Can Real Games Survive On A System Focused Toward New And Casual Gamers?

Please read THIS

Then edit your post (meaning it's what you'll want to do after reading that article he linked)

Also you have the wrong impression of what E3 is.

It's for the industry, not the fans. The fans have no place at E3.

Nintendo does not need to show games at E3 because that doesn't make devs want to jump aboard. They need to show others why devs should jump on the Wii's bandwagon.

The Wii Fit Balance Board was the biggest thing at E3 and allowed devs to plan for new hardware. It also took the worldwide media by storm which has not settled to this very day.

while I understand E3 is an "industry event" it is also a spring board for people in the industry to find out about what's new in the gaming world so they can tell all the fans about it it magazines and on websites like gamespot. What happens at E3 is big news for gamers the world over looking for info on what is coming out for there favorite system or PC games or otherwise. Not to mention most of the gaming industry is composed of gamers and fans alike. To say that E3 is only for the gaming industry or means nothing to fans of video games is misleading to say the least but your entitled to your opinion.LightsaberBlues

No it's not, once again you're trying to make E3 something it is not.

Here's their mantra straight from the E3 site......

"Washington, DC – December 18, 2007 – The 2008 E3 Media & Business Summit will take place from July 15 – 17, 2008, at the Los Angeles Convention Center (LACC), the Entertainment Software Association (ESA) announced today. The event will continue to focus on the business of the computer and video game industry, with an emphasis on press events and small meetings with media, development, and other key sectors. While there will be opportunities for game demonstrations, the 2008 E3 Media & Business Summit will not feature the large trade show environment of previous years."

Knowledge is power!

From what I have seen with sales and public opinion the Wii is still for the most part made up of hardcore gamers. People on these forums can mimic what they here but its just a reality that has to be met.

There are some good games but if they strive in quality they lack the marketing funds to make it well known and significant for the average buyer. We constantly hear about developers talking about PS3 and 360 in pairs and then they go off to say they are going to do something quirky and offbeat on the Wii. I think games like de Blob and Deadly Creatures is a move in the right direction. Most people just want good games. They dont need to jump through all these weird hoops and they dont need to be quick cheap PS2 ports.

Whatever happens something has got to give. Nintendo fans have to go the extra mile to support those few good third party games (they are not) and devs have to make games on the quality that is seen with Bioshock and CoD4. its a two way deal and once ithappens we will see a real revolution. In the meantime we will continue to see gold from Nintendo on their little island seperated from all these other developers and we will see half hearted or ill marketed efforts from devss.

This is basically how it will go down feel free to reply.

I think you'd be better off continuing this in System Wars

i hope you realize there is another game coming out that uses the balance board thats not Wii Fitair_wolf_cubed

like?

[QUOTE="air_wolf_cubed"]i hope you realize there is another game coming out that uses the balance board thats not Wii FitSonick54

like?

There's 20 or so in production right now

It was a news story here a while ago

[QUOTE="air_wolf_cubed"]i hope you realize there is another game coming out that uses the balance board thats not Wii FitSonick54

like?

And sure the Wii fit might be an interesting gimmick like the zapper that came out last year but how many times in the past couple months have you bothered even picking up the zapper let alone using to play a real game. Almost every game made for the zapper plays better without it. And while the Wii fit board is a little more interesting than a piece of plastic that holds your wiimote and nunchuck it still remains to be seen if it will be of any use with any real games. My guess is if your excited about Wii fit it's because there is nothing else to get excited about for Wii this year. At least untill we find out more about Nintendo's future plans beyond Wii fit.LightsaberBlues

It seems all you see is that Wii Fit is the only thing that is coming.

Tales of Symphonia 2, Deadly Creatures, Monster Hunter 3, Mushroom Men, Fatal Frame IV, Fragile, Blast Works, Okami (if you didn't play that before), Rygar, King Story, ... are the games you should watch as well. I'm sure a Pikmin or Animal Crossing is coming.

Wii Fit is for another demographic. But a "real" gamer could find fun this "non-game".

[QUOTE="Sonick54"]

[QUOTE="air_wolf_cubed"]i hope you realize there is another game coming out that uses the balance board thats not Wii FitJaysonguy

like?

