title people give themselves. Kinda like how "hardcore" gamers gave themselves the title, hardcore gamers. It makes them feel good about something in their lives.

WINDWAKER1

You people act as if there is noMicrosoft Casual Games division, there is no EA Casual Entertainment Groupor no Casual Games Association.

Now I understand why I was almost lynched when I said Plants vs. Zombies was a casual game and it shouldn't be counted in SW like other casual games from platforms like XBL, PSN, Wiiware.

People here don't understand that Casual game and Hardcore or Core game are accepted terms in the industry and are defined accordingly.

It cuold also be, like I said before, that there is a misunderstanding and ignorance that there are proper definitions for these terms and people are mistaking "Casual Game" with "A game that is casual".

Play Counter-Strike: Source on a VAC server with proper maps, then ask your topic question again please, OP.Zythyl

I do believe I said in my opening post that people play CS:S very "hardcorely". So whats me getting on and playing with some pros going to accomplish? How about you join the military, go to Iraq see how it is there and come back and ask me your question again...

[QUOTE="glez13"]

Yes, but it shows that there is a proper meaning for hardcore games and casual games in the industry, thus a "casual game" is not the same as a game that is too casual, and the same for hardcore ones. Thus it's not up to the player to decide what is a casual game, but he can decide if a game is too casual, noob friendly, or whatever he likes to call it.

SexySasquatch11

Of course it's up to the player to determine what type of player they are. Why do you think online gameing it becoming huge now? Make a good online means what people will keep there games instread of trading them in so others can buy them used, and now that some games have advertasing in it, the amount of money they make from that reflects the user base. Why you think people call Call of Duty 4 a cop-out and a noob game. They dumbed it down so people can play it and enjoy themselfs, so it wasn't difficult people can jump into a game have fun and come back for more. Devolpers are trying to pull the people that play their games casualy, into people that play them hardcorely. And I'd have to say I hate online gaming but I did get sucked into CoD 4 for a month or two...

From what you bolded and what you wrote I'm guessing you didn't understand completely my point. But in the rest we do agree. CoD4 is a Hardcore game, of a hardcore genre, but it is too casual or noob friendly.

Everytime I come to this board I see people talking about the Hardcore Gamer and the Casual Gamer. People say the Wii sucks because it doesn't have hardcore games, or this game is a hardcore game while someone calls it casual. So I thought I'd help people out, there is no such thing as a "Hardcore" game. Now before you rip my head off listen to me.

Whether or not a game is "hardcore" is up to the person that plays it. I play Halo 3 a couple hours a year, so to me Halo 3's a casual game. While some other people play Halo for 6 hours a day everyday. Now to the person Halo 3's a hardcore game. I know people that play Wii Sports like theres no tomorrow. So thats a hardcore game to them. I myself buy about 30-40 games a year, and I consider myself as casual as they come. I play no game "hardcorely". Hell look at Peggle. Very simple game but look at how many hours people put into that game.

So what determines a Casual game or a Hardcore game completely depends on you. If you dedicate yourself to a game thats what makes it hardcore. If you play thought a game once and never though it again, you were casual to that game. Look at people that play CS:S and Madden professionally, they're very hardcore. While I'll play a couple games with my friends, that makes me casual.

Just because a games got blood and vilence doesn't make it "Hardcore", it just makes it appeal to a different audience. I'm all good with violence and everything, but when I saw the new GoW 3 trailer and I saw Kratos tearing off that gods head, I didn't think wow that hardcore, I thought wow thats really immature.

So what you put into the game either makes if a hardcore game or a casual game. Hopefully this translates well...

SexySasquatch11

You are partially on the right track. But I think it's more than simply the amount of time a gamer spends on the given game. It's really more to do with the dedication of learning and mastering it's unique play mechanics, especially when there's competetive play involved.

