[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]The battle system did a lot of things well, and it's clear that that was one part of the game they put a lot of work into (I read that they had a prototype running on PS2 hardware as far back as 2005), but they hamstrung it with short-sided decisions. Specifically, not being able to give an "override" order to any of your other party members, similar to what you could do in XII when Gambits were on, and everyone just giving up in the party leader fell boggled my mind.; And the strategy was just common sense with the formations and being able to win almost all the battles just by hitting A/X while doing something else.With the advent of FFXIII, Square tried to create an engine that could do absolutely everything they would ever want to do with it on the PS3. But it was simply an impossible, foolish task and work on FFXIII relied on the engine. By the time they reached a point where they could actually work on FFXIII, time was running out and they had to prioritize on the elements that were "most important." The problem with this is that while the battle system was definitely the best, the story was just awful with poor directing throughout. If the story had been good, it would have been more excusable. One half of their priorities, not counting graphics, just didn't go well.
However, if anything, I think people enjoy hating on Square these days. I can't see Square ever reaching a point where they'll be well liked again, because they aren't even appreciated for the achievements they did make with FFXIII, in spite of its flaws.
MAILER_DAEMON
How much has Square Enix tarnished their reputation with Final Fantasy 14 Online
This topic is locked from further discussion.
Mashing A/X constantly is all well and good, but you won't get anywhere with that strategy for long. It's all about the pre-battle set-up. Or more specifically, the formation of your paradigm deck. Without the right paradigms, you're pretty much screwed on most of the boss battles.
On another note, there are actually photos on the net of FFXIII's battle system running on the PS2 with FFX-2 characters used as stand-ins. It's actually quite neat to see if you're willing to find them.
Eh, most of the game was mash "X". Yes you have to change paradigms... in some fights. Most of the fights are over before this happens, and even if you do... you still mash "X". FF13 is just "X" = game plays for you. You dont even have to select what to do, the game just selects the best option and goes with it. I platinumed the freaking game just because i had nothing better to do at the time and was waiting for more games to come by mail, and in 95% of the fights you dont even have to select any kind of command on your own, there is no point. Ravager - Mash X, Commando - Mash X, and so on.
Id rather go with the Gambit system in FF12 any day over this. FF13 non-leader characters follows a pre-ordered set of gambits and (mostly with medics) its horrible, you have no imput wathsoever on them. At least with the gambit system you could change your characters at will, at any time, change characters on the fly too, create combos, and so on.
I agree with thisFFXIII was a good game. No doubt about it. There's a reason it scored well universally. I've said it many times before, and I'll say it again. FFXIII was a victim of it's own hype. No matter what the game turned out to be in the end, there was no way it was ever going to please the masses. A game with the amount of hype that that game had has no chance. People need to stop judging FFXIII based on what they expected it to be, and start judging it by what it actually is.
KH-mixerX
With Square in the state it is I feel like there's an opening for a company to come in and establish a top quality JRPG franchise. There really hasn't been a AAA JRPG at all for years. There have been some decent ones but nothing near the level of FF7 at it's release.
Eh, most of the game was mash "X". Yes you have to change paradigms... in some fights. Most of the fights are over before this happens, and even if you do... you still mash "X". FF13 is just "X" = game plays for you. You dont even have to select what to do, the game just selects the best option and goes with it. I platinumed the freaking game just because i had nothing better to do at the time and was waiting for more games to come by mail, and in 95% of the fights you dont even have to select any kind of command on your own, there is no point. Ravager - Mash X, Commando - Mash X, and so on.
Id rather go with the Gambit system in FF12 any day over this. FF13 non-leader characters follows a pre-ordered set of gambits and (mostly with medics) its horrible, you have no imput wathsoever on them. At least with the gambit system you could change your characters at will, at any time, change characters on the fly too, create combos, and so on.
Marmotas
Do you not just mash X/A in most JRPG's anyways? Maybe not in boss fights, but in most random encounters, you simply just mash the attack button. FFXIII is no different. And let's face it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much that game's attack button. The only reason people complain about it is because it has the word "Auto" in it. If the button just said "Attack(which it basically is)," then nobody would say a word about it.
