Best: Yes.

Sta1k4r

Best how?

Foolproof: No.

Sta1k4r

No DRM is fool proof, even World of Warcraft get's pirated and played over pirate servers. But how is Steam any more effective as DRM than any other digitial distribution medium?

But I love steam and I recomend it to any interested in pc gaming.Sta1k4r

Ok, well I dislike the fact that Steam only allows me to patch through their launcher and forces me to launch games through their launcher, causes some games to have gameplay and performance issues that they otherwise wouldn't have, and causes problems modding some games or creates mod compatibility issues, but Steam does have a large collection of games and a built in chat function. Is there any reason you recomend Steam specifically over other digitial distribution mediums such as Impulse or GG?

And to think that it started with the Orange Box

Sta1k4r

So in other words you had Steam installed onto your computer out of a retail box and you've grown to love it? What if another Digital Distribution system had been installed out of that Orange Box instead?

[QUOTE="ValentineHeart"]publishers that do it because they're told by Valve that it will prevent piracy are being conned.UpInFlames

Unless you can prove that Valve does such a thing, you should drop this argument as you've already been exposed when making stuff up (you claimed that Steam takes more profits than other digital distribution outlets when it is, in fact, the opposite).

It used to be in the About section that Publishers should use Steam because it prevents piracy. They seem to have changed a bit since the last time I was there. For one they don't seem to charge for distribution anymore (they used to charge quite a bit) and they don't say in the about section that they prevent Piracy anymore (they used to, back a few months ago).

As things are I withdraw my criticism, unless I come across that claim elsewhere on their site or find an artical written by Valve about how Steam combats Piracy. Steam is still no better a tool to combat Piracy than any other digital distributer, but unless they're still claming to be I have no real criticism in the DRM area.

Anyway your logic doesn't follow, I didn't make the claim you're asserting and even if I had made that claim it wouldn't follow that I was just making stuff up. If I had made claim it could have been that I was misinformed, or that it used to be the case and things have changed, or that I was just mistaken (as you obviously are), so you're stating a Non Sequitur in response to an argument I didn't even make.

Besides, your assertion doesn't make sense considering the fact that lots of publishers use other forms of DRM (sometimes proprietary technology - Ubisoft, Rockstar) for non-Steam games. That must mean they're...conning themselves?UpInFlames

This isn't an insult, so please don't take it as one, but you used several logical fallacies in the above quote. Responding to what you said, I'd say that some DRM companies do con publishers out of money on false promises, like InSecurRom which utterly fails in every way every day on launch date without delay, or StarForce which has been useless for what seems like years, but that's all beside the point. I didn't say DRM was bad and I didn't criticize the use of DRM or say that DRM was necessarily a con. I said that Steam doesn't prevent Piracy, that Steam Exclusives are pirated On Release Date and that for Valve to use Piracy prevention as a reason to make Steam Exclusive Games is (Edit: Was) dishonest.

Edit: Several Edits, Typos, Edits to add Edit information, additional information and retraction after visiting Steam site to get a link (things have changed), punctuation error, double bracket, sentence structure, quote glitch, edited again just to make it a round number, no more typing when I've been up for 30 hours.

...Uhm....y'know what? You're trying to force me to address points that I'm not even going near AND you're accusing me of misquoting you or just being downright dishonest. I mainly did the post that way to avoid the forum rule of 5+ quote in a post can warrant a warning....but I think it's clear you actually don't have anything to say.Sheppard212

Wow for someone who doesn't have anything to say I sure have a lot to say and I sure make a lot of points don't I?

That and your shifting the blame to me and trying to be the white knight.Sheppard212

Blame you for what "White Knight"? I just clicked "Quote" and the amount of forum code you used made it impossible to follow. So there's a forum rule against using more than 5 quotes? Nice to know.

It's obvious you don't know anything about the topic or you're pretty much bashing Steam because it's not pirate proof.Sheppard212

The Topic asks if Steam is the best example to combat Piracy and I point out that Steam Games are pirated on launch date and that Valve sells it's service as "preventing piracy" to get publishers to agree to Steam exclusives. Why do you feel the need to defend Valve's corporate interests so strongly anyway? The Walmart Hive Mind infect you?

IUnless you've got actual proof that Steam is telling companies to use their "pirate-proof" platform, the idea that users will buy Steam products anyway because of their user-centric stance and discounts holds mroe than enough water for now. So we're done here, VH.Sheppard212

Look I'm sorry you're not getting this but I never said there was no reason to use steam, I said that Valve has been using the claim that Steam prevents piracy as a major selling point to publishers for awhile now, it was even on their website last time I checked, back when I played Empire Total War (they have an FAQ section or something about why you should use steam to distribute your games).

It can't be done!...mainly because there are NO points you've made at that point in time other that picking at sarcasm!Sheppard212

I know you were using obvious sarcasm, but if you actually knew the alternatives why would you have went to EA Download Manager or even asked what the alternatives were in the first place? As for me having made no points, I've made multiple points which you're choosing to ignore, like the point that Steam games are pirated on Launch Date and thus Steam is not the best example to combat PC Piracy.

I'm still skeptical of your honesty (to clarify, since you didn't gather it in your next post, I'm skeptical of your claim that you knew the alternatives, as alluded to by the above paragraph) and It's still irrelevant to my overall point. What you personally know doesn't effect the point at all.

So here I'm responding to pretty much everything you said without the use of quotes, sorry if this is hard to follow, but the above post was extremely difficult to quote.

You reduce everything to Opinion when saying Steam is Superior, and seem to want me defending Impulse. Well have you ever compared the two? In terms of how "User Friendly" they are, which was the issue, let's compare.

