Will Sakaguchi still be able to crush Final Fantasy with Lost Odyssey?

Despite Blue Dragon's score, do you believe that Sakaguchi will still live up to his word and "break [Final Fantasy games] into pieces" and "crush them at [his] feet"?

VS.

Hell naw!

Gameplay for FFXIII looks superb.

Gameplay for LO looks generic and slow... kind of like FFX.

I heard they're having troubles with the UE3.

hell no fuzzy.

i remember reading a preview of lost odyssey and it kinda confirmed this thing i was thinking about Squeenix and mistwalker.

Mistwalker feel that by recycling the outdated crap of yesteryear with brand new polish they can somehow rouse this nostalgic feeling they think gamers want. They're right about a lot of gamers to be fair.

in preview i've read of FF13 it sounds like they're speeding miles into the future with the next installment introducing a dynamic camera system, and all of this ?

It's quite a read, but for those are who interested from FF-XIII.net who collated stuff from interviews...

The battle system for Final Fantasy XIII will be very different than most other Final Fantasy games in the everlasting series. According to Kitase, he says that people will say "Is this really FF?" when they play the game. However many traditional elements will be used for battles.

Party battles will be used, although it is unsure as to how many people will take part in each party. It will most likely be three though since all of the games in the playstation era excluding FFIX and FFXI have had 3 people in the party.

Weapon exchanges can be made in the middle of battle. In the 2006 E3 trailer, we see Lightning change from gun mode to sword mode and vice versa. According to Toriyama, due to the detail done for weapons in the game, weapon transformations will be possible. So chances are these transformations will be a crucial part of the battle system.

The battles will be of Advent Children quality. If you have ever seen Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children, then you will know that each battle in the movie is spectacular. Well FFXIII will have similar types of battles, with multiple camera angles and fast paced action. If at the time of a battle you are riding a bike, you will be able to use it in battle to help defeat the monsters. Revision has been made to the ATBActive Time Battle and is now concidered a CTB Count Time Battle. The fluidity of battles will be apparent concidering that you will be able to chain you attacks one after another as if it were a constant limit break, which also means that animation for attacks will be different virtually every time you attack. To get an idea of the array of combinations you could do is that you could choose a simple 'slash' attack or a run and slash attack. Mixing magics with these attacks can also be done. It doesn't take long to see that the variety of attacks is extremely customizable.

Hey would you look at that...

Battle encounters will be handled in a similar way as FFXII in that you will actually see your enemy before entering the battle phase. Also when a battle has begun, one of the ally characters within the party will say something like "Oh! Here's and enemy"

Another nifty feature in the battle system is the Overclock Gauge. This gauge will slowly charge over the span of a battle or several battles and once fully charged a count down timer will begin, and during this time, the character currently 'overclocked' will be able to unleash more powerful attacks and abilities. The following are phases of the overclock gauge along with non-official names for them

This is equivalent to comparing Crackdown to GTA IV.. SE is a company giant with lots of $$$ to spend on their projects while Mistwalker is only starting up.. They're both taking different directions as well. FFXIII is going with this real time-ish battles system while LO is sticking with what works while adding a few twists here and there. And since FFXIII is dated for sometime late next year while LO is coming out this holiday, I don't think its a fair fight.

But I do believe Lost Odyssey will do well. Story's interesting, gameplay looks good, graphics are great for a JRPG, music sounds good thanks to some Uematsu magic. Though I'm honestly thinking it'll only get 8.0 here on GS for a number of reasons. Hopefully, TGS will change my mind..

Lost Odysseylooks much better than blue dragon but i doubt it will be better than ff 13

I have to say no. I've been saying no, and I'm sticking to it. You see, Sagaguchi hasn't directed in a long, Long time. Now, with Mistwalker, he is going backwards, bringing his old, tired Ideas to the new generation. He needs to go back to producing, if not for Square, for Mistwalker. They need to hire a New, Younger more talented Director with vision for RPG gameplay. Sagaguchi can obviously handle the story, it's all about gameplay.

I knew Blue Dragon was going to be lacking, not to the degree it is, but still, it needs to be treated as a lesson. I think Lost Odysee will garner a 7.0 Type of score, hopefully.

Now on to CRUSHING FF....that isn't even possible at this point. SE have WAY too many resources to let that happen. Look at the Xenogears to Xenosaga issue. You take Square out of the picture, and the Xeno series just lacked that extra cushion of talent, resource, and Production they would have got a SE. SE isn't perfect, but they won't let a staple like FF lack any resourse.

