Ideas for the Next Zelda

I think it's about time for Nintendo to completely overhaul Zelda and reinvent it from the ground up. I actually think they pretty much did all they can do with the current formula, so why not start over instead of rehashing the same stuff over and over? Anyway, I don't know how they could do this, but I do at least have a some suggestions. Here are some of the things which I think need to be addressed if Nintendo wants me to maintain interest in Zelda:

1) That annoying beeping sound when you are low on health: every time I play a new Zelda game I am shocked that they are still implementing this. Why can't it just beep a few times to alert you? Why must it beep until you find another heart? Sometimes it's 5 minutes before I find a heart, so I just have to listen to that annoying beeping. It's kind of like if your alarm clock went off but you couldn't turn it off for 5 minutes. Annoying as all hell and completely unnessesary.

2) Voice acting. Nintendo needs to join the 21st century and give the NPCs voices. I don't think this is as big a deal as some people make it out to be, but it's still annoying having to read what everyone says. The characters would have a lot more personality if they actually talked.

3) Wallet limitation. OK, why can I only hold so many rupees? What is the point of this? I'm sick of finding rupees and then realizing that my wallet is full so I can't pick them up. Just let me carry as many rupees as I want.

4) Speaking of rupees, how about giving us some good crap to buy. It feels like money is practically worthless in this game because there aren't too many good things to buy with it. I think you should be able to purchase new armor at least. Imagine being able to upgrade your armor several times throughout the game with money. You could start out with the green garb, but then upgrade to leather armor or something. Or maybe you could spend rupees on weapon upgrades. Just give me something worthwhile to spend the money on or don't put it in the game.

5) Combat. I really feel that combat is almost pointless in Zelda because the enemies are so easy. I mean, you generally just hit them a few times with your sword and they die. And since they just drop rupees or easy to find/buy items, there really isn't much incentive for fighting them. The combat should be quite a bit deeper and more fun. I'm not saying go all out and make it like Ninja Gaiden where the sole focus is on kicking ass, but it really should be expanded. And the enemies should put up more of a fight.

6) Harder bosses. The bosses are such pushovers in Zelda games. I don't want them to be extremely difficult, but it should take at least a few tries to beat them. As it is, I usually beat a new Zelda boss on the first try.

7) Music. Come on, Nintendo, how about hiring a live orchestra to do the music. Zelda actually has some pretty darn good music for a video game, so why not spend a few bucks and make it sound as good as possible? It would really add to the experience. Oh yeah, and record it in 5.1 surround if possible.

As good as some of those implementations would be, it's still far from innovating the series. It's still just improving on the same formula. Before discussing such details, we should see what should change closer to the core of Zelda.

As for voice acting... that's arguable. I don't think it's a pain to read the text, and like that, characters have the personality I want. It's subtle, but it works. Don't be surprised if, once Zelda gets voice acting, we all feel like it lost part of its magic.

As good as some of those implementations would be, it's still far from innovating the series. It's still just improving on the same formula. Before discussing such details, we should see what should change closer to the core of Zelda.

As for voice acting... that's arguable. I don't think it's a pain to read the text, and like that, characters have the personality I want. It's subtle, but it works. Don't be surprised if, once Zelda gets voice acting, we all feel like it lost part of its magic.

Wintry_Flutist

No, I know. My suggestions are not innovative. They're more just ideas that should have been implemented by now but due to Nintendo's stubborness have not yet been. I really don't know how to reinvent Zelda. Maybe Miyamoto could figre that out. I'm just saying that I think it's time for it to be done.

well maybe everybody else could talk.but make link the quiet one.SIMIFU

yeah... i liked it in WW when link was the only person not to make a sound... everyone else had little SFX when you went to speak to them usually a portion of what they were currently saying... but by no means should Link ever ever EVER speak...

the beeping hearts... u can have that one... aswell as the moneterial issues... there certainly isn't enuf to buy... and mostly everthing you can buy can be found easily

the combat... c'mon it's been getting better ever since OOT... since then they've turned dodging into an inportant element aswell as combos and teqhniques... hell they even had little 'Finish Him' moments in TP... but personally i loved the fastpaced dodge and slash system from WW... and you could steal enemies weapons... infact if they could fuse the fighting sytems of WW and TP that would be sweet

the music... eh i don't really care im usually listening to a CD or DVD when i play Zelda games

but in retrospect Zelda games don't need anything added... why mess with a formula that works?

I agree with everyone else, voice acting wouldn't cut it. It's what made Link well... Link. I like the silent protagonist thing.zeriva

the combat... c'mon it's been getting better ever since OOT... since then they've turned dodging into an inportant element aswell as combos and teqhniques... hell they even had little 'Finish Him' moments in TP... but personally i loved the fastpaced dodge and slash system from WW... and you could steal enemies weapons... infact if they could fuse the fighting sytems of WW and TP that would be sweet

Getting better since OoT? Because they're adding a few more options? That's far from what makes combat good. You need to be engaged, and frankly, Zelda has been lacking in this department.

the music... eh i don't really care im usually listening to a CD or DVD when i play Zelda games

You're missing a lot.

but in retrospect Zelda games don't need anything added... why mess with a formula that works?

It has officially got old with TP.

Yyin9564

I agree with everyone else, voice acting wouldn't cut it. It's what made Link well... Link. I like the silent protagonist thing.zeriva

Link isn't an NPC.

The new Zelda will have to be alot different then Twilight Princess IMO. I got bored with Twilight Pricess and I had to force myself to finish it. The first Zelda game I've had to do so by the way.

Voice acting worked great for Metroid. Samus didn't speak, but everyone else did.So why not do that same in Zelda? Let Link stay everyone's favorite mute but don't make him in a world of mutes.

The new Zelda will have to be alot different then Twilight Princess IMO. I got bored with Twilight Pricess and I had to force myself to finish it. The first Zelda game I've had to do so by the way.

Voice acting worked great for Metroid. Samus didn't speak, but everyone else did.So why not do that same in Zelda? Let Link stay everyone's favorite mute but don't make him in a world of mutes.

Durhamster

Thing is, Metroid is not even supposed to have NPCs (besides the enemies, of course). Voice acting or not, the simple fact that there is dialogue is weird. There's no point comparing Metroid to Zelda in this case.

The new Zelda will have to be alot different then Twilight Princess IMO. I got bored with Twilight Pricess and I had to force myself to finish it. The first Zelda game I've had to do so by the way.

Voice acting worked great for Metroid. Samus didn't speak, but everyone else did.So why not do that same in Zelda? Let Link stay everyone's favorite mute but don't make him in a world of mutes.

Durhamster

Ok, i have a good sugestion. How about getting over Ganondorf? I mean, how many times do you kill him? At least in