The Defense of John Cena...

Day in and day out I see John Cena being torn to shreds across internet forums. I have to admit origninally when the Anit-Cena campaign started I was puzzled, I had not seen a rason as to why all of the sudden the fans were turning on him. I see myself as an impartial viewer in this spectical but at some point I came to realize that I have the knowledge of wrestling (yes, I'm pretty conceited) to show the fans what they are doing, and why it is hypocritical. Why am I doing this? Well to be honest, I feel bad. Yes I feel bad. John Cena has been everything a face Champion should be, charismatic, graceful with fans, persistent, I feel bad for the guy.

Firstly let me state before I get into this, Cena is not a bad wrestler. I repeat Cena is not a bad wrestler. Let that sink into your skulls, I'll wait... are we good? Ok, probably the most hypocritical crap I see from fans today is that John Cena does "the same old &*%$" so he sucks.  Yes, he does I'll admit that he is repetitive. Why even when I went on Wikipedia there was a paragraph on what the called John Cenas "6  Moves of Doom", it was at that point I lost it. Repetiveness has never stopped you ass-hats from cheering before? Why even the phrase "6 Moves of Doom" is stolen from the description of Bret Hart where it was firstly used to describe his extremely repetive style. At ONS the fans were chanting "same old *&%#", yet in that same match was one even more repetitive RVD. I have yet to see a Van Dam match not completed with out one Rolling Thunder, one caught heel spin kick, and a 5*. That's why Van Dam has floundered in the WWE mid-card prior to this push, his inability to adapt his style and gimmick. RVD is the epitomay of how you say "same old @#$%" the man still uses the same gimmick, pot jokes, and style of the 90's. The only reason he was pushed was aout of promotion of ECW not his years of work. Other Champions cheered who are widely known to be repetitive? Stone Cold Steve Austin, seen one match, seen them all. Now does this make these wrestlers suck? Hell no, RVD is a great wrestler to watch,I could watch hours of SCSA matches, Bret Hart is legnedary. Repetiveness should not be a basis for heat.

So I found holes in the arguement of repetiveness, but I didn't think that was the reason people hate John Cena. Personally I think that was a blanket to hide the reall reason behind. Most clear to me is that John Cena get's the most heat from teenage fans. Most mature adults and young children seem to love the guy, this is what leads me down  a two answer path. Basically I think the vast reason why Cena is hated is because he is indeed too mainstream (at least as mainstream as can be in the industry), many internet fans do something I like to call Wreslting Elitism (I cite this for heat all the time). Esentially they hate John Cena because they believe if they like him they aren't sophisticated and intelligent fans, because casual fans like him. My other reason has to do with teenage angst, rebelling from what is like by the younger crowd or the older crowds.

In closing, John Cena is not a bad wreslter, again I must reiterate that. The only fault I can find in him is the fact that he relies on cliches far too much, his Chain Gang, etc. can be percieved as lame attempts to level with the crowd. But again this is nothing new, for decades wreslters have used lame claiches to get them over, why DX is doing it right now. Take this into consideration the next time you bash the man please.

I disagree. Elitism is more of a product of the Cena hate than the root. I definitely think there are a number of marks in disguise who bash Cena to look cool, but that's more of a case of mindless kool-aid chugging than elitism.

I agree, he's nowhere near as bad in the ring as people say he is. I'm not naming him worker of the year anytime soon, but go back to 2003 and tell me the man wasn't solid at best. Hopelessly inept would be Snitsky.

I diagree that teenagers are the core of the Cena haters.  Seriously, how can you honestly expect a mature, fully aware 30 year old man to cheer for a guy who's supposed to be some half assed throwback to the whitemeat babyfaces of the 80's in THE ANTIHERO AGE? Something that seems all but designed to appeal to children and women..... and voila, he's a hit with the children and women. The countless lame jokes aren't exactly a plus, either. Moreover, let's not forget about the minorities. He already loses their support by acting "gangsta" and hardcore. Which is why the character worked so much better as a heel. He was basically Puffdaddy's **** and it was totally original. People of all races loved seeing him get slapped around for the same exact reason.

The 18 - 35 year old demographics reject Cena simply because the character has nothing to offer them, plain and simple.

I disagree. Elitism is more of a product of the Cena hate than the root. I definitely think there are a number of marks in disguise who bash Cena to look cool, but that's more of a case of mindless kool-aid chugging than elitism.

I agree, he's nowhere near as bad in the ring as people say he is. I'm not naming him worker of the year anytime soon, but go back to 2003 and tell me the man wasn't solid at best. Hopelessly inept would be Snitsky.