As for Gambits, I don't really see the difference between them and Paradigms. When you set up your Gambits the correct way, it's an even more hands off experience than FFXIII. At least with Paradigms you still have to be able to switch your paradigms in a swift and timely fashion. You don't even have to touch the controller though when you have a good Gambit set-up.
[QUOTE="Marmotas"]
Eh, most of the game was mash "X". Yes you have to change paradigms... in some fights. Most of the fights are over before this happens, and even if you do... you still mash "X". FF13 is just "X" = game plays for you. You dont even have to select what to do, the game just selects the best option and goes with it. I platinumed the freaking game just because i had nothing better to do at the time and was waiting for more games to come by mail, and in 95% of the fights you dont even have to select any kind of command on your own, there is no point. Ravager - Mash X, Commando - Mash X, and so on.
Id rather go with the Gambit system in FF12 any day over this. FF13 non-leader characters follows a pre-ordered set of gambits and (mostly with medics) its horrible, you have no imput wathsoever on them. At least with the gambit system you could change your characters at will, at any time, change characters on the fly too, create combos, and so on.
KH-mixerX
Do you not just mash X/A in most JRPG's anyways? Maybe not in boss fights, but in most random encounters, you simply just mash the attack button. FFXIII is no different. And let's face it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much that game's attack button. The only reason people complain about it is because it has the word "Auto" in it. If the button just said "Attack(which it basically is)," then nobody would say a word about it.
As for Gambits, I don't really see the difference between them and Paradigms. When you set up your Gambits the correct way, it's an even more hands off experience than FFXIII. At least with Paradigms you still have to be able to switch your paradigms in a swift and timely fashion. You don't even have to touch the controller though when you have a good Gambit set-up.
Auto battle just does that, takes all the interaction you have with the game. You just touch X and the game makes all the decitions. If the enemy is weak agains something, the game automatically attacks with such elements for example. There is no lerning curve and no experimentation, you just touch X and the game plays for you, no matter the roles, no matter the situation.
Gambits are different to paradigms, they involve some thought process, you have to set up competent gambits according to the situation, you can trust your characters will obey them and if they do something bad, you dont feel cheated because it was your fault to begin with. In FF13 when the AI makes stupid choices, like dont heal the main character with more than 1 low cure making absolutely no diference you feel cheated, or when the AI attacks enemies they shouldnt making you basically HAVE to take the commando role all the time and relying on the AI to use all other classes if you ever want to attack.
If you set up a good gambit, then yes, it auto plays, but you set up those gambits, you put your mind into them and experimented according to the enemies. You can just set up basic gambits to buff/heal and take care of the combat, or set up gambits in especific for each situation (like bosses), and being realistic, most of the boss fights requires you to constantly switch characters and makes them change roles, because gambits as you put them only wrk as long as you have MP, or as long as you have as much gambits to set up all you want.
Beyond the paradigm asignement, there is no interaction with the system at all. No thought process, the game does everything for you.
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
[QUOTE="Marmotas"]
Eh, most of the game was mash "X". Yes you have to change paradigms... in some fights. Most of the fights are over before this happens, and even if you do... you still mash "X". FF13 is just "X" = game plays for you. You dont even have to select what to do, the game just selects the best option and goes with it. I platinumed the freaking game just because i had nothing better to do at the time and was waiting for more games to come by mail, and in 95% of the fights you dont even have to select any kind of command on your own, there is no point. Ravager - Mash X, Commando - Mash X, and so on.
Id rather go with the Gambit system in FF12 any day over this. FF13 non-leader characters follows a pre-ordered set of gambits and (mostly with medics) its horrible, you have no imput wathsoever on them. At least with the gambit system you could change your characters at will, at any time, change characters on the fly too, create combos, and so on.
Marmotas
Do you not just mash X/A in most JRPG's anyways? Maybe not in boss fights, but in most random encounters, you simply just mash the attack button. FFXIII is no different. And let's face it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much that game's attack button. The only reason people complain about it is because it has the word "Auto" in it. If the button just said "Attack(which it basically is)," then nobody would say a word about it.
As for Gambits, I don't really see the difference between them and Paradigms. When you set up your Gambits the correct way, it's an even more hands off experience than FFXIII. At least with Paradigms you still have to be able to switch your paradigms in a swift and timely fashion. You don't even have to touch the controller though when you have a good Gambit set-up.
