Older RPGs

This may be a topic that would be better suited in the general game discussions in the regular forums, but Im asking it here because being collectors, it seems that many people here have a pretty good grasp on games, old and new alike, and also people seem to be able to be a little more objective here.

I recently have started playing a few RPGs. I never really was into them in the past. The first (and last) true, turnbased RPG I played was the original dragon warrior for the NES that I got free from Nintendo power. Recently I have just completed FFXII and I am about 20hrs into Dragonquest VIII. (Ive played a number of Diablo clones, but those are different beasts all together)

Now, I know that there are many many many RPGs out there for many various systems, and Im trying to determine which ones are worth picking up and which ones are not. I don't really want anything Pre-16bit, because while graphics aren't everything, they definately help draw you in. In fact the only reason Im considering 16bit ones is that so many people seem to highly recommend them. Also, Im not looking for anything stupidly priced. Im sorry, Im sure Panzer Dragoon Saga is a great game and worth its price tag to many people, but I think my wife would have my head if I spent $200 on a 10yr old game. What Im primarily interested in is games that have  good stories that are at the very least somewhat mature ( I want to be able to relate to the story at least somewhat. ). I have a SNES, GENESIS, Saturn, Dreamcast, and N64 (I have other consoles, but am not really considering them for this topic).

Side question, are there any real RPGs for the N64?

Yeah, I can see why you'd want to post this here instead of the general games forum, I could see this getting out of hand pretty quick there.

I played the original Dragon Warrior back in the day too.  Good fun.  I think it might have been my first RPG as well.... I think.

While I own a fair number of RPGs, and I love the genre very much, I probably wouldn't call myself an RPG coniseur.  I'm sure there are others in this union much more suited to that title, and I can't wait to see what they have to input on this subject.

But... I'll give you my humble reccomendations anyway. ^_^

Xenogears
Judging by what you said about "good stories that are at the very least somewhat mature", I would say you can't go wrong with the original Xenogears for the Playstation.  As far as RPGs with mature stories goes, I would say this fits the bill.  This is the only Xenogears game I've played through, but it was awesome.  It's got a fantasy/sci-fi mix feel to it with giant robos thrown in for good measure.  You get to fight battles in and out of the mechs and there's a pretty nifty combo system for your attacks.  On top of that, it just an excellent game.

Thousand Arms
Cutesy little RPG with dating sim elements thrown in.  I've played through this one as well, and while it wasn't the best RPG ever, I would say it was still worth the time I put in to it.  Not too complex, and the battle system feels a bit thin (you can only have one character from your party doing attacks at any given time, the others are relegated to support duty), but it's a colorful game that's a good bit of fun.  I suppose it's not all that "mature" of a story, but I recommend it all the same.

Final Fantasy IV Advance
Final Fantasy II
This is my favorite Final Fantasy game.  You could of course go for FF IV Advance for the GBA or FF II for the SNES, same thing. 

Tales of Phantasia
This is the only RPG I'm listing here that I haven't played through yet... but I've plucked through a few hours just to get a feel for it after I first bought it.  And my impressions were that I think I'll really like it when I get around to playing through it.  It seems to be right at that level of RPG that I like the most: not too complex, but not too simple.  Combat isn't turn based, instead you fight more like you would in a 2D action platformer. 

End Note: I began this post before Aspro made his reply, and I wasn't under the impression that you were looking for games only for the systems you mentioned.  If that is the case, then only FFII SNES really applies.

Side question, are there any real RPGs for the N64?

Working_Stiff

It's a shame you don't want any RPGs for the PS1 or PS2.  I was in much the same position as you not really appreciating RPG's until very recently, but found Shadow Hearts: Covenant, the second in the series to be engaging and mature with a fun battle mechanism and not overly long (about 22 hours).  Here is my review.

Skies of Arcadia for the Dreamcast is a favorite of Mrs. Aspro73, she plays RPG's exclusively and has played that 4 times through.  I cannot speak to the maturity of the game, but from what I am told the story is great.

Both of these games can be obtained fairly cheap (under $20 on Ebay).
aspro73

Ya. Im thinking about picking up skies of arcadia after reading some reviews. I also like the fact that the DC version "technologically superior" (according to gamespot) to the PS version. I just wonder if the common common complaint in reviews for the game, the excessiveness even for an RPG of random battles, brings the game down much.

