dcps210go / Member

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An End to the System wars Debate?!?

After reading this post here is my honest opinion. Dreamcast is better true...yet to a certain degree Ps2 is better because it was supported. Also, u can't compare god of war to sword of berserk, that's like comparing something dc is good at without realtime...last time i checked, ps2 didn't have anything as good as rendering realtime in the manner of shenmue. Show me hair in shenmue done on ps2 as dreamcast did it. Also, dreamcast is simply worst true, do to lack of games. But here's the thing, Dreamcast has Ps2 quality graphics. That means the rule is highest visual possible. Ps2 with component is a AA nightmare... and til this day, nothing can mimick the power vr2...or sh4 processor. Dreamcast did not clone its namco processor that's 4 times faster than a ps2, but infact stripped it, and that's why they went bankrupt. Its a perfect copy of the arcade machine itself...they cheated basically. I can gaurantee any port of a ps2 game going to dreamcast after being released on ps2 will be better on dreamcast. Polygons isn't everything...sure ps2 will have an advantage on every category speaking for instance, d2 is blocky compared to say silent hill...however dreamcast has an advantage on games such as virtual tennis simply due to the nature of how textures on dreamcast are made. Dreamcast arcade games are simply better. Also the colors on dreamcast is better, its a fact that the colors merge correctly...til this day you can play pc games in 1340 res watevr, and you will still see the light of your ati graphics card not merge well with its lightsource. Dreamcast does that perfectly. That's due to nec's power vr2, which infact is different then the bland nvidia gen and its leading ati one...and there last mentioned is the real reason why xbox 360 outdid or is outdoing ps3 in graphics as well. Ati is sharper, yet power vr simply merged colors better. Anyone with an hdtv converter on dreamcast will see that. Hence the large hd tvs scale 640x480 to a degree, destroying the light source in the game. If you play txr2 on a sony 40 inch hdtv with vga, then with and hdmi converter you will see the black is not correctly adjusted. The streetlamps on an hdmi converter infact smear, on a stretched vga signal it is a pixel that stands out. To see this you must buy a smaller hdscreen/monitor in the range of 17 inch. Less, stretch the better...17 inches don't stretch at all from an hdmi signal. Ps2 better than dreamcast is like saying pluto is a minor planet, in the occult its infact a planet. Ps2 has exactly 0x bumpmapping (DC 2x, GC 8x, XB 4x, whilst the prev gen is not even a factor with 7million pps, that's@least 20 times more powerful than its 180 thousand polygonal predecessor the N64) or what i call vetrix simulated bump mapping, which looks good, but is made of triangles...so naturally vf4 will look great. Under a spyglass or component it will not. Ps2 is an odd one, but it does the job and has the best games in every category. I just don't think it matches Xbox 1 or Gamecube due to this circumstance, yet defeats Dreamcast simply because of data storage. Dreamcast however, can stream its data via video ram or 'unified ram' just like the 360 directly from the disc which the other consoles can not do (they load the data into the ram which then goes into the videoram). I am judging the systems via technical aspects basically (Xbox=64 megs of ram, GC 43, PS2 36, DC 24). If Xbox has more ram, GC will lose, hence xbox 360 has unified ram and this completly caught up to the ps3. The only reason why Ps2 beats dreamcast is because of this. Dreamcast simply has too low of a polygon count, bringing it in last place, naturally. Some say Dreamcast can even match gamecube in the data storage area. Even if I won't see gamecube textures via Skies of Arcadia done well anytime soon, it could be done on gamecube with two discs instead of one. All systems in the sixth gen are great, but to do what the power vr 2 does is impossible mostly if you custom build your processor to handle tnt2 type graphics before nvidia is even released. Last time I checked planets had atmosphere's and rotation (yeah, not going to test it on the hdtv upstairs since i know the results. Sony's 32 inch released a few years back (the one I broke, it was nudged it tipped the end) is the best gaming tv u can get though). Here are some pics on the internet that caught my eye:

Pics above are need for speed ps3 vs wii u, resevoir dogs wii u vs ps4, via effects and the original wii vs ps2 on cod (original video links@my troll and/or spam https://www.facebook.com/fernando.ronaldo.900 for writing drafts, extra account access for games/websites etc its always good to have an extra account or email just in case). Environment wise, even videos can't really give u a sense of resolution, framerate etc.

So here is a review displaying ps2's 'problem' in technical engineering terms. Burnout 2 is trash... https://youtu.be/JJXiyIw7vvQ here is why: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSojyt7XoMA Component on ps2 is trash. Flat textures, PC has this too. Its all do to color. However, it looks glorious on a svideo signal. Dreamcast may have this problem, if the colors are outmatched, however, I doubt c rated games by american developers like 102 dalmations, or the grinch who stole x-mas is a factor (these games have bad framerate do to the environment and camera angles, yet the vmu registers just like any game with stats, a techical marvel, that imho i think wii u stole the idea from...chicken run looks good though). The only gen where a console released before another managed to have graphically 'caught up' may infact be the xbox 360 seventh gen against the ps3, where it has always been until then in graphics terms 'genesis vs snes' (every one knows snes was 'a little' better than genesis even if genesis was faster). To know what I'm talking about you have to be aware of the difference in scaling ie xbox 360 has always been 720p..and not even god will change the fact that its not native 1080p like ps3 is. However, ps3 is nvidia architecture, and it's relatively bad for frame rate with the advantage of environments etc, this may not be good enough. For instance, games like Bad company 2 on xbox 360 are naturally better or more well built (arcadey I guess, u know without programming flaw) then ps3. Ati does better lighting and effects, however nvidia does better environments. Its hard to explain, but xbox 1's star wars battlefront looked world's better than ps2, yet it struggled with halo and what not against rogue leader. Unfortunetly, gamecube's rogue leader alone was not good enough to outmatch xbox in general (4x vs 8x bumpmapping?!?). Xbox 1 had an edge in environments and games like steel battalion showed this edge. So far every gen, has excelled over the prev gen with Wii U being an unknown or a possible equivalent basically if not for polygon count (both wii u, ps4, pc and xbox one are the same imho or they use ati graphics). Ps4 with a slight edge over the competition due to polygon count (not counting ports like warthunder) coincedentally released last. Yet, why do I say Xbox 360 is equivalent to Ps3? and not the rest? Because Ps3 has its ups, and xbox 360 counters them in a major way with polygon count. Ps3 was made for mechanics which the xbox 360 can't do however (see also uncharted 3). May spell check, correct later.