Take fighters for example. Some people approach it casually just for fun, and handle it as a button masher. While a hardcore gamer will dedicate thmselves to learning each fighters styIes down to the complete combo list, and perfect their timing technique to be able to play in competetive tournaments. Halo as the other example, some will approach it just for fun run n' gun, while others will take the time to learn each weapon's strengths and weaknesses, as well as each maps strong points, all in the effort to master the play strategies of tournament play.

But then you take a game like Wii Sports. No matter how much time someone spends on it, is there really a higher level of playing that will differentiate casual from hardcore gameplay in it? Really, that game is meant strictly for casual fun that anybody can play and enjoy it. So really what makes the game hardcore or casual, is the level of play mechanics it has inherent in its design, that a dedicated player can learn and master, or just allow for the casual approach, all based on what that player puts into it. So long as there is a higher level in its design.

NG2 highest difficulty. Very, very, hardcore. I don't see how a casual player can beat or even attempt to try and beat any NG game on highest difficulty. No, NG games were meant for "hardcore" players.

Now IMO no-one is a hardcore or casual gamer, we're all gamers and that's what matters. Not which title you fall under. However I believe the title hardcore can maybe go for players that don't give up, that seek to become formidable a opponent for a difficult game they want to play. Rather you play, 1 hour a day or 16, that want to become the best and actually try, try, and try again is what makes a hardcore gamer imo.

[QUOTE="WINDWAKER1"]

It's like lemmings and cows. They aren't ACTUALLY cows, it's just a stupid title people give themselves. Kinda like how "hardcore" gamers gave themselves the title, hardcore gamers. It makes them feel good about something in their lives.

glez13

You people act as if there is noMicrosoft Casual Games division, there is no EA Casual Entertainment Groupor no Casual Games Association.

Now I understand why I was almost lynched when I said Plants vs. Zombies was a casual game and it shouldn't be counted in SW like other casual games from platforms like XBL, PSN, Wiiware.

People here don't understand that Casual game and Hardcore or Core game are accepted terms in the industry and are defined accordingly.

It cuold also be, like I said before, that there is a misunderstanding and ignorance that there are proper definitions for these terms and people are mistaking "Casual Game" with "A game that is casual".

When they make Halo, they don't sit around and say "This is a hardcore game, and were going to target hardcore gamers". They sit down and get their demographic like Males between the ages of 13-25. Then they'll get a secondary demographic and maybe a third and so on. Then they figure out why those gamers will like their game. So if their games a hack n' slash like GoW, they'll figure out what about that game they liked try to incopurate it into theirs. So once they pull what type of games their demographic like they try and market the game towards them. A lot of time and money goes into it, and really the only time casual and hardcore get thrown around is when ppl like Cliffy try to get some short cheap publicity for their game. Getting people excited and getting yout game attention about it is all that matter.

Well, there is no definite meaning for 'hardcore' like there is casual, so in a sense there aren't 'hardcore' games.. But my interpretation of it is just reversing what causal games and whatever genre/game falls under that is hardcore.. I also believe a hardcore gamer is someone who plays those types of games.

That's just my opinion.

NG2 highest difficulty. Very, very, hardcore. I don't see how a casual player can beat or even attempt to try and beat any NG game on highest difficulty. No, NG games were meant for "hardcore" players.

Now IMO no-one is a hardcore or casual gamer, we're all gamers and that's what matters. Not which title you fall under. However I believe the title hardcore can maybe go for players that don't give up, that seek to become formidable a opponent for a difficult game they want to play. Rather you play, 1 hour a day or 16, that want to become the best and actually try, try, and try again is what makes a hardcore gamer imo.

SamGv

If thats true, why did they put in diffucility modes? Why not just lock the game on Very Hard a make everyone play it like that. Because people wouldn't play it. They'd quit and not try the next installment. Thats why we have difucitlity modes, so people can pick up play throught it and be done, while others can get smacked around on the higher settings. Thats what makes it targeted to either.