At this point, I'd be happy Lost Odysee is just a good game, forget FF killing.

isn't sakaguichi producing final fantasy XIII as well? or is wikipedia lying to me? (that's unbelievable!)

mm wait, no he's not. whatever. Gamespot is probably gonna flop it just because thats what they do, and they're just going to complain about one aspect of the game and bring the whole game down because of it, just like what they did about Blue Dragon. "It's story kind sucks, and the story sucks... the story isn't good, because its bad, 6"

...I seriously can't stand gamespots reviews now, good or bad.

isn't sakaguichi producing final fantasy XIII as well? or is wikipedia lying to me? (that's unbelievable!)FlawlessSeasons

Yoshinori Kitase (game producer)

i just hope people dont hype this game to be THE final fantasy killer

look what happend to blue dragon

I really don't care if he crushes the final fantasy, final fantasy is slowly killing itself cause square is running out of ways to reuse the same ideas, thats mainly why they've opted for a completely different direction with FF13 to change things up and make it fresh, they can't afford to have final fantasy fail cause its there companies legs, final fantasy fails and SE fails.

Sakaguchi mainly left SE cause they wouldn't create new ideas or more percisely they couldn't, all there main focus has to go into final fantasy and nothing else. If kingdom hearts had of failed they would have lost millions, the licenses alone for it cost them more then the game itself.

Like I said I don't want or care if he crushes the series, he needs to focus on his own titles instead of spinning this stuff, but i understand why he wants to do it, he wants his old company to get itself outside of this final fantasy main focus cause SE when capable of so much if it works outside of final fantasy (Chrono Series, Kingdom Hearts Series, Saga Series, Mana Series, etc).

Lost odyssey looks infinitely more interesting than Ffxiii... final fantasy has been going downhill fast since 8...FlockofSpagheti

not saying you're wrong or anything. Just kinda curious why you think it's more interesting. I want mass effect halo3 and alan wakei need more reasons to own a 360 than3 games.

Lost odyssey looks infinitely more interesting than Ffxiii... final fantasy has been going downhill fast since 8...FlockofSpagheti

:lol:

It really all depends on the gameplay. He needs to bring something new to the genre, and I'm not sure if he will.

My initial thought would be no, he won't be able to crush FF with LO.

I think it sad that people are not giving Mistwalker the room they need to progress. I mean Sakaguichi, Toriyama and Nobou Uematsu spear-headed the entire game with a small dev house like Artoon.

You guys don't realize that SE is the only japanese developer thatcan produce a game to the budget of Final Fantasy. 2 hours of CG animations, Exclusive music from Jpop idol, extensive marketingand high budget graphics. FFs are the only series IMO that have the production valuesof a movie.

As far as "presentation" goes no JRPGcan beat Final Fantasy. SE pours way too much money into this, but I expect little victories like LO having a better story, or more interesting cast of characters.

.

SE pours way too much money into this, but I expect little victories like LO having a better story, or more interesting cast of characters.

Blue-Sky

Well Blue dragon sure doesn't prove it.

[QUOTE="Blue-Sky"] .

SE pours way too much money into this, but I expect little victories like LO having a better story, or more interesting cast of characters.

Cedmln

Well Blue dragon sure doesn't prove it.

I think it sad that people are not giving Mistwalker the room they need to progress. I mean Sakaguichi, Toriyama and Nobou Uematsu spear-headed the entire game with a small dev house like Artoon.

You guys don't realize that SE is the only japanese developer thatcan produce a game to the budget of Final Fantasy. 2 hours of CG animations, Exclusive music from Jpop idol, extensive marketingand high budget graphics. FFs are the only series IMO that have the production valuesof a movie.

As far as "presentation" goes no JRPGcan beat Final Fantasy. SE pours way too much money into this, but I expect little victories like LO having a better story, or more interesting cast of characters.

Blue-Sky

i'm sorry but these "little victories" you speak of are things ff fans (who are mostly if not all hardcore) want most in FF. These little victories were severely lacking in Blue dragon, if you've read/watched the reviews this the the main thing the reviews utterly trash is the lack of these "little vicotories". When i first saw blue dragon and Lost odyssey i had very very high hopes. BUt the more i saw the less i was impressed. Lo looks like a tacky ps2 era bargain bin rpg with next gen graphics, dont get me started on blue dragon lol.

