VR talk...what, how, problems, and possibilities

So, I was listening to a podcast from the Funhaus guys who were talking about VR and they had some interesting things to say.

1. Motion sickness and VR. What could possibly come of this relationship? What if VR is the fix for ppl who get motion sickness from FPS like Half Life 2. One of the guys said he thinks it has to do with the FOV and has not had motion sickness while trying any VR yet. could VR fix this?

2. Other applications and scenarios that VR could come in handy. This isn't a new one. From the start, I thought of VR being very relevant in hospitals doing surgery or such things. One idea they had was where you could redesign your living room with VR before buying furniture. I think etiher Home Depot or someone has this already...of sorts. Where you view your living space and recolor the room as you see fit....now that I think of it....it's a paint company that has this.

3. Theres some game coming out or came out where you are a baby or toddler and your in a house at night. It's a scary game recreating our fears from childhood. The devs were going to port the game to VR, saying they were all excited b/c what a great idea....a horror game with VR, right? Well, they said they found a golden rule or sorts. Their game has times where the game itself will have you fall down...not of the free will of the user. They said this broke the immersion factor of the VR and what the VR was suppose to do. Basically, VR strengths are when the user and the VR compliment each other with the free roaming of a game....but if the game takes over say for if the camera moves so you'll purposely see something for part of the story....it takes away.

What do you think of VR?

Heres the video:

Doesn't really interest me at the moment

Don't know how comfortable it would be having something strapped to my face

Only kinds of games I think it'll make things better really would be first person survival horror, but not much more than just playing late at night with the lights off on a modestly sized HDTV with a good pair of stereo headphones and a sandwich bag full of bong fodder.

@mr_huggles_dog: Maybe I missed something but that video has nothing to with vr, not the images anyway and I'm an images person.

Anyway to answer your questions? I haven't tried vr yet but I doubt so many people would be busy with it if it didn't had a future.

1. What i heard of motion sickness is that the problem happens when you move and the image doesnt follow or vice versa. I've read somewhere you could replicate it if you move with your eyes closed. I tried that and it was indeed nauseating, pretty much immediately. However valve says they fixed it but you need space then , something a lot of us don't have , not to that extent that you can play call of duty. So I think Vr's biggest future will be in the arcade hall, or something similar, for now anyway.

2. I don't think it will have a lot of mass wide applications in the near future because not many people will have it. See 1.

3. Not sure what you mean by this but free falling , roller coasters, stuff like that probably won't be a nice feeling in vr if you're body isn't experiencing something similar. Still, like I said I haven't tried it yet but I surely will!

I think microsoft hololens will have a bigger future.

I'm eager for VR. I'm curious to try Oculus' Medium, and intend to buy the Oculus Touch when it releases Q2 next year (probably going to hold off and get the headset all at the same time). I think the tech holds a lot of potential across many different genres of gaming. I'd love to see a web browser application like the one in Johnny Mnemonic. Yea I know it'd be impractical, superfluous, and less efficient than how the net is surfed now, but it sure as hell would be fun and I don't see any reason why such a thing couldn't be accomplished in a 3D space using a gesture bound interface. And while Touch will be the first way to interface with Oculus, there's also gloves in the works as well (although it's a third party Kickstarter so who knows how well that will pan out).

VR is going to be a lot niftier than people are currently giving it credit for. I want to play an RPG or Resident Evil type game from a first person with virtual hands and head tracking. Or in racing sims and DCS modules. I already have a Track IR for them and it frees the game up significantly. Not a game changer, but very immersive. I can't imagine what having my entire field of view covered with the addition of surround headphones will be like.

I can't wait.

The problems they run in to are fascinating. That surgeon sim demo in which they realized that one of the players was a little kid, and (s)he was too short to see the tools laying on a table. That one made me smile. It's great that the most popular and immersion breaking factors of video games will have to be re-imagined. Such as the FPS genre (too fast) and cutscenes (instant position changes), load screens or moments in which games take away control from you. I don't like those things, or they are overused, so this is a great opportunity for gaming to make some steps forward.

If this sells well, and keeps evolving, this could be the best thing or at least the most interesting thing that has happened to gaming in years.

Porn

All we need is VR porn and it will becomes the dominant computer interface within a year

Hololens + Kinect = VR is dead and buried.... just sayin. :P

Dead on arrival, no good for family fun, cant try one out since cost too much to send a demo to every store, which would be a failure also even if they did. The only good thing it would be for is movies and porn which it will fail at both those also since the screen has no motion warning for when someone might be opening your door. Youll have to lock yourself in the basement to play with it.

