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The Personal Moment That Changed My Mind About Red Dead Redemption 2

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The best part of the Old West is hanging out with other outlaws.

While playing the first handful of hours of Red Dead Redemption 2, I was coming to terms with kinda sorta...hating it. Rockstar's sprawling western just wasn't for me. It was too plodding, too deliberate, too time-consuming, and too dull. So many of the game's systems seemed designed deliberately to keep you from having fun while playing it. No matter how much I liked the original Red Dead Redemption--a game I'd fully completed in 2010, despite a lot of the same sorts of issues--I was getting ready to let the sequel ride off into the sunset that is deleting it off my PS4 hard drive.

Then I hit one of the game's best scenes (at least, so far), and it significantly changed my mind.

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It's not exactly an easy task to get to that scene if you're already at odds with the game's pace. It comes in Chapter 2, after you have gone through quite a few tutorial missions, learning about brushing horses, tracking and hunting game through the wilderness, and improving camp. Red Dead 2's story isn't in any particular hurry to pull you along, but eventually you spend time with all of the Van der Linde gang's characters, and hanging around with them starts to become the story in itself. One mission sees you and your comrades mounting a rescue mission to save Sean, an outlaw pal who was captured by bounty hunters off-screen in the earlier Blackwater job that happens before the game's start.

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It's not the mission to save Sean that turned the corner for Red Dead 2. That's another of those "fight a bunch of guys" missions common to video games, where you gun down a small army while ducking behind trees and random bits of wood to hide incoming fire. Red Dead 2's gunplay isn't especially engaging most of the time; leaving the game's sticky aim assist on basically does the work for you, but turning it off makes picking out targets finicky and difficult. But the gang and I managed to clear out the bounty hunters holding Sean and secure his release, safe and sound.

One evening not long after rescuing Sean, I returned to camp to find everyone in good spirits. Dutch, the gang's leader, declared Sean's return a major victory, and before long, a full-blown party started. Scattered groups of people in the gang started pounding whiskey, singing, dancing, and conversing. The camp came alive as the characters cut loose and had a rare bit of fun.

The party scene is, so far, my favorite thing that's happened in Red Dead 2. You can wander around, sitting by campfires and joining in as other members of the gang sing songs, to which protagonist Arthur doesn't always know all the words. You can ask one of the women of the gang for a dance, and somewhat clumsily sway with her, or offer a quick dip. You can listen to a variety of interactions, including Sean drunkenly trying to convince one of the camp's women, Karen, that he's in love with her--and then to their tryst in a tent, where both break down in whiskey driven tears. It's a moment that's both heartfelt and hilarious, especially when Sean stumbles back out of the tent afterward and playfully calls Arthur a creep.

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The party lasts through the night, and while there's not a particularly large amount to actually do from a gameplay standpoint, it's one of the better moments in Red Dead 2 because it takes advantage of what's great about the game: its characters. You spend the party just learning about the people who make up the gang, and time spent with them deepens the story moments and conversations that come later.

It's nice, too, that for as much shooting and stabbing as you do in Red Dead 2, there are ways to interact with its world that don't come at the end of a gun barrel. The games industry is full of triple-A titles that have huge, beautiful, imaginative worlds, but your only way of taking part in those worlds is to kill the stuff within them. For all that imagination, the reality of what games offer is usually pretty narrow: kill, or be killed. In Red Dead 2, there are at least these other opportunities, where interacting with characters is as rewarding as sticking them up or gunning them down.

Video games as a medium often still struggle in trying to tell compelling stories, specifically focusing on plot and action while relegating character development and worldbuilding to collectible notes and audio logs. Games often feel like their creators fear that if players aren't constantly running from one battle to the next, they'll stop playing altogether--there's no time to waste on populating many games with people, even though the people within them are what make humans so interested in stories in the first place.

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Red Dead 2 isn't afraid to let you stop and just spend time with its characters. The party scene has no real gameplay loop, there's no achievement or trophy tied to it, and you can basically set your controller down for most of it. Red Dead 2's confidence in its characters is such that the game is okay with you not playing for a bit, but instead just being there, in that moment it's trying to create for you. Rockstar's willingness to try to leave you in moments like that is refreshing, because so many games and developers aren't. When other developers are looking at Red Dead 2's success, I hope that's the lesson they take from it.

