Which Nintendo Franchise is most hardcore, relevant and important today?

You know, once, Mario was the be all and end all of gaming. A Mario game invoked such mass hysteria, it was almost uncontrollable. While Mario still remains very important today, he no longer can carry off a console alone, by himself, like he did back in the N64 days.

The Legend of Zelda is Nintendo's most exalted franchise. It's quality has remained consistent all through the years, and each game sells like hot cakes, and gets accolades like there is no tomorrow. Yes, Zelda is only growing in prominence and relevance today.

Metroid is the most overlooked franchise in Nintendo's top tier stable. It's got the least number of games, and the maximum number of time between each subsequent instalment on an average. But in today's day and age, the franchise is possibly their most relevant, with its sci-fi shooter trimmings. I think many would vouch that Metroid is Nintendo's most hardcore franchise today.

Super Smash Bros... is this even a franchise? It started off as a spin off Mario game, but evolved into a game series that has produced a game which can today be called one of the greatest ever created. While only three games have ever been released, there is no doubt that many people will buy a Nintendo console just to play a Super Smash Bros game.

Pokemon, while not hardcore at first glance, with its cutesy and kiddy exterior, turns out to be one of the deepest and most involved RPG experiences imaginable. And with each title breezing over the 10 million mark, it appears that more and more peoplke would agree that Pokemon is Nintendo's biggest franchise today.

What do you guys think? What is Nintendo's biggest, most important, most relevant and most hardcore franchise today? Sound off and vote!

I'm gonna hold off on voting until they show some M+ zedla.

But, moving away from nintendo, and just wii, I'd say Red Steel 2 and Silent Hill Shattered Memories

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Pokemon for me

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

The most hardcore Nintendo franchise is with out a doubt Zelda or Metroid. Both games, are not made with casuals in mind, and both games have really dark, mature undertones to them, something Nintendo is not really known for.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

mexicangordo

I have no idea what that means. More people play Pokemon competitively than Smash? There's no way that's true.

Either way, that's irrelevant. Smash wins out here because Pokemon lacks depth and involves far more luck, which is usually something competitive gamers want to avoid.

Nintendo is hardcore? When? Did I miss something?-Hells_Gate-

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

Nintendo is hardcore? When? Did I miss something?-Hells_Gate-

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

well actually ive found out Pokemon has a lot of depth after i found out about EV training it adds a lot to the game. On a different note never buying the 3rd Pokemon game in a combo like Platinum its almost exactly the same as the first 2murat8

Isn't EV training just stat boosting? It doesn't really add depth to the actual battles.

I'd love to be proven wrong on this "depth" issue though--I used to dig Pokemon, but I just haven't been into it recently because of this.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

I have no idea what that means. More people play Pokemon competitively than Smash? There's no way that's true.

Either way, that's irrelevant. Smash wins out here because Pokemon lacks depth and involves far more luck, which is usually something competitive gamers want to avoid.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

For hardcore, it's Smash, because it has competitive multiplayer. (Pokemon does too, but it lacks depth.)

For relevant, it is, and will always be, Mario.

Locke562

There might be a metagame (Pokemon lends itself to one like no other game), but it's the "game" itself I've found to be shallow. With so much luck involved, the game can only go so far competitively.

[QUOTE="murat8"]well actually ive found out Pokemon has a lot of depth after i found out about EV training it adds a lot to the game. On a different note never buying the 3rd Pokemon game in a combo like Platinum its almost exactly the same as the first 2Tsug_Ze_Wind

Isn't EV training just stat boosting? It doesn't really add depth to the actual battles.

I'd love to be proven wrong on this "depth" issue though--I used to dig Pokemon, but I just haven't been into it recently because of this.

Ever heard of a pokemone circuit? Or Shoddy? They are different "areas" where hardcore players battle and theirs one in EU, America and many other countries.

mexicangordo

I'm sure there is. Pokemon is a very popular game (understatement). But percentage-wise, there's just no way more people play Pokemon competitvely.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="murat8"]well actually ive found out Pokemon has a lot of depth after i found out about EV training it adds a lot to the game. On a different note never buying the 3rd Pokemon game in a combo like Platinum its almost exactly the same as the first 2murat8

Isn't EV training just stat boosting? It doesn't really add depth to the actual battles.

I'd love to be proven wrong on this "depth" issue though--I used to dig Pokemon, but I just haven't been into it recently because of this.

No doubt. Training is the best part of the game.

[QUOTE="murat8"]well actually ive found out Pokemon has a lot of depth after i found out about EV training it adds a lot to the game. On a different note never buying the 3rd Pokemon game in a combo like Platinum its almost exactly the same as the first 2Tsug_Ze_Wind

Isn't EV training just stat boosting? It doesn't really add depth to the actual battles.

