Why is the Wii still produced on 90nm chipsets?

The original 360 and PS3 "fat" models were all produced on 90nm chipsets, which explains their larger size and high manufacturing cost. Later, they went to 65nm, and now they are on 45nm. Meanwhile, the Wii is still on 90nm. So I am wondering, why don't they move down to 45nm transistors like PS3 and 360? Doing this will make the Wii smaller/thinner, produce less heat, consume less electricity, and cost less to manufacture. So why don't they ever do this to their consoles, while doing it happily with their handhelds (DS Lite, GBA Micro)?

Thoughts?

You know, if they made the freaking thing even smaller, you wouldn't have room to fit the game discs.

no one is really developing for old hardware... I would imagine it would cost nintendo money asking who ever makes the parts to make the chipset smaller. It probably dont cost nintendo much to make the Wii anyways.

How much smaller do you want them to make it? its only about 3 DVD cases alreadydarkspineslayer

No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.TheAcountantMan

excuse ,me wii is not dying!

with kirby pandoras tower wii play 2 zelda sws conduit 2 etc etc , ,

its here for a few more years whether you like it or not! if any thing should be dead it is the ps2

[QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.PandaBear86

It certainly is weird why they wouldn't switch. I guess that's its already small enough and runs cold enough anyway that Nintendo don't want to bother changing fabrication. Making it cheaper to make though would be a big bonus to Nintendo though... so i don't know.

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"][QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.ocstew

Making a processor smaller and cooler(and thus more reliable) can still be considered an "upgrade".

45nm is cheaper as such but requires a significant initial investment to set up. If Nintendo is planning on releasing a new console in the near future the development cost would outweigh the per-unit savings. Also bear in mind that the 360 and PS3 were also downscaled to reduce the physical size and heat production whereas the Wii has always been small and cool.

excuse ,me wii is not dying!

with kirby pandoras tower wii play 2 zelda sws conduit 2 etc etc , ,

its here for a few more years whether you like it or not! if any thing should be dead it is the ps2

mariokart64fan

The current generation is demonstrably drawing to a close whether you want it to or not. Because of Nintendo's different market focus they don't need to worry about matching the technology of the other two but this also means that they could decide to be the first without the risk the other two would face doing so. A strong software lineup does not mean that the end is not coming soon because as with any past console the Wii will have big titles coming out right up until the end. Remember that the Wii arrived at the same time as Twilight Princess. While I'm not expecting Nintendo to announce a new console this year it is by no means out of the question.

the Wii is very cheap to produce already and Nintendo make a healthy profit on it.

The Wii is small enough as it is and consumes little electricity and doesn't need downsizing.

downsizing the chip takes time and costs money.

Nintendo don't really want to bother

[QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.PandaBear86

No sense in it. It's already a compact, nifty little device. Even if it's not the most powerful machine, it's still a thing of beauty.

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"][QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.TheAcountantMan

Why waste money on developing something new when your making loads of money off the old stuff.

If Nintendo truly cared, they would have made a HD wii by now with all the money.

[QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"] Shifting to 45nm is not "upgrading", its just manufacturing it a different way.lordlors

[QUOTE="lordlors"]

[QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]

Yes, but its STILL an upgrade. :lol: Manufacturing a chip on the 45nm is an upgrade from doing it on the 90nm process. It wont give any graphical boosts (so theres no point in going 45nm) but it would be cheaper (and its cheap enough to make as it is already therers no need to be greedy now) with less heat output (upgrade), but it would take resources from Nintendos RnD team some time to develop the 45nm chip for the Wii, which is a dying platform, instead they could put that time to work on the Wii 2.

ferret-gamer

Nintendo likes retro don't ya know.

They are actually going to move to a 120nm process for the Wii2 and remove some of the higher resolutions that don't fit with their vision of a technologically backwards future.

Nintendo likes retro don't ya know.

They are actually going to move to a 120nm process for the Wii2 and remove some of the higher resolutions that don't fit with their vision of a technologically backwards future.

1080pOnly

[QUOTE="1080pOnly"]

Nintendo likes retro don't ya know.

They are actually going to move to a 120nm process for the Wii2 and remove some of the higher resolutions that don't fit with their vision of a technologically backwards future.

PandaBear86

Oh you won't be using media as such, it will come with a book of 100 gamesand a small keyboard. You'll need to type in the code, line by lineeach time you want to play.