I diagree that teenagers are the core of the Cena haters.  Seriously, how can you honestly expect a mature, fully aware 30 year old man to cheer for a guy who's supposed to be some half assed throwback to the whitemeat babyfaces of the 80's in THE ANTIHERO AGE? Something that seems all but designed to appeal to children and women..... and voila, he's a hit with the children and women. The countless lame jokes aren't exactly a plus, either. Moreover, let's not forget about the minorities. He already loses their support by acting "gangsta" and hardcore. Which is why the character worked so much better as a heel. He was basically Puffdaddy's **** and it was totally original. People of all races loved seeing him get slapped around for the same exact reason.

The 18 - 35 year old demographics reject Cena simply because the character has nothing to offer them, plain and simple.

_Muta

I feel like Cena has been a victim of WWE's writing. They moved him to Raw from Smackdown and fueded him with a face (Jerico) who was very much over with the crowd at the time. Fine, I'll admit I was cheering for Cena because of how good of a heel Jerico was able to play. Then came Kurt Angle, one of the most respected men in wrestling. Known as one of the better submissionists in WWE. And basically they make it seem like Angle could be taken out easily.

Right there you show that you want the fans to go for Cena over a lot of people's favorites or at least respected them. But the way Creative did it wasn't all that well done sadly.

I'm just giving my perspective of why they began to dislike him. That was the main reason I began to dislike him. Plus, his championshop run was/is way to long. He should have lost at the Royal Rumble and let Edge keep the title until WM, then maybe let him win it back.

Also your point about limited moveset. Now, I personally love watching anything to do with Austin or Bret, but they had something that Cena has been lacking for a while. That presence that makes up for the moveset. They both were superb on the mic imo, had some fueds that bring back memories, and overall could be more entertaining. Cena as of late and for a while, has not. Sure, he's new and give him some time. Also, although RVD's moveset is also limited, since he is a high flying man he can entertain the crowd. When he's off the ground he certainly can put on a show.

I'm also going to add that all this aside, I find the way that he is booked to almost never lose cleanly a horrible insult to both him and the rest of WWE. I also think its actually easier to watch him when he doesn't have the WWE title and actually may be an underdog.

This is definately a thread that has raised a lot of good explanations on why Cena has lost alot of his fans.

I do agree that Cena is not nearly as bad a wrestler as the haters make him out to be.   However, the biggest reason that the "6 Moves of Doom" came about is not so much about the moves themselves, but because of their incorporation into the match.  For what felt like most of last year, there was a formula to every Cena match on Raw, no matter who or how many he was against, where he would literally get in no more offense than a few punches, get his ass handed to him for a varying amount of time depending on whether it was a squash or not, then hit a hip toss or the worst Fisherman's suplex ever, a few clotheslines, the spin-out suplex (which has regressed), 5 Knuckle Shuffle, pump up the sneakers, kick to stomach and F-U and game over.  This sequence was never countered and always lead directly to the finish during this period.

Every wrestler has signature moves, from RVD, who you rip apart, to Randy Orton, to the beloved by all Chris Benoit and Kurt Angle.  What seperates their signature moves from Cena's is incorporation.  Yeah, RVD will almost always hit a Rolling Thunder and counter a boot to the stomach with a windmill kick.  Just like most Benoit matches these days will see him bust out the Germans and the Flying Headbutt.  But, rarely, have consecutive RVD or Benoit matches matches had them used in the exact same formula and even more rarely have they lead directly to the end of the match uncountered.  And while RVD may not have changed his character over the years, he hasn't been given a character to work with in WWE, either.  He "floundered" in the midcard, not because crowds didn't take to him or the quality of his matches, but because WWE rarely let him do anything but "flounder."  And had Heyman never given him the mic and time at the first One Night Stand, I doubt they'd give him anything more to do but "flounder" in the future.  Though, that's not really the topic of this discussion.

I agree with those who said the biggest problem with Cena has been WWE Creative, but I think its really a combination of just about everything.  When he moved from Smackdown to Raw (where things went down hill), his first major feud was against a guy who has and will always have his fans in Chris Jericho.  He then moved on to Angle.  Both Y2J and Angle are two guys who are vastly respected and guys who will have their passionate fans.  This was coupled with WWE's change of Cena from "thug-life" edgy anti-hero to "Chain Gang"ing kid-friendly babyface and alot of fans point of views chaned.  In music terms, he went from MandM to Vanilla Ice, and the people who liked the former were not so keen on the latter.  Those fans became less forgiving towards Cena promos and matches and arguements made, by people like me, for a long time made more sense.  The anti-Cena fans grew in numbers, especially in the more smarky areas like New York, and made their voices heard.  Then, somewhere along the line, Anti-Cena bandwagon became as trendy as the Pro-Cena bandwagon.

