Epic says Nintendo Wii not profitable???

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mrmoeone

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#1 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

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vnc20100

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#2 vnc20100
Member since 2007 • 1685 Posts
Let him eat his own words. Numbers are speaking, more Wiis sold than Xbox 360. Mario Galaxy is just the beginning of good graphical wii games
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SilentCapybara

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#3 SilentCapybara
Member since 2007 • 350 Posts

Can you provide us with a link? We all can make assumptions and biases, but I'd like to see for myself please. Much obliged

~ SilentCapybara

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codemasterzxc

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#4 codemasterzxc
Member since 2005 • 417 Posts
straight up, that sucks, i was always kinda hoping epic would do somthing on wii, they are really doing well, man why epic why!
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mrmoeone

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#5 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
the website it is on is www.digitalbattle.com...sorry i dont know how to do the link...my bad

Can you provide us with a link? We all can make assumptions and biases, but I'd like to see for myself please. Much obliged

~ SilentCapybara

SilentCapybara

Can you provide us with a link? We all can make assumptions and biases, but I'd like to see for myself please. Much obliged

~ SilentCapybara

SilentCapybara
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mrmoeone

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#6 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
woops...www.digitalbattle.com
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Mr-Gingersnaps

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#7 Mr-Gingersnaps
Member since 2007 • 578 Posts
thats dumb
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Jaysonguy

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#9 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts

Do not respond to the phil poster, just report and ignore.

Do not kill this thread with arguing with someone trying to start trouble

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mrmoeone

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#11 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
youare seriosly trippin...
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

philip6k

people like you are really irritating and can't come to the realization that the wii isnt capable of a lot besides mini games for kids that nintendo makes

the wii probably couldnt handle their gaming engine, its sad the wii cant even match ps2 graphics, its not fear at all its just smarts, they want to keep making respectable and quality products out of their company

the wii really just is a N64 with motion sensor controls and online capabilities

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aleco2012

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#12 aleco2012
Member since 2007 • 151 Posts
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

philip6k

people like you are really irritating and can't come to the realization that the wii isnt capable of a lot besides mini games for kids that nintendo makes

the wii probably couldnt handle their gaming engine, its sad the wii cant even match ps2 graphics, its not fear at all its just smarts, they want to keep making respectable and quality products out of their company

the wii really just is a N64 with motion sensor controls and online capabilities

your just pissed off you bought a ps3 i bet you have never even played wii

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vnc20100

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#13 vnc20100
Member since 2007 • 1685 Posts
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

philip6k

people like you are really irritating and can't come to the realization that the wii isnt capable of a lot besides mini games for kids that nintendo makes

the wii probably couldnt handle their gaming engine, its sad the wii cant even match ps2 graphics, its not fear at all its just smarts, they want to keep making respectable and quality products out of their company

the wii really just is a N64 with motion sensor controls and online capabilities

lol

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Spektre41

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#14 Spektre41
Member since 2007 • 3217 Posts
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

philip6k

people like you are really irritating and can't come to the realization that the wii isnt capable of a lot besides mini games for kids that nintendo makes

the wii probably couldnt handle their gaming engine, its sad the wii cant even match ps2 graphics, its not fear at all its just smarts, they want to keep making respectable and quality products out of their company

the wii really just is a N64 with motion sensor controls and online capabilities

/facepalm

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EYEInferno

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#16 EYEInferno
Member since 2003 • 530 Posts
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

this is really irritating...i just got done reading an article,and in it Mark Rein from epic pretty much bashes theWii...in one of his statements he says its not worth itto make engines for the Wii,and unless your selling your engine to Nintendo your pretty much going for scraps on the platform...i feel the only reason he is saying this is because theWii isdifferent to develop for unlike the other two consoles which are very similar to pc game development...

now the reason why this irritates me...here is this company with an incredible gaming engine with the capabilities to make the engine for Wii,but because the Wii is so different to develop for they figure its not even worth a shot...lazyness and the fear of something different has alot to do with what Mark Rein thinks of the Wii.that and because the Wii isnt HD...wich he states in the article.Does the Wii really need HD capabilities to make a truly incredible game...no...if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

philip6k

people like you are really irritating and can't come to the realization that the wii isnt capable of a lot besides mini games for kids that nintendo makes

the wii probably couldnt handle their gaming engine, its sad the wii cant even match ps2 graphics, its not fear at all its just smarts, they want to keep making respectable and quality products out of their company

the wii really just is a N64 with motion sensor controls and online capabilities

You dont know anything about this do you?
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tomarlyn

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#17 tomarlyn
Member since 2005 • 20148 Posts

The big dev's and publishers are supporting the big hardware.

