Square-Enix: "Anyone who tries to make an original game will be fired"

So we all complain about how games are getting stale in their originality and then the sad truth eventually gets brought up that few people buy original games. And now we have a dramatic, real-world example of that coming from Square-Enix. Apparantly the company's profits were so bad in 2007 that he's issued an ultimatum saying that if the company doesn't begin focusing exclusively on mainstream tastes that job cuts will follow. So if you liked The World Ends With You, too bad, you're never seeing anything like it again coming out of SE.

Source 1
Source 2

Oh, please. Perhaps if The World Ends With You wasn't bookended by fifty-seven different volumes of Final Fantasy, I'd see his point.

I think he has a point that the market is largely sequel driven, but I think Square has no one to blame but themselves for this. I'm actually shocked that people are shocked. This is business as usual for Square.

Oh, please. Perhaps if The World Ends With You wasn't bookended by fifty-seven different volumes of Final Fantasy, I'd see his point.

I think he has a point that the market is largely sequel driven, but I think Square has no one to blame but themselves for this. I'm actually shocked that people are shocked. This is business as usual for Square.

Shame-usBlackley

True, this doesn't really change much seeing as how SE is more of a Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest factory than a developer, but it just goes to show how easily devs get fed up with taking risks. But you are right that this is mostly SE's fault. They did a terrible job promoting the game.

SE is disgusting me with this kind of mentality. some of its best work in the SNES days was new IP. SE is becoming like nintendo for me. i will still, reluctantly, buy FF because i love it, but my respect for them is in the crapper. i no longer look to them for exciting new IP. they are just a sequel factory.

i understand that money makes things cost prohibitive these days but w/e, they can have their profits and lose my respect, they were already doing this anyway.

Then why are they starting several new series for the 360, like Infinite Undiscovery? O.oSirFrosty

SE is the Publisher, Tri Ace is the developer.

Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.MAILER_DAEMON

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

Wierd. Recently, I read the SE prez saying he wanted to reach out to the western market more and he was hinting on merging with western developers like Ubisoft, for example.

Also, what's going to happen to games like Last Remnant, Infinite Undiscovery, etc.?

Anyway, expect more zippers, spiky hair, big swords, metrosexual protagonists, and chicks that look like they are advertisting a cosplay fashion show with the name Final on the titles more often. ;)

[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"]Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.juradai

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

I couldn't agree more. I actually bought WEWY and it's definitely NOT worth the $40 price tag.

Its a shame, but there are still talented teams such as NIS, TriAce and Level 5 who make quality original jrpgs.

So who do we blame for this mentality? Senior management or the idiots who buy every incarnation of FFIV? It is sequel driven because we all decide to buy their re-re-re-remakes. Granted it will generate money to run these remakes, you spend nada on scripts or translations, just update the graphics and off you go, a platinum hit made for peanuts.

Squeenix used to be the best in the business, as of late, Atlus has been eating up most of my money, and they deserve every cent of it.

SCREW SQUARE-ENIX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11 If they dont translate and bring over Front Mission 5 they can go bankrupt for all i care. Lazy buttholes.

Maybe they will finally give what people want. cough*FF7Remake*cough. Da_Ryce_One

Wada's analysis couldn't possibly be any more wrong. The only thing that appears to be insular are the people advising him. SE is the mainstream. If their port-a-thons and whoring out of spin-offs onto the handheld market doesn't scream mainstream, then I don't know what the mainstream is. It's the market that has rejected SE's products and direction. How many freaking times and ways do I need to play Square classics?

Hey Wada, here's some advice for you, how's about putting some of those licenses that you've buried to good use. Remember Chrono? How about Parasite Eve? Remember when you bought the Ogre franchise from Atlus or did that slip your mind? Think of what could be done with Xenogears? By the way, would it kill you guys to go multiplatform with FF XIII?

The problem isn't that your developers are putting out games "that only they want to play." They're developing games that NO ONE wants to play.

Maybe the shakeup is a good thing after all, it should have occured long ago. Hopefully it'll add some sense of urgency to Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FF XIII.

i think jrpg's on on the 360 and ps3 is going to be a hard sell. the wii is the only relavant console in japan which is obviously a large market for jrpg's. i think square would do well for itself to spend big bucks for now to establish a franchise in a more western genre.

