Fighting games question

Ok now i am an avid lover of fighting games. but in our little AU crew we had a disagreement. It got hot steamy and a little sweaty :P.

Is Super smash Brothers brawl a fighting game.

I say no and that is what started this arguement. what do you guys think.. back your reasoning.

I think so, it's like a cage match when you got other friends playing with you.lamprey263

SSB contains a percentage element instead of a health bar and people hitting you with shells or with yoyo's if .. yeh you hit each other but you could also do that in streets of rage, yet thats not a fighter. To me typically SF, MK, Tekken, Soul Calibur, Guilty gear/BlazBlue DOA are all fighting games. SSBB is lik a poor sub genre something which doesn't really have a category. Yeh its a decent game but i dont find it as a fighting game. If its classed as a fighting game then i think it mocks the genre.

[QUOTE="lamprey263"]I think so, it's like a cage match when you got other friends playing with you.mystic_knight

I consider as a sub genre of fighting games

I consider as a sub genre of fighting games

EPaul

Is luck really a factor to include in fighting games though. The competitions in street fighter comps are all about skill. Luck was never a factor to win. Maybe i do hold the powerups, hazards against it, but its within good reason as this introduction of an external factor has become involved in a person vs person fight. mystic_knight

Well Hardcore smash players never play with items on and Melee was at Evo a few years ago. Once u turn off the items in smash the luck factor is thrown out the window

[QUOTE="mystic_knight"]Is luck really a factor to include in fighting games though. The competitions in street fighter comps are all about skill. Luck was never a factor to win. Maybe i do hold the powerups, hazards against it, but its within good reason as this introduction of an external factor has become involved in a person vs person fight. EPaul

Well Hardcore smash players never play with items on and Melee was at Evo a few years ago. Once u turn off the items in smash the luck factor is thrown out the window

It's a very unique fighting game, but it's still a fighting game.

A small group of fighters are locked in an arena with nothing to do but fight each other untill the match is over. This is how I define the genre. Usually it's 2, usually there are no random items, and usually the combos are more complicated. But these are not part of the definition, that's just what most are like. Smash Bros is unique.

[QUOTE="EPaul"]

[QUOTE="mystic_knight"]Is luck really a factor to include in fighting games though. The competitions in street fighter comps are all about skill. Luck was never a factor to win. Maybe i do hold the powerups, hazards against it, but its within good reason as this introduction of an external factor has become involved in a person vs person fight. mystic_knight

Well Hardcore smash players never play with items on and Melee was at Evo a few years ago. Once u turn off the items in smash the luck factor is thrown out the window

I completely understand you. It def isnt a fighter in the traditional sense like SF4,BB, ect but i would still call it a fighter.

[QUOTE="mystic_knight"][QUOTE="EPaul"]

Well Hardcore smash players never play with items on and Melee was at Evo a few years ago. Once u turn off the items in smash the luck factor is thrown out the window

Gen007

I completely understand you. It def isnt a fighter in the traditional sense like SF4,BB, ect but i would still call it a fighter.

My opinion? It's not a fighter at all. More like a party brawler between four friends.

If it was, it would have been taken seriously at a very high competitive level and, to my knowledge, it has never been accepted as a game worthy of tournament status in an event like EVO.

I say no.

It depends on your definition of "Fighter."

If you define fighting games as strictly between 2 people on a 2D plane, you're going to be throwing out a lot of candidates other people deeply value as fighters. What about 3D fighters? Aren't they fighting games? Samurai Shodown features items in the matches, does that make it not a fighter either?

If your definition of a fighting games is limited to what you yourself define as a fighting game, your scope will be very limited. I did not spend 10 years of my life playing Smash Bros. and mastering combos to have other people tell me it's not a fair judge of skill with certain regards to X and Y.

So long as your goal is to eliminate your opponent in a controlled relatively close environment using skills that involve hitting and/or special moves, I would call that a fighter.

But people can choose to be close-minded as much as they want. If Smash Bros. isn't as "hardcore" as they'd like it to be, I would suggest looking at how other modern fighters are embracing the whole "easy to learn, difficult to master mantra." Blazblue has a "Special" button. In previous generations, people would have balked at the idea of simply having a button for a special move, but they'd be missing all the aspects of such a decision and how it shapes the game.

I love Street Fighter. I love Marvel vs. Capcom. I love Smash Brothers. I consider them to all be necessarily different but equally valid entries into the fighting game canon. Each one of them requires a certain level of mastery if you intend to be serious about the game.

Being a person who has played Tekken on a tournament level in the past, and someone who hasn't been able to put down Marvel vs Capcom 3 since I got it, I cannot in any way consider SSB a true fighting game. SSB has far more in common with pick up and play party games than fighters IMO.

The reason? Variable. Simply put there are far too many "luck factors" in SSB. For a game to be truly competitive, which is what fighting games are at their core, it must be as skill based as possible with as few randomizers as possible. 4 players fighting at the same time automatically ditches that. Add random items and stages that can heavily favor certain characters and you have a game that's at least 50% luck based.

If you have to strip a game of half It's content to make the core gameplay "balanced" then I find it hard to accept it as a true fighting game. The problem with SSB specifically, when you strip this content, you then see how unbalanced the characters themselves are. Some characters just CANNOT win matches consistently 1v1. Other characters CANNOT win consistently without using items.

TL;DR: If a game can't be considered playable on a competitive tournament level on It's DEFAULT settings, the way the game developers DEVELOPED the game thus the way it was intended to be played. Then I believe you cannot consider it a true fighting game.

Yes, it is definitely a fighting game...just a different type.

No it is not to me but considering how they made Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 so simple Super smash brothers could be consider one. Don't get me wrong I love Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 I got the special edition day one. I just think MVC3 is less complicated than the ones before. But when I think of Smash Brothers I think of a party game.

My opinion? It's not a fighter at all. More like a party brawler between four friends.

If it was, it would have been taken seriously at a very high competitive level and, to my knowledge, it has never been accepted as a game worthy of tournament status in an event like EVO.

Metamania

I'd say it strays too far from fighting game conventions to really count. If SSB is a fighting game, so is Bionic Commando Rearmed's multiplayer. I could see it being a sort of sub genre though.

I'd say it strays too far from fighting game conventions to really count. If SSB is a fighting game, so is Bionic Commando Rearmed's multiplayer. I could see it being a sort of sub genre though.

rragnaar

Exactly. Just like how leveling up and unlocking new perks/weapons/attachments in Call of Duty multiplayer doesn't make it an RPG.

I'd say it strays too far from fighting game conventions to really count. If SSB is a fighting game, so is Bionic Commando Rearmed's multiplayer. I could see it being a sort of sub genre though.

rragnaar

I consider as a sub genre of fighting games

EPaul