Engines for these new premium games are more expensive and time consuming to build, so they often buy them from people like Epic instead of crafting their own. The power inside the 360 and PS3 takes a lot more commitment and resources than ever before to achieve their next-gen qualities.

Its less profitable designing an engine specifically for the Wii, because its so behind in the times that its more sensible for dev's to build from last-gen assets. Thats where it sits in the technology tree, its on common ground with the Cube and xbox from a technical point of view. So they'll continue doing what they've done the last 5-6 years in terms of development.

Wii dev's don't need to source graphics engines from the outside which leaves Epic without much business on the platform. Thats where Epic is comming from.

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Jaysonguy

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#18 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts

The power inside the 360 and PS3 takes a lot more commitment and resources than ever before to achieve their next-gen qualities

tomarlyn

Hello lol

Actually it's the exact opposite.

Devs have a cookie cutter system for the 360 and the PS3 while they have to make special provisions for the Wii. Now they also have to do it on the PS3 if they want the very best but for the most part it's just copy/paste.

He's still lying about cost though, but he's doing it in a sneaky way. It takes about 1/5th the cost to make a Wii game then it costs to make a 360/PS3 game and when you look at the way the market is being saturated you still gain a greater return. Now he wants to say that the Wii doesn't make him money and it really wont on the first game.

The thing is that he can start off at the point the last game ended as far as building and the next game will be MUCH cheaper to make (even if you double everything because they now have the ability and engines to do it)

It's the old case, you don't make money unless you spend money. This person at Epic would rather lie then tell the truth that's fine. It's not like Nintendo is in need of software devs since places like EA have said they're cutting back their 360 and PS3 support in favor of the Wii.

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musicman748

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#19 musicman748
Member since 2007 • 2754 Posts

Do not respond to the phil poster, just report and ignore.

Do not kill this thread with arguing with someone trying to start trouble

Jaysonguy

agreed

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mrmoeone

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#20 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
niceley said man...i totally agree
[QUOTE="tomarlyn"]

The power inside the 360 and PS3 takes a lot more commitment and resources than ever before to achieve their next-gen qualities

Jaysonguy

Hello lol

Actually it's the exact opposite.

Devs have a cookie cutter system for the 360 and the PS3 while they have to make special provisions for the Wii. Now they also have to do it on the PS3 if they want the very best but for the most part it's just copy/paste.

He's still lying about cost though, but he's doing it in a sneaky way. It takes about 1/5th the cost to make a Wii game then it costs to make a 360/PS3 game and when you look at the way the market is being saturated you still gain a greater return. Now he wants to say that the Wii doesn't make him money and it really wont on the first game.

The thing is that he can start off at the point the last game ended as far as building and the next game will be MUCH cheaper to make (even if you double everything because they now have the ability and engines to do it)

It's the old case, you don't make money unless you spend money. This person at Epic would rather lie then tell the truth that's fine. It's not like Nintendo is in need of software devs since places like EA have said they're cutting back their 360 and PS3 support in favor of the Wii.

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tomarlyn

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#21 tomarlyn
Member since 2005 • 20148 Posts
[QUOTE="tomarlyn"]

The power inside the 360 and PS3 takes a lot more commitment and resources than ever before to achieve their next-gen qualities

Jaysonguy

Hello lol

Actually it's the exact opposite.

Devs have a cookie cutter system for the 360 and the PS3 while they have to make special provisions for the Wii. Now they also have to do it on the PS3 if they want the very best but for the most part it's just copy/paste.