Hey Wada, here's some advice for you, how's about putting some of those licenses that you've buried to good use. Remember Chrono? How about Parasite Eve? Remember when you bought the Ogre franchise from Atlus or did that slip your mind?

MarcusAntonius

Wada's analysis couldn't possibly be any more wrong. The only thing that appears to be insular are the people advising him. SE is the mainstream. If their port-a-thons and whoring out of spin-offs onto the handheld market doesn't scream mainstream, then I don't know what the mainstream is. It's the market that has rejected SE's products and direction. How many freaking times and ways do I need to play Square classics?

Hey Wada, here's some advice for you, how's about putting some of those licenses that you've buried to good use. Remember Chrono? How about Parasite Eve? Remember when you bought the Ogre franchise from Atlus or did that slip your mind? Think of what could be done with Xenogears? By the way, would it kill you guys to go multiplatform with FF XIII?

The problem isn't that your developers are putting out games "that only they want to play." They're developing games that NO ONE wants to play.

Maybe the shakeup is a good thing after all, it should have occured long ago. Hopefully it'll add some sense of urgency to Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FF XIII.

MarcusAntonius

I always enjoy your posts, you know. You rarely find informed individuals on GS. In recent years, Atlus really has replaced Square-Enix as THE JRPG publisher. Even where sequels are concerned, Atlus has trumped Square-Enix (P3 v FFXII). This doesn't mean that Atlus are becoming a flawless publisher, because the JRPG development/publishing companies in their totality are stagnant, in part due to how the Japanese market has progressed. Many publishers and developers from Japan are apparently having difficulty with reconciling the differences between the Japanese market and NA/European markets. One of the primary problems is quite simple: the market for JRPGs throughout the world has dwindled, so there is little incentive to create new IPs or even bring back old IPs (like PE, Chrono, etc.) that are primarily remembered by people whom don't play video games anymore. I do agree with you on old IPs being a possible revitalization of Square-Enix. The problem is that they're already doing this. The problem is that they are producing new titles for old IPs that are inarguably niche (Valkyrie Profile or Star Ocean ringing any bells?). While an excellent Chrono sequel could easily surpass the next Final Fantasy, if done well, one of the major issues with revitalizing old IPs is available talent. For most of us, a Chrono sequel or Xenogears sequel would have to FEEL like Chrono or Xenogears. The issue is that most of the programmers, composers, etc. that worked on these titles have moved on to other developing companies and new publishing partners or owners (see: NamcoBandai, Mistwalker Studios). So instead we get...Valyrie Profile 2: Silmeria. Yeah, thanks. Because I REALLY needed another Valkyrie Profile game. I agree on Ogre Battles as well. Such a title doesn't require the original development team and could easily bring younger gamers in to the TBS genre. While Atlus publishes good titles, without Square Enix the genre can't enjoy the market saturation it deserves. Atlus just doesn't have the means to accomplish such a feat.

While I dream of Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FFXIII (as well as the next Star Ocean) being amazing, I can't imagine any of them being the next Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy VI, Xenogears, Parasite Eve, etc. In so far as I can see, the issue is two-fold. First, they rely heavily on FF for annual profits, so remaking FFVII would only concrete what we both already recognize, which is the utter stagnation of SE's development process. Second, they lack much of the talent that made Squaresoft and Enix feel like Squaresoft and Enix. Even their development subsidiaries are subpar (like Tri-Ace). The problem is that a FFVII remake would sell, and I see SE remaking FFVII before attempting to come up with a new revolutionary IP on par with Chrono or FF.

I, like most other people, am also tired of the endless remakes and ports. The spin-offs are childish and short-sighted. Does Wada and SE's board really believe that the dedicated fans of FF - most of us being adults - want to play Crystal Chronicles or Chocobo Hunter? How many of us didn't play FFVI? How many of us didn't already play Valkyrie Profile on the PSX? While another poster stated that these are low-cost profit generators, quite the opposite is true. While such ports and spin-offs CAN be profitable, when they make up 60% of your yearly output the opposite is true. These ports and spin-offs require high profile titles that generate hundreds of millions in revenues to compliment them. That is, to allow various areas of the market to have the product they expect and want. Some publishers seem to be making the mistake of focusing on the portable consoles too much, and SE are at the forefront here.