There's 20 or so in production right now

It was a news story here a while ago

I heard it's 10 games not 20. I could see a 1080o Snowboarding game using it. That's why Project HAMMER had been canned. Project HAMMER was made by NST and 1080o is also made by NST.

The Wii already had better third party sales then the Gamecube at this point

Also out of the top sellers in the Wii's library for third party games only 3 of them are "casual" games

Again I ask that if you're just going to badmouth the system and it's users please take this to System Wars. Also research the facts more before you go so you can make a better argument

Please read THIS

Then edit your post (meaning it's what you'll want to do after reading that article he linked)

Jaysonguy

darn you beat me to the link! lol but yeah.

to TC: dont make walls. its hard to see your point from over here.

We can talk and talk and talk but the same people who are complaining about the lack of third party games would rather buy Mario Party 8 or Mario and Sonic at the olympics than buy No More Heroes or MoH: H2. I think there are more hardcores on board for Wii and they are also buying up those games that are considered trash here.

Once this strange wall between Nintendo fans and third party developers falls we can expect great things. But I dont see it getting better. In fact were probabaly gonna go a whole generation based off of good sleeper hits and blockbuster Nintendo first party games. Hell so far its got me interested in Wii more than 360 but I was hoping that Wii would be the next SNES but its not and probabaly never will.

I too consider myself to be a true gamer. I get very frustrated with the lack of 3rd party games on the wii as well as deficiency in content of the 3rd party games we have. If a game goes multi-platform, the ps3/360 get a butt load of content plus more and the wii gets a lot less and like no online play/content or nothing. its like wii gets treated like the bastard step child of gaming. True the wii is successful but theres really nothing there for the hardcore gamer. A 3rd party will say "oh we're working on this game for the 360/ps3 that is going to be awesome and on the side, we we're working on some game for the wii. It just seems that they feel the wii isn't work wasting time on.

Like so many people are upset with Harmonix over rockband wii and some are going as far as making petititions to get them to give us a decent version but Harmonix probably realized (as most 3rd parties do) that when a game goes multi-platform it won't do as well on the wii as it does on others. so why waste time. Nintendo really should stop hiding out on its own lil island and maybe work with thes 3rd partys as far as promotion is concerned. this alienation is going to make 3rd parties not want to work hard on games for the wii or give us half-arsed games because they know they wont make much off of it but just want to satisfy a few consumers.

After a while I'm starting to understand why Suda said what he did. I'm not saying I agree with him but I understand where the frustration is coming from.

I too consider myself to be a true gamer. I get very frustrated with the lack of 3rd party games on the wii as well as deficiency in content of the 3rd party games we have. If a game goes multi-platform, the ps3/360 get a butt load of content plus more and the wii gets a lot less and like no online play/content or nothing. its like wii gets treated like the bastard step child of gaming. True the wii is successful but theres really nothing there for the hardcore gamer. A 3rd party will say "oh we're working on this game for the 360/ps3 that is going to be awesome and on the side, we we're working on some game for the wii. It just seems that they feel the wii isn't work wasting time on.

Like so many people are upset with Harmonix over rockband wii and some are going as far as making petititions to get them to give us a decent version but Harmonix probably realized (as most 3rd parties do) that when a game goes multi-platform it won't do as well on the wii as it does on others. so why waste time. Nintendo really should stop hiding out on its own lil island and maybe work with thes 3rd partys as far as promotion is concerned. this alienation is going to make 3rd parties not want to work hard on games for the wii or give us half-arsed games because they know they wont make much off of it but just want to satisfy a few consumers.

I personally could understand why Suda said what he did about nintendo gamers. Not saying I agree with him but I understand his frustration.

BrooklynHotBoy

But not everyone buys No More Heroes. Even though they should... I suspect Ninja Reflex will sell more than No More Heroes...LightsaberBlues

The first crappy japanesse weeks of NMH outsell Ninja Reflex. Pull it up in VGCHARTZ.

Jaysonguy can you pull out your post that shows casual mini-games shovelware comps don't sell?

