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God Of War Ragnarok Ending The Norse Saga After Two Games Is Like The Lord Of The Rings Box Set, Barlog Says

"Being able to condense it and feel like that experience I had when I got the extended edition box set of The Lord of the Rings."

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God of War: Ragnarok is the second and final entry in Sony Santa Monica's Norse saga, and now series veteran Cory Barlog has shed some light on why the studio is planning to wrap things up with Ragnarok. Speaking to Kaptain Kuba, Barlog said there are "several reasons" for this, the first of which is that games of this size and scale simply take a very long time to make, and Barlog doesn't want the saga to drag out too long. Also in the interview, Barlog compared the God of War Norse saga to the extended edition box set of The Lord of the Rings.

"I think one of the most important reasons is the first game took five years. The second game, I don't know how long it's going to take, but I'm just going to throw out that it's going to take close to a similar time to do this. And then you think, 'Wow, a third one...' we're talking a span of close to 15 years of a single story. And I feel like that's just too stretched out. I feel like we're asking too much to say the actual completion of that story, taking that long, just feels too long," Barlog said.

"And given where the team is at and where [director Eric Williams] is at with what he wanted to do, I was like, I think we can actually do this in the second story."

From the beginning, Barlog wanted to tell a story about Kratos and Atreus--they are the "core of the story's engine," as he put it. The complexities that stem from that relationship have plenty of room to grow, but Barlog didn't want to stretch things too far.

"The complexity radiates out, like ripples in a pond. We could make it an ocean, and have those ripples just go for thousands of miles. But is that necessary and is that beneficial, or are we feeling like you know what, it's just spreading it too far apart?" Barlog said. "The ripples get too far apart and you sort of lose the plot a little bit."

Being able to condense the God of War Norse saga story into two games is similar to how you could sit down and watch all the Lord of the Rings films and feel like you were told a complete story that had a strict beginning and end.

"Being able to condense it and feel like that experience I had when I got the extended edition box set of The Lord of the Rings, and I was able to say, I can sit down and have like 13.5 hours of this experience playing them one after another back to back, and I just thought that was fantastic. Amazing," he said. "So to be able to say, you could start God of War 2018 and then play God of War Ragnarok and feel like you're getting the entirety of the story. And I kind of want that to happen before my kid is in college."

Barlog also said a two-game arc for the God of War Norse saga felt right for what Eric Williams, the new director, had in mind for the game.

While Ragnarok is the final entry in the Norse saga, Barlog said he plans to make a "big splash" with a different project as his next game, though he didn't share any details.

Ragnarok launches in 2022 for PS4 and PS5. For more, check out GameSpot's roundup of everything we know about God of War Ragnarok.

Got a news tip or want to contact us directly? Email news@gamespot.com

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DuoMaxwell007

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well if t heyre gonna end it I hope they connect it to teh previous games and explain how he got there instead of just being in a brand new world and we dont know how/why

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Nabinator

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@DuoMaxwell007: They've explained it. The minute details as to exactly how are unimportant and now utterly irrelevant to the ongoing story.

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DuoMaxwell007

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@nabinator:

lol "unimportant" Ummm you dont go to sleep in your bed then wake up in Sword Art Online, and never find out how and or why. Thats not "unimportant" thats bad/lazy writing. They could have EASILY explained it away by saying "this is a reboot" those 4 words wouldve been enough. Cause that tells us as a reboot this is just a familiar character in a brand new unconnected story/environment (as all reboots tend to be), if they didnt wanna connected the other games properly.

Also if the game did explain it then why do all the reviews say it doesnt and claim theres zero connection to the other games within? So I guess we just ALL missed it? ok

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Nabinator

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Edited By Nabinator

@DuoMaxwell007: like I said, they've explained it. Greece is geographically on the same continent as the Nordic nations, as we are assuming this is still bloody Earth. The pantheons are ruling over their own regions, as already hinted with the Egyptian gods existing in Egypt.

So, how did Kratos physically get there? I assume he got on a fucking boat or walked there. The Norse figures know about Greece, so I can only assume the Greece culture knew about the Norse. Barlog has allowed the players to fill in some gaps themselves, because he respects the audience's intelligence enough. In some cases, I guess that respect is misplaced.