Beh, I don't feel like continuing, I need to take a shower. Maybe I'll finish my thoughts later...or forget entirely. Sorry for rambling.

Maybe they will finally give what people want. cough*FF7Remake*cough. Da_Ryce_One

Yeah, great news! I want it!

[QUOTE="juradai"]

[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"]Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.ASK_Story

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

I couldn't agree more. I actually bought WEWY and it's definitely NOT worth the $40 price tag.

I hear that. Game was overhyped and overpriced.

I wonder how long this can continue.

Why is the videogame business is the only one where original products are bad business?

I wonder how long this can continue.

Why is the videogame business is the only one where original products are bad business?

Oilers99

Because most of the time, its often hard to make a quick buck out of something that isn't proven.

[QUOTE="MarcusAntonius"]

Wada's analysis couldn't possibly be any more wrong. The only thing that appears to be insular are the people advising him. SE is the mainstream. If their port-a-thons and whoring out of spin-offs onto the handheld market doesn't scream mainstream, then I don't know what the mainstream is. It's the market that has rejected SE's products and direction. How many freaking times and ways do I need to play Square classics?

Hey Wada, here's some advice for you, how's about putting some of those licenses that you've buried to good use. Remember Chrono? How about Parasite Eve? Remember when you bought the Ogre franchise from Atlus or did that slip your mind? Think of what could be done with Xenogears? By the way, would it kill you guys to go multiplatform with FF XIII?

The problem isn't that your developers are putting out games "that only they want to play." They're developing games that NO ONE wants to play.

Maybe the shakeup is a good thing after all, it should have occured long ago. Hopefully it'll add some sense of urgency to Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FF XIII.

YourChaosIsntMe

I always enjoy your posts, you know. You rarely find informed individuals on GS. In recent years, Atlus really has replaced Square-Enix as THE JRPG publisher. Even where sequels are concerned, Atlus has trumped Square-Enix (P3 v FFXII) This doesn't mean that Atlus are becoming a flawless publisher, because the JRPG development/publishing companies in their totality are stagnant, in part due to how the Japanese market has progressed. Many publishers and developers from Japan are apparently having difficulty with reconciling the differences between the Japanese market and NA/European markets. One of the primary problems is quite simple: the market for JRPGs throughout the world has dwindled, so there is little incentive to create new IPs or even bring back old IPs (like PE, Chrono, etc.) that are primarily remembered by people whom don't play video games anymore. I do agree with you on old IPs being a possible revitalization of Square-Enix. The problem is that they're ALREADY DOING THIS. The problem is that they producing new titles for old IPs that are inarguably niche (Valkyrie Profile or Star Ocean ringing any bells?). While an excellent Chrono sequel could easily surpass the next Final Fantasy, if done well, one of the major issues with revitalizing old IPs is available talent. For most of us, a Chrono sequel or Xenogears sequel would have to FEEL like Chrono or Xenogears. The issue is that most of the programmers, composers, etc. that worked on these titles have moved on to other developing companies and new publishing partners or owners (see: NamcoBandai, Mistwalker Studios). So instead we get...Valyrie Profile 2: Silmeria. Yeah, thanks. Because I REALLY needed another Valkyrie Profile game. I agree on Ogre Battles as well. Such a title doesn't require the original development team and could easily bring younger gamers in to the TBS genre. While Atlus publishes good titles, without Square Enix the genre can't enjoy the market saturation it deserves. Atlus just doesn't have the means to accomplish such a feat.