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philhornshaw

Phil Hornshaw

Phil Hornshaw is a former senior writer at GameSpot and worked as a journalist for newspapers and websites for more than a decade, covering video games, technology, and entertainment for nearly that long. A freelancer before he joined the GameSpot team as an editor out of Los Angeles, his work appeared at Playboy, IGN, Kotaku, Complex, Polygon, TheWrap, Digital Trends, The Escapist, GameFront, and The Huffington Post. Outside the realm of games, he's the co-author of So You Created a Wormhole: The Time Traveler's Guide to Time Travel and The Space Hero's Guide to Glory. If he's not writing about video games, he's probably doing a deep dive into game lore.

Red Dead Redemption 2

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m_nay2008

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Amazing video and article ?

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Capt_ireland

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Good story driven games are going to die as the average intelligence levels continue to drop. Also the average attention span in the USA today is less than a goldfish!

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gruoch1

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Edited By gruoch1

I wish I had spent more time interacting with others during the party. Instead I spent the whole time trying to see how drunk I could get... cowboy life is hard.

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nomadski69

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I get its pace won't be for everyone, but the world is so nuanced I can't help drinking all the immersion the game gives me. It's the first open world game I feel like a character in, rather than just the sole driver in it.

I know many won't agree, but I think it's a masterpiece.

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spiddyman007

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Man. I played a lot of red dead 2 but I guess my brother did the Sean mission because I didn’t get to play it but oh well

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Pyrosa

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I despise the controls, more than any game since... well, RDR1.

I've tweaked, tuned, etc., but absolutely nothing makes these one-off controls acceptable. The game is a marvel to behold on XOX. The fact that they're not in "yet another boring desert" is amazing. But just the act of riding the horse, dealing with equipment, and even searching is just atrocious every single session. It's not a hard game, yet it's a chore.

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Pyrosa

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@Pyrosa: To say it another way, all they'd have to do is add proper analog stick support and button remapping, and this would push GOW out of GOTY for me.

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PeRsPeCtIvE-1998

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Edited By PeRsPeCtIvE-1998

Sooooo 1 scene made the you think differently even though the core mechanics of the game you don't like..... makes perfect sense

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Vodoo

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If you just came from playing Spiderman, like I did, this game feels like it's moving backwards in comparison, lol.

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Wendopolis_Bruh

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@Vodoo: Yeah, it's SUPER SLOW for the first 5 hours. I had to mentally slow-down and get the pace. After that, I found the slower pace better for numerous reasons. Also, if you like westerns in any capacity, you'd understand it easier.

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phrozac

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@Vodoo: Even worse. I spent 200+ hrs playing AC Odyssey where Alexios can fleece an entire public market of its valuables in about 10 seconds flat. I'd be ok with RDR2's sluggish and overly complicated systems if I could completely loot a wooden shack in less than a minute.

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VakarianGirl

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@Vodoo: As much as I hate to say it - you are right in certain ways. I came on to this game from playing Shadow of the Tomb Raider - LOL!

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Fandango_Letho

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A silly scene made you change your mind on this masterpiece, which you found dull and boring? Lol ok.

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Pyrosa

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@Fandango_Letho: The game is largely dull and boring, yes. All the dialogue, writing, visual aspects are amazing, but this gameplay in between is like putting up with sitting at the DMV for a half-day before going to a 5-star film.

Open-world games only "work" when the controls are fluid and effortless.

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Wendopolis_Bruh

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@Pyrosa: Totally agree.

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Fandango_Letho

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@Pyrosa:

I agree that the controls are clunky, limited by the heavy motion-capture of every animations. Open world games, though, only work when the controls are fluid and effortless? This is where I disagree. Red Dead 2 is a game that asks you to take your time and smell the flowers. And gameplay-wise, I personnaly like how powerful the gunplay can be ( once you fiddle with the free-aim ). How you can cock and hold the bolt of your gun for dramatic effect. How every shot has to count.

And there's a lot of open worlds out there who throw out the finesse of animations for fluidity and aren't really better for it. Look at AC Odyssey, the protagonists are terribly animated and look constipated when they run. To me, this kinda break the immersion of being in a living, breathing world.

I think Red Dead 2 is the best open world we've had yet, because of how believable it is and how it doesn't hold your hand. And this lack of hand-holding is extremely welcome in this day and age.

Anyways, I respect your opinion, I was just stating mine for fun.

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phrozac

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@Fandango_Letho: Completely disagree about your perception of AC Od's anims. I think they're superb, and I'm an animator. If you look, you'll see that the player run cycle for both games shows a wider stance when you begin running to show the effort of accelerating. And then there's the parkour. Nothing like that in RDR2.

