The Point - Tabletop vs. Gaming

I like boardgames but tabletop RPG is the pinnacle of gaming. There is nothing quite as awesome.. Boardgames however could easily be replaced by video games.. The freedom and appeal and general awesomeness of tabletop RPG though.. No siree, video games can't top that.

wow I didn't know there were such in depth tabletop games :o I mostly played those with my brothers and sisters as a kid, but not much now.

And whenever I am hanging out with friends, everyone is talking about land plots, buying a car, buying a house... etc. So I wanna go home and do something fun like playing video games XD

Totally agree.

As a kid I loved tabletop games. The reason I started playing video games, was mainly because it was hard to gather enough people to enjoy a tabletop, while on video games you could have less (tabletops require usually 4 people at least to be fun). Unfortunately with the demise of couch co op, I'm extremely sad as I have nothing to play with friends in my home; don't get me wrong, I like online a lot, but everything has its place. There should be many many more split screen games, especially on something like the wii u that has so many screens (and I mean quality games, not that tech demo that Nintendo bundles with the wii u).

i have adhd,

so id rather not

Aahhh back in the day we would spend 10 hours a day around a table rolling dice and hacking foes in D&D 2nd edition, and 3rd edition, wish me n my buddies have the time now to spend countless hours playing tabletop games...

And btw anyone playing republic of rome? played once and loved it, sadly it also requires a lot of time...

I was into Warhammer for a while.. until it got too expensive..

<sigh> those were the days. I must confess I do miss tabletop gaming. It is all just gathering dust in the garage :-(

Nope. Sorry. Tabletop is too complicated. Too many stats and dice rolling. Dumbing down comes first.

Great episode, I am glad Johnny did this one, as much as I love all of Danny's output he can not say "R"pg or most "R" words without making me snigger.

i play magic the gathering. very fun and a good investment too

this sounds nice but doesn't apply to me - I have been super shy my whole life, never had any friends - I love video games and online multiplayer allows me to have fun with other people I wouldn't have had the chance to otherwise ( I don't use chat though) Its too late for me being in my late 20s, but I suppose if you have friends, table top seems cool

Hey! Thanks for the kind words about Deadlands. It's greatly appreciated, and I'm glad you and Senor Edgar Salazar had a great time in the Weird West. :)

Shane Hensley

Great episode.

F**K OFF BACK TO YOUR OWN SQUARE JOHNNY.

I joke. good show!

I would have loved tabletop gaming if not for the vagaries of the dice. I despise luck-based gameplay elements.

I also happen to be aware that rather many guidebooks for Game Masters suggest ditching the dice and making up results whenever necessary in order to keep the narrative going.

Good article Johny. I'm glad to see someone in the industry spotlight, such as yourself, is pointing out the differences between tabletop and digital gaming. My main passion has always been table top gaming, especially wargames, starting off in Warhamemer 40,000 (yes pre Relics' Dawn of War) many years ago. From there I have gone down the path of RPGs, dozens of other wargames and gone on from there. I love digital gaming, I see them as a chance to sit back and relax the brain.

But, can one really bring the two into the same world? I mean if that happens, wouldn't the line between them become irrelevant? Not every gamer out there has the mind for table top games, and vica versa. A good example would be, a while ago I was playing a MMORPG, and I did something in character of my character - this caused much outrage from a couple of my friends I was playing with at the time. I explained my choice was in character, and that concept was lost to them. After several minutes of trying to explained the concept, I eventually realized that the wall I was pounding my head against was never going to break. It was then it dawned on me, I realized a good portion of Massive Multilayer Online Role Playing Game's player base, has no clue or understanding of what a RPG actually means. Since then I've been perplexed as to way MMORPG's are called just that. Shouldn't they be called MMOAAG - Action Adventure Games - because essentially, that's what they are.

I'm an introvert that gets shy even on multiplayer online games. I'm kind of a hermit too. It would be nice to have good friends, though. lol. Sigh.

Hell yes, Netrunner!

In other news, I'm really happy to see this episode. Board games often have a depth that comes more from nuance than the complexity video games offer, both because tabletops can't automate everything and because the players need to be able to keep all the rules in their head while playing. Those constraints for the rule set lead to more creativity in design, and allow for discovery in the depth of the interactions.