Perhaps one day i will not be in the minority on this subject but I just can't bring myself to believe that the Wii isn't capable of a great third party game. Or am I of the impression that Nintendo isn't capable of creating great games that don't star mario or zelda. Nintendo could be taking more risks in the type of games it's making too as well as looking to outside sources to try and fill in the huge gaps in the Wii library (adventure/RPGs/shooters/action)since it seems to not want to touch those types of games. It could be a match made in heaven (Eternal Darkness) or in hell (Giest) but if Nintendo doesn't want to do something themselves about the problem and third parties are too afraid to risk trying something new all you can expect in the future is disapointment. I love Nintendo. I've grown up with Nintendo and will continue to be a Nintendo advocate but sometimes the truth hurts and this is one of those times. Boy does it sting!LightsaberBlues

I agree. I don't know why so many people defend the quality of third party games here. The truth is that the wii has a new demographic which has greatly attracted sub-par games. Hopefully developers will soon realize that they cannot survive on these sub-par, non-games any longer.

Well, it seems like Nintendo is changing. Wii doesn't cater as much to those long time fans still looking for the type of quality titles from the NES/SNES days. And Nintendo knows it.

Hell, Nintendo was one of the first reasons I knew what a law suite was. Tengen got sued twice for releasing worthwhile games on NES. These days, the Official Nintendo Seal of Quality is gone. End of story.

[QUOTE="BrooklynHotBoy"]

I too consider myself to be a true gamer. I get very frustrated with the lack of 3rd party games on the wii as well as deficiency in content of the 3rd party games we have. If a game goes multi-platform, the ps3/360 get a butt load of content plus more and the wii gets a lot less and like no online play/content or nothing. its like wii gets treated like the bastard step child of gaming. True the wii is successful but theres really nothing there for the hardcore gamer. A 3rd party will say "oh we're working on this game for the 360/ps3 that is going to be awesome and on the side, we we're working on some game for the wii. It just seems that they feel the wii isn't work wasting time on.

Like so many people are upset with Harmonix over rockband wii and some are going as far as making petititions to get them to give us a decent version but Harmonix probably realized (as most 3rd parties do) that when a game goes multi-platform it won't do as well on the wii as it does on others. so why waste time. Nintendo really should stop hiding out on its own lil island and maybe work with thes 3rd partys as far as promotion is concerned. this alienation is going to make 3rd parties not want to work hard on games for the wii or give us half-arsed games because they know they wont make much off of it but just want to satisfy a few consumers.

I personally could understand why Suda said what he did about nintendo gamers. Not saying I agree with him but I understand his frustration.

Cyber-

it's great and all that it sold better than the other versions. but as a gamer, wouldn't you want the better version? (i.e, the 360 version?)

So will third parties ever decide to invest in the Wii? Most third parties say "well we want to make a game for that system becasue a lot of people own that system and we want a lot of people to be able to play our game." So if that is really the driving force behind why third parties are investing in making great games for a system why don't they do it for the Wii? The Wii is apperently outselling the PS3 and i constantly see third parties making huge investments for upcoming PS3 games. So why not the Wii? LightsaberBlues

Developers weren't expecting the Wii to be so popular and have such a large userbase.

How long does it take to make a decent game and how long as the Wii been out? /math

So will third parties ever decide to invest in the Wii? Most third parties say "well we want to make a game for that system becasue a lot of people own that system and we want a lot of people to be able to play our game." So if that is really the driving force behind why third parties are investing in making great games for a system why don't they do it for the Wii? The Wii is apperently outselling the PS3 and i constantly see third parties making huge investments for upcoming PS3 games. So why not the Wii? LightsaberBlues

To answer your question, because, they can put little effort into a sub-par game and still have it sell well. Why put tons of effort into a potentially great game when you can make a game that takes little effort that will outsell a potentially great game? Again, this comes down to nintendo's new demographic, they will buy anything with cool box art.

Please read THIS

Then edit your post (meaning it's what you'll want to do after reading that article he linked)

Jaysonguy

[QUOTE="Cyber-"][QUOTE="BrooklynHotBoy"]

I too consider myself to be a true gamer. I get very frustrated with the lack of 3rd party games on the wii as well as deficiency in content of the 3rd party games we have. If a game goes multi-platform, the ps3/360 get a butt load of content plus more and the wii gets a lot less and like no online play/content or nothing. its like wii gets treated like the bastard step child of gaming. True the wii is successful but theres really nothing there for the hardcore gamer. A 3rd party will say "oh we're working on this game for the 360/ps3 that is going to be awesome and on the side, we we're working on some game for the wii. It just seems that they feel the wii isn't work wasting time on.