Auto battle just does that, takes all the interaction you have with the game. You just touch X and the game makes all the decitions. If the enemy is weak agains something, the game automatically attacks with such elements for example. There is no lerning curve and no experimentation, you just touch X and the game plays for you, no matter the roles, no matter the situation.
Gambits are different to paradigms, they involve some thought process, you have to set up competent gambits according to the situation, you can trust your characters will obey them and if they do something bad, you dont feel cheated because it was your fault to begin with. In FF13 when the AI makes stupid choices, like dont heal the main character with more than 1 low cure making absolutely no diference you feel cheated, or when the AI attacks enemies they shouldnt making you basically HAVE to take the commando role all the time and relying on the AI to use all other classes if you ever want to attack.
If you set up a good gambit, then yes, it auto plays, but you set up those gambits, you put your mind into them and experimented according to the enemies. You can just set up basic gambits to buff/heal and take care of the combat, or set up gambits in especific for each situation (like bosses), and being realistic, most of the boss fights requires you to constantly switch characters and makes them change roles, because gambits as you put them only wrk as long as you have MP, or as long as you have as much gambits to set up all you want.
Beyond the paradigm asignement, there is no interaction with the system at all. No thought process, the game does everything for you.
I think you nailed the weakness with with FFXIII's battle system. Of course the story and the linerarity are another barrel of fish.
[QUOTE="Marmotas"]
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
Do you not just mash X/A in most JRPG's anyways? Maybe not in boss fights, but in most random encounters, you simply just mash the attack button. FFXIII is no different. And let's face it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much that game's attack button. The only reason people complain about it is because it has the word "Auto" in it. If the button just said "Attack(which it basically is)," then nobody would say a word about it.
As for Gambits, I don't really see the difference between them and Paradigms. When you set up your Gambits the correct way, it's an even more hands off experience than FFXIII. At least with Paradigms you still have to be able to switch your paradigms in a swift and timely fashion. You don't even have to touch the controller though when you have a good Gambit set-up.
juliankennedy23
Auto battle just does that, takes all the interaction you have with the game. You just touch X and the game makes all the decitions. If the enemy is weak agains something, the game automatically attacks with such elements for example. There is no lerning curve and no experimentation, you just touch X and the game plays for you, no matter the roles, no matter the situation.
Gambits are different to paradigms, they involve some thought process, you have to set up competent gambits according to the situation, you can trust your characters will obey them and if they do something bad, you dont feel cheated because it was your fault to begin with. In FF13 when the AI makes stupid choices, like dont heal the main character with more than 1 low cure making absolutely no diference you feel cheated, or when the AI attacks enemies they shouldnt making you basically HAVE to take the commando role all the time and relying on the AI to use all other classes if you ever want to attack.
If you set up a good gambit, then yes, it auto plays, but you set up those gambits, you put your mind into them and experimented according to the enemies. You can just set up basic gambits to buff/heal and take care of the combat, or set up gambits in especific for each situation (like bosses), and being realistic, most of the boss fights requires you to constantly switch characters and makes them change roles, because gambits as you put them only wrk as long as you have MP, or as long as you have as much gambits to set up all you want.
Beyond the paradigm asignement, there is no interaction with the system at all. No thought process, the game does everything for you.
I think you nailed the weakness with with FFXIII's battle system. Of course the story and the linerarity are another barrel of fish.
Most battle systems in JRPGs are bad. The sad thing is is that with some thought or at least a variety of exciting animations they can be much better. I didn't really hate FF13 battle system because all I was doing was mashing A/X, because in most RPGs I'm just using the most damaging move and conserving MP, it also takes little or no thought, the problem is that instead of improving JRPG battle systems FF13 just said **** it and made the system even worse. I don't want JRPGs to give up on their battle system, I want improvements.
Square Enix has tarnished their reputation not with their FF MMORPGS, but with other titles, such as pretty much all the PSP games, and even some of the nintendo DS games.