I also want to clairify why I didn't ask about PS2 games. I definately don't plan to ignore this console, I still have FFX in my collection to get through plus numerous others that I plan to pick up. It is because its easier to find info on them and reviews are more likely (obviously never 100%) to reflect the views on a gamers in the current environment than reviews for older games. I wanted more directed responses, especially because there are so many great RPGs for the PS2 I felt it would overshadow the ones for the older consoles. (BTW, I do have my eyes on the shadow hearts games.). Also, I felt that RPGs may be a good genre to look into to help me get some more use out of my older systems (Thats why I didnt ask about PS1 games, as Id end up popping them into my PS2). I find it hard to get myself to play my older consoles for more than a few minutes here and there. It may seem silly, but maybe not to others here in this union, but I like playing each different console because they each have their own "feel" to them. The problem is I want engaging, new experiences, and find that my traditional go-to genre, action adventure games, doesn't draw me in on these systems as much. The last game I really got into that were not on a PS2 era or later system was about 6 months ago I replayed Super Metroid for the umpteenth time.

Also, I want to clairify something on the maturity comment I made. Its not that I need gritty, adult oriented stories per se, its more that I dont want something overly cheesey. Games like Dragon Quest VIII are definately not M rated, but dont make me cringe when the cutscenes come on. However, I played about an hour of Star Ocean, TTEOT, and it just got under my skin. Im going to try the game again, but I don't have high expectations.

oh, and inkwolf, thanks for the suggestions. Im going to look into those games more.

EDITED TO ADD: It may appear that Im getting ahead of myself by asking for recommendations on multiple, time consuming games, especially when I already have a backlog of games, but what I like to do is have a stockpile of games to pick from so that when I finish whatever Im playing now, I have a good selection of titles to pick from, again, a concept that is probably not that odd to other collectors.

Gamespot's List of Traditional RPgs for the N64.GAMECAMILLER

There's only five games on that list!  I can't believe there are so few.  I'm shocked.

[QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"]Gamespot's List of Traditional RPgs for the N64.inkwolf

There's only five games on that list! I can't believe there are so few. I'm shocked.

Every one will cost you a pretty penny though to buy them now, so if you have them in your collections, be thankful. :)

[QUOTE="inkwolf"]

[QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"]Gamespot's List of Traditional RPgs for the N64.GAMECAMILLER

There's only five games on that list! I can't believe there are so few. I'm shocked.

Every one will cost you a pretty penny though to buy them now, so if you have them in your collections, be thankful. :)

Guess you never played Ogre Battle 64 :P  That was a goddamned good game.  And, iirc, none of those are traditional RPG's and in fact, Ogre Battle 64 is the closest you'd get to a traditional RPG on the N64.

Anyway, if you want older - not so much traditional, but older - RPG's, get DOSBox and download The ELder Scrolls Arena; Bethesda made it freeware, so you can nab it from http://www.elderscrolls.com  It's pretty much the weakest link in the series, and the only things it has in common with Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion are that it's first person, the combat is real time and your inventory is based on weight.  Is levelling is traditional experience grinding, as opposed to levelling up skills, so in terms of concept, you'd never have guessed that Daggerfall would become the way that it did.

What I would recommend is Final Fantasy 6. Best 16-bit era FInal Fantasy (and I've played 4, 5 and 6.  Haven't finished 5, though).  Great story, great gameplay, great stat manipulation possibilities.  Trie to get Final Fantasy 3 (SNES), though, if you can because the GBA version has castrated sound, and that game has an incredible soundtrack.

Going back to strict SNES titles, I'd also strongly recommend Actraiser (not a traditional RPG, though...action, strategy, a really great mix altogether), Brainlord and Dragonview.  How you get them and in what format is up to you ;)

[QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"][QUOTE="inkwolf"]

[QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"]Gamespot's List of Traditional RPgs for the N64.Apathetic_Prick

There's only five games on that list! I can't believe there are so few. I'm shocked.

Every one will cost you a pretty penny though to buy them now, so if you have them in your collections, be thankful. :)

Guess you never played Ogre Battle 64 :P That was a goddamned good game. And, iirc, none of those are traditional RPG's and in fact, Ogre Battle 64 is the closest you'd get to a traditional RPG on the N64.

Anyway, if you want older - not so much traditional, but older - RPG's, get DOSBox and download The ELder Scrolls Arena; Bethesda made it freeware, so you can nab it from http://www.elderscrolls.com It's pretty much the weakest link in the series, and the only things it has in common with Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion are that it's first person, the combat is real time and your inventory is based on weight. Is levelling is traditional experience grinding, as opposed to levelling up skills, so in terms of concept, you'd never have guessed that Daggerfall would become the way that it did.

