Yes, I'm beginning to think the real reason we don't have games with console and PC players on the same server is that console players would get raped. I've seen them play, it's pitiful.

Aragorn is right, my PC cost slightly more than a ps3 when it was released and beat the crap out of it tech wise. Kieronsp your point is moot. You're saying that consoles last 5 years and somehow PCs last less time because you upgrade them. You MAY update them, and if you do it will make your PC last PAST that 4-5 years. Consoles become obsolete at exactly the same rate, they just have no option but to stay obsolete. Lastly, for all those who have mentioned that the PC's slightly better picture is not worth the "extra money" (which is not much at most) compared to a console, you are right. HOWEVER, I know that a PC is a better system and it has diddly to do with graphics, and EVERYTHING to do with a vastly superior control scheme( and if somehow you think otherwise, we must not forget that PCs also may have controllers), a better community, better multiplayer(notably larger FPS servers), RTS games that don't suck, and most of all, the ability to turn a great game into an even better, completely different game via modding. The illustrious examples include: Mods for Rome Total War such as Rome Total Realism and Napoleonic Total War, the infinite amount of Half life mods (including mods that let you play as an RTS or BOTH and RTS and FPS at the same time!), Company of Heroes Europe in Ruins, and many, many more. Oh, and apparently MMO's are pretty popular although I think they are silly, MMO's are also a PC feature.

Well, unless consoles implement mouse and keyboard, or touchscreen, I doubt we'll be getting RTS in the future. The only workable RTS game son console are from EA right now but EA is terrible at making Competitive RTS.

Stealth 5000 To reiterate my previous point, what's the difference? None of those game you described are particularly hard to play and being better simply comes with playing more. Is "hardcore" simply a synonym with "no life", because from what I'm seeing it certainly sounds like it. Not to mention,and quite ironically, the fact that if a game is hardcore simply because there is the potential to grind or play a lot, doesn't that make games like zelda and ssb hardcore as well? In fact, any game with replayability falls under the "hardcore" you ahve described. To that point I associate "hardcore" with games that require more intelligence(strategy) or organization(world in conflict/bf2/America's army)

Frankly no consoles have hardcore games compared to PC, in Strategy or FPS. When you really think about it halo is just an echo of half-life, especially when it comes to orange box. Statistically better graphics combine with bigger server sizes (64 player FPS or 16 player RTS anyone?), and a supposedly more mature community due to socio-economics(yea yea CS I know) , and you have a much more serious community with much more potential(see the list of half life and RTW mods for details.) Strategy is a joke on console, don't even go there. I realise it getting better but we're only talking the simpler RTS's here. And then we have the truly hardcore strategy games, dominions 3 anyone?