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
[QUOTE="Marmotas"]
Eh, most of the game was mash "X". Yes you have to change paradigms... in some fights. Most of the fights are over before this happens, and even if you do... you still mash "X". FF13 is just "X" = game plays for you. You dont even have to select what to do, the game just selects the best option and goes with it. I platinumed the freaking game just because i had nothing better to do at the time and was waiting for more games to come by mail, and in 95% of the fights you dont even have to select any kind of command on your own, there is no point. Ravager - Mash X, Commando - Mash X, and so on.
Id rather go with the Gambit system in FF12 any day over this. FF13 non-leader characters follows a pre-ordered set of gambits and (mostly with medics) its horrible, you have no imput wathsoever on them. At least with the gambit system you could change your characters at will, at any time, change characters on the fly too, create combos, and so on.
Marmotas
Do you not just mash X/A in most JRPG's anyways? Maybe not in boss fights, but in most random encounters, you simply just mash the attack button. FFXIII is no different. And let's face it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much that game's attack button. The only reason people complain about it is because it has the word "Auto" in it. If the button just said "Attack(which it basically is)," then nobody would say a word about it.
As for Gambits, I don't really see the difference between them and Paradigms. When you set up your Gambits the correct way, it's an even more hands off experience than FFXIII. At least with Paradigms you still have to be able to switch your paradigms in a swift and timely fashion. You don't even have to touch the controller though when you have a good Gambit set-up.
Auto battle just does that, takes all the interaction you have with the game. You just touch X and the game makes all the decitions. If the enemy is weak agains something, the game automatically attacks with such elements for example. There is no lerning curve and no experimentation, you just touch X and the game plays for you, no matter the roles, no matter the situation.
Gambits are different to paradigms, they involve some thought process, you have to set up competent gambits according to the situation, you can trust your characters will obey them and if they do something bad, you dont feel cheated because it was your fault to begin with. In FF13 when the AI makes stupid choices, like dont heal the main character with more than 1 low cure making absolutely no diference you feel cheated, or when the AI attacks enemies they shouldn't making you basically HAVE to take the commando role all the time and relying on the AI to use all other ****s if you ever want to attack.
If you set up a good gambit, then yes, it auto plays, but you set up those gambits, you put your mind into them and experimented according to the enemies. You can just set up basic gambits to buff/heal and take care of the combat, or set up gambits in especific for each situation (like bosses), and being realistic, most of the boss fights requires you to constantly switch characters and makes them change roles, because gambits as you put them only wrk as long as you have MP, or as long as you have as much gambits to set up all you want.
Beyond the paradigm asignement, there is no interaction with the system at all. No thought process, the game does everything for you.
Well, there's a couple reasons that you are wrong. And I'll point them out, but let me first say that you don't have to to use the Auto-Battle button. In fact, there is an option in the configuration menu that specifically makes it so the cursor starts on the Abilities tab, and not the Auto-Battle button. So there you go. Problem fixed.
The reasons I spoke of earlier are the following...
That is exactly the same as setting up your Paradigm deck. You flat out won't get anywhere in FFXIII without knowing how to formulate a specific Paradigm deck for any given situation. You can mash X/A all you want, but if you don't have the correct Paradigms and know when to switch them, you won't progress through the game.
I don't know what version of FFXIII you were playing, but I've beaten the game three times now and have never had any of those problems. I was actually surprised at how proficient the AI is. The only problem I've ever had with the AI is that sometimes when you have them use the Saboteurrole, they will keep casting the same debuff on an enemy even if that enemy is immune to that particular debuff. Other than that, the AI is practically flawless. Especially in the Medic role. They always heal the character with the lowest health first. The only time they only use 1 low cure spell is when everybody is practically at full health. As for the Commando problem you pointed out, I'm not sure I understand. I almost never used the Commando role. I always relied on the AI for that role. That actually reminds me of one other minor problem. Sometimes when you have the entire party in offensive roles, they all won't attack the same target, which can be very annoying.
How is that any different from the Gambit system? You set up your Gambits, and then the game plays for you, literally. I've had my Gambits set up in such a way before that I could literally put down the controller, and the game played for me. I'm not joking. I've gone through entire boss fights without even pressing a button. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but it's definitely less hands on than the Paradigm system. With Paradigms you can't just set them up, and the game plays for you. Even if you have the perfect Paradigm deck, you'll still get your a** handed to you if you don't switch them in swift and timely fashion.