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Fandango_Letho

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Edited By Fandango_Letho

@phrozac: Nothing like that? You mean the parkour? Considering that there were about 10 other main-stream AC games to improve upon, the animations are at the bare minimum. Even Origins had better walk/run animations and Bayek's movement was different in the sand. Characters in Odyssey seems to have a pole up their behind when they run. The running ''cycle'' you mention are in most AAA action-adventure games, even in RDR2.

Which brings me to ask you, have you played RDR2? I don't think you did. It's so, so far ahead of anything we've had before. From picking up herbs, to skinning an animal, to properly cocking a gun, to using a fishing rod.This game is beyond anything AC could ever dream to be anim-wise. If you call AC Odyssey's animations superb, then look at the posture of your character during horse riding and how your character's feet are everywhere when you fight. They lowered the quality of animations to ease their job while ensuring faster movement and input responses, unlike RDR2's animations which have to be committed to.

Anyways, I don't think we'll convince each other so let's leave it at that. I'm glad you enjoy AC Odyssey, you'll have a big game on your hands.

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Croxus

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Edited By Croxus

So when the game feels very boring and repetitive, leave your controller down, cause its so scripted, that nothing significant that demands yr attentions happens...

Most hyped up game of decade!

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hosedandhappy

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I'm pretty sure you can do the Sean mission before any of the other tutorial stuff. I know for sure I couldn't brush a horse until well after I rescued Sean.

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FkzAz

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The thing that i like the most about this game, is the fact that there isn't anything like it on the market. By far and by a long margin.

If it was Gone Home or it was an indie game and this was 5 years ago...we wold totaly see a hipster me much....

If it is AC, it's because it lakcs depth...if it is RDR2 it's because it as 2 much depth...

I dunno, this reviews or certain views about some games, as a gamer myself, just makes complete no sense to me...but to each their own.

I don't see the *chore* mechanics as a bad thing, i see them as Unique in a video game.

I really like to drag those bags to the Pearson post, seeing people interacting with me, asking me things and pointing me out as i do it....and the graphics the fog on the camp...i mean....it's really an unique game.

But now the cool thing seems to be fast consume me much please next....maybe EA was right, single *player games are dying* on this younger generation. Oh well, Twitch... :)

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Pyrosa

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@FkzAz: Yes, this game is unique. But that does not automatically make all of those components fun. I play at least 50 indie games per year (I try to buy one each week), specifically looking for the magical combo of unique and fun.

RDR2 is an amazing technical innovation.

It is a massive step backward for control design.

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FkzAz

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@Pyrosa: Welll said.

As for making it fun, i guess that allways depend in what we are looking for.

But the controls, the controls are actualy the biggest downside for me in the game.

Altough i understand it, with so many interactions possible in the game, it actualy makes it hard for a single gamepad to sink it all in.

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Willowvale75

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Edited By Willowvale75

Really? The party scene changed your mind? Well, after that, it's back to plodding, tedium and awkward slow slogging. I'm getting bored already. I'm in chapter 5. It's not holding the FUN factor I had with AC Odyssey from start to finish. It's a great game, but definitely not perfect and over hyped.

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Berserk8989

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@willowvale75: Playing through Assassin's Creed Odyssey is the equivalent to scraping your balls with a cheese grater. With options to pay real money to make the blades duller, so it's less painful.

Shallow, grindy, generic, topped with high school writing and acting and filled with microtransactions. The only thing Ubisoft's good at, is creating a problem and then selling you the solution.

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Fandango_Letho

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Edited By Fandango_Letho

@willowvale75: I am done with Odyssey after 45 hours. And I'm probably half-way through the story. I just can't anymore. The boat combat is tedious and trivial, finding chests is useless, clearing outposts is just as useless. And this comes from someone who clocked 98 hours in Origins and loved it.

I feel robbed of my money with Odyssey. I skip half of the dialog because it leads nowhere. Side-quests aren't interesting and they're not funny either when they try to be. I feel like Ubi's B-team did this game while the real talent worked on something else.

Anyways, to each their own. I'm glad you enjoyed Odyssey for what it was.

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santinegrete

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I'm sorry if this question is ridiculous for you: do you think we will get a second Undead Nightmare with this sequel?

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Berserk8989

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@santinegrete: There are certainly hints of that. Like the town of Pleasance, where all people died on the same day, as is written on the gravestones. There's also "Stay Out, Plague" written on one of the barns. Go take a look.

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punksterdaddy

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@santinegrete: It is very unlikely. RDR Online will be out soon and their efforts will likely be focused on that, rather than a single player expansion.