You describing FF like a big budget movie is accurate. In terms of depth you'll seldom find an rpg that has such a rich universe and amazing art design. The little victories must sit together with awe-inspiring art design, music, and graphics. many many many ff's have had this package.It's like Halo. A very very very great package of features that pleases a lot of people; maybe not all but many. The gameplay alone doesn't justify the sizeable number of fans. Squeenix are doing something very right.

Of course, Sakaguchi will mop the floor with Final Fantasy.

Final Fantasy X, that is.

Look at the battle system of FF12 and the promised battle system of FF13. Fluid, semi-realtime, highly cinematic.

Now look at Lost Odyssey's battle system. Achingly slow, tedious and lacking in any kind of strategy from what we've seen so far.

Actually, now I think about it, Lost Odyssey isn't even going to match up to FFX.

[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"]Lost odyssey looks infinitely more interesting than Ffxiii... final fantasy has been going downhill fast since 8...Finale-

:lol:

If anything it's going uphill. FFXII was very well recieved and it was different to previous FF games with it's battle system. FF series is one of the most respected in the industry and no one game can top it.

I really don't care if he crushes the final fantasy, final fantasy is slowly killing itself cause square is running out of ways to reuse the same ideas, thats mainly why they've opted for a completely different direction with FF13 to change things up and make it fresh, they can't afford to have final fantasy fail cause its there companies legs, final fantasy fails and SE fails.

Sakaguchi mainly left SE cause they wouldn't create new ideas or more percisely they couldn't, all there main focus has to go into final fantasy and nothing else. If kingdom hearts had of failed they would have lost millions, the licenses alone for it cost them more then the game itself.

Zenkuso

You didn't play FFXII, did you?

And now that Sakaguchi has his own company and can finally implement those new ideas you're talking about, why did reviewers say Blue Dragon is so generic? And why did reviewers say FFXII was innovative compared to its predecessors?

ok you guys say blue drang sucks so that must mean lO will suck well they have been working on LO more than they have BD and people who have seen live play of it love it but we will see come tgscody412

Also Feel PLus wasmade especially for lost odyssey and more people from final fantasy are working on it, artoon desinged blue dragon and that had many frame rate issues.

Debatable. I'm leaning towards no personally, even if LO turns out to be great, FF has a massive brand-name backing it up.

I'm still more of a Megaten fan though, personally. :P

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15020.html

Looks full of fresh ideas, it will probably re-invent the genre as we know it. Sakaguchi you are my hero!

[QUOTE="Finale-"]

[QUOTE="FlockofSpagheti"]Lost odyssey looks infinitely more interesting than Ffxiii... final fantasy has been going downhill fast since 8...Riviera_Phantom

:lol:

If anything it's going uphill. FFXII was very well recieved and it was different to previous FF games with it's battle system. FF series is one of the most respected in the industry and no one game can top it.

Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne.

(In sales, of course not. Quality? I think so)

I do like me some FF though.

its virtually impossible...this thread made me LOL...Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy,two JRPG franchises owned by square enix that can never be dethroned...blazinpuertoroc

shadow hearts dethroned dragonquest long ago .

Let me think for a minute...

20 years of some of the most amazing RPG's available on multiple consoles, or, a hit or miss RPG coming out on 360? This takes me 1, maybe 2 seconds to think about.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15020.html

Looks full of fresh ideas, it will probably re-invent the genre as we know it. Sakaguchi you are my hero!

Vyylent

im sorry i like mistwalker but that video didnt have any fresh ideas, random battles, turn based , etc.

im sure itll be a lovely experience though.

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15020.html

Looks full of fresh ideas, it will probably re-invent the genre as we know it. Sakaguchi you are my hero!

Vyylent

I dub thee, Sarcasmo. Let not your wit be lost among the rabble.

That...sucked. It reminded me of the lightning field in X except, less everything.

If this is it, then Mistwalker has a long way to go to best Final Fantasy.

[QUOTE="Vyylent"]

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/15020.html

Looks full of fresh ideas, it will probably re-invent the genre as we know it. Sakaguchi you are my hero!

benjaminbuckner

im sorry i like mistwalker but that video didnt have any fresh ideas, random battles, turn based , etc.

im sure itll be a lovely experience though.

Argh, you know what that video reminded me of?