Wow some people are defensive:| The OP is suggesting something that will SAVE Nintendo money, savings that might then be passed onto the consumers...GulliversTravel

It could possibly be more expensive to change the way that they're making it to not make it worth it. We don't really know which will save them money.

[QUOTE="darkspineslayer"]How much smaller do you want them to make it? its only about 3 DVD cases alreadyPandaBear86

[QUOTE="GulliversTravel"]Wow some people are defensive:| The OP is suggesting something that will SAVE Nintendo money, savings that might then be passed onto the consumers...cain006

It could possibly be more expensive to change the way that they're making it to not make it worth it. We don't really know which will save them money.

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"][QUOTE="darkspineslayer"]How much smaller do you want them to make it? its only about 3 DVD cases alreadyHarlockJC

Yes and that's why its not the gaming device of choice ;).

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"][QUOTE="TheAcountantMan"]No its fine, the Wii is already a dated system and a dying platform, theres no need to "upgrade it" and manufacture the chips on a 45nm process, just make a new Nintendo system with 1080p graphics.ocstew

Yeah, why explain them that it's means reducing the size of the chip to increase it's heat/power efficiency and reduce production costs? I mean that's way too technical..

Edit: But thanks for your subective view on what upgrading constitutes. I'll keep my subjective view that improving the chip is an fact an ugrade.

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"]

[QUOTE="lordlors"] How is it an upgrade if there is no technical boost? The definition of upgrade in technological terms requires that there be a boost in something technical related.

PandaBear86

Huh?
Of course it is a technical upgrade.
The term upgrade refers to the replacement of a product with a newer version of the same product. It is most often used in computing and consumer electronics, generally meaning a replacement of hardware, software or firmware with a newer or better version, in order to bring the system up to date
How do you argue against that:| ?

The 45nm process is in high production and the RnD for it in general has been done like you said, but wouldn't Nintendo have to invest money and resources into testing, q and a, analysis, getting a new production line setup so they could make chips on the 45nm process?
All that costs money and resources, that could be spent making the Wii 2 which would be a far better invesment.
Its not like theres some "90nm to 45nm converter program" where with a click of a button you can convert a 90nm chip to the 45nm process.......you do know this right?

Wouldn't that labor be better spent on working on a succesr to the Wii?
That would just be like AMD manufacturing their Phenom II chips on the 32nm process, when their new Bulldozer CPU's are right around the corner, i mean sure i do like the Phenom II series just like you like the Wii, theyre good chips(AMD), but theres NO POINT, in making it on a 32nm process, when you could focus on Bulldozer (AMDs next gen chips).
The Phenom II is a dying platform.
Just like Nintendo, the Wii is old, its out dated, why focus on a dying platform, when Nintendo could work on the Wii 2?
The Wii has had its fun in the limelight, make something new already.
Just my 0.02.

EDIT:

Here's an article on how much it cost Intel to upgrade their fab plants to make chips on the 45nm process.
Now since IBM makes the CPU and AMD makes the GPU in the Wii, wouldn't IBM and AMD/NEC/TSMC (or wherever they manufacture the GPU) have to upgrade the sectors at wherever they fab the chips at so they could manufacture chips on the 45nm process?

[QUOTE="PandaBear86"]

[QUOTE="ferret-gamer"] runs cooler and use less power? Better manufacturing is an upgrade just not on the processing power side of things.

TheAcountantMan

Huh?
Of course it is a technical upgrade.
The term upgrade refers to the replacement of a product with a newer version of the same product. It is most often used in computing and consumer electronics, generally meaning a replacement of hardware, software or firmware with a newer or better version, in order to bring the system up to date
How do you argue against that:| ?

The 45nm process is in high production and the RnD for it in general has been done like you said, but wouldn't Nintendo have to invest money and resources into testing, q and a, analysis, getting a new production line setup so they could make chips on the 45nm process?
All that costs money and resources, that could be spent making the Wii 2 which would be a far better invesment.
Its not like theres some "90nm to 45nm converter program" where with a click of a button you can convert a 90nm chip to the 45nm process.......you do know this right?