He's still lying about cost though, but he's doing it in a sneaky way. It takes about 1/5th the cost to make a Wii game then it costs to make a 360/PS3 game and when you look at the way the market is being saturated you still gain a greater return. Now he wants to say that the Wii doesn't make him money and it really wont on the first game.

The thing is that he can start off at the point the last game ended as far as building and the next game will be MUCH cheaper to make (even if you double everything because they now have the ability and engines to do it)

It's the old case, you don't make money unless you spend money. This person at Epic would rather lie then tell the truth that's fine. It's not like Nintendo is in need of software devs since places like EA have said they're cutting back their 360 and PS3 support in favor of the Wii.

He's talking about selling engines. Your absolutely right, its a lot cheaper to make Wii games. Wii dev's don't need to buy Epic's engines, there's no money in it for Epic. Like I said Wii devs only need to use last-gen assets, it doesn't have the architecture to make use of their demanding engines in the first place. Are you confusing this with software sales?
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mrmoeone

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#22 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts

they made the engine that powered Elder Scrolls available for Wii...are they not going to make any money because devs dont need it???that doesnt make much sense if u ask me...i bet if Epic made the unreal engine 3 available for the Wii many devs would use it in there games...the Wii doesnt program like a pc,which is a big reason why Epic doesnt even want to bother with the Wii imo.....we become so acustomed to something that when something different comes along we imedietley begin to try to shoot it down...which is the case for the Wii.

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lucky326

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#23 lucky326
Member since 2006 • 3799 Posts

they made the engine that powered Elder Scrolls available for Wii...are they not going to make any money because devs dont need it???that doesnt make much sense if u ask me...i bet if Epic made the unreal engine 3 available for the Wii many devs would use it in there games...the Wii doesnt program like a pc,which is a big reason why Epic doesnt even want to bother with the Wii imo.....we become so acustomed to something that when something different comes along we imedietley begin to try to shoot it down...which is the case for the Wii.

mrmoeone
Bingo, Oblivion is capable on the Wii although Bethsoft are in the middle of making Star Trek:Conquest and are busy with Fallout 3. And by the Time TES V: Skyrim is out I would expect that the 8th Gen of Consoles will have just been released.
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mrmoeone

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#24 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
lol...
[QUOTE="mrmoeone"]

they made the engine that powered Elder Scrolls available for Wii...are they not going to make any money because devs dont need it???that doesnt make much sense if u ask me...i bet if Epic made the unreal engine 3 available for the Wii many devs would use it in there games...the Wii doesnt program like a pc,which is a big reason why Epic doesnt even want to bother with the Wii imo.....we become so acustomed to something that when something different comes along we imedietley begin to try to shoot it down...which is the case for the Wii.

lucky326
Bingo, Oblivion is capable on the Wii although Bethsoft are in the middle of making Star Trek:Conquest and are busy with Fallout 3. And by the Time TES V: Skyrim is out I would expect that the 8th Gen of Consoles will have just been released.

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nintendofreak_2

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#25 nintendofreak_2
Member since 2005 • 25896 Posts
Epic makes makes about half of their profit by selling game engines. It's only unprofitable to them.
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mrmoeone

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#26 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
i dont really see how it would be unprofitable for them???if they optimized the unreal engine 3 for the Wii devs would use it,and not only that Epic could begin making games for nintendo as well...imo they would make plenty of money, but like i said the Wii is different and underpowered when u compare numbers and because of that Epic continues to try and bring the Wii down which is rediculous imo...
Epic makes makes about half of their profit by selling game engines. It's only unprofitable to them.nintendofreak_2
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#27 Duckman5
Member since 2006 • 18934 Posts
What is that guy smoking? Not profitable? Stupidest quote of the year.
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#29 hiphops_savior
Member since 2007 • 8535 Posts
One game on a console doesn't equal to an underpowered console, yet Epic says that it's a N64 with motion controls? IMO that's the most bigotry comment that I've ever heard. They're either extremely conservative or just changophobic.
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toadster101