Your basically sticking a phone to your face which will cause tunnel vision being so close. This will be the worst gaming tech in the history of gaming.

I was surprised when people gave two fcuks about VR or AR for gaming. Yall didn't care for motion controls or plastic wear, like a power glove. So... yeah.

1. There are people who are going to get motion sickness from VR. That's just a fact, and it's too bad for them but we can't hault technological progress because a small minority of the population can't use it. I'm totally blind in one eye but I don't protest 3D because I can't see it.

2. I used to work Marketing at a medical device company and at one convention I went to in Xiamen, China there was a kiosk demonstrating a "simplified" VR surgery system using Oculus Rift headsets and some specialized input peripherals. The medical applications are definitely real, but so are the educational possibilities. Imagine a VR based re-enactment of historical events or anatomical diagrams. The sky is the limit and I think VR companies should invest in educational software or programs to get headsets into schools.

3. I'm not exactly sure what you're asking but I think the game you're talking about is called Among the Sleep. You play as a baby that can't quite walk yet so yeah, you fall down a lot. I don't think it's a big deal because, realistically, VR can't emulate everything that your body goes through during gameplay. I wouldn't want it to, either, because getting shot doesn't sound like it would feel too great. All the same, though, it definitely is going to have a certain degree of disconnect preventing total immersion. One thing that'll be interesting is to see how many people have serious heart attacks playing horror games. VR kinda "tricks" your brain into thinking that what you're experiencing is actually there, in a way that a static 2D monitor can't, so that'll be interesting.

I can't wait for VR, it's going to be amazing. My main problem is that I'm totally blind in my left eye, so if there are HUD elements on the left goggle but not the right one I'll be totally unable to see them. Still, I've used the Oculus and it's amazing, even if I can't see the 3D.

@Big_Red_Button: agreed, VR is going to kick some serious ass. I remember using one long ago. There were no hand controls like upcoming Oculus Touch mind you, but just having the visor on with head-tracking and being able to look around fully immersed, even with such rudimentary visuals at the time (it was in the mid nineties) blew my mind.

It's too bad many won't be able to use it due to a high entry cost, but eventually it'll come down while the tech gets better. We'll finally have truly relevant and progressive motion controls useful in a variety of applications with VR, something far better than that Wii gimmick Radio Shack cheap tier garbage could ever hope to promise.

I tried the Vive in Elite Dangerous at EGX last week and its one of the best and most thrilling gaming experience I have ever encountered, definitely better than the DK2. When you put the Vive on you dont feel like you are in a game -you feel like you are in a real ship, in endless space, Its really incredible.

I didnt get to try the Rift that much this year because I couldnt be bothered to wait in the really long queues, though im pretty sure they were all just DK2s anyway. I wasnt going to leave without trying Vive though, the precision compared to the DK2 is so good that you forget you are wearing a headset.

Naw... Holo Lens + VR mixed will likely be the top end future ... kinect has no place in any of this... since both VR and Hololens has simulate / track you without it.

I'm gonna try n snag a VIVE as soon as they are available... can always return if its not that good, or I cant handle it with motion sickness.. apperently though motion sickness is alot less common now anyway.

Valve's 2 mini-experiences:

Valves Dota 2 Secret shop?

Truly amazing first steps.... how anyone can say this will be a dead fad... are just missing the point of what games are trying to achieve in general.

Valve also have something more substantial coming with the VIVES release... honstly won't expect miracles, but if these are anything to go by....

I don't want to strap stuff to my face.

Sony and/or Facebook should develop a Home-like application for VR. It would literally change everything.

VR+the forward facing camera on every smartphone, DS, and Vita everty ever = LOLolens

VR is awesome, but it is not for all types of games. I think it is only a matter of time before someone makes a Facehugger mod that you put on top of your VR headset. Imagine walking into a room and seeing someone playing VR with that on their head. lol. Although, the added weight would not be ideal.

are you sure? I dont know the tech behind holo lens... but it looks much better than phone AR currently does....

Looking forward to both. Vr and Hololens suit different purposes... or a hybrid could be great too... at least holoens can interact with real surfaces... that combined with VR's Immersion and creating the surroundings... truly great concepts.

I can't wait to get the Oculus rift consumers version. Also need to upgrade again then...

VR is a great thing, that combined with those running platforms and some fallout 4 would be awesome.

Could be

@jj-josh said:

@RedentSC said:

Porn

All we need is VR porn and it will becomes the dominant computer interface within a year

Could be

Porn and the defense industries are the two that are mainly responsible for being the driving forces behind the adoption of new technology. Hilarious it may be, it's the truth.