I'd love to be proven wrong on this "depth" issue though--I used to dig Pokemon, but I just haven't been into it recently because of this.

How about battling itself? This is another hardcore aspect of pokmon, especially switching and mind-games. Their are so many different scenarios that can happen its so important to know whats going on in a battle. Pokemon isnt your typical RPG were you level up and use your best attacks to win, theirs combos, switching, items, and the fact that your not playing a computer, you are playing a human that can perform the same combos you can and have a completely different strategy.

Theres a lot i left out but i hope thats enough to convince. :P

Nintendo is hardcore? When? Did I miss something?-Hells_Gate-

First of all, I'm a cow (a Sony fanboy, I mean).

Gee, dude. When did you start playing games? Maybe you just became a gamer and read some god forsaken comments about Nintendo which were written by completely biased Nintendo haters. Nintendo is the most hardcore company ever. In fact, we can even say that Nintendo CREATED gaming. Revered series, that all developers hold in the highest regard and look up to, games that defined gaming, that inspire so many present day franchises, were created by Nintendo. Heck, Nintendo created the most revered series of all time which also has what is said to be the best game ever- The Legend of Zelda. Nintendo created Mario, which was the first platformer ever and all the new wanna be titles like Ratchet and Clank, Jak and Daxter, Banjo-Kazooie- all of them are just mere rip-offs of Mario. Nintendo created Metroid, the first hardcore game and one of the most loved series ever. Nintendo CREATED gaming, as you know it today. Nintendo introduced the concept of 3D walking. Of 3D talking. Of stories in games. Of saving your game. Nintendo developed games, for the first time, mind you, that actually lasted you more than an hour. Nintendo created the first ever fully 3D console. Nintendo created analog sticks. Nintendo revived gaming, man.

Nintendo has created one of the best consoles ever. Nintendo created NES, which can practically be called the first console ever. They developed SNES, which houses one of the best and most revered libraries of all time. Nintendo created N64, which was the first ever fully 3D console and offered us games like Super Mario 64, Ocarina of Time and Goldeneye. Nintendo created Gamecube, which houses what is considered to be the best Zelda game by many. Nintendo developed the Wii, which introduced the concept of motion gaming.

Nintendo is the most hardcore company ever. Man, your statement was as ridiculous as the statements that I'm gonna write below (assuming, of course, that you DO understand what I'm saying. You don't know a damn about gaming).

1. Virtual Boy is man's best invention. (Virtual Boy... you know what that is, don't you?)

2. CDi was the most hardcore console ever. (CDi... ah forget it. You won't understand.)

3. Playstation is a Nintendo console. (Playstation is what you call PS)

4. God of War was first released on the SNES. (You know what SNES and God of War are, don't you?)

5. Kratos is a playable character in SSBB (Super Smash Bros Brawl, just in case you do not know what SSBB means. That is expected of you anyway)

6. PSP beats the hell out of the DS every month. (I'm assuming you know what PSP and DS are).

Man, your statement about Nintendo not being hardcore is just plain dumb. I laughed so hard the first time I read that. If I ever met you in person, I would point at you as if you're some strange anomaly and laugh my guts out. Even the most hardcore and biased Sony and microsoft fanboys would laugh at you, if they ever read that comment. So just shut up. Go to wikipedia, do some research on gaming, and then come back. Gamespot is not for any Tom Dick and Harry. Gamespot, and all other gaming sites, are for people who have some semblance of gaming knowledge. That automatically excludes you.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Ever heard of a pokemone circuit? Or Shoddy? They are different "areas" where hardcore players battle and theirs one in EU, America and many other countries.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

I'm sure there is. Pokemon is a very popular game (understatement). But percentage-wise, there's just no way more people play Pokemon competitvely.

Metroid. It has hardly, if any casual appeal.

Metroid. It has hardly, if any casual appeal.

foxhound_fox

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="murat8"]well actually ive found out Pokemon has a lot of depth after i found out about EV training it adds a lot to the game. On a different note never buying the 3rd Pokemon game in a combo like Platinum its almost exactly the same as the first 2mexicangordo

Isn't EV training just stat boosting? It doesn't really add depth to the actual battles.

I'd love to be proven wrong on this "depth" issue though--I used to dig Pokemon, but I just haven't been into it recently because of this.

How about battling itself? This is another hardcore aspect of pokmon, especially switching and mind-games. Their are so many different scenarios that can happen its so important to know whats going on in a battle. Pokemon isnt your typical RPG were you level up and use your best attacks to win, theirs combos, switching, items, and the fact that your not playing a computer, you are playing a human that can perform the same combos you can and have a completely different strategy.