While I dream of Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FFXIII (as well as the next Star Ocean) being amazing, I can't imagine any of them being the next Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy VI, Xenogears, Parasite Eve, etc. In so far as I can see, the issue is two-fold. First, they rely heavily on FF for annual profits, so remaking FFVII would only concrete what we both already recognize, which is the utter stagnation of SE's development process. Second, they lack much of the talent that made Squaresoft and Enix feel like Squaresoft and Enix. Even their development subsidiaries are subpar (like Tri-Ace). The problem is that a FFVII remake would sell, and I see SE remaking FFVII before attempting to come up with a new revolutionary IP on par with Chrono or FF.

I, like most other people, am also tired of the endless remakes and ports. The spin-offs are childish and short-sighted. Does Wada and SE's board really believe that the dedicated fans of FF - most of us being adults - want to play Crystal Chronicles or Chocobo Hunter? How many of us didn't play FFVI? How many of us didn't already play Valkyrie Profile on the PSX? While another poster stated that these are low-cost profit generators, quite the opposite is true. While such ports and spin-offs CAN be profitable, when they make up 60% of your yearly output the opposite is true. These ports and spin-offs require high profile titles that generate hundreds of millions in revenues to compliment them. That is, to allow various areas of the market to have the product they expect and want. Some publishers seem to be making the mistake of focusing on the portable consoles too much, and SE are at the forefront here.

Beh, I don't feel like continuing, I need to take a shower. Maybe I'll finish my thoughts later...or forget entirely. Sorry for rambling.

I made the point about a year or two ago on these very forums that JRPGs aren't the same anymore really that they have become stagnant in most cases as you say here. Maybe its because I am older and I just don't care about games anymore I don't know. But there is no RPG in the future that interests me anymore I was into all the old JRPGs that people have discussed here but I just summarized that JRPGs have become stagnant and I was ridiculed for it on these forums and I layed out SE as one of those companies. Don't get me wrong I am excited to see what they will do with Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FFXIII cause I am craving a good RPG. I was really disappointed with FFXII. It was just the lack of turn based RPG, but give them credit for trying real-time, but I still thought they didn't do it right like Bioware has done.

So it is unfortunate that this is the direction of SE now when it was games that were original that made them the company they are today. But the TWEWY maybe the right idea but I haven't played it didn't seem to what people are looking for. Well most people are looking for a FFVII remake including myself but I just will summarize perhaps it is time SE maybe becomes a less successful company for a few years and overtime they maybe revitalize themselves just like Nintendo did (although I don't mean become casual and an uninteresting company, but have a new idea about how to makes games).

Maybe they will finally give what people want. cough*FF7Remake*cough. Da_Ryce_One

See, it isn't all bad! Now you will have more chances to buy games you played 10 years ago all over again!

Alright, enough with the sarcasm. Your attitude is the reason why Square-Enix needs to put out sequels, and why the quality of their games isn't where it used to be. You reward them for how they brand their games and not their quality.

Games are too big, and Square-enix won't commit to developing new franchises; or even digging up old neglected franchises that haven't been tested for years (aka chrono)

This really is business as usual, but it's business as usual that's hurting Square-enix

They're over-milking DQ/FF and thus weakening their brand image, it's their overreliance that's killing them. Their foray into incompatible markets like Mobile and 360 are also problems.

Digging up old franchises and pursuing low-cost markets such as DS and Wii are the only real solutions. I'd do a lot of quick mobile to DS ports as well.

Also you need to have inspired developers willing to do fun, exciting things, threatening your workers into doing the same-old isn't helping them keep good talent.

The issue is that most of the programmers, composers, etc. that worked on these titles have moved on to other developing companies and new publishing partners or owners (see: NamcoBandai, Mistwalker Studios). So instead we get...Valyrie Profile 2: Silmeria. Yeah, thanks. Because I REALLY needed another Valkyrie Profile game.

While I dream of Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FFXIII (as well as the next Star Ocean) being amazing, I can't imagine any of them being the next Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy VI, Xenogears, Parasite Eve, etc. In so far as I can see, the issue is two-fold. First, they rely heavily on FF for annual profits, so remaking FFVII would only concrete what we both already recognize, which is the utter stagnation of SE's development process. Second, they lack much of the talent that made Squaresoft and Enix feel like Squaresoft and Enix. Even their development subsidiaries are subpar (like Tri-Ace). The problem is that a FFVII remake would sell, and I see SE remaking FFVII before attempting to come up with a new revolutionary IP on par with Chrono or FF.