What I would recommend is Final Fantasy 6. Best 16-bit era FInal Fantasy (and I've played 4, 5 and 6. Haven't finished 5, though). Great story, great gameplay, great stat manipulation possibilities. Trie to get Final Fantasy 3 (SNES), though, if you can because the GBA version has castrated sound, and that game has an incredible soundtrack.

Going back to strict SNES titles, I'd also strongly recommend Actraiser (not a traditional RPG, though...action, strategy, a really great mix altogether), Brainlord and Dragonview. How you get them and in what format is up to you ;)

Going back to strict SNES titles, I'd also strongly recommend Actraiser (not a traditional RPG, though...action, strategy, a really great mix altogether), Brainlord and Dragonview.

Apathetic_Prick

Ya. Im thinking about picking up skies of arcadia after reading some reviews. I also like the fact that the DC version "technologically superior" (according to gamespot) to the PS version.

Working_Stiff

[QUOTE="Working_Stiff"]

Ya. Im thinking about picking up skies of arcadia after reading some reviews. I also like the fact that the DC version "technologically superior" (according to gamespot) to the PS version.

aspro73

Your right. Im getting it confused with Grandia 2, so disregard that part of the post. Now that you jogged my memory, the Skies of Arcadia Legends (I believe thats what its called) has a slightly improved graphics and alittle extra content. Its Grandia 2 that had the excessive random battles and the lower quality PS2 port.

[QUOTE="aspro73"][QUOTE="Working_Stiff"]

Ya. Im thinking about picking up skies of arcadia after reading some reviews. I also like the fact that the DC version "technologically superior" (according to gamespot) to the PS version.

Working_Stiff

Your right. Im getting it confused with Grandia 2, so disregard that part of the post. Now that you jogged my memory, the Skies of Arcadia Legends (I believe thats what its called) has a slightly improved graphics and alittle extra content. Its Grandia 2 that had the excessive random battles and the lower quality PS2 port.

[QUOTE="Apathetic_Prick"][QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"][QUOTE="inkwolf"]

[QUOTE="GAMECAMILLER"]Gamespot's List of Traditional RPgs for the N64.GAMECAMILLER

There's only five games on that list! I can't believe there are so few. I'm shocked.

Every one will cost you a pretty penny though to buy them now, so if you have them in your collections, be thankful. :)

Guess you never played Ogre Battle 64 :P That was a goddamned good game. And, iirc, none of those are traditional RPG's and in fact, Ogre Battle 64 is the closest you'd get to a traditional RPG on the N64.

Anyway, if you want older - not so much traditional, but older - RPG's, get DOSBox and download The ELder Scrolls Arena; Bethesda made it freeware, so you can nab it from http://www.elderscrolls.com It's pretty much the weakest link in the series, and the only things it has in common with Daggerfall, Morrowind and Oblivion are that it's first person, the combat is real time and your inventory is based on weight. Is levelling is traditional experience grinding, as opposed to levelling up skills, so in terms of concept, you'd never have guessed that Daggerfall would become the way that it did.

What I would recommend is Final Fantasy 6. Best 16-bit era FInal Fantasy (and I've played 4, 5 and 6. Haven't finished 5, though). Great story, great gameplay, great stat manipulation possibilities. Trie to get Final Fantasy 3 (SNES), though, if you can because the GBA version has castrated sound, and that game has an incredible soundtrack.

Going back to strict SNES titles, I'd also strongly recommend Actraiser (not a traditional RPG, though...action, strategy, a really great mix altogether), Brainlord and Dragonview. How you get them and in what format is up to you ;)

Oh gotcha, my bad.  But yeah, GS has been really screwy lately.  It does that when it allegedly detects bad html, which means the webset is currently a lot more glitchier than usual :P

I only rented Ogre Battle 64 once, then I bought it.  Best $100 (CDN) I ever spent on a game.  Yes, it was that much, and only specialty game stores carried it, and everyone from EB Games to Compucenter (which went out of business in 2002) had it at that price, but finding it was brutal.

I have a SNES, GENESIS, Saturn, Dreamcast, and N64 (I have other consoles, but am not really considering them for this topic).