FFIII on the DS: random enemy encounters, very basic options (attack, magic, items), turn-based command selection without indication of order of attacks, etc. You could tell just from how fast the player was jamming on the (presumably) A button to issue commands that it's not going to be very deep or very satisfying. Hopefully this is only the early game and things pick up later on, but all the videos I've seen are similar and boring battle systems can easily make/break an RPG.

FFIII on the DS: random enemy encounters, very basic options (attack, magic, items), turn-based command selection without indication of order of attacks, etc. You could tell just from how fast the player was jamming on the (presumably) A button to issue commands that it's not going to be very deep or very satisfying. Hopefully this is only the early game and things pick up later on, but all the videos I've seen are similar and boring battle systems can easily make/break an RPG. Datheron

"Lost Odyssey relies on random enemy encounters, but since there are many event-based battles, Mistwalker is reducing the number of redundant combat encounters and put more depth in each battle instead. Though there are a total of nine playable characters, you may only take a maximum of five party members into battle with you.

Lost Odyssey's battle system is turn based with some real time elements. Lost Odyssey operates on the same turn-based principles as Final Fantasy. A turn indicator in the lower left-hand corner of the screen shows the order in which the characters will attack. Certain attacks, such as a powerful magic spell, will take a bit longer to charge than a standard physical attack. During a battle, for example, Kaim was able to attack with his sword multiple times while the Sarah prepared a fiery magical assault.

There is another element in this game when a melee attack is executed, a contracting circle onscreen will appear, and pulling the right trigger at the right moment will give the damage dealt a boost.

Lost Odyssey will employ a wall system, which will require players to ensure that the front guards protect the rear. The invisible wall reduces the amount of damage your party takes, but it can be broken down. There is a gauge on the top of the battle sequences that represents how much protection the front row gives to the back row with their wall system. Enemies will also use these formations and will rely on the timing based physical attack system (mentioned above), spells, and items to breech those walls.

Magical attacks in Lost Odyssey are much more powerful than physical attacks, so sorcerers must be protected with the front line while they do their own thing. Spells are divided into White Magic, Black Magic, Spirit Magic and Composite Magic.

There are certain battles where you are able to use the objects in the area during battle. An example is shown where a crane holding a number of explosives was conveniently suspended above a mammoth black monster. After damaging the crane, the crane released its payload damaged the beast.

The Microsoft representative stated that these types of battles would occur about once an hour during normal gameplay.

It was asked if it was possible to beat the boss monsters the old fashioned way by just hacking away at the beast with swords and spells. You can, but your party must be strong enough to do so.

Another feature in Lost Odyssey's combat is during boss battles, your party members will discuss tactics manga-5tyle like a pre-battle cutscene.

Sakaguchi hinted that acquired skills will be needed to equip accessories and that obtainable skills will vary between mortals and immortals in the game.

He also said that item synthesis would be in the game and would work through combining items infused with magical powers along with a basic weapon. If you look closely at the E3 07 trailer, you can see Kaim's sword glow green. This could be an example of item synthesis.

Another element in Lost Odyssey is the ability for immortal characters to gain new skills by absorbing powers from mortal characters.

In Lost Odyssey, immortal characters don't die during fights. If Kaim or another immortal character falls in battle, he is automatically revived after a few turns. Mortal characters, however, will still need to be revived via spell or item. If the entire party is passed out at the same time, you lose the game and restart from a save point."

Just to be fair, that video posted was from the early build of the game.

no

Thanks for the info!

"Lost Odyssey relies on random enemy encounters, but since there are many event-based battles, Mistwalker is reducing the number of redundant combat encounters and put more depth in each battle instead. Though there are a total of nine playable characters, you may only take a maximum of five party members into battle with you.plainoldsam

That's a big plus for me; I've been a fan of the larger parties of older games and I was sad when the new trend seemed to focus on smaller parties.

Lost Odyssey's battle system is turn based with some real time elements. Lost Odyssey operates on the same turn-based principles as Final Fantasy. A turn indicator in the lower left-hand corner of the screen shows the order in which the characters will attack. Certain attacks, such as a powerful magic spell, will take a bit longer to charge than a standard physical attack. During a battle, for example, Kaim was able to attack with his sword multiple times while the Sarah prepared a fiery magical assault.plainoldsam

Oh, I must have missed that in the video, then, or it wasn't implmented yet. Sounds a bit like FFX's turn-based system, which isn't bad at all.