Wouldn't that labor be better spent on working on a succesr to the Wii?
That would just be like AMD manufacturing their Phenom II chips on the 32nm process, when their new Bulldozer CPU's are right around the corner, i mean sure i do like the Phenom II series just like you like the Wii, theyre good chips(AMD), but theres NO POINT, in making it on a 32nm process, when you could focus on Bulldozer (AMDs next gen chips).
The Phenom II is a dying platform.
Just like Nintendo, the Wii is old, its out dated, why focus on a dying platform, when Nintendo could work on the Wii 2?
The Wii has had its fun in the limelight, make something new already.
Just my 0.02.

EDIT:

Here's an article on how much it cost Intel to upgrade their fab plants to make chips on the 45nm process.
Now since IBM makes the CPU and AMD makes the GPU in the Wii, wouldn't IBM and AMD/NEC/TSMC (or wherever they manufacture the GPU) have to upgrade the sectors at wherever they fab the chips at so they could manufacture chips on the 45nm process?

1) I like how you make it sound like Nintendo can barely afford to spend money on R&D, testing etc for 45nm Wii chips. They are a multi-billion dollar company. They can afford R&D like you can afford a pack of bubble gum. They can afford this in addition to research on Wii 2.

2) IBM and AMD already manufacture chips on 45nm process, its just that Nintendo does not purchase them. Nintendo sells enough Wii's to justify the move to 45nm.

You know, if they made the freaking thing even smaller, you wouldn't have room to fit the game discs.

LordQuorthon

1) I never meant to make it "sound" like Nintendo "can barely afford to spend money on RnD", i just THINK it's a waste,spending 1 billion+ on switching a near dying platforms chip manufacturing process from 90nm to 40nm when the platform is near its end....it just seems like a waste, what does it accomplish ?, the platform is near its end, why try to give it more life, when Nintendo could invest in the Wii 2....switching from the 90nm to the 45nm would be whats called "a waste of money"

2 ) Yes exactly they sell enough.....why spend MORE when its not going to make a difference?
That would be diminishing returns.
"The tendency for a continuing application of effort or skill toward a particular project or goal to decline in effectiveness after a certain level of result has been achieved.

Nintendo made their millions with the Wii already, they dont need to make the chips on the 45nm process, and how many more people are going to be buying wiis to justify it?

IBM and AMD (AMD doesn't manufacture btw, they're a fabless semiconductor, they have a spin of company called Global Foundries where they make AMD chips, but i think the Hollywood gpu is fabbed by TSMC or NEC and not at globalfoundries, dont quote me on this) do already make make 45nm chips, but they're NOT the CPU or GPU in the Wii, IBM and AMD make OTHER CHIPS aswell which so happen to be 45nm, they have the tech, they just dont have Nintendos chips made on the 45nm all on stand by, Nintendo would have to PAY IBM and AMD, to develop it, which costs money, its not free incase you didnt know. Why move to the 45nm manufacturing process, when the 90nm is fine ?

Nintendo is already making loads of money as is, the system is dirt cheap to produce, and it's also outdated, it seems like a bad move to re-invest on something thats hardware is from the stone age, especially when the Wii 2 could be "right around" the corner, just because you have a billion...doesnt mean you HAVE to spend it.
Why throw away money on something pointless, when it could be used on something else ? it just seems like a moronic thing to do imo anyways.

Invest money on the Wii 2, bring it out soon, MS and Sony will follow suit, better games will be made for the new hardware, and we will all move FOWARD, instead of being at a stand still like we are now, everyone wins :D.
Invest in the 90nm to 45nm process, this generation continues for a few more years, no new hardware ????.....then what ? Would you rather play on the Wii or the Wii 2??

The Wii is small enough, it needs room for the disc anyway. If Nintendo were to come out with a smaller verson now, people will wonder (particularly that analyst Michael...) why Nintendo didnt tac on HD.

[QUOTE="cain006"]

[QUOTE="GulliversTravel"]Wow some people are defensive:| The OP is suggesting something that will SAVE Nintendo money, savings that might then be passed onto the consumers...PandaBear86

It could possibly be more expensive to change the way that they're making it to not make it worth it. We don't really know which will save them money.

They would have to change the way they make it, that costs money. I know 45mm is cheaper, but the question is whether converting will save them money at this point.

You want it to be smaller? how the hell am i gonna insert my games? Plus it would only raise the cost.

Wow some people are defensive:| The OP is suggesting something that will SAVE Nintendo money, savings that might then be passed onto the consumers...GulliversTravel

Nintendo can do nothing wrong!

The size of the processor has nothing to do with the size of the console.