Of course, my current favorite tabletop experiences, Android:Netrunner, Galaxy Trucker, and Mage Knight: The Board Game are all over-the-top complicated, so that invalidates my point a little bit, but the great Euro games like Dominion and Ticket to Ride really shine with respect to mechanical simplicity leading to strategic depth.

There are many advantages in Tabletop than Video games and vice versa.

However, I prefer to spend a little more time playing tabletop games with friends than a round in CG: GO for example. It's just more, as johnny said it, intimate.

Plus, all the noisy kids from generic board games (monopoly, game of Life, etc.) are migrating to video games, leaving tabletop a place for real civilized group of people to enjoy themselves without having to worry that someone might creep upstairs to "bang your mother".

It goes both ways, I think.

I've spent more than a few evenings playing evil fencing aristocrats in RPGs or ... trying to take over the world. I do a lot of the latter. You all should be terrified of me. Yes, I love Illuminati, Twilight Imperium, Twilight Struggle or basically anything with Twilight in the name excepting TWILIGHT.. But what I really love is crafting worlds. I've designed campaigns for GURPS where the players go on a near future globe trotting adventure in service of a Corporation and Post-Steam Punk Space Opera, where electronics were never invented. I've written essays to go along with those such as explaining why Elves are completely unequipped for any sort of scientific progress. But what I keep finding myself coming back to is this: Trying to recreate that feeling of politics and meaning and gravity from Suikoden, Final Fantasy Tactics and Tactics Ogre. I've been trying desperately to form a group for Spellbound Kingdom, with its system for fluid combat that isn't based on having the +5 Hoe of Destruction and a ingrained system for "social" combat, mass combat, and player orginisations. But there still remains the problem.

Crafting an engaging plot with a huge degree of reactivity that works within a living world of a metagame where the players can use their organisations to affect the region and "national" politics isn't really something players excel at. It needs a machine to handle the heavy lifting.

Therefore, allow me to suggest that the best of both worlds is possible: a hybrid computer/table top game. Someone needs to design an tablet app capable of running a world simulation, while allowing players and the GM to handle characterisation and the more intimate details of the plot without it devolving into NWN or VTM Redemption mp mode, where the art assets limit truly spontaneous play.

Or whatever. Just a few thoughts.

saying "tabletop vs gaming" doesnt make any sense because they are both gaming it should read "table top vs video games" lol

Now I see where you got your obsession with Mexican banda music. Arriba! arriba! andale! andale!!

If I were to start, where would I start, what is a good one to start with, also how would I do it because I don't have many friends that I feel would be willing to give it a go

Lack of time made me retire from tabletop with friends, but it still the best in my book. Must be the player's handbook.

screw yourself on twitter :p nowhere else, just twitter, you sexy thang.

great video johnny!

i also had an RPG group while ago, we used to play the hack out of D&D!

tabletop RPG's are really powerful, the way they allow us to shape our own characters. i do agree that developers should take note to it.

Honestly I think Johnny has a point here, I mean RPG's in the 80's and 90's were based largely on table top gaming ideas. Now each RPG slowly gets more and more dumbed down. Granted this is to "to let newer and newer people play them," or "due to the limited system capabilities" which is my favorite because if you take the graphics down a notch your system capabilities for more gameplay increases.... Anyway But my point being that we have gotten away from this table top gaming ideas and worked more towards the idea that each game has to be built of other gaming ideas. I love when I see a new game say they are doing stuff never done before, and I'm like I saw this in a RPG from 1993....

It has been more than a decade ago, since I played my last pen & paper session. But I agree with Johnny, that nothing can beat an afternoon in the company of your mates, while you pretend to be someone else.

I used to love playing table-top games. The closest video games ever got to mirroring the fun and camaraderie was when a bunch of us played Mario Cart and 007 on the split screen. Some of my fondest memories. With the focus on online play, I feel like this generation seems somewhat soulless.

When I saw th D12, I thought DnD!!!

Contact friends asking them to play...

Noone wants to start a pen and paper DnD campaign :(..

Oh well...

*installs Baldur's Gate 1 and 2... :P

THEY'RE TAKING THE HOBBITS TO ISENGARD!