Theres a lot i left out but i hope thats enough to convince. :P

I don't know--it seems too much of the game is decided outside of the actual fights. There is a hint of this in competitive Brawl, obviously, counterpicking and stage banning etc., but it's not nearly as important.

I can respect that part of the game though, since there's a lot of that in competitive CCGs. That doesn't bother me nearly as much as the coin-flip luck factor. That's a killer for a competitive game.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Ever heard of a pokemone circuit? Or Shoddy? They are different "areas" where hardcore players battle and theirs one in EU, America and many other countries.

mexicangordo

I'm sure there is. Pokemon is a very popular game (understatement). But percentage-wise, there's just no way more people play Pokemon competitvely.

There are more people that play Pokemon in general, but what percentage of those people play competitively? It simply can't be higher than Smash, and your quote proves it--Only the 18-and-above play in these tournies? What about the millions and millions of kids that play the game?

Fighters lend themselves to more competitive communities. I don't have numbers, though, so I doubt this argument will go anywhere.

Most hardcore? between Zelda (although I never really find difficulty in them, maybe its because i've played pretty much all of them :P) and Metroid (although you could argue Prime 3 was made easier to satisfy a wider audience). I couldn't give this to SSBB (which I love) because the tier system is unbalanced and clone characters annoy me. Pokemon isn't even in the running for this in my eyes.

Most relevant? For me? Zelda is my favourite but the winner here is defeintaly Mario, followed by Pokemon

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

I'm sure there is. Pokemon is a very popular game (understatement). But percentage-wise, there's just no way more people play Pokemon competitvely.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

There are more people that play Pokemon in general, but what percentage of those people play competitively? It simply can't be higher than Smash, and your quote proves it--Only the 18-and-above play in these tournies? What about the millions and millions of kids that play the game?

Fighters lend themselves to more competitive communities. I don't have numbers, though, so I doubt this argument will go anywhere.

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]Ive competed more times in a SSBM tournament than a Pokemon tournament, and im telling you that their are way more competitive people who play pokemon than their is in SSB. In SSB tourny's you can find, 12, 13, 14's...ect who are good at the game (and theres nothing wrong with that) but in pokemon competition theres nothing but 18 and up, with a few exceptions.

mexicangordo

There are more people that play Pokemon in general, but what percentage of those people play competitively? It simply can't be higher than Smash, and your quote proves it--Only the 18-and-above play in these tournies? What about the millions and millions of kids that play the game?

Fighters lend themselves to more competitive communities. I don't have numbers, though, so I doubt this argument will go anywhere.

I think that has more to do with more people playing Pokemon in general, but I'll take your word for it.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

There are more people that play Pokemon in general, but what percentage of those people play competitively? It simply can't be higher than Smash, and your quote proves it--Only the 18-and-above play in these tournies? What about the millions and millions of kids that play the game?

Fighters lend themselves to more competitive communities. I don't have numbers, though, so I doubt this argument will go anywhere.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

I think that has more to do with more people playing Pokemon in general, but I'll take your word for it.

Beh! It seems like i still havn't convinced you, im sure your over this but you don't have to take my word for it. Do some snooping around and you'l see for yourself :P

mexicangordo

Well maybe I will!

*pouts*

[QUOTE="-Hells_Gate-"]Nintendo is hardcore? When? Did I miss something?khoofia_pika

First of all, I'm a cow (a Sony fanboy, I mean).

Gee, dude. When did you start playing games? Maybe you just became a gamer and read some god forsaken comments about Nintendo which were written by completely biased Nintendo haters. Nintendo is the most hardcore company ever. In fact, we can even say that Nintendo CREATED gaming. Revered series, that all developers hold in the highest regard and look up to, games that defined gaming, that inspire so many present day franchises, were created by Nintendo. Heck, Nintendo created the most revered series of all time which also has what is said to be the best game ever- The Legend of Zelda. Nintendo created Mario, which was the first platformer ever and all the new wanna be titles like Ratchet and Clank, Jak and Daxter, Banjo-Kazooie- all of them are just mere rip-offs of Mario. Nintendo created Metroid, the first hardcore game and one of the most loved series ever. Nintendo CREATED gaming, as you know it today. Nintendo introduced the concept of 3D walking. Of 3D talking. Of stories in games. Of saving your game. Nintendo developed games, for the first time, mind you, that actually lasted you more than an hour. Nintendo created the first ever fully 3D console. Nintendo created analog sticks. Nintendo revived gaming, man.