Personally, I was never much of a Cena fan.  I was never a fan of the rapper gimmick and his in-ring skill didn't particularly excite me.  As a heel, I though he was great in the love to hate way and I was never converted to him as a face.  To go back to the music analogy, I hate both Eminenema and Vanilla Ice.  But with the crowd reactions he was drawing at the time, I could never deny that he should be pushed (though I thought it was a bit premature to put the WWE Title on him when they did).  These days, I've found myself defending Cena more than attacking him because alot of the criticism he draws is just down-right unwarranted.  I think there was a period during Cena's run where he got complacent and it showed, butthe big matches came around, Cena usually delivered strongly and always put the effort in (even if the haters won't give him the credit he deserves).

 Your missing out in a lot there. I'm a big Cena fan, have been ever since mid 2003, but the reason why the fans have been booing him is not just because of the "six/five moves of doom" its because his character and mentality has changed. He used to be (as dude pointed out) an anti-hero, his freestyles were quite impressive at times and most teenage and adult fans could relate to him. But then, WWE turned him into a face, and it was going really while for a while. But in an attempt to push him to the next Hulk Hogan or Stone Cold Steve Austin, they ruined his character. His hip hop mentality was replaced by...well, child-friendlyness, and as he stopped his freestyles, his mic skills got worse as well.

And you say that most of his critisism comes from teenagers, thats incorrect. The key WWE age demographic is 18 - 47, and 80% of his heel popularity (if that makes any sense) came from that demographic, and as his anti-hero personality died, so did his popularity (eventually). Its that demographic that started the "Cenahatermania".

Additionally, his in-ring skills didn't help him either. As dude said, its not the moves he used, its the formula he ued it in, which essentially made all of his matches predictable and boring. And thats coming from a Cena fan. Plus, all if his "I will fight till the lights go out" speeches didn't help either.

But, the reactions he's been getting are certainly not justifyable. I'm sure a lot of the Cena haters on this board will agree that he can wrestle very well, like his match at Wrestlemania 22 (though some will argue HHH carried that match, i personally don't think it was all him). Its just that he often doesn't wrestle to his full potential.

Lately however, he has been getting a lot of his popularity back, but the way he's been wrestling (like his match with Balls Mahoney a few weeks ago), it probably won't last for long. Though his match with RVD was pretty good.

I was playing Wrestlemania 19 today and I found my self playing with Cena. I own all the GameCube WWE games but I don't really use him in the latest game DOR2. Why...cause of the character. The guy he is now is not the guy he was then just 5 years ago.

Most hate of the rap gimmick is from people that hate rap music so there some hate right there.

But he went from. Yo yo yo and free-styling, quite good too might I add.

And today with so many hours of wrestling on tv from the WWE, no man should carry the belt for a year straight. But the argument that Batista held the title for almost a year is another topic right there. The thing is though, Batista's whole thing in the ring did not change. He was the animal and thats it. Cena just shot down after beating JBL. He went from an entertaining heel/face to same old same old. Nobody wants to see The Rock Cold Hulk Sammartino these days.

My overall point is... Cena has been terribly used. If he had better wrestlings skills, or if they hadn't portrayed him as "Superman" all year long, shoving him down our throats, he might not have had to face all of those negative crowd responses.

In my opinion, the guy should start doing some more power moves, since he's got great muscles to go with those moves, and try to impress the male demographic in his promo.

His matches lately have been getting better, but I think we owe that to his opponents, even though I've only watched his match with RVD on Raw, I'm gonna try to get my hands on the one with Balls).

I was playing Wrestlemania 19 today and I found my self playing with Cena. I own all the GameCube WWE games but I don't really use him in the latest game DOR2. Why...cause of the character. The guy he is now is not the guy he was then just 5 years ago.TheGm86

here's the thing...why push Cena when you could push Gene Snitsky?

Cena is a great wrestler IMO, many say he doesnt deserve to be a champion. But truth is, he has proven that he is (well, was) a good champion.  Making Triple H tap (you dont see that vry often).  And lets face it, the only thing why Cena lost the title its because Edge interfered in the match.  Otherwise, he would have also defeated RVD.  Yes, he may have had the title a little too long, but that just proves that he does deserve to be a champion.  I agree that he is a bit repetitive, but hey how many in the past were also repetitive?DX keeps mocking other people, Stone Cold always did the Stunner, The Rock always did the Rock Bottom and People's elbow, Bret Hart continuously did his famous Sharpshooter and people always liked it and liked them.  I believe that Cena is hated cause they want a new champion.