Working_Stiff

Saturn - your not really going to find any cheap on this console. i got albert odyssey, and dark savior for a reasonable price. blazing heroes is the only one i got fairly cheap, but i havent played it yet so i cant recomend.

Genesis - shining force and phantasy stars

snes - actraiser, secret of evermore, and illusions of gaia can be obtained cheap, and if your willing to spend a bit more you can get breath of fire I and II, lufia's, secret of mana, and chrono trigger

dreamcast - skies of arcadia (and yes it has a ton of random battles, but in the second disc you can avoid most of them, still a great game), grandia II (still one of my favorite battle systems, no random battles), record of lodoss war, draconus: cult of the wyrm, and elemental gimmick gear

n64- pretty much no rpgs, also why i dont own an n64

Thread necromancy strikes again! :D

Really, I think all the ones worth mentioning have all been mentioned, so I'll just say:

Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore, Final Fantasy IV-VI, Illusion of Time/Gaia, Shadowrun, Phantasy Star II-IV, Chrono Trigger, Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Shining Force I-II...*

*most of which are on my to-buy list, a significant number of which were never released in Europe (grr) and all of which can go for a pretty penny on eBay.

Thread necromancy strikes again! :D

Really, I think all the ones worth mentioning have all been mentioned, so I'll just say:

Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore, Final Fantasy IV-VI, Illusion of Time/Gaia, Shadowrun, Phantasy Star II-IV, Chrono Trigger, Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Shining Force I-II...*

*most of which are on my to-buy list, a significant number of which were never released in Europe (grr) and all of which can go for a pretty penny on eBay.

totalgridlock

thread necromancy? talking bout me posting in old threads? im new to the union so i was looking over the old posts, and a couple i thought i could contribute to.

i think the op was looking for cheaper games thats why i left earthbound out. it gets expensive, and why i left off several good rpgs for the saturn. but yeah if he is willing to spend some loot earthbound is a cool game. i borrowed it from a friend cause i didnt want to pay the going rate on it.

[QUOTE="totalgridlock"]

Thread necromancy strikes again! :D

Really, I think all the ones worth mentioning have all been mentioned, so I'll just say:

Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore, Final Fantasy IV-VI, Illusion of Time/Gaia, Shadowrun, Phantasy Star II-IV, Chrono Trigger, Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Shining Force I-II...*

*most of which are on my to-buy list, a significant number of which were never released in Europe (grr) and all of which can go for a pretty penny on eBay.

Dunbake

thread necromancy? talking bout me posting in old threads? im new to the union so i was looking over the old posts, and a couple i thought i could contribute to.

i think the op was looking for cheaper games thats why i left earthbound out. it gets expensive, and why i left off several good rpgs for the saturn. but yeah if he is willing to spend some loot earthbound is a cool game. i borrowed it from a friend cause i didnt want to pay the going rate on it.

Oh don't worry. We like thread necromancy. Feel free to dig up and reanimate any old thing you find lying about the place :)

I don't think the original poster is going to be around though... :P

[QUOTE="Dunbake"][QUOTE="totalgridlock"]

Thread necromancy strikes again! :D

Really, I think all the ones worth mentioning have all been mentioned, so I'll just say:

Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore, Final Fantasy IV-VI, Illusion of Time/Gaia, Shadowrun, Phantasy Star II-IV, Chrono Trigger, Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Shining Force I-II...*

*most of which are on my to-buy list, a significant number of which were never released in Europe (grr) and all of which can go for a pretty penny on eBay.

totalgridlock

thread necromancy? talking bout me posting in old threads? im new to the union so i was looking over the old posts, and a couple i thought i could contribute to.

i think the op was looking for cheaper games thats why i left earthbound out. it gets expensive, and why i left off several good rpgs for the saturn. but yeah if he is willing to spend some loot earthbound is a cool game. i borrowed it from a friend cause i didnt want to pay the going rate on it.

Oh don't worry. We like thread necromancy. Feel free to dig up and reanimate any old thing you find lying about the place :)

I don't think the original poster is going to be around though... :P

i figured it was probably to long a time for the op, i was keeping with the original question in case anyone else stumbled upon it as i did. i love this union message board btw. there is only one other forum i frequent (non-game related) most of the other i have been to are immature or have a bunch of retards in them. i recently started looking at the forums on this site and was spending most of my time in legacy platforms until i seen someones signature and checked out this board. good topics and good posts. though reading through some threads it seems gamespot has been through some turmoil in recent history. kinda glad i missed out on all that.