Would Tomb raider be popular franchise if it had male protagonist?

Hello,

so my friend, I recently tried rise of tomb raider which is uncharted with crafting and female protagonist. except uncharted is lot better. when game start you are just walking in snowy mountain first then climb which is just pressing buttons. then game has magic vision which highlight objects (lol dev think once again we are stupid). anyways fast forward, many fans claim new tomb raider games are dumbed down and older version are better and offer more exploration etc.

but then i look into old TR games, and i have to say they are mediocre as well. terrible controls, terrible camera angle, terrible combat. doesnot age well. i played older TR long ago and then try to replay again and it doesnot age well.

Now thing comes to my mind that is this series only popular because lara croft is female? i mean TR was one of the first game to potray strong female protagonist and lara croft is most recognizable gaming female protagonist.

Now i ask, what if the protagonist is male? would it still be popular franchise? would it still be praised? because i personally thing it would be forgattable franchise and no one would care.

New TR games might improve controls and camera angle which i give them credit but then they replace them with on rail cinematic sequence and magic vision.

so what do you think?

lets discuss

Next Doom is gonna have a female protagonist btw.

@ghosts4ever:

Yes, and fucking go outside, sniper.

It was popular back in the days.. They just need to make the games good to be popular!

I don't think the old Tomb Raider games are bad, and I think Rise of the Tomb Raider is more fun than Uncharted 4.

It's pretty popular as it is. It even compliments Uncharted and vise versa.

The next doom should have a female protagonist.

It would also be more popular if the characters weren't so boring; not that Uncharted has any better characters, but I feel they have a bit more personality, just on a more cliche scale.

But you know what else would make it more popular? Advertising. They barely advertise compared to the Uncharted games.

@DragonfireXZ95: its already popular but what i meant it would be forgettable if protagonist were male.

I'm surprised the franchise is still around. Not complaining, but it has existed for many years now.

Anyway, you'd have Nathan Drake pretty much if that was the case. Voiced by Troy Baker.

Yes, of course it would because it would still be an excellent game.

Ironically, I enjoyed the old Tomb Raider more when it came out on Saturn and PS1 than I do the new one so eh.

No. It would immediately be compared to Uncharted and deemed to be worse imo

Yes, it's called Uncharted.

Rise of the Tomb Raider was a crap game not because the protagonist was female, it was because the game was a shitty version of Uncharted with no likeable or memorable characters and a very generic shooting mechanic that was poorly ripped from Ubisoft games

@iandizion713: dang, you beat me by 17 minutes.

uncharted is cover based shooter with platforming elements. tomb raider used to platformer game with shooting elements. there is no comparision between both until they reboot the TR franchise.

there said. i think TR has never been good.

Again, no. Your idiotic views don't reflect most gamers, sniper.

LMAO You're suggesting Tomb Raider ISNT popular.

The originals are some of the first fully 3d action adventure games, and had an huge impact on game design. Having a female character might have had some influence to young teens, but it's asine to think that alone is what made the series.

They did aged terribly, even at the time they were flawed. Mostly because hardware wasn't there yet.

As for the latest one, way better than Uncharted 4 Imo.

Have you been living under a rock? It's already popular.

If it we're a male protagonist the game would be called Womb Raider.

Yes, it would be called Uncharted also.

read again. Im saying that if it include male lead. would it be still popular as it is?

I don't think it would be as popular with a male lead. Many might call it a blatant Indiana Jones or Bandon Frazier's Mummy movies ripoff/reboot then.

There have been only 2 of the new Tomb Raider games vs 4 Uncharted games and then some. So it's understandable fans of the series feel more invested in the characters. But if someone has played neither I bet they choose Rise OT tomb raider over UC4. Unless they really love moving crates.

Yeah, it's called Uncharted

I think they would risk pissing off longtime fans by abandoning a franchise's central character. People at large groaned about Halo doing it with games without Master Chief and that was a universe I felt could be a lot more flexible in that regard. Why not just make a competing franchise with a male hero like Uncharted did? They did well for themselves. Frankly this Indiana Jones like action adventure territory is pretty locked down, something would have to be pretty incredible to gain any footing there. I'm a fan of games though that let you customize your own character, there's always that option.

like i explain above. they are different.

im talking about what if First tomb raider game in 1996 have male protagonist. it would fail and would be forgattable because series is mediocre and only popular because main character was female.