YourChaosIsntMe

Here's where we'll butt heads a bit. Silmeria, despite its problems (some aspects of gameplay being poorly conceived and executed, questionable character design, one of the major features of the first VP game 'einherjar' reduced to almost an afterthought in VP2, and a plot that completely fell apart mid-game) was one of the few things that kept SE credible and was arguably the best work SE put out last gen IMO. But then again, even as a VP fanboy, I'd be remiss if I didn't admit that based on the sales of VP, it had no ******* business getting a sequel. In this respect, we agree.

However, it was nice to see SE doing something besides going back to the well for once. After all, fair is fair and I applauded SE for their attempt to resurrect VP.

Given the new current direction of SE, it seems like old-fashioned penny-pinching is the reason for avoiding the most revenue friendly decision in green lighting a FF VII remake. Not that this is something I would ever want to see, but in terms of easy money, it seems to be the most rational project for SE to undertake.

And I wouldn't call Tri-Ace subpar, not completely anyway. Throughout the 32-bit age, Tri-Ace pushed the envelope of RPG development in ways that Squaresoft didn't dare approach, that is until they wound up in the clutches of SE and suffered through their meddling. This was likely the reason for Star Ocean 3 being a colassal disappointment that dropped way off from SO2. It seems like Tri-Ace is a developer that no one really knows what to expect from anymore. Its either boom or bust with this group. Hence the reason why I have cautious optimism for Infinite Undiscovery.

i just personally think that SE will have to fall from grace to realize that they need to shake things up. i don't put much clout into what people say about so and so leaving the company and killing it. fresh blood is a good thing. the problem is the old suits sitting around saying well hey, this made us money so this is what we will repead ad nauseam.

i actually kind of hope that FFXIII flops, although i know it wont. it would give them reason to get off their rears and do something creative.

Square-Enix has indeed gotten too sequel-happy, and the backlash from the gaming public is deserved. There's no two ways about it.

At the same time, if we're talking about money and nothing more, I fail to see how their current viewpoint differs from that of any other major publisher these days. I'm also sick and tired of seeing people complain bitterly about sequels. We are in the midst of one of the best gaming stretches in history, and what do we have?

Grand Theft Auto IV
Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
Devil May Cry 4
Gran Turismo 5
Final Fantasy XIII
Gears of War 2
Halo 3
Bioshock 2 and Mass Effect 2 (start of series)
Guitar Hero IV
Resident Evil 5
Marios
Maddens

The biggest games of this generation are almost ALL sequels, and oh yeah, they're also some of the best games ever made. I just find it immensely ironic (and a little bit funny) that we have all these threads pining over the loss of IPs, and then millions are sold of the preceding games, and they're raking in ridiculous review scores. This being the current state of gaming, why SHOULDN'T S-E adopt this approach? Their only problem is that their sequels aren't of the high quality we're familiar with, but that doesn't make the concept wrong. Furthermore, S-E's slacking only affects these lacking sequels; in no way will it affect FFXIII, and I doubt anything thinks it will. On top of which, no entry in the primary FF series can be considered a "sequel," anyway (save FFX-2), which only proves that S-E simply has to kick things up a notch if they want to play the sequel game.

See above.

It's not so much sequels that people have a probelm with as 12 installments of FF would attest to. It's more the issue of massive porting and spamming the PSP and DS with spin-offs that is largely becoming the majority of SE's work that people are having a problem with.

Again, SE cannot be be written off with four feature releases on the way out, so they still get the benefit of the doubt. However, Wada's comments only serve to invite a lot of flames and snickering. His comments may not have adaquately addressed his true concerns, but the cat is out of the bag and given SE's releases over the past few years, it is fairly reasonable to accept his comments from the article at face value.

It's a complex issue, no doubt about that. With development costs skyrocketing, game devs walk a really thin line every time a high profile game is in the works. Sticking with the things that have proven profitable in the past is nothing but a sound line of reasoning, from a financial standpoint. After all, they still need to make a profit if they're supposed to stay in business.