Overall, I think both systems are good, but I prefer Paradigms over Gambits. Another thing I disliked about FFXII is the fact that every person in your party is pretty much the same in terms of combat abilities. At least in FFXIII there are roles you have to assign to each character. I will give FFXII points for being able to control every character though. No matter how good the AI is in FFXIII, it'll never replace a human player controlling the action.
final fantasy 13 was too linear for me... great graphics, but too linear and boring.. I wish they would make another ff tactics game... Yeah FF 14 online they trashed their reputation badly, but supposedly its still a popular online game so I guess they win.
When was the last time that Square Enix came out with a great game?
Well, there's a couple reasons that you are wrong. And I'll point them out, but let me first say that you don't have to to use the Auto-Battle button. In fact, there is an option in the configuration menu that specifically makes it so the cursor starts on the Abilities tab, and not the Auto-Battle button. So there you go. Problem fixed.
The reasons I spoke of earlier are the following...
That is exactly the same as setting up your Paradigm deck. You flat out won't get anywhere in FFXIII without knowing how to formulate a specific Paradigm deck for any given situation. You can mash X/A all you want, but if you don't have the correct Paradigms and know when to switch them, you won't progress through the game.
I don't know what version of FFXIII you were playing, but I've beaten the game three times now and have never had any of those problems. I was actually surprised at how proficient the AI is. The only problem I've ever had with the AI is that sometimes when you have them use the Saboteurrole, they will keep casting the same debuff on an enemy even if that enemy is immune to that particular debuff. Other than that, the AI is practically flawless. Especially in the Medic role. They always heal the character with the lowest health first. The only time they only use 1 low cure spell is when everybody is practically at full health. As for the Commando problem you pointed out, I'm not sure I understand. I almost never used the Commando role. I always relied on the AI for that role. That actually reminds me of one other minor problem. Sometimes when you have the entire party in offensive roles, they all won't attack the same target, which can be very annoying.
How is that any different from the Gambit system? You set up your Gambits, and then the game plays for you, literally. I've had my Gambits set up in such a way before that I could literally put down the controller, and the game played for me. I'm not joking. I've gone through entire boss fights without even pressing a button. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but it's definitely less hands on than the Paradigm system. With Paradigms you can't just set them up, and the game plays for you. Even if you have the perfect Paradigm deck, you'll still get your a** handed to you if you don't switch them in swift and timely fashion.
Overall, I think both systems are good, but I prefer Paradigms over Gambits. Another thing I disliked about FFXII is the fact that every person in your party is pretty much the same in terms of combat abilities. At least in FFXIII there are roles you have to assign to each character. I will give FFXII points for being able to control every character though. No matter how good the AI is in FFXIII, it'll never replace a human player controlling the action.
KH-mixerX
Figuring out a paradigm to use in a battle is so simple that my cat could do it, not only you are limited to 3 paradigms per character for 85% of the game, limiting even more the combinations, but after you gain access to the rest its basically x3 of each role and thats it. There is nothng more to the game.
The fact that the characters dont attack the same targets is because there is no commando in the team, if the AI is a commando it will probably attack a random enemy instead of the one they have to attack (in fights with mulltiple ones) so if you want to do it right, you have to play commando.
Its different from the gambit system as in, you actually have to put some though in the gambit system, if you believe the paradigm system need more asistance than the gambit is just weird, they just need you to change paradigms so they can keep playing for you. In ff12 at least you had to change gambits and experiment with them, you said that FF12 characters played by themselves but that was after you created all the gambit tree they used and in some fights, that just doesnt do the trick. In FF13 once you figure out the paradigms you have to use, wich again, is extremelly simple, you just mash X. L1 sometimes to change roles and thats it.
FF13 characters are basically the same too, they are proficient in 3 roles, and have less stuff in the other 3. But in the end, they are basically the same.
FF13 imo, only had graphics, the music was horrible, the story was meyer-like "derp herp derp herp" (yeah, FF13 is Twilight but in videogame), storytelling was horrible too, the characters annoying, horrible lvl up system (Crystarium), and so on.
