When does it become stealing? (NOT ADVOCATING PIRACY)

As we've seen from countless threads that have come out asking how to steal games using the install feature, pirating is alive and well. Mod consoles are still present in the thousands, as are pirated games. The majority of readers get angry when they read these threads, as most of us paid our hard earned money for the games we own. However, an interesting question is raised from this: when does borrowing or renting a game cross the boundary to stealing?

 While we all get frusterated with the posters who want to borrow their friends games, and copy them on their console, we have to remeber that if this is stealing, most of us are guilty too. After all, we all trade and borrow games with our friends; it's a major social aspect of gaming. So why is it stealing to copy it and play it till you get bored and delete it different from borrowing until the friend wants it back?

 These posters also talk about renting games and copying them. We consider this terrible, as they are basically asking how to get a whole game for $5. Consider this though: most rental places buy the games like any of us do, and then charge to lend them to people, quickly making a profit. How much of this money goes to the game companies? None. Even gamstop and EB are to blame. When you go and sell a game back to Gamstop, they give you $15, then resell it for $35. this means they make a $20 profit off used games that they buy back and resell, but none of this money goes to the companies either.

 I'm not trying to advocate pirating, or stealing of games: i pay for all my games like the rest of us. However, i'm curious why so many gamespot members are getting mad at these kids who want a free game or two, when in reality they are stealing nothing in the way of profits compared to any game dealer or rental company like gamefly. thoughts?

EDIT: I understand that the disc must be in the console to play, i'm simply observing alot of posters are asking about stealing games without knowing that the disc needs to be there. the question is about why we get angry at pirates, but not at companies that steal more money then them from the companies. it is NOT a question about whether or not the disc must be in the console to play it.  

I thought you still had to put the disc in once you installed the game on your HDDxxyetixx

you do, but alot of pirates are coming out trying to find ways to steal games by getting around this safeguard. even a few posters on this site have advocated trying to just copy games, which doesn't prove their pirates, but is still the same as stealing. 

As we've seen from countless threads that have come out asking how to steal games using the install feature, pirating is alive and well. Mod consoles are still present in the thousands, as are pirated games. The majority of readers get angry when they read these threads, as most of us paid our hard earned money for the games we own. However, an interesting question is raised from this: when does borrowing or renting a game cross the boundary to stealing?

 While we all get frusterated with the posters who want to borrow their friends games, and copy them on their console, we have to remeber that if this is stealing, most of us are guilty too. After all, we all trade and borrow games with our friends; it's a major social aspect of gaming. So why is it stealing to copy it and play it till you get bored and delete it different from borrowing until the friend wants it back?

 These posters also talk about renting games and copying them. We consider this terrible, as they are basically asking how to get a whole game for $5. Consider this though: most rental places buy the games like any of us do, and then charge to lend them to people, quickly making a profit. How much of this money goes to the game companies? None. Even gamstop and EB are to blame. When you go and sell a game back to Gamstop, they give you $15, then resell it for $35. this means they make a $20 profit off used games that they buy back and resell, but none of this money goes to the companies either.

 I'm not trying to advocate pirating, or stealing of games: i pay for all my games like the rest of us. However, i'm curious why so many gamespot members are getting mad at these kids who want a free game or two, when in reality they are stealing nothing in the way of profits compared to any game dealer or rental company like gamefly. thoughts?

THE DISC HAS TO BE IN THE CONSOLE SO ITS THEFT PROOFdrummerboi43

[QUOTE="xxyetixx"]I thought you still had to put the disc in once you installed the game on your HDDAnotherMulligan

you do, but alot of pirates are coming out trying to find ways to steal games by getting around this safeguard. even a few posters on this site have advocated trying to just copy games, which doesn't prove their pirates, but is still the same as stealing. 