It's a damn shame as I am not even slightly interested in the online portion from the small details I know of.

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santinegrete

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@punksterdaddy: same feeling. Oh well, I won't be bitting into that.

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phillybro806

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I remember that scene and it still didn't erase the boredom I had with the game. This game was just not for for me.

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Onnyx

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Edited By Onnyx
9/10 lemmings

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deactivated-64c06b51403e7

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I can't help but feel that the game's over-rated.

I've played 80 hrs+ and am at the end of chapter 6.

The narrative is impressive so is the attention to details. But, Arthur's character seems incongruent, and the story (from the cutscenes I had watched) seems to wrap up sloppily.

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Fandango_Letho

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@proceeder: I'd be burned too if I had spent 80 hours in a week playing this game man.

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deactivated-611611d19b9ca

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@proceeder: This game is very much overrated. I’ve been seeing a bunch of used copies at GameStop. It seems a lot of people agree.

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hosedandhappy

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@justthetip: Used copies don't indicate anything. Look at the guy above you. The game hasn't been out for two weeks, yet he's found time to put in 80 hours. Most people are going to be done with the game far before 80 hours. The game sold record numbers so of course there are going to be a ton of used copies available.

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xADx

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People say too long, I say I am getting my $65(w/tax) worth. Yes I dislike Hunting like Raccoons. I am on Chapter 4 and I have plenty of money, I just want a pelt trader that I can buy pelts from. Again RDR wasn't for everyone, but it became a classic that needed a sequel/prequel.

I am not a fan of eating and sleeping, etc. and hated those systems in GTA:SA.

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xemnas1997

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I'm glad to see some people in the comments see this game for the piece of ART that it is. This game is masterfully crafted in every aspect. I knew from my experience from the first game that this would be a slow paced game and within the first hour I was already getting invested in the characters. If you want a game with fantastic storytelling, characters, immersion, and a huge open world to explore, this is your game. If you like the open world and exploring but also want to be constantly in the action, maybe something like Just Cause would be more to your taste. If you just want to shoot people, go back to CoD or Fortnite and leave this game for people who will appreciate it.

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attirex

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Bargain bin purchase.

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NateZowa100

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@attirex: that’ll be when the ps5 comes out

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untouchables111

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I was feeling the game was going a bit to slow for me as well.. ill tell you this i just got into chapter 4 and let me tell you the game just got WOKE at the end of chapter 3..Shizzz got real!. The direction is now hype and thus far im actually excited for what i want to see happen with the gang and the new focus they are on.

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whippyice

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im actually glad i read this, because honestly i was having the same problem and didn't dare say lol, it;s been beautiful to be in but i thought i was clearly missing something because i kept getting board, and would just put call of duty back on and forget it,

i will get through it, now i know it does pick up

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mehrdad19872010

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It's good the writer found something he liked about the game. But it is extremely sad to know in 2018, after all these talks and discussions and articles and podcasts and tweets and posts and blogs and videos and whatever else, we are still judging games by one and one virtue only: IS IT FUN!!!!!

If a game does not satisfy us constantly or does not make use feel gratified at every moment, we are ready to put it down!!! I suggest we no longer demand games to grow up as we are still kids just wanting to play with the new toy instead of adults ready to dissect a work of art.

Shame on us! Seriously, shame on us!

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untouchables111

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@mehrdad19872010: i agree and not so much agree.. i see what your saying though i cant help but say i do demand more from my gaming exp. i cant get behind a $60 investment just to be board of it.. i wont force myself to play a game that fails to deliver good content. Not everyone will praise a title that you do.

Example: I played Destiny for 3+ years...i wont spend another $40 for a DLC that fails to deliver anything genuinely new..

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xemnas1997

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@untouchables111: These days I'm not sure "game" is the best term to use. In the case of games like this I prefer to call it an "experience". It's meant to pull you in, make you feel like you're a part of a living, breathing world that can go on with or without your input. Naturally this will bore some people because they want constant action and that is understandable, but you have games like Destiny or CoD or many many others to satisfy that need. So I can't stand to see RDR2 getting hate from people who don't understand the point. If you don't like the sound of it don't play it, there are plenty of us who appreciate this for the work of art it is.

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untouchables111

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@xemnas1997: oh for sure. im one of those that love the immersion of RDR2. It that detail level that "makes" this game AAA.

I love Fallout 76 as well. fans hate the fact it has no NPCs but i see what the dev went for and i appreciate it all the way.

Even sea of thieves was a amazing game...but it fell short on delivering a lasting exp. and i think thats what the majority deem a success.

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