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BloodborneLore

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@nabinator: Realms can be entered quite easily. No need for a Bifröst to make that possible.

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dmelissa

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@DuoMaxwell007: They do explain how and why he is in Norse lands. Go back and play the last game and pay attention to the conversations.

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cboye18

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@DuoMaxwell007: wait you mean God of War 4 doesn't explain that? Especially after the ending of God of War 3? That's just stupid...

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DuoMaxwell007

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@cboye18: if by god of war 4 you mean god of war ascension. then no... why would it explain that when it s a prequel to all the other games? Now if you mean the last God of War game on PS4/5 that Ragnarok is a sequel to then no they dont, Kratos just went from being in Greek Mythology to Norse Mythology with zero explanation of how or why. They just changed the settings and act as if the other games never happened they dont even reference them at all.

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sonic_spark

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@DuoMaxwell007 said:

@cboye18: if by god of war 4 you mean god of war ascension. then no... why would it explain that when it s a prequel to all the other games? Now if you mean the last God of War game on PS4/5 that Ragnarok is a sequel to then no they dont, Kratos just went from being in Greek Mythology to Norse Mythology with zero explanation of how or why. They just changed the settings and act as if the other games never happened they dont even reference them at all.

There is a whole sequence involving Zeus in the underworld, a key aspect of the story is Kratos not telling Atreus that he murdered gods and his whole Greek history, Mimir instantly recognizes Kratos and much of his dialogue discusses Greece, and locked in the treasury are several artifacts from other parts of the world including Greece where Kratos drinks alcohol from Greece and shares it with Atreus. And then of course, when he realizes he needs to revert to his old ways, he grabs his Blades of Chaos which was hidden in his cabin.

You couldn't be more wrong. The reason this isn't in the reviews is because these are all spoilers.

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SkyHighGam3r

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@DuoMaxwell007: They explain it, you clearly just missed it.

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DuoMaxwell007

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@skyhighgam3r: Also if the game did explain it then why do all the reviews say it doesnt and claim theres zero connection to the other games within? So I guess we just ALL missed it? ok

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SkyHighGam3r

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@DuoMaxwell007: lol this is not a constant thread about the game. But w/e, you do you I guess.

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BloodborneLore

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Edited By BloodborneLore

@DuoMaxwell007: What are you confused about? He travelled North. That’s it.

There’s plenty connection to his Greek origins as well.

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dragonsama

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Can they move on to Christian/Islamic/Jewish mythology next? I think seeing Kratos taking on God/Allah and Satan themselves would be pretty awesome.

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Nabinator

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Edited By Nabinator

@dragonsama: No, simply from a plot perspective, this wouldn't work. You need a Pantheon to pull this off, and God from the Bible is infinitely more powerful than anything in mythological pantheons. He just wills things out of existence and creates entire universes with a breath.

Also, there's a difference between religions and legend/myths. For the same reason, no one's taking on Hindi gods in a game regardless of that having many deities to play with.

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dragonsama

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@nabinator: There is a pantheon in Christian Mythology. you have Michael and the Archangels , then you also have the Saints and Jesus on God's side

Then you have the various demons of hell and and high level sinners on Satan's side.

There are tons of interesting themes that could be explored and some really epic fights and gameplay that can be done.

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BloodborneLore

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@nabinator: Kratos wouldn’t be fighting Christ though. He’d fight Behemoth, Lilith, Leviathan, Goliath, the four horsemen and the antichrist etc.

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mogan

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mogan  Moderator

@dragonsama: That seems like causing a lot of drama for little payoff. Like, they'd be doing it for attention instead of it making for a good story.

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PrpleTrtleBuBum

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@mogan: yeah its hyperbole but i can already see the next idea after that being that kratos could fight alexander the great, hitler, george bush and donald trump. that could be epic too right if written right?

yea in some games you already kill hitler or jfk or so, but they have very one-off approach to already dead historic figures. sometimes hiding it under the historic ambiguity like ezio or simple lolwut comedy

i think its good there are some offlimits things. these guys arent comedians who try to satirize religion or other world topics to cause controversy. especially if the game is part of the known gow lore so the religious gamers cant really separate it from the bunch. that kind of mock-up just taints the whole series.