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#30 toadster101
Member since 2006 • 12622 Posts
BS.
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#31 clarke0
Member since 2005 • 865 Posts
If they built an engine for the Wii there would be no one to buy it. The only thing third party developers want to make for the Wii are crappy mini games. All the games I have for the Wii are first-party Nintendo games.
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#32 RyanWare
Member since 2002 • 12113 Posts
Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. Why should they make Unreal Engine 3 on the Wii? It's made for next-gen hardware, and the Wii is in the same league as the GameCube and Xbox. Essentially, Epic would have to remove all of the features from the UE3 that... well, make it the UE3. The UE2 already works perfectly well on the Wii. In fact, the UE2 can pretty much max the Wii out. Putting the UE3 on the Wii would indeed be a waste of time for Epic.
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Jaysonguy

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#33 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts

Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. RyanWare

No, actually anyone willing to look up all the data knows just as much and knows he's telling a lie.

What did I say? He's carefully put out his words so in this instance it's true but overall it's a lie.

I'm not going to post it over so just scroll up.

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#34 Tri-Enforcer
Member since 2007 • 1899 Posts

Nintendo may be making alot of money off of the Wii consoles themselves, but not much comes from Wii hardware sales. It seems the only thing people are buying Wiis is for Wii sports, then they get tired of it and let it collect dust. I say this because Wii hardware sales have been less than stellar since launch of the Wii. As good as MP3 is, it should of sold waaaay more than it did--even if it is available in the U.S. currently.

The original X-Box version of Madden 08 sold way more than Wii version--that's ashame. I could understand the PS2 version of Madden 08 selling more, but not the old X-Box. That's pitiful. The problem is the consumer view of Nintendo. Consumers don't think of Nintendo when itcomes down to hardcore and multiplatform games. Yes, most Wii ports suck and there just are not enough hardcore titles on the Wii to shake the assumptions that people make about Nintendo consoles.

It may very well cost Epic waaaay less to make a Wii game than a next-gen game, but I think they're more concerned about time and resources. Yes, Epic can make a profit off the Wii, and bring over crappy rushed titles like everyone else is doing. However, the time and resourced taken away from bigger projects on the 360 and PS3, just wouldn't be worth it. In other words the mere profits a Wii game can make for epic, would be chump change.

Well, why not make a good quality title for the Wii, as opposd to a quick cash-in? The cost to make a Wii game will not be as much for a 360 or a PS3 game--no matter how much quality is put into it. However a good quality game like MP3, isn't your standard 'cheap' Wii game. If developers put that kind of effort into Wii games, they may lose profit...simply because it cost more than the average Wii game, and the sells won't justify the prouction costs. That's why developers are scared to make 'quality' Wii games--they will make a profit off the cheaper builds, but lose money on the more expensive builds. That discourages developers from really trying. Yeah that can invest alot of time into some ports and make it decent, but not a game from the ground-up that will be profitable.

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Jaysonguy

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#35 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts

Nintendo may be making alot of money off of the Wii consoles themselves, but not much comes from Wii hardware sales. It seems the only thing people are buying Wiis is for Wii sports, then they get tired of it and let it collect dust. I say this because Wii hardware sales have been less than stellar since launch of the Wii. As good as MP3 is, it should of sold waaaay more than it did--even if it is available in the U.S. currently.

The original X-Box version of Madden 08 sold way more than Wii version--that's ashame. I could understand the PS2 version of Madden 08 selling more, but not the old X-Box. That's pitiful. The problem is the consumer view of Nintendo. Consumers don't think of Nintendo when itcomes down to hardcore and multiplatform games. Yes, most Wii ports suck and there just are not enough hardcore titles on the Wii to shake the assumptions that people make about Nintendo consoles.

It may very well cost Epic waaaay less to make a Wii game than a next-gen game, but I think they're more concerned about time and resources. Yes, Epic can make a profit off the Wii, and bring over crappy rushed titles like everyone else is doing. However, the time and resourced taken away from bigger projects on the 360 and PS3, just wouldn't be worth it. In other words the mere profits a Wii game can make for epic, would be chump change.

Well, why not make a good quality title for the Wii, as opposd to a quick cash-in? The cost to make a Wii game will not be as much for a 360 or a PS3 game--no matter how much quality is put into it. However a good quality game like MP3, isn't your standard 'cheap' Wii game. If developers put that kind of effort into Wii games, they may lose profit...simply because it cost more than the average Wii game, and the sells won't justify the prouction costs. That's why developers are scared to make 'quality' Wii games--they will make a profit off the cheaper builds, but lose money on the more expensive builds. That discourages developers from really trying. Yeah that can invest alot of time into some ports and make it decent, but not a game from the ground-up that will be profitable.