I guess the ideal thing would be trying to reach some sort of balance between sticking to sequels (which drive the market, as has been pointed out before) and offering new IPs.

[QUOTE="mohmaaytah"]

So who do we blame for this mentality? Senior management or the idiots who buy every incarnation of FFIV?

fathoms_basic

Considering that every last FF since FFIV has been entirely and completely different in every possible way, and considering the average review score for those games is probably somewhere in the low to mid-9s, this may be the most ridiculous statement I've ever read.

Don't infect people with this, please.

I think he is talking about the people who actually bought Final Fantasy 4 multiple times in all its rereleases. There is a group of people that buy everything with Final Fantasy on the box regardless of wether they have played it or not or if it is a totally different and much worse game like Dirge of Cerebus.

I guess the ideal thing would be trying to reach some sort of balance between sticking to sequels (which drive the market, as has been pointed out before) and offering new IPs.

SteelAttack

That's just it though, SE doesn't need new IPs, though I'm pleased to see two original titles on the way out. SE has a wealth of IPs that are collecting dust. Why SE refrains from flexing that muscle is beyond me. Sure, VP2 was cool and all, but why bring back such a niche IP while Chrono fades into obscurity?

It's weird, because lately I thought their portfolio was quite interesting - The World Ends With You, The Last Remnant, Infinite Undiscovery...

Although I would be certainly pleased to see more Parasite Eve. Perhaps as a episodic series?

[QUOTE="SteelAttack"]

I guess the ideal thing would be trying to reach some sort of balance between sticking to sequels (which drive the market, as has been pointed out before) and offering new IPs.

MarcusAntonius

That's just it though, SE doesn't need new IPs, though I'm pleased to see two original titles on the way out. SE has a wealth of IPs that are collecting dust. Why SE refrains from flexing that muscle is beyond me. Sure, VP2 was cool and all, but why bring back such a niche IP while Chrono fades into obscurity?

maybe they are afraid to poop all over it like they did to the poor, poor mana "series".

[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"]Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.juradai

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

seriously...weighing TWEWY at $30 against Persona FES at $30 i'll go with Persona every time.

[QUOTE="juradai"]

[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"]Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.N8A

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

seriously...weighing TWEWY at $30 against Persona FES at $30 i'll go with Persona every time.

[QUOTE="N8A"][QUOTE="juradai"]

[QUOTE="MAILER_DAEMON"]Maybe if they wouldn't spend so much money and time making underwhelming games, I'd actually buy some. Aside from DS and PSP, they just don't release anything.Skylock00

Exactly.

I also would like to point out that the only thing that has prevented me from buying TWEWY is the $39.99 price tag. I honestly feel that it's just too much for a handheld game.

seriously...weighing TWEWY at $30 against Persona FES at $30 i'll go with Persona every time.

haha whoops i was trying to give them a little benefit of the doubt...I just dont think any portable game should be more than $30.

i'm lazy to write long but i think the problem lies with consumers too. yes they make many ports, spin-offs or any other attempts to make money but thats because of people want them.

look at FFXII, they tried, added many new things and it was great but people say its not a FF game ? i think most of people here and there are bound to nostalgia ALOT. do you think FF7 remake will use that same battle system again ? i think not. but lets assume it used the same battle system again and how many people will like it again ? i think more than half of fans will not enjoy it because its so old and boring today. but people still blindly want old things in Square games...

some of you gave Atlus example, how do they succeed ? with new things. before did you play Persona 2 before Persona 3 ? there is hardly similarity in them. at P2 time Atlus was not so big company and many people even didnt hear of it but people who played it loved it. now with P3 they give an earthshake even though they didnt have superior graphics. also which SMT game has similarity between them ? they are just like FF series, only main idea is the same but totally different games.

but when SE does new things majority cant accept it because they still masturbate about FF7... i dont talk about ports, spin-offs etc. i'm talking about FFXII like changes. also people say its not FF game because this man, that man left the team so it cannot be the same. thats pure biased views. personally, before i played FFXII i thought its a bad game due to people here but after I played the game myself it became my favorite FF game, with its gameplay,musics,visuals, in short, with everything.

so now they are afraid of making new things because people still want remakes, old things etc. and actually they give what people want right now...