Cena is a great wrestler IMO, many say he doesnt deserve to be a champion. But truth is, he has proven that he is (well, was) a good champion.  Making Triple H tap (you dont see that vry often).  And lets face it, the only thing why Cena lost the title its because Edge interfered in the match.  Otherwise, he would have also defeated RVD.  Yes, he may have had the title a little too long, but that just proves that he does deserve to be a champion.  I agree that he is a bit repetitive, but hey how many in the past were also repetitive?DX keeps mocking other people, Stone Cold always did the Stunner, The Rock always did the Rock Bottom and People's elbow, Bret Hart continuously did his famous Sharpshooter and people always liked it and liked them.  I believe that Cena is hated cause they want a new champion.

-L-U-I-S-

[QUOTE="-L-U-I-S-"]

Cena is a great wrestler IMO, many say he doesnt deserve to be a champion. But truth is, he has proven that he is (well, was) a good champion.  Making Triple H tap (you dont see that vry often).  And lets face it, the only thing why Cena lost the title its because Edge interfered in the match.  Otherwise, he would have also defeated RVD.  Yes, he may have had the title a little too long, but that just proves that he does deserve to be a champion.  I agree that he is a bit repetitive, but hey how many in the past were also repetitive?DX keeps mocking other people, Stone Cold always did the Stunner, The Rock always did the Rock Bottom and People's elbow, Bret Hart continuously did his famous Sharpshooter and people always liked it and liked them.  I believe that Cena is hated cause they want a new champion.

Demonic_Jin

apparently he is the living incarnation of "Kayfabe"

i live in an area where there are a lot of hispanic wrestling fans... they all drool over him b/c of his "gangsta" gimmick... these ppl on the other hand dislike Mark Henry b/c he hurts ppl, not b/c hes the worst wrestler in the WWEToTheBank

then that means Mark Henry as a "heel" is working.

[QUOTE="TheGm86"]I was playing Wrestlemania 19 today and I found my self playing with Cena. I own all the GameCube WWE games but I don't really use him in the latest game DOR2. Why...cause of the character. The guy he is now is not the guy he was then just 5 years ago.Demonic_Jin

He's only been wrestling in WWE for 4 years

Also the basic thugonomics owns. The time is now.

John Cena sucks cuz he doesn't know the difference between a hammerlock and an armbarsephy37

[QUOTE="sephy37"]John Cena sucks cuz he doesn't know the difference between a hammerlock and an armbartrick_man01

[QUOTE="Demonic_Jin"][QUOTE="TheGm86"]I was playing Wrestlemania 19 today and I found my self playing with Cena. I own all the GameCube WWE games but I don't really use him in the latest game DOR2. Why...cause of the character. The guy he is now is not the guy he was then just 5 years ago.TheGm86

He's only been wrestling in WWE for 4 years

Also the basic thugonomics owns. The time is now.

[QUOTE="sephy37"]John Cena sucks cuz he doesn't know the difference between a hammerlock and an armbartrick_man01

it was a joke :P. i love that video.

but that really could be why he sucks.

"i can't do an armbar! then screw workrate! i'll only learn 6 moves and 3 of them will be punches, shoulderblock, and a fist drop! mwahahahahaha"

Let's see. He is white...and acts angry so he is an angry white man...and his promos go a little something like this:

I'M GONNA YELL REAL LOUD FOR NO REASON AND SAY THAT I CAN SPIT FIRE FROM EYES! I DON'T EVEN SAY YO YO YO ANYMORE! I SAY FART JUICE! AND I'M GONNA CALL KURT ANGLE A HAM SANDWICH!

That is pretty much all of Cena's promos since he came to Raw.

Seriously the only thing hip-hop related to Cena is his song.

Serously the only thing hip-hop related to cena is his song...TheGm86

and his chains, baggy pants, backwards hat, jerseys, and his whole "demeanor"

john cena needs Vanilla Ice as his manager. i would be a fan if he came out to "Ice Ice Baby" at WM 23.

[QUOTE="TheGm86"]Seriously the only thing hip-hop related to cena is his song...sephy37

and his chains, baggy pants, backwards hat, jerseys, and his whole "demeanor"

john cena needs Vanilla Ice as his manager. i would be a fan if he came out to "Ice Ice Baby" at WM 23.