Tri-Enforcer

A lot is wrong there.

Let's start with the XBOX version of Madden selling more. Well that makes sense since there's 3 times as many XBOXes out there compared to the Wii. Let us also remember that XBOX is a mainly American supported console while Wii is global so in reality the XBOX has an even larger jump on the Wii with an American football game.

Metroid is a niche title that has lost fans over the Prime series and this was Nintedno's way of trying to get them back which is working. It's not surprising that Metroid isn't selling out as much as other games on other systems. Anyone who looks at the data from the Metroid series can see it wouldn't be a huge seller. Heck most of the gaming public doesn't even know the main character's name.

Eric doesn't need to make a rushed game to make a profit. If they spent money on one game it would cost them. Then if they followed it up they'd need to do one quarter the effort to make an even better game. That's the great thing about the Wii, you pick up where the last game left off, and not even the last game in a certain genre left off.

Again you're comparing a niche game again with Metroid sales. Metroid is not a mainstream title. Heck it's fanbase is more secluded then Zelda's.

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JordanElek

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#36 JordanElek
Member since 2002 • 18564 Posts

[QUOTE="RyanWare"]Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. Jaysonguy

No, actually anyone willing to look up all the data knows just as much.

I don't know about that. Someone who is actually in the field knows a whole lot more than most of us, regardless of the amount of research we do. And each developer has different goals, different areas of interest, and they know about them more than we do. How can any of us say that the Wii is in Epic's best interest when someone from Epic itself says that it isn't?

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chathorrible

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#37 chathorrible
Member since 2005 • 25 Posts
For what it's worth I agree with the comment on Metroid. I had previously only played Super Metroid veyr briefly when I was around maybe 9 or 10 and it was just too complicated for me. I never bothered with any other Metroid games until this one came out for the Wii, I am now 25 and the game blew me away and I am now interested in going back and playing the previous games. The problem is not the software per se. Nintendo makes incredible first party games. Which Nintendo games have the most hype now? Mario Galaxy and Super Smash Brothers. The one thing they might have shot themselves in the foot with is that with a weaker graphical system, it will be hard to break any exclusivity and bring, say a GTA or a Bungie developed game to their system. Although this is not really the market they're going for, it might convince people to buy a Wii who wouldn't otherwise knowing that they can play a game they can't play otherwise. They've got Guitar Hero now, definitely a step in the right direction. Now they just need soemthing to compete with Gears of War, Gran Turismo and other beasts like that. So software isn't the problem, it's trying to get third parties to buy into it.
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mrmoeone

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#38 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
it isnt in there best interest because the Wii is different so they dont even want to give it a chance...
[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]

[QUOTE="RyanWare"]Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. JordanElek

No, actually anyone willing to look up all the data knows just as much.

I don't know about that. Someone who is actually in the field knows a whole lot more than most of us, regardless of the amount of research we do. And each developer has different goals, different areas of interest, and they know about them more than we do. How can any of us say that the Wii is in Epic's best interest when someone from Epic itself says that it isn't?

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Jaysonguy

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#39 Jaysonguy
Member since 2006 • 39454 Posts
[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]

[QUOTE="RyanWare"]Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. JordanElek

No, actually anyone willing to look up all the data knows just as much.

I don't know about that. Someone who is actually in the field knows a whole lot more than most of us, regardless of the amount of research we do. And each developer has different goals, different areas of interest, and they know about them more than we do. How can any of us say that the Wii is in Epic's best interest when someone from Epic itself says that it isn't?

Granted we can't know the insides of it but he's cooking the books.

We don't know the direction they want to go, that's a given, but what he's saying is false. We've seen how much it costs to make top tier games for the Wii and we've seen what kind of return people get for their trouble. We've also seen how much certain companies have spent to start Wii studios and we've seen in some situations a pairing with Nintendo for the studios to help deflect the initial cost of making games (Nintendo-Bandai) We've seen how some companies (like EA) have cut support for other consoles to focus on the Wii because it gives them a quick profit if they reuse an engine no matter where it comes from.