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BloodborneLore

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@PrpleTrtleBuBum: Those aren’t deities though.

Satirical comedy was invented in Athens.

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BloodborneLore

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@mogan: Spoken like someone who doesn’t know the Bible, let alone the epic of Revelation. Don’t write it off just yet.

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Fandango_Letho

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@dragonsama:

It won't happen, sadly. It'll spark a social media outrage. You can't talk about modern-day religion in AAA video games.

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BloodborneLore

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Edited By BloodborneLore

@Fandango_Letho: Why not?

Social media is so splintered nowadays that everyone’s on something different and only old people go on Facebook now anyway. Let them squabble amongst themselves. That’s what the media does.

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Rolento25

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@dragonsama: God no.

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rodoxthedark

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He’s so close to being called balrog which would have made him even cooler

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BloodborneLore

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“we're talking a span of close to 15 years of a single story. And I feel like that's just too stretched out. I feel like we're asking too much to say the actual completion of that story, taking that long, just feels too long,"

~ It disgusts me to no end.. this lazy approach to honouring their own story.

It’s money at the end of the day, cashing in because they want to make smaller or shorter games. That seems needlessly rushed. It’s not like they have to give us nine realms all in one go.

"The complexity radiates out, like ripples in a pond. We could make it an ocean, and have those ripples just go for thousands of miles. But is that necessary and is that beneficial, or are we feeling like you know what, it's just spreading it too far apart?" Barlog said. "The ripples get too far apart and you sort of lose the plot a little bit."

~ On the contrary, you lose the plot by not including it. Like Atreus/Loki obtaining that Falcon suit from Freya after they make peace, allowing him to fly around which then provides you with the opportunity to have some vertical crazy level design for one of the realms. I mean, you can’t have Ragnarök without Fenrir being born first. You can’t just rush to the end and have Atreus suddenly round up all the fire giants in Muspelheim and March them at Asgard, kill Odin in some arbitrary way and be done with it. That’s just lazy.

“Being able to condense it and feel like that experience I had when I got the extended edition box set of The Lord of the Rings, and I was able to say, I can sit down and have like 13.5 hours of this experience playing them one after another back to back, and I just thought that was fantastic. Amazing," he said. "So to be able to say, you could start God of War 2018 and then play God of War Ragnarok and feel like you're getting the entirety of the story. And I kind of want that to happen before my kid is in college."

~ Ironic Error: Barlog’s comparing his two-parter to a trilogy with a beginning, middle and an end. Then he resolves back to more “my kids, my time” rhetoric when he’s not even Directing it anymore. Come on, Barlog, enough with the lethargic can’t-be-assed excuses. Atreus isn’t going to be strong enough to take Heimdall on his own and you know it. We need a Part 3.

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SkyHighGam3r

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@bloodbornelore: You lost me in this sea of nonsense when you called a 5 year development "lazy" and "rushed"

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BloodborneLore

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Edited By BloodborneLore

@skyhighgam3r: I wasn’t aware you were following. If I had known, I would have used more elementary language.

PS: Don’t you ever misquote me again.

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SkyHighGam3r

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@bloodbornelore: I accurately quoted you, it's all right there.

PS: I'll do w/e I like and you can deal with it.

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BloodborneLore

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@skyhighgam3r: I didn’t call a five year development rushed or lazy though, so making crap up doesn’t exactly work in your favour. I said it was lazy to decide to make shorter/smaller instalments. You can’t accuse people based on your lack of comprehension. Otherwise, you get called out on it. That simple. There’s just no need to get like that. :\

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Nabinator

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@bloodbornelore: all this wall of text was completely unnecessary, as you completely misunderstood what he was talking about.

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BloodborneLore

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@nabinator: I understood perfectly. He wants to make shorter/smaller games.

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JamesHetfield89

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@bloodbornelore: I think he doesn't want to spend 15 years of his and the team's lives making the same game 3 times.

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BloodborneLore

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@JamesHetfield89: He doesn’t need to if they just make Freya lend Atreus her Falcon suit so Loki can fly around some vertical level design.

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Asultana121x

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I'm hoping the next one explores Egyptian Mythology although I heard it may be Celtic Mythology.