He wears shorts...and he has his hat forwards to...wait does he even wear the chains anymore...Jerseys is a Jerseys and his demeanor is an angry white man...that Salutes the troops!

[QUOTE="sephy37"]

[QUOTE="TheGm86"]Seriously the only thing hip-hop related to cena is his song...TheGm86

and his chains, baggy pants, backwards hat, jerseys, and his whole "demeanor"

john cena needs Vanilla Ice as his manager. i would be a fan if he came out to "Ice Ice Baby" at WM 23.

He wears shorts...and he has his hat forwards to....Wait does he even where the chains anymore...Jerseys is a Jerseys. and his demeanor is an Angry white man...That Salutes the troops!

the salute thing is so when his movie "The Marine" comes out then he'll already have people doing the "salute"

stupid WWE movies

Yeah I know it from that....I can't wait for it to come out cause well get to see the plugs for every 3 minutes O goodie!.

I wonder if he will ever do the Throwback again!.

Yeah I know it from that....I can't wait for it to come out cause well get to see the plugs for every 3 minutes O goodie!.

I wonder if he will ever do the Throwback again!.

TheGm86

let's just hope that they don't campaign it like they did "See No Evil" where they have promos for it after it's been in the theatre for over a month and people know it sucks.

Did you miss this part?

"Angry white man gimmick (or lack of)"?

He has no gimmick so to speak. A rapper thats does not rap. Angry White Man is the closest thing to say what Cena has going on at the moment.

Edge is the Rated R Superstar.

Randy Orton is the Legend Killer.

John Cena...is just there yelling loud.

He was angry on two shows, but it was only because of the ECW stuff, normally he comes...parading out to the ring, all happy trying to get a reaction from the crowd.

And Cena is, or at least was the leader of the "Chain Gang".

john cena needs Vanilla Ice as his manager. i would be a fan if he came out to "Ice Ice Baby" at WM 23.

sephy37

Cena does love to shout into the camera, veins bulging on his forehead and neck.  I don't know if I'd call it the "angry white man" gimmick or just the "generic shout into the camera 80's wrestler promo" gimmick.  The name might need shortening to sound more catchy :p

[QUOTE="sephy37"]

john cena needs Vanilla Ice as his manager. i would be a fan if he came out to "Ice Ice Baby" at WM 23.

AcolyteV1

he can feud with MC Hammer! ratings gold!

Cena doesn't have a rap gimmick, I have to agree with the angry white man. Cena doesn't rap and he's child friendly. This a gansta rapper can't do. He's not the leader of the chaingang because he's not in jail *if you know what a real chain gang is*

I don't think HHH carried Cena at WM. Speaking of which when HHH kicked out of the FU JR made it sound like noone had done it before. Almost every Maineventer on Smackdown from 2002-2003 kicked out of the FU

Cena hasn't lost a match cleanly since...Undertaker I thinkKotenks

y'no, you could be right, i loved that match it was a great match for free TV standards and i loved Cena back then, i hate him now cos all he does is brawl until the six moves of doom, he has lost his gimmick and is annoying, and is made out to be unbeatable, he beat sabu by the STFU :|

I read it and I agree but the thing is Cena doesn't do anything except his 6 six moves in a match. Others build up to said moves before performing them so the audience knows when the match's end is coming. Cena just does those moves and nothing else so that is why he gets those chants.

...I thought my topics would add to the discussion.

Kotenks

[QUOTE="Kotenks"]

I read it and I agree but the thing is Cena doesn't do anything except his 6 six moves in a match. Others build up to said moves before performing them so the audience knows when the match's end is coming. Cena just does those moves and nothing else so that is why he gets those chants.

...I thought my topics would add to the discussion.

superman2412

To add to the "edgey/angry" being better idea, I personally have found Cena 100x more entertaining when he was briefly pissed off. When he invaded ECW and when he wanted to destroy Edge he wasn't kid friendly, if only he had that intensity in his title reign. He needs to take a page out of Kurt's book intensity wise.scoobypat

He already did that with Ruthless Aggression John Cena.

The reason we slam John Cena on forums is because most of us are fans of the greatest wrestling promotion, Ring of Honor. I'll admit I think Cena's in ring skills are lacking but I can stand the guy and if he is the champ I'm ok with it. I myself in the past have compared him to the likes of the American Dragon Bryan Danielson and Kurt Angle.

You'll find that most of the guys cheering John Cena are Women and Children. Why? Because they probably don't watch ROH. :)

I can stand him...but he isn't any Bryan Danielson.