I'm sure this guy is going to get a pat on the back from the other two companies after reading this and that helps his business but I'm still not thrilled with him telling lies. He's bringing up one situation and trying to make it the rule. It's the usual corporate doublespeak that you see so often.

Yes he wont get much return on his first game but no one in their right mind is just going to make one game for a platform and then stop. Look at Grand Theft Auto and how often that engine was used. It's the same thing with Epic, if they built something for the Wii and made a few installments there comes the return.

Here's a good analogy. When you build a manufacturing plant to make something it doesn't start to make a return until you make a certain number of things in that plant. What Epic is saying is that if they build the plant and run off one set of items it's not worth their time which is true. What he's not telling the people is that if he keeps the plant open to run a few sets he'll make a return on his investment.

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qupidxoxo

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#40 qupidxoxo
Member since 2004 • 1556 Posts
Yea im a wii owner.......sure some games on it look bad and some games coming out for it are looking great..why dontcompanies want to buy or build their own game engine..well because their plain oldlazy,most games us wii owners have are basically ports, like prince of Persia,Res:4,Godfather,etc...but these ports are ok looking, well these game should look better then ok, why do Nintendo games come out of the oven hot and freshwith nice looking next-gen graphics .Isthe reason some developers dont want to develop games for the wii is because nintendo isn't giving them the full product or as i said before are developers getting lazy!
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mrmoeone

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#42 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
why did they make the engine that powers games like Elder Scrolls available for Wii...are they just wasting their money for doing so??? to meEpic is just beating around the bush when it comes down to it...im no developer nor do i know anything about Epicother than they make some amazing games...it would be awesome if they began to some work on the Wii but it seems that ignorance hasblinded the good folks over at Epic...imo
Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. Why should they make Unreal Engine 3 on the Wii? It's made for next-gen hardware, and the Wii is in the same league as the GameCube and Xbox. Essentially, Epic would have to remove all of the features from the UE3 that... well, make it the UE3. The UE2 already works perfectly well on the Wii. In fact, the UE2 can pretty much max the Wii out. Putting the UE3 on the Wii would indeed be a waste of time for Epic.RyanWare
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shockwave04

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#43 shockwave04
Member since 2002 • 19257 Posts

.if u can give me 3 times more than what Resident Evil 4 brought to us on Gamecube...it would be awesome,and a pretty big difference imo...

mrmoeone

I totally agree.
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chris3116

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#44 chris3116
Member since 2003 • 12174 Posts
Let me know when they'll make somethingoriginal than an other shooter.
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RyanWare

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#45 RyanWare
Member since 2002 • 12113 Posts
[QUOTE="JordanElek"][QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]

[QUOTE="RyanWare"]Epic is right. If you think you know more about their business than they do, you are sadly mistaken. Jaysonguy

No, actually anyone willing to look up all the data knows just as much.

I don't know about that. Someone who is actually in the field knows a whole lot more than most of us, regardless of the amount of research we do. And each developer has different goals, different areas of interest, and they know about them more than we do. How can any of us say that the Wii is in Epic's best interest when someone from Epic itself says that it isn't?

Granted we can't know the insides of it but he's cooking the books.

We don't know the direction they want to go, that's a given, but what he's saying is false. We've seen how much it costs to make top tier games for the Wii and we've seen what kind of return people get for their trouble. We've also seen how much certain companies have spent to start Wii studios and we've seen in some situations a pairing with Nintendo for the studios to help deflect the initial cost of making games (Nintendo-Bandai) We've seen how some companies (like EA) have cut support for other consoles to focus on the Wii because it gives them a quick profit if they reuse an engine no matter where it comes from.

I'm sure this guy is going to get a pat on the back from the other two companies after reading this and that helps his business but I'm still not thrilled with him telling lies. He's bringing up one situation and trying to make it the rule. It's the usual corporate doublespeak that you see so often.