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BloodborneLore

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@asultana121x: Egyptian after Norse then it will be either Celtic or Japanese, if plans haven’t changed.

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kutraz

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@asultana121x: I doubt they would end this early to start a different Kratos storyline. But if it does happen, I hope he isn't a father in the next one. I didn't care for the relationships between the two, felt like they wanted to make it clear it was a different game. It's like a batman and robin situation.

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Brandonks

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I can't imagine this was the plan from the beginning. 2018 Gow just scraped the surface of Norse lore, this 2nd game has a LOT of work to do. Also doesn't seem like atreus will get much more arc if he's just barely older in this version.

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waltdawg443

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@brandonks: Totally agreed. My biggest gripe with the last game is that they barely dug into the depths of Norse mythology. Sure we heard a lot of stories from Mimir, but that's not the same as actually playing thru or seeing this stuff. And considering how many gods and mythological creatures there are in Norse lore, it felt like they skimped on it by only introducing us to a small handful.

For them to wrap up this storyline in only one more game means they're either gonna have to leave out a hell of a lot, or they're gonna need to make the most epic all-encompassing Norse game of all time. It pains me to say it, but my money is on the former.

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BloodborneLore

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There’s no way they can give us a proper Ragnarök then because Angrbrodr is just way too young to be giving birth to a colossal wolf. Helheim also can’t adapt into it’s final form without Hel there. The timeline needs more time to develop. Fans don’t want to see another neutered Ragnarök.

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videogameninja

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I know there are a lot out there who are worried that this whole Norse mythology saga in the GOW franchise can't possibly be wrapped up in a nice neat bow in just one more installment but I'm going to give Santa Monica Studios the benefit of the doubt.

As long as the game is not overtly bloated or the opposite (just trying to cram as much in as possible.) I think it's totally doable that they can tell a complete and compelling tale that leaves a sense of satisfaction at its conclusion.

I will say this, the team really does have its work cut out for them. 2018's GOW felt like a big enough game yet anyone could tell as those credits rolled that there was so much more yet to be explored by ways of the story.

Personally, I can't wait for GOW 5 to drop and more importantly I'm wondering what Kratos is going to be calling his son in the game. 😉

-YOUNG MAN!!!!! NINJA APPROVED-

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BloodborneLore

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Edited By BloodborneLore

@videogameninja: It won’t be anywhere near as satisfactory or as epical as Ragnarök by only including half the battles and characters that should be involved.

GOW 2018 was fantastic but no way was it big enough. Helheim had no ice palaces with snake venom dripping off the ceilings, home to wretched necromancers, and Niflheim was a rushed labyrinth section. Each realm would have and could have had it’s own Lake of Nine, considering we can literally see Muspelheim’s lava-lake of nine below but can never get to it.

He’ll call his son, Atreus, after the Spartan general he’s named after. As well as “BOY!” because who doesn’t love that?

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kutraz

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I need to see more gore and killing of gods in this next one. If this is it, there should be a jump in time where you first kill Odin, and Atreus comes after you because of "family". All this ending with Kratos also killing his kid. I mean, let's not forget god of war is about tragedy, I would hate for them two to ride off into the sunset with a happy ending.

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Nasuke1

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@kutraz: The Jötunn predicted the death of Kratos, so... I would not think they're getting a happy ending.

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kutraz

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@Nasuke1: That would be cool, and have Atreus kill him and get ash all over his body. And swear revenge against the world

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BloodborneLore

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@kutraz: Not if square button isn’t even a character switch button yet. He needs his own acrobatic move set and skill tree before he can have his own game.

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kutraz

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@bloodbornelore: I honestly was never a fan of the father/son dynamic. These games have always been about combat and great boss battles. To me, it felt like they needed to make sure players saw this as a new game. Adding a sidekick makes it pretty clear, even if it feels forced.

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Zaryia

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And in the next game he goes after Jesus right?

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BloodborneLore

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@zaryia: You’re not far off. He goes after Horus (edit: actually I think they might be allies).

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s1taz4a3l

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@zaryia: Nah, next one shit gets real with the holy trinity, buddha jesus and allah is an epic free for all royale, winners takes the whole world!!!

Blood for the blood god!!!!

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