Steam requires you to patch games exclusively with their service, Impulse Doesn't

Steam requires you to launch games through their launcher, Impulse Doesn't

Steam causes problems running mods on a lot of games, Impulse Doesn't

Steam can take up to 15 Seconds to launch a game, Impulse Doesn't

Steam has bad patch support for some games, and there's no way to patch games manually

And Impulse has really good customer support

So even if Steam is superior (It has more games, an online chat service that notifies you when friends are online with no extra download, ect) it's still not as User Friendly, whatever your personal opinions are. Also in the above post you seem to equate Popularity with Superiority, but popular doesn't always equal better.

Edit: Finished, I think that's everything I needed to respond to, I had to keep coming back to address things I missed.

[QUOTE="ValentineHeart"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]Steam and MMO's are the best way to combat piracy.. Furthermore it by no means is as invasive or annoying as other systems out there.. ESPECIALLY when most pc gamers who are into their hobby have a broad band connection.sSubZerOo

Wrong, Steam is absolutely useless for preventing Piracy. Steam games are Pirated on launch date. Sorry.

I never said that it didn't, but it certainly curbs it..

Steam Exclusives are often pirated on release date. In terms of making it more difficult for Pirates, Steam has practically no effect. In terms of reducing piracy by ensuring simultanious world wide release dates, any digital distribution system can do that. As it stands making a game a Steam Exclusive will only ensure that it's pirated more and reaches less people than a game that uses multiple distribution systems (also including Steam, of course).

There's good reason to sell games on Steam, they have a large community so there's a large market there, but there's no reason to sell exclusively on Steam and publishers that do it because they're told by Valve that it will prevent piracy are being conned.

[QUOTE="ValentineHeart"]

[QUOTE="Sheppard212"]

But which platform for digital content is more user friendly than Steam? EA Download manager? xD

sSubZerOo

Oh gee I don't know, Impulse?

Did you seriously suggest that Direct2Drive is more user friendly?

No I cited D2D as one of the alternatives to Steam that most people don't even know about, but I cited Impulse as more User Friendly. Did you notice that I said "Oh gee I don't know, Impulse?" and not "Oh gee I don't know, Direct2Drive?"

But seriously to say Steam is better for modding than Impulse, are you freaking kidding me? Maybe with officially distributed mods but for a lot of mods on a lot of games Steam is absolutely horrible, rendering some mods unusable and creating issues with other mods. And to say Steam is better for patching, to top it off there's no alternative to the Steam patcher, and Steam's patch support for mainstream games is generally good but patch support for some games is just outright abbysmal, not to mention Steam causes problems with some games that they're slow to fix like the Arx Fatalis gamebreaker. Impulse normally has good patch support and even if it fails there are at least alternatives, which you don't get with Steam.

Also with Steam you have less control over patch versions and I'm not sure if they fixed this but last time I was on steam you couldn't even play while a patch was downloading. And when you say Game Support do you mean they have more games, or that they patch them more rapidly, or what? I'm a bit confused by that statement, because how fast they patch a game depends on the game, they do have more games, but in terms of tech support Impulse generally has excellent tech support and a really helpful community while Steam's tech support is really hit or miss, if by Game Support you mean it runs games well that would also depend on the game.

As for stoping Piracy how is Steam any more effective than any other digital distribution medium? Steam exclusives are pirated on release date so apart from ensuring a simultanious worldwide launch and giving people a way to download online (Which ANY digital distributer can do) how does it curb piracy?

[QUOTE="ValentineHeart"]

[QUOTE="Sheppard212"] I'm sorry, VH, but your argument is centered around my "ignorance", and beyond that, there isn't much else to say.kieranb2000

So let's just ignore all the other points I made then huh?

Care to cite example?

Actually even if you could, it wouldn't be the same thing. I'm obviously not going to go scouring the thread reading every single post and responding to everything I don't agree with, so in order for you to criticize me for the equivilent of what he's doing, you should cite an example of me responding to a post, and in that response you should show me ignoring the majority of the points made by claiming that a small aspect of one of the arguments is absolutely is central to all of the points being made and thus using dismissing and simultaneously ignoring all of the other points.

I'm not convinced Sheppard212 isn't just trying to save face by claiming he knew the alternatives, but even if he did know the alternatives (and I really don't buy it) that's not central to my argument.

Edit: (Had to remove one of these because it was too wordy)

I'm sorry, what? The "only reason people defend Steam"kieranb2000

I'm sorry did you miss the word "most"? As in "Most People"? Because I garuntee you most people using Steam have never even used anything else.

Gah Gamespot needs an edit button

Edit: Oh cool they have one. Didn't see that there.

I know what the alternatives are, you don't simply win by stating the obvious to my blatant sarcasm.Sheppard212

I'm skeptical, it seems more likely that you don't want to admit that you just didn't know the alternatives. Otherwise why ask what the alternatives are and name EA Download manager?

I'm sorry, VH, but your argument is centered around my "ignorance", and beyond that, there isn't much else to say.Sheppard212

So let's just ignore all the other points I made then huh?

As the poster above me said, Steam is popular because of the services it provides along with Valve's consumer-friendly business approach (see: Not charging for content addons on XBL or even on the PC).Sheppard212

Steam is hardly Customer Friendly and the only reason it's really so popular is because of the games you can get on it, and because so many people are introduced to it out of the box. If Empire: Total War had been on Impulse and the games on Steam Games were on Impulse, Impulse would be more popular.

I don't mean to say the other DD services suck, but I'm merely saying that Steam is clearly superior.Sheppard212

Superior how? Because you say so? I guess all the criticisms people levy against steam are just invalid now, Sheppard212 says it's superior.