Yes he wont get much return on his first game but no one in their right mind is just going to make one game for a platform and then stop. Look at Grand Theft Auto and how often that engine was used. It's the same thing with Epic, if they built something for the Wii and made a few installments there comes the return.

Here's a good analogy. When you build a manufacturing plant to make something it doesn't start to make a return until you make a certain number of things in that plant. What Epic is saying is that if they build the plant and run off one set of items it's not worth their time which is true. What he's not telling the people is that if he keeps the plant open to run a few sets he'll make a return on his investment.

But Rein wasn't talking about developing games. He was talking about supporting the Wii with the Unreal Engine. As Joystiq says: "Also, some people seem to be confused by Rein's profit comment. The profits for Epic wouldn't come from game sales but from licensing out the engine. Since most developers don't focus on the graphical prowess of their Wii titles, Epic would not be able to charge much for their engine -- hence why Rein doesn't feel the Wii would be a profitable venture for them." That, and the fact that dedicating staff to work on the engine for Wii would take them away from PS3 and 360 projects - hence more money lost in those departments. Plus as he said before, third-party games don't sell very well on the Wii anyway and Nintendo sure won't license Epic's Unreal engine.

I'm sure Rein has seriously considered supporting the Wii with their engine, since it is selling so well. He isn't stupid enough to pass up on a money-making opportunity. All companies are in the business of making money, after all. He has his reasons for not supporting the Wii, and I think they are very sound reasons. It's just a risk he doesn't see paying off. You can act like you have a crystal ball and can see into the future, but the fact of the matter is he is much more qualified to make a call on the issue than you.

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phatsy

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#46 phatsy
Member since 2006 • 25 Posts
umm....dude the wii does have hd capabilities if you go to screen settings it will show you that it does
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Big_Boss465

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#47 Big_Boss465
Member since 2007 • 834 Posts
He was saying it isn't profitable to make an engine for the Wii. It isn't worth their time given the minimal profits they would make. I think the game attachment rate for the Wii is also quite small compared to the 360 and PS3 as well. Owners of those two systems buy more software.
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mrmoeone

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#48 mrmoeone
Member since 2006 • 524 Posts
hmmm...
He was saying it isn't profitable to make an engine for the Wii. It isn't worth their time given the minimal profits they would make. I think the game attachment rate for the Wii is also quite small compared to the 360 and PS3 as well. Owners of those two systems buy more software.Big_Boss465
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cinemax237

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#49 cinemax237
Member since 2005 • 390 Posts
umm....dude the wii does have hd capabilities if you go to screen settings it will show you that it doesphatsy
no 480p is not hd. The wii does not have hd capabilities. 720p,1080i,1080p are hd settings.
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Arnalion

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#50 Arnalion
Member since 2006 • 3316 Posts
[QUOTE="tomarlyn"]

The power inside the 360 and PS3 takes a lot more commitment and resources than ever before to achieve their next-gen qualities

Jaysonguy

Hello lol

Actually it's the exact opposite.

Devs have a cookie cutter system for the 360 and the PS3 while they have to make special provisions for the Wii. Now they also have to do it on the PS3 if they want the very best but for the most part it's just copy/paste.

He's still lying about cost though, but he's doing it in a sneaky way. It takes about 1/5th the cost to make a Wii game then it costs to make a 360/PS3 game and when you look at the way the market is being saturated you still gain a greater return. Now he wants to say that the Wii doesn't make him money and it really wont on the first game.

The thing is that he can start off at the point the last game ended as far as building and the next game will be MUCH cheaper to make (even if you double everything because they now have the ability and engines to do it)

It's the old case, you don't make money unless you spend money. This person at Epic would rather lie then tell the truth that's fine. It's not like Nintendo is in need of software devs since places like EA have said they're cutting back their 360 and PS3 support in favor of the Wii.

Do you know why PS3 and 360 games are so expensive to develope? It's exactly because of the reasons tomarlyn wrote.
It is harder to develope for the PS3/360 than the Wii and that's why the Wii games are cheaper.

A Wii developer doesn't need a team at 80 people working in 3 years to make a decent game.

Easier development = shorter development time = small development cost = more profit.

The PS3/360 developers themselves have stated that they've never needed this amount of resources to make games before.