---- oh, and just to make it clear, i dont like FF12 that much, imo it was just average, at best. And still, miles better than 13 ----
And seeing how this FF14 topic has degenerated into a FF13 topic, must say that FF14 was and still is horrible broken and boring, and that the quality of the main series has dropped so much in past years that im not surprised at all about this outcome. SquareEnix is just trusting in the FF name to sell games while they do minimal work on them and the less effort possible to create even a decent game.
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
Well, there's a couple reasons that you are wrong. And I'll point them out, but let me first say that you don't have to to use the Auto-Battle button. In fact, there is an option in the configuration menu that specifically makes it so the cursor starts on the Abilities tab, and not the Auto-Battle button. So there you go. Problem fixed.
The reasons I spoke of earlier are the following...
That is exactly the same as setting up your Paradigm deck. You flat out won't get anywhere in FFXIII without knowing how to formulate a specific Paradigm deck for any given situation. You can mash X/A all you want, but if you don't have the correct Paradigms and know when to switch them, you won't progress through the game.
I don't know what version of FFXIII you were playing, but I've beaten the game three times now and have never had any of those problems. I was actually surprised at how proficient the AI is. The only problem I've ever had with the AI is that sometimes when you have them use the Saboteurrole, they will keep casting the same debuff on an enemy even if that enemy is immune to that particular debuff. Other than that, the AI is practically flawless. Especially in the Medic role. They always heal the character with the lowest health first. The only time they only use 1 low cure spell is when everybody is practically at full health. As for the Commando problem you pointed out, I'm not sure I understand. I almost never used the Commando role. I always relied on the AI for that role. That actually reminds me of one other minor problem. Sometimes when you have the entire party in offensive roles, they all won't attack the same target, which can be very annoying.
How is that any different from the Gambit system? You set up your Gambits, and then the game plays for you, literally. I've had my Gambits set up in such a way before that I could literally put down the controller, and the game played for me. I'm not joking. I've gone through entire boss fights without even pressing a button. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but it's definitely less hands on than the Paradigm system. With Paradigms you can't just set them up, and the game plays for you. Even if you have the perfect Paradigm deck, you'll still get your a** handed to you if you don't switch them in swift and timely fashion.
Overall, I think both systems are good, but I prefer Paradigms over Gambits. Another thing I disliked about FFXII is the fact that every person in your party is pretty much the same in terms of combat abilities. At least in FFXIII there are roles you have to assign to each character. I will give FFXII points for being able to control every character though. No matter how good the AI is in FFXIII, it'll never replace a human player controlling the action.
Marmotas
Figuring out a paradigm to use in a battle is so simple that my cat could do it, not only you are limited to 3 paradigms per character for 85% of the game, limiting even more the combinations, but after you gain access to the rest its basically x3 of each role and thats it. There is nothng more to the game.
The fact that the characters dont attack the same targets is because there is no commando in the team, if the AI is a commando it will probably attack a random enemy instead of the one they have to attack (in fights with mulltiple ones) so if you want to do it right, you have to play commando.
Its different from the gambit system as in, you actually have to put some though in the gambit system, if you believe the paradigm system need more asistance than the gambit is just weird, they just need you to change paradigms so they can keep playing for you. In ff12 at least you had to change gambits and experiment with them, you said that FF12 characters played by themselves but that was after you created all the gambit tree they used and in some fights, that just doesnt do the trick. In FF13 once you figure out the paradigms you have to use, wich again, is extremelly simple, you just mash X. L1 sometimes to change roles and thats it.
FF13 characters are basically the same too, they are proficient in 3 roles, and have less stuff in the other 3. But in the end, they are basically the same.
FF13 imo, only had graphics, the music was horrible, the story was meyer-like "derp herp derp herp" (yeah, FF13 is Twilight but in videogame), storytelling was horrible too, the characters annoying, horrible lvl up system (Crystarium), and so on.
---- oh, and just to make it clear, i dont like FF12 that much, imo it was just average, at best. And still, miles better than 13 ----
And seeing how this FF14 topic has degenerated into a FF13 topic, must say that FF14 was and still is horrible broken and boring, and that the quality of the main series has dropped so much in past years that im not surprised at all about this outcome. SquareEnix is just trusting in the FF name to sell games while they do minimal work on them and the less effort possible to create even a decent game.