Like so many people are upset with Harmonix over rockband wii and some are going as far as making petititions to get them to give us a decent version but Harmonix probably realized (as most 3rd parties do) that when a game goes multi-platform it won't do as well on the wii as it does on others. so why waste time. Nintendo really should stop hiding out on its own lil island and maybe work with thes 3rd partys as far as promotion is concerned. this alienation is going to make 3rd parties not want to work hard on games for the wii or give us half-arsed games because they know they wont make much off of it but just want to satisfy a few consumers.

I personally could understand why Suda said what he did about nintendo gamers. Not saying I agree with him but I understand his frustration.

Sonick54

it's great and all that it sold better than the other versions. but as a gamer, wouldn't you want the better version? (i.e, the 360 version?)

That's great and all but you need to actually have a 360 to buy that version.

It sold more anywyay, it was the PS3 version that was way behind.

Please read THIS

Then edit your post (meaning it's what you'll want to do after reading that article he linked)

Jaysonguy

You beat me to it...

In the end it really comes down to this. How does any developer or publisher ever know for sure if the game they are making will be a sucsess? Can you really trust sales numbers to tell you wether or not your game is going to be the next Halo or Super Smash Bros.? All developers take a risk when they decide to invest in developing anything they just seem to take a lot less risk when it comes to the Wii. A trend that as long as it's profitable will linger on well into the Wiis' last days regardless if things change or not. Sad but true...LightsaberBlues

It's only their fault if they don't advertise.

Good third party games like Zack & Wiki and No More Heroes are basically unheard of outside of video game sites.

They could advertise and establish the franchise into something well known but it just doesn't happen.

[QUOTE="Cyber-"][QUOTE="BrooklynHotBoy"]

I too consider myself to be a true gamer. I get very frustrated with the lack of 3rd party games on the wii as well as deficiency in content of the 3rd party games we have. If a game goes multi-platform, the ps3/360 get a butt load of content plus more and the wii gets a lot less and like no online play/content or nothing. its like wii gets treated like the bastard step child of gaming. True the wii is successful but theres really nothing there for the hardcore gamer. A 3rd party will say "oh we're working on this game for the 360/ps3 that is going to be awesome and on the side, we we're working on some game for the wii. It just seems that they feel the wii isn't work wasting time on.

Like so many people are upset with Harmonix over rockband wii and some are going as far as making petititions to get them to give us a decent version but Harmonix probably realized (as most 3rd parties do) that when a game goes multi-platform it won't do as well on the wii as it does on others. so why waste time. Nintendo really should stop hiding out on its own lil island and maybe work with thes 3rd partys as far as promotion is concerned. this alienation is going to make 3rd parties not want to work hard on games for the wii or give us half-arsed games because they know they wont make much off of it but just want to satisfy a few consumers.

I personally could understand why Suda said what he did about nintendo gamers. Not saying I agree with him but I understand his frustration.

Sonick54

it's great and all that it sold better than the other versions. but as a gamer, wouldn't you want the better version? (i.e, the 360 version?)

who said its the better version. the Wii version is cheaper has rumble and speaker functionality and free online. DLC is a pain but it is supposed to come out and DLC is not as important for GHIII.

[QUOTE="LightsaberBlues"]In the end it really comes down to this. How does any developer or publisher ever know for sure if the game they are making will be a sucsess? Can you really trust sales numbers to tell you wether or not your game is going to be the next Halo or Super Smash Bros.? All developers take a risk when they decide to invest in developing anything they just seem to take a lot less risk when it comes to the Wii. A trend that as long as it's profitable will linger on well into the Wiis' last days regardless if things change or not. Sad but true...Erebyssial

It's only their fault if they don't advertise.

Good third party games like Zack & Wiki and No More Heroes are basically unheard of outside of video game sites.

They could advertise and establish the franchise into something well known but it just doesn't happen.

Ya it seems that fi they not spending money on development they advertise and if they are spending money on development they dont advertise.

Its justy such a bad business practice to throw these random shots and hope that some of them stick. They know what they have to do in the long run it will pay off.