First of all, all blockbuster games and videos are encrpyted. I don't even think it is even possible to install a game you got from blockbusted. Even so, the xbox won't play without the disk; there are certain things that the xbox just wont install. I don't think it's possible for even the smartest hacker to figure a way around this without completely tearing apart the xbox. And even then, you void the ability to go online.

I don't think theft is something Microsoft is sweating over right now.

THE DISC HAS TO BE IN THE CONSOLE SO ITS THEFT PROOFdrummerboi43

To me it's stealing once you've created a copy or downloaded it or whatever you do to get the game without paying for it. If you borrowed it from a friend it may or may not screw the company out of a sale but I don't think it's stealing because you haven't created another copy, you've still just got the one. This is also more acceptable obviously because it's impractical to try and control that.

It may also be impractical to fight pirating but then again I don't have a clue because I don't know how much it actually screws them out of in sales.

It's just a matter of time before you can download "no cd cracks" just like on the PC, but I'm sure you will need a modded console for it to work (unlike the PC). But if you do have a modded console you can just torrent the games anyways, so it does't really matter.gregbmil

Umm... I'm sure there were people who figured that out before the NXE even came out. I knew a guy who modded his old xbox to have a bunch of old nintendo games stored on his hard drive. Obviously you can't take the xbox online after doing that. The NXE didn't change anything... It just made life easier for those who like to obey the law.

To me it's stealing once you've created a copy or downloaded it or whatever you do to get the game without paying for it. If you borrowed it from a friend it may or may not screw the company out of a sale but I don't think it's stealing because you haven't created another copy, you've still just got the one. This is also more acceptable obviously because it's impractical to try and control that.

It may also be impractical to fight pirating but then again I don't have a clue because I don't know how much it actually screws them out of in sales.

tommy7154

Well, borrowing the game from a friend is not illegal, so there is nothing wrong with it. Gamers are too sensitive about this kind of stuff

[QUOTE="gregbmil"]It's just a matter of time before you can download "no cd cracks" just like on the PC, but I'm sure you will need a modded console for it to work (unlike the PC). But if you do have a modded console you can just torrent the games anyways, so it does't really matter.Motza22

Umm... I'm sure there were people who figured that out before the NXE even came out. I knew a guy who modded his old xbox to have a bunch of old nintendo games stored on his hard drive. Obviously you can't take the xbox online after doing that. The NXE didn't change anything... It just made life easier for those who like to obey the law.

Yeah, I know read my last sentence. Also a no cd crack would of been pointless before the NXE update since they are only affective if you have the game loaded onto your hard drive

To me it's stealing once you've created a copy or downloaded it or whatever you do to get the game without paying for it. If you borrowed it from a friend it may or may not screw the company out of a sale but I don't think it's stealing because you haven't created another copy, you've still just got the one. This is also more acceptable obviously because it's impractical to try and control that.

It may also be impractical to fight pirating but then again I don't have a clue because I don't know how much it actually screws them out of in sales.

Well, borrowing the game from a friend is not illegal, so there is nothing wrong with it. Gamers are too sensitive about this kind of stuff

you can install games from blockbuster i just installed undercover today nothing is theft proofRewMe

LOL, try to play it after you return it!

[QUOTE="deimos113"][QUOTE="tommy7154"]

To me it's stealing once you've created a copy or downloaded it or whatever you do to get the game without paying for it. If you borrowed it from a friend it may or may not screw the company out of a sale but I don't think it's stealing because you haven't created another copy, you've still just got the one. This is also more acceptable obviously because it's impractical to try and control that.

It may also be impractical to fight pirating but then again I don't have a clue because I don't know how much it actually screws them out of in sales.

johnny41252

Well, borrowing the game from a friend is not illegal, so there is nothing wrong with it. Gamers are too sensitive about this kind of stuff

 It's not exactly the same thing but I know what you mean. Like I said I think the reason lending to a friend etc isn't cracked down on is because it can't be and it isn't a big enough problem.

If that wasn't true I think they would try and control that too.