Does anyone really wonder about this?All Square-based games,exept Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts had been not really good or bad.Well in case of FF they´re far from the SNES/PS1-Parts but they´re at least successful.Kingdom Hearts is the only new thing that had been at least good...and sold great.But that´s all...and they want to make money after all.

i'm lazy to write long but i think the problem lies with consumers too. yes they make many ports, spin-offs or any other attempts to make money but thats because of people want them.

TheLegendKnight

But if SE is taking a hit on profits, then perhaps consumers are no longer the problem. It reflects a decline in brand name confidence.

[QUOTE="YourChaosIsntMe"]

The issue is that most of the programmers, composers, etc. that worked on these titles have moved on to other developing companies and new publishing partners or owners (see: NamcoBandai, Mistwalker Studios). So instead we get...Valyrie Profile 2: Silmeria. Yeah, thanks. Because I REALLY needed another Valkyrie Profile game.

While I dream of Infinite Undiscovery, Last Remnant, and FFXIII (as well as the next Star Ocean) being amazing, I can't imagine any of them being the next Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy VI, Xenogears, Parasite Eve, etc. In so far as I can see, the issue is two-fold. First, they rely heavily on FF for annual profits, so remaking FFVII would only concrete what we both already recognize, which is the utter stagnation of SE's development process. Second, they lack much of the talent that made Squaresoft and Enix feel like Squaresoft and Enix. Even their development subsidiaries are subpar (like Tri-Ace). The problem is that a FFVII remake would sell, and I see SE remaking FFVII before attempting to come up with a new revolutionary IP on par with Chrono or FF.

MarcusAntonius

Here's where we'll butt heads a bit. Silmeria, despite its problems (some aspects of gameplay being poorly conceived and executed, questionable character design, one of the major features of the first VP game 'einherjar' reduced to almost an afterthought in VP2, and a plot that completely fell apart mid-game) was one of the few things that kept SE credible and was arguably the best work SE put out last gen IMO. But then again, even as a VP fanboy, I'd be remiss if I didn't admit that based on the sales of VP, it had no ******* business getting a sequel. In this respect, we agree.

However, it was nice to see SE doing something besides going back to the well for once. After all, fair is fair and I applauded SE for their attempt to resurrect VP.

Given the new current direction of SE, it seems like old-fashioned penny-pinching is the reason for avoiding the most revenue friendly decision in green lighting a FF VII remake. Not that this is something I would ever want to see, but in terms of easy money, it seems to be the most rational project for SE to undertake.

And I wouldn't call Tri-Ace subpar, not completely anyway. Throughout the 32-bit age, Tri-Ace pushed the envelope of RPG development in ways that Squaresoft didn't dare approach, that is until they wound up in the clutches of SE and suffered through their meddling. This was likely the reason for Star Ocean 3 being a colassal disappointment that dropped way off from SO2. It seems like Tri-Ace is a developer that no one really knows what to expect from anymore. Its either boom or bust with this group. Hence the reason why I have cautious optimism for Infinite Undiscovery.

I really feel like I need to clarify that I was only referring to Tri-Ace as subpar last generation. Star Ocean: The Second Story is easily one of the greatest RPGs on the PSX. I only considered last-gen because it wasn't until last generation that we all began to lose our collective confidence in Square-Enix. I also admit that I was a little harsh on VP, because I did like the original and I enjoyed Silmeria as well, save for a few glaring flaws. I just think it was a poor financial decision on their part. The same criticism could be extended to the Mana series, Star Ocean series, Grandia series, etc. The issue extends to the various development teams they publish, which only makes the problem more severe. There seem to be just as many DS and PSP games published by SE as there are games that are developed and published by SE, and most of them are either mediocre or cater to a niche audience, and I think this does relate to what I said earlier about the loss of development teams/individual talent. While I might agree that VP is some of their best work last-gen, there wasn't really that much to compare it to. I enjoyed almost all of the SE games last-gen, yet I've forgotten almost all of them (with the major exceptions being FFX and VP2).