Nintendo has created one of the best consoles ever. Nintendo created NES, which can practically be called the first console ever. They developed SNES, which houses one of the best and most revered libraries of all time. Nintendo created N64, which was the first ever fully 3D console and offered us games like Super Mario 64, Ocarina of Time and Goldeneye. Nintendo created Gamecube, which houses what is considered to be the best Zelda game by many. Nintendo developed the Wii, which introduced the concept of motion gaming.

Nintendo is the most hardcore company ever. Man, your statement was as ridiculous as the statements that I'm gonna write below (assuming, of course, that you DO understand what I'm saying. You don't know a damn about gaming).

1. Virtual Boy is man's best invention. (Virtual Boy... you know what that is, don't you?)

2. CDi was the most hardcore console ever. (CDi... ah forget it. You won't understand.)

3. Playstation is a Nintendo console. (Playstation is what you call PS)

4. God of War was first released on the SNES. (You know what SNES and God of War are, don't you?)

5. Kratos is a playable character in SSBB (Super Smash Bros Brawl, just in case you do not know what SSBB means. That is expected of you anyway)

6. PSP beats the hell out of the DS every month. (I'm assuming you know what PSP and DS are).

Man, your statement about Nintendo not being hardcore is just plain dumb. I laughed so hard the first time I read that. If I ever met you in person, I would point at you as if you're some strange anomaly and laugh my guts out. Even the most hardcore and biased Sony and microsoft fanboys would laugh at you, if they ever read that comment. So just shut up. Go to wikipedia, do some research on gaming, and then come back. Gamespot is not for any Tom Dick and Harry. Gamespot, and all other gaming sites, are for people who have some semblance of gaming knowledge. That automatically excludes you.

... well, um... i am... what do i say after that? no, seriously... man, i have never seen a better anti nintendo fanboy bash, and yeah, i'm a sheep... hard to believe you're a cow any more

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Beh! It seems like i still havn't convinced you, im sure your over this but you don't have to take my word for it. Do some snooping around and you'l see for yourself :P

Tsug_Ze_Wind

Well maybe I will!

*pouts*

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Beh! It seems like i still havn't convinced you, im sure your over this but you don't have to take my word for it. Do some snooping around and you'l see for yourself :P

mexicangordo

Well maybe I will!

*pouts*

Ha! ROB eats Lucarios for breakfast and Diddys for brunch. ;) And ROB doesn't have a mouth.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

Well maybe I will!

*pouts*

Tsug_Ze_Wind

Ha! ROB eats Lucarios for breakfast and Diddys for brunch. ;) And ROB doesn't have a mouth.

I would say both Fire Emblem and Metroid since both can be unforgiving at times while aiming for a more mature audience than most other Nintendo franchises.

But does he eat Peanuts, banana's or Aura Spheres? ;)

mexicangordo

No, he feeds them to his pet gyro.

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

But does he eat Peanuts, banana's or Aura Spheres? ;)

Tsug_Ze_Wind

No, he feeds them to his pet gyro.

Ahh, your a quick one. And that made me lol, I havn't played a decent ROB in agies, I played PC one but that was before he mained ROB, still beat me with Falco, darn him.

mexicangordo

Eh, I haven't been so decent recently, but we'll see. If all else fails, I can always rely on Wolf. ;)

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Ahh, your a quick one. And that made me lol, I havn't played a decent ROB in agies, I played PC one but that was before he mained ROB, still beat me with Falco, darn him.

Tsug_Ze_Wind

Eh, I haven't been so decent recently, but we'll see. If all else fails, I can always rely on Wolf. ;)

Everyone thinks their good with wolf

mexicangordo

Difference is, I actually am. :P

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Everyone thinks their good with wolf

Tsug_Ze_Wind

Difference is, I actually am. :P

[QUOTE="Tsug_Ze_Wind"]

[QUOTE="mexicangordo"]

Everyone thinks their good with wolf

mexicangordo

Difference is, I actually am. :P

Well, hopefully I'll be on my game when we face off. :D

:shock: Geez, it is late. I have to get some sleep. Until next time, Pokemon's still too luck-based, and my ROB (and Wolf) pwns.

Metroid is the only one that is still alive and isn't stagnating.Cherokee_Jack

Metroid is the only one that sounds good with a word like hardcore.

[QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]Metroid is the only one that is still alive and isn't stagnating.khoofia_pika

[QUOTE="khoofia_pika"][QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"]Metroid is the only one that is still alive and isn't stagnating.Cherokee_Jack

Twilight Princess was just Ocarina waith a Wii control scheme slapped on

Out of those probably metroid, although F-zero is more hardcore IMO. Story mode on GX was unbelievably hard.