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I thought the battle system was exciting and deep. The soundtrack is one of my favorites this year. Almost everything about FFXIII, except for the average story, was great in my eyes. I'm sorry you didn't get as much out of it as I did.
As for FFXIV, I haven't played it so I can't really say how I feel about it. Besides, I've never been a big MMO player so even if I had played it, I wouldn't really be qualified to make a judgment.
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I thought the battle system was exciting and deep. The soundtrack is one of my favorites this year. Almost everything about FFXIII, except for the average story, was great in my eyes. I'm sorry you didn't get as much out of it as I did.
KH-mixerX
Finally... someone who agrees. Masashi Hamauzu did a great job. He deserves special credit for making one of the best fight songs this gen.
When was the last time that Square Enix came out with a great game?
ubpoker123
Well they published Just Cause 2 so some props are in order
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I thought the battle system was exciting and deep. The soundtrack is one of my favorites this year. Almost everything about FFXIII, except for the average story, was great in my eyes. I'm sorry you didn't get as much out of it as I did.
fend_oblivion
Finally... someone who agrees. Masashi Hamauzu did a great job. He deserves special credit for making one of the best fight songs this gen.
Join the club. I've been preaching that sermon ever since the game came out. FFXIII's OST is among my top 5 favorite video game soundtracks of all time.
[QUOTE="fend_oblivion"]
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
Well, I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I thought the battle system was exciting and deep. The soundtrack is one of my favorites this year. Almost everything about FFXIII, except for the average story, was great in my eyes. I'm sorry you didn't get as much out of it as I did.
KH-mixerX
Finally... someone who agrees. Masashi Hamauzu did a great job. He deserves special credit for making one of the best fight songs this gen.
Join the club. I've been preaching that sermon ever since the game came out. FFXIII's OST is among my top 5 favorite video game soundtracks of all time.
Same with me. I loved the soundtrack for the game. Sure, it wasn't as good as some past FF soundtracks, but it's definitely not bad.Join the club. I've been preaching that sermon ever since the game came out. FFXIII's OST is among my top 5 favorite video game soundtracks of all time.
KH-mixerX
Please tell me you have Chrono Cross in that list or else :x
I'm in love with Snow's Theme and Blinded By Light. My favorite songs from the FF 13 OST :)
[QUOTE="KH-mixerX"]
Join the club. I've been preaching that sermon ever since the game came out. FFXIII's OST is among my top 5 favorite video game soundtracks of all time.
fend_oblivion
Please tell me you have Chrono Cross in that list or else :x
I'm in love with Snow's Theme and Blinded By Light. My favorite songs from the FF 13 OST :)
I don't actually. I've never played Chrono Cross. My favorite pieces from FFXIII though are...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ad3vezqwGms
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvXrgEVpOKU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kbzEkWyklg&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InLeRju2eOo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFZ6S1sFDco&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEYttrTF10A
Well Hironobu Sakaguchi, the man behind the series, has moved on and is working on The Last Story for the Wii (his new Final Fantasy). But after FFXIV's reviews started coming out he told S-E to "stop milking Final Fantasy!"More importantly, they need to bring back the original team members that made the series a success in order to get them back to that point - where they used to be great, for what they are dishing out now with the recent FF games will not cut it.
And someone said that the battle system was good in FFXIII? People who believe that are just crazy, IMO. Dull, repetitive, and a chore. No fun at all!
Metamania
I agree with the battle system being repetitive. It was strategic sure, but if they just allowed us individual control of the characters then there really would be no need for Paradigm Shift, no need.
Well Hironobu Sakaguchi, the man behind the series, has moved on and is working on The Last Story for the Wii (his new Final Fantasy). But after FFXIV's reviews started coming out he told S-E to "stop milking Final Fantasy!"[QUOTE="Metamania"]
More importantly, they need to bring back the original team members that made the series a success in order to get them back to that point - where they used to be great, for what they are dishing out now with the recent FF games will not cut it.
And someone said that the battle system was good in FFXIII? People who believe that are just crazy, IMO. Dull, repetitive, and a chore. No fun at all!