There is another element in this game when a melee attack is executed, a contracting circle onscreen will appear, and pulling the right trigger at the right moment will give the damage dealt a boost.plainoldsam

Hm, no different than, say, using the Gunblade in FFVIII or even hopping on blocks in Super Mario RPG. Still, not a bad thing.

Lost Odyssey will employ a wall system, which will require players to ensure that the front guards protect the rear. The invisible wall reduces the amount of damage your party takes, but it can be broken down. There is a gauge on the top of the battle sequences that represents how much protection the front row gives to the back row with their wall system. Enemies will also use these formations and will rely on the timing based physical attack system (mentioned above), spells, and items to breech those walls.plainoldsam

Uh, it sounds like the front/rear formation setup that's been in Final Fantasys for ages, enhanced slightly.

Magical attacks in Lost Odyssey are much more powerful than physical attacks, so sorcerers must be protected with the front line while they do their own thing. Spells are divided into White Magic, Black Magic, Spirit Magic and Composite Magic.plainoldsam

Pretty standard RPG fare.

There are certain battles where you are able to use the objects in the area during battle. An example is shown where a crane holding a number of explosives was conveniently suspended above a mammoth black monster. After damaging the crane, the crane released its payload damaged the beast.

The Microsoft representative stated that these types of battles would occur about once an hour during normal gameplay.plainoldsam

So scripted battle events, kinda like enemy monsters with multiple attack points. I'm not even sure why they bother mentioning this, it's hardly special.

It was asked if it was possible to beat the boss monsters the old fashioned way by just hacking away at the beast with swords and spells. You can, but your party must be strong enough to do so.plainoldsam

.....

A brilliant way to ask nothing and get nothing back as a response.

Another feature in Lost Odyssey's combat is during boss battles, your party members will discuss tactics manga-5tyle like a pre-battle cutscene.plainoldsam

More scripted events.

Sakaguchi hinted that acquired skills will be needed to equip accessories and that obtainable skills will vary between mortals and immortals in the game.

He also said that item synthesis would be in the game and would work through combining items infused with magical powers along with a basic weapon. If you look closely at the E3 07 trailer, you can see Kaim's sword glow green. This could be an example of item synthesis.plainoldsam

Also pretty standard RPG fare, a job system of sorts (in this case, it looks like fixed "jobs") and item combinations. The key to these systems is making sure to provide lots of interesting item combinations and to make the jobs different enough that you'd bother using a lot of their skills.

Another element in Lost Odyssey is the ability for immortal characters to gain new skills by absorbing powers from mortal characters.

In Lost Odyssey, immortal characters don't die during fights. If Kaim or another immortal character falls in battle, he is automatically revived after a few turns. Mortal characters, however, will still need to be revived via spell or item. If the entire party is passed out at the same time, you lose the game and restart from a save point."

Just to be fair, that video posted was from the early build of the game.plainoldsam

Hopefully battles will be challenging; I usually go by a standard of "if I don't grind levels, what % of my HP would a normal attack do?" Games like FFXII and (old school!) Legend of Legaia are fun partially because they're not easy - I remember in LoL enemies would easily do 30-40% of your HP in one hit, and if you're not careful you'd die in 2 turns. On the flip side, when games like Blue Dragon make the game too easy, you're just sitting there mashing the "OK" command.

------------

The verdict's still out on LO; I don't think it'll be a bad game, but with modern JRPG's you really need more than just a good story and good graphics. Players spend 1/2 their time in these JRPG's going through battles (possibly more, if you're looking for those rare end-game items), and having a boring or generic battle system means that one half of your 50-hour adventure is wasted on a pointless chore (hence the term "grinding").

Because of this I'm much more interested in Eternal Sonata, which does have a pretty interesting battle system. We'll see if LO delivers.

:lol:

No.

American websites will hate this game for one reason only, Random Encounters. I really do think the fact it has random encounters will make it ever score anything higher than a 8.0 here or ign. Meanwhile japanesse game reviewers will say its great. Personally i am enjoying blue dragon and looking forward to lost odyssey.Tactis

Yup, that pretty much spells death for Lost Odyssey. I still can't wait for it though.

The chances of Lost Odyssey killing Final Fantasy are just as good as Killzone 2 killing Halo 3, which is to say no chance in hell.whocares4peace

Pretty much...