OT, I'm torn between the Vive and Oculus. I hear Vive will allow for movement in a 15 x 15 foot area (by laser scan cameras in opposing corners of the room that can read your movements and define borders), whereas Oculus will be static and will accomplish movement with analog sticks on the controller. I'm up for VR, but don't know if I want to be walking around all the time worrying if I'm going to bump into shit and have to constantly recalibrate (especially when there's a cable attached to the back of my head to trip on), not to mention my room with my PC is crowded. If I had my own house with a dedicated empty room this would be better, but I rent one, and it's not exactly large nor empty.

I really like what I see in the videos MBirdy88 posted (thanks for those MBirdy), but space is a factor, and I think it will be for many. Plus from what I'm hearing Oculus sounds to be a bit cheaper, and I intensely want Medium (the sculpting software) that comes with the Touch.

Yea this site is notorious for disappearing posts so I always C & P mine before posting.

I'm tending towards the Oculus as well, but one thing I've heard that troubles me is it's (from what I'm reading) more prone to induce motion sickness than the Vive is, and this is my biggest fear as I'm hugely susceptible to it. Although I don't know if it's improved as most of the complaints I've read online have been from early development kits. Even so, I'm hearing the problem may end up there for some people regardless, and the last thing I want is to be unable to use Oculus after I've spent $350+ on it (which it's sounding to be in the range of, my guess is from $350-450, and that's not including the Touch nor of upgrading my graphics card and possibly CPU).

While FB's financial backing is encouraging, I'm also drawn towards Steam's established framework and distribution platform which I find will be just as relevant and needed for the proliferation of the tech. I'm not aware of how Oculus intends to accomplish this as I'm not a FB user. Valve's not exactly wanting for money either, although they are relatively small in comparison. I do like the idea of FB allocating resources solely to VR such as movies, but even so I would like to see some demonstrations before taking the plunge. Gaming is not even in the front in my mind in the appeal of VR's potential really. Much of the demos I've watched on YT are of VR implementations into games that were designed with it not in mind. I don't want this technology superficially tacked onto shooters and such simply so I have convenient and more immersive free-look. While that will be useful (Star Citizen is the driving motivation for me getting VR), if that's ultimately all it's going to be used for it will be a disappointment.

There's so much potential it is absolutely mind-boggling. You ever had a lucid dream? That's the kind of experiences I want to see. I want VR to be something that is my domain and transcends rules and boundaries. A creative medium, like Medium and Tilt Brush (nice vids, btw), but not just a painting or sculpting program but within a world I can completely control. I do hope developers think outside the box and don't just recreate reality in a virtual setting. That would be a bore.

Hollywood doesn't seem to be interested at all - this is a curious fact. As for its applications in games, it might find a spot, but it can't supersede gaming "as we know it" because it requires an add-on. No peripheral (apart from the Wiimote) ever really defines the content to any significant degree.

I think for gaming purposes it won't take off as much as people would like. The problem is and the same happened to the kinnect, Wii motion controls, and the eye toy. People just won't really care. Plastic instruments for guitar hero and rock band took off only because they could still use a controller but anything that requires more than just using your thumbs for gameplay purposes is a bit too much. Plus the types of games we would hope to get never really come out for these controls. Kinnect became a simple dancing simulator. Wii Motion was just mostly used in a very simplistic way that made no significance on gameplay. So I see VR/ AR not being big in the gaming world, but for work professionals and training simulators.

Putting on an electronic blindfold and flailing your limbs around is considered bad luck in most cultures. I dunno, maybe they'll give you a special mat to stand on or something, but I foresee a lot of VR related hospitalisations.

@MirkoS77 said:

@jj-josh said:

@RedentSC said:

Porn

All we need is VR porn and it will becomes the dominant computer interface within a year

Could be

Porn and the defense industries are the two that are mainly responsible for being the driving forces behind the adoption of new technology. Hilarious it may be, it's the truth.

OT, I'm torn between the Vive and Oculus. I hear Vive will allow for movement in a 15 x 15 foot area (by laser scan cameras in opposing corners of the room that can read your movements and define borders), whereas Oculus will be static and will accomplish movement with analog sticks on the controller. I'm up for VR, but don't know if I want to be walking around all the time worrying if I'm going to bump into shit and have to constantly recalibrate (especially when there's a cable attached to the back of my head to trip on), not to mention my room with my PC is crowded. If I had my own house with a dedicated empty room this would be better, but I rent one, and it's not exactly large nor empty.