ZIVX
I agree with the battle system being repetitive. It was strategic sure, but if they just allowed us individual control of the characters then there really would be no need for Paradigm Shift, no need.
It's not about using the Paradigm system to compensate for using only one character. The idea behind the Paradigm system is speed. At least that's what I think. If you would've allowed the player control over every character, then the battle system would be no different from the done-to-death ATB(Active Time Battle) system used in almost every FF since FFV. The Paradigm system allowed for them to speed up the battle dramatically, while still keeping a deep sense of strategy.
[QUOTE="hakanakumono"]The battle system did a lot of things well, and it's clear that that was one part of the game they put a lot of work into (I read that they had a prototype running on PS2 hardware as far back as 2005), but they hamstrung it with short-sided decisions. Specifically, not being able to give an "override" order to any of your other party members, similar to what you could do in XII when Gambits were on, and everyone just giving up in the party leader fell boggled my mind.;With the advent of FFXIII, Square tried to create an engine that could do absolutely everything they would ever want to do with it on the PS3. But it was simply an impossible, foolish task and work on FFXIII relied on the engine. By the time they reached a point where they could actually work on FFXIII, time was running out and they had to prioritize on the elements that were "most important." The problem with this is that while the battle system was definitely the best, the story was just awful with poor directing throughout. If the story had been good, it would have been more excusable. One half of their priorities, not counting graphics, just didn't go well.
However, if anything, I think people enjoy hating on Square these days. I can't see Square ever reaching a point where they'll be well liked again, because they aren't even appreciated for the achievements they did make with FFXIII, in spite of its flaws.
MAILER_DAEMON
Well I actually think the paradigm system didn't hit the game until very late. The game was always imagined as a game where the player would select a number of turns per character, lining them up. This continued with the demo, and it wasn't until later in it's final release year that we saw the paradigm system revealed. With the paradigm system came the option to use "auto battle," which fueled a lot of hate for the game.
Which is interesting, because I found that the "x mashing" complaint I grew to have witht he rest of the series was less prevalent in FFXIII due to actually having to use more than "attack" in common fights.
The battle system did a lot of things well, and it's clear that that was one part of the game they put a lot of work into (I read that they had a prototype running on PS2 hardware as far back as 2005), but they hamstrung it with short-sided decisions. Specifically, not being able to give an "override" order to any of your other party members, similar to what you could do in XII when Gambits were on, and everyone just giving up in the party leader fell boggled my mind.;[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"][QUOTE="hakanakumono"]
With the advent of FFXIII, Square tried to create an engine that could do absolutely everything they would ever want to do with it on the PS3. But it was simply an impossible, foolish task and work on FFXIII relied on the engine. By the time they reached a point where they could actually work on FFXIII, time was running out and they had to prioritize on the elements that were "most important." The problem with this is that while the battle system was definitely the best, the story was just awful with poor directing throughout. If the story had been good, it would have been more excusable. One half of their priorities, not counting graphics, just didn't go well.
However, if anything, I think people enjoy hating on Square these days. I can't see Square ever reaching a point where they'll be well liked again, because they aren't even appreciated for the achievements they did make with FFXIII, in spite of its flaws.
hakanakumono
Well I actually think the paradigm system didn't hit the game until very late. The game was always imagined as a game where the player would select a number of turns per character, lining them up. This continued with the demo, and it wasn't until later in it's final release year that we saw the paradigm system revealed. With the paradigm system came the option to use "auto battle," which fueled a lot of hate for the game.
Which is interesting, because I found that the "x mashing" complaint I grew to have witht he rest of the series was less prevalent in FFXIII due to actually having to use more than "attack" in common fights.
When you think about it, the "Auto-Battle" button is pretty much a fancy name for the "Attack" button. The only reason people complained is because it had the word "Auto" in it. And god forbid should the game do anything for you. But whatever, I'm repeating myself now.
We have to rebuild all our franchises from the ground up again, and turn them into the examples of perfection these once were. I regret that we let them slip into such shoddy products.Yoichi Wada - Square Enix CEOSE stock value is at a 10 year low and their profits plunged 90%. FF13 was bad for their earnings, but FF14 may be the worst mistake the company has ever made.
Please Log In to post.
Log in to comment