I don't agree with that at all I think it's petty and ridiculous but I think they'd try. $$$

[QUOTE="tommy7154"]

To me it's stealing once you've created a copy or downloaded it or whatever you do to get the game without paying for it. If you borrowed it from a friend it may or may not screw the company out of a sale but I don't think it's stealing because you haven't created another copy, you've still just got the one. This is also more acceptable obviously because it's impractical to try and control that.

It may also be impractical to fight pirating but then again I don't have a clue because I don't know how much it actually screws them out of in sales.

deimos113

Well, borrowing the game from a friend is not illegal, so there is nothing wrong with it. Gamers are too sensitive about this kind of stuff

Thank you. While I don't advocate piracy for games in any way, publishers and developers are trying to make us feel guilty. 

Overall, October gross sales were $1.31b, equivalent to an 18% year over year improvement. Software sales were up 35% to $697m. Hardware sales were relatively flat at about 5% growth, largely due to weakness with portable players, which were down about 14%.Source.

We are in a recession and yet the industry is still growing in profits. Meanwhile, little Timmy can't buy that used copy of Super Mario Galaxy from Gamestop without developers yelling BLOODY MARY!

These threads crack me up. I surprised a lot of people didn't know about the installation feature with the new update. When they find out they immediately think they can just rent games and BAM.. own it forever.

It's stealing when your downloading it off a website somewhere and didn't pay a dime for it. If your borrowing it from a friend. It's a legit copy of the game he bought. Then its no big deal.

These threads crack me up. I surprised a lot of people didn't know about the installation feature with the new update. When they find out they immediately think they can just rent games and BAM.. own it forever.

It's stealing when your downloading it off a website somewhere and didn't pay a dime for it. If your borrowing it from a friend. It's a legit copy of the game he bought. Then its no big deal.

Childeater10

No, that's still stealing

I'm surprised at how many people don't understand what stealing means

I don't consider borrowing games to be stealing.  It was paid for and when you lend it to somebody you no longer have access to it.

I don't know how the game industry works, but in the movie rental business, companies are compensated well for rentals.  They charge more for the discs and there are rules and regulations about selling rental versions.

Trading games isn't stealing either.

You can say it screws over the developers since they don't get any money, but its not theft in any legal sense.

I don't know how the game industry works, but in the movie rental business, companies are compensated well for rentals.  They charge more for the discs and there are rules and regulations about selling rental versions.

Senor_Kami

That's completely wrong

Companies pay even less then normal retail because they buy so many disks at one time. They make their money back very quickly on even semi popular movies. They're also allowed to sell the copies they own at any time although they usually wait until they no longer get rented out a lot.

Borrowin =/= stealing.

If it was the case then anything that someone borrow would be considered stealing.. Let someone drive my car for X reason. < ---- He's stealing the car industry, even worse, he stealing gaz industry too Borrowing some milk. Stealing, Etc.

I would think that what is considered stealing is thing that are forbidden by the law. Downloading a game from torrent is againts the law. Stealing. Borrowing/giving thing is not forbidden by the law. Not stealing.

[QUOTE="Senor_Kami"]

I don't know how the game industry works, but in the movie rental business, companies are compensated well for rentals.  They charge more for the discs and there are rules and regulations about selling rental versions.

Jaysonguy

That's completely wrong

Companies pay even less then normal retail because they buy so many disks at one time. They make their money back very quickly on even semi popular movies. They're also allowed to sell the copies they own at any time although they usually wait until they no longer get rented out a lot.

[QUOTE="Senor_Kami"]

I don't know how the game industry works, but in the movie rental business, companies are compensated well for rentals.  They charge more for the discs and there are rules and regulations about selling rental versions.

Jaysonguy

That's completely wrong

Companies pay even less then normal retail because they buy so many disks at one time. They make their money back very quickly on even semi popular movies. They're also allowed to sell the copies they own at any time although they usually wait until they no longer get rented out a lot.