I really like what I see in the videos MBirdy88 posted (thanks for those MBirdy), but space is a factor, and I think it will be for many. Plus from what I'm hearing Oculus sounds to be a bit cheaper, and I intensely want Medium (the sculpting software) that comes with the Touch.

Hehe yes those two areas will definitely do well. There is actually some stuff that has been done with the military in Norway here using Oculus to see outside the tank.

I tried the Oculus but it really didn't get to me. I thought that I might just be one of those boring people unphased by game gadgets, but then we got a Vive in our office and I was blow away. It just completely felt like I was inside the game. And I was very very skeptical going into it. Moving around isn't a problem, as you get feedback on when you are getting too close to the end of the area you have set up (it stopped me from falling over our couch), although the wire is a bit of an issue. I didn't feel sick at all like I had after a while with the Oculus. You do need a room with some space.

The demo I played was Portal and now I just can't wait. I believe the biggest mistake companies will end up doing is trying to shoehorn their games into the use of VR. You need to create the game specifically with the VR in mind. I think the Vive will be able to be the beginning of a new exciting type of games, as the enclosed space gives you some interesting limitations. A, though, problem is that it becomes less of a socal experience if only one person can see what is going on. Might be easy to just project what is happening on the TV screen though, in "normal" view for people watching.

2. There are loads of other aplications where VR would come in handy, but as probably not enough people will end up buying it, companies would only get stuff like this made for tradeshows etc. That is a great way to get some attention at your stand, though.

3. Yes Among the Sleep is a great game, and trying that with the Oculus was very interesting. I have seen other games tried with the Oculus, like Mirrors edge and that seemed less succesful. Just because there is so much head-bobbing in the game. Just showing that you really need to design the game from the start with VR in mind. Sadly it will most likely take away from the full game experience if developers try to do too much at once. Like making a None-VR game that is also suited for VR or vice versa.

Oh btw, really want to go here and try this.

I don't see VR being that successful. Its a add on you buy separately. A lot of people assume they're going to fire up Call of Duty and have a fun time lol. I for one am not big on having a device strapped to my head, but who knows, I could be proven wrong.

dedicated machines for this could come around easily enough. or even be built into the headset for lower-level non gaming experiences... (or non demanding games) ... don't expect this market to stay the same forever.

I've tried Google Cardboard ... while a very LIMITED experience, its a very cheap way of seeing the potential.

I felt the same way, but have to say that after trying the Vive I now know I NEED to get one. I still think it's not going to be in every home though, of course.

I don't see much potential in it. At least not in a way that could benefit the genres I enjoy the most. Motion gaming has proven to have some merit and has improved a number of franchises over the years (Metroid Prime 3, Pikmin 3, Skyward Sword). I'd rather more time be spent there than on VR.

@cathinshadow: damn, the void looks awesome. Wish I were rich, I'd buy a warehouse and programmers to create new experiences every month or so. I have to try that.

What about the Vive sold you more on VR that the Oculus lacked? Why was it more immersive? I really don't care to move around, and don't have the room even if I did without some major hassle of moving furniture around. Did you use the Touch with the Rift?

I definitely want the best experience, I just don't know how practical the Vive would be for my current living situation. Will there be uses for it sitting down?

@mr_huggles_dog: VR is the gimmick of this generation like motion controls were last ones. Thats all there is to it. Theres no way developers or people to adapt to such thing as VR googles , become a trend etc ... Personally i see VR as a tragic way to play games as of now . Maybe in 50 years from now VR will make sense ... but now .. naaah , ill pass.

@MirkoS77 Yeah that must be fun. Would be interesting to see if they hire in people to do development if they become hugely successful.

For starters, the visuals are better. As far as I know the headset uses two 1200x1080 pixel screens, and the Field of View of the headset is high enough to create a sense of presence. You can see movement at the very edge of your eyes and turn to track it smoothly. Being able to move around, having the controllers represent your hands, plays an important role too. You have two joysticks with touchpads and trigger-style buttons that let you interact with the world you are in. Viewing things while being able to use your whole body instead of being stuck in one place really makes a difference.

Of course, playing the Portal demo helped in dazzling me XD
But the drawing demo is also pretty cool.

@mr_huggles_dog Yes of course it is a gimmik, but considering how open Valve are with developers and how accesible it is to us, I would say you can expect to get several games out. If they will stick or not is of course something that we will just have to wait and see. Might still be too soon, but developers are getting psyched about this. Especially Norwegian developers might take a chance on this, since several developers probably will get state funding to create VR-games. I already know of a new company starting up that has some cool ideas and we are doing a VR jam in our offices in just a few months. :3