I don't read your dumb words

but I respect you doc.

The gender of the protagonist is irrelevant for a Tomb Raider type game otherwise Uncharted wouldn't have been successful, a good game is a good game.

Would Indiana Jones have been popular if the protagonist was female?

Because back in late 90s there were MUCH better games and tomb raider has never been good. when game have bad camera and controlling. it cant be consider good.

aaaaaand the irony continues, failing to realize that the imitation is the other way around. Now did the newer Tomb Raider games take notes from Uncharted when it comes to cinematic presentation? Sure it did. But it's just astounding how Drake fans want to ignore how Uncharted's thematic game design (world travelling treasure hunter, exploration, platforming, level design modeled from ancient civilizations...) is borrowed from Tomb Raider first.

And that's the nature of the media, all games take inspiration from those that came before. But to put it in proper perspective, TR was at the forefront of 3D level traversal, and one of the first (if not the very first) to implement it with acrobatic/athletic platforming as part of Lara's skill set and the games mobility design. Even before Uncharted we saw this carried into Prince of Persia, Sands of Time trilogy that added time manipulation to the formula. TR itself could be said to have taken inspiration from the earlier PoP games, and evolving that into the 3D space.

And the reason the earlier TR games weren't like Uncharted should be obvious enough; we're talking four generations ago, hailing back to PS1, N64 and Dreamcast, when 3D level environment and traversing was still in its infancy, as was creating the cinematic experience. What Uncharted delivers wasn't possible when Tomb Raider first hit the scene. Developers were only just beginning to see the potential of games telling their story with dynamic and even interactive camera work, coming out of the era of 2D level traversal and still shot illustrations, or even some pre-recorded video.

Uncharted has the benefit of entering the media when these graphical techniques were already fully developed and developers had a handle on utilization. Whereas Tomb Raider and others like Metal Gear Solid paved the way for this, both being series that took that long road to get to where newer games are today, making the mistakes and learning along the way that lead to the future innovations. You could even say that Uncharted has its beginnings from the fruits of Tomb Raider's (and other similar titles) labors.

I often hear the "Tomb Raider copied Uncharted" argument from people I suspect only began gaming last generation. But as someone who claims to be such a long time and old school gamer, I would think you could appreciate the historical relation and context between the two series, Ghosts.

The original Tomb Raider was a massively popular game, it was ground braking in many different ways. There's a reason it has spawned so many sequels and Hollywood movies (which were indeed crap as is the want of video games being turned into movies)

The guy who was largely responsible for the creation of Lara Croft (Toby Gard) originally planned on the protagonist being a man but others at Core Design were worried about it only being seen as an Indiana Jones rip off, so the protagonist became female.

if that happen. people would indeed call it indaina jones rip off. game would fail because of mediocre gameplay. and uncharted series wouldnot even exist at all.

Not sure if that would have been a good thing or not ;)

blessing in disguise? we would not have many cinematic QTE action games?

Sony would have collapsed and disappeared from the face of the earth by now. Sony owe a lot to Core Design.

Yes,see Uncharted

@ghosts4ever:

Tomb Raider earned popularity by being one of the first full 3D adventure game on PS1. It was revolutionary and in many ways, groundbreaking. I don't think it would've gotten any less popular if Lara was a man. I do think that her gender certainly helped but it wasn't the only reason why people fell for her games. Mainly because Lara's gender has zero affect on the gameplay. All you really need is weapons, medkits and agility. So when you look at it like that, it's always been an adventure game that just so happens to have a female protagonist.

If you only play a game because it has a female protagonist then I dont even know what to say...

i think you guys dont get this thread. it means tomb raider which already is mediocre series only popular because it has female protagonist. otherwise it would be forgattable.

plus both TR reboot and rise of TR are some of the worst games ever ever made. they represent everything wrong about gaming.

It wouldn't be as popular, Lara Corft a sex icon. People who haven't played games have heard of her.

Not to say the games are bad, I'd rather play them than Nathan Drakes next cutscene.

@uninspiredcup: Male ass vs female ass, huh?

this is great, how did I miss this?

Would Doom be better with a female protagonist? I vote yes!

I heard at gencon Metro's going to have an all female cast, and is also being remade into an anime dating sim.

I wonder if one day TC will be able to create a thread that's not just awkward.