Performance of systems (from best to last):

Eighth gen

Ps4 1 billion pps (driveclub can't be outdone as of yet)

PC 785m pps

Xb1 770m pps

Wii U 550m pps (effects almost put it at xbox one pc level)

Seventh gen

Xbox360 Maximum polygon count: 500 million triangles per second (Let me explain: less data storage, no cpu/vpu processing or swapping data power ='s ps3 eg infamous movement vs halo 4 graphics details or streaming polies are just better generally speaking, many games suffer the 60fps stuttering issue..ps3 sacrifices in the fps department too)

PS3 Maximum polygon count: around 275pps peak : Ps3 introduced cpu processing instead of graphics capability, ie movement is sacrificed with AA, even though it came out later, it ended up being worst in terms of AA problems, blur and slowdown taking a toll on the cpu's framerate. However, because it was so much more powerful with a slightly faster GPU, its equal to Xbox 360.

Wii Maximum polygon count: 100m pps peak : Basically, Wii was as good as Xbox 360 in a way, yet underpowered. Wii is like the Saturn of nintendo it has some rare underground games, with AA games and hidden gems (even online too) but its going to go unnoticed.

Sixth Gen

Xbox Maximum polygon count: around 75m pps peak (xbox released doa 3, falling entropy ie leaves etc basically took out rogue squadron as a launch title imho..gamecube never really saw great fighting games but for bloody roar..er timesplitters 2 is best on this console too). If Splintercell's shadow wasn't so prevelant in the gaming industry, gamecube would be better here.

Gamecube Maximum polygon count : around 12 m pps peak (4x bumpmapping, ram, general performance outweighs ps2), via scart vga this console is infact = to xbox if not for the lack of ram, and lack of disc space in games. This puts it at second place in graphics.

PS2 Maximum polygon count : most games with particle effects are 20m pps peak, around 66 mpps : This console has a unique feature is present in every console, it has to do with the way a gpu condenses textures to save system ram. If a company does it differently, it will be different looking. For instance, Sony uses vectors, gamecube's ati uses unified ram, however's ati and nvidia concentrates on shadow rather than bumpmapping. NEC concetrates on a color ratio.

Dreamcast Maximum: 7m pps peak : as you know polies arent everything, this uses sh4 powervr series, so it texture maps from the gpu everything via 8megs ram condenses the textures better directly from the cd or gdrom basically. That means color is brighter, and merges better. Ever see SOA under the moonlit stage on Dreamcast then on Gamecube? Sure GC covers fps and polies + the effects, but dreamcast covers the color merging. No hd tv in the world can do that and neither can the latest graphics card on your pc. Ever see streamed textures on sonic adventure, then on it for Gamecube? Notice the color is not photographic? It doesn't sheem. DC though still comes in 4rth on this gen due to lack of polies and ram.

Fifth gen and prev

N64: 120k pps, ps1 370k pps, saturn 100k pps

Other

1996 CGI - Toy story 2 billion pps

Toy story 2 4 billion pps

Want more proof of the Ps4's power? Well here's more. Recently f12015 came out, and I caught this video comparison of it versus the PC and Xone. Unfortunetly, it looks like Microsoft tried to pay off the maker, and use a driveclub elemental system ie build the game a little dif. Imho, that's why the version is different than the Ps4/PC. Driveclub has differential lighting, ie a lightsource and combines this with elemental real world effects and physics. This may have to do with the ps4 processing power, that was infact tested on the ps3, or the 1billion pps markset or with technical prowess by the developer. Both systems seem to be the same in these effects. But wait, there's a catch. The difference is unnoticable. If you skip to 3:52 on this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9Qy_eZqbtU you can clearly see what the Ps4 is capable of in terms of elemental physics. It shows to be in first place, beating even its PC counter-part with Xone coming in last. Notice the lighting is a little stronger in Ps4 and dust particles heavier. Its called real world lightning alongside particle effects, ie when you turn the light reflects against say a mirror or window glass. That requires a lot of processing power, like an 8-core cpu and a lot of polies to attain 30fps. Although Xone is great, its still last place, even if the hull is lighting qualified with dust particles, its because its built differently. What's happening here is that the elements with lighting are there. On F1 2015, the elements may infact be the same. Yet the physics are still not up to par ie the elements like the shadows etc outweigh the environment or the vehicle is simply too small to navigate in. Here is an example, driveclub physics has elemental lighting on the dust and rain, fairly unseen in videogaming, and almost akin to cgi.

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Playing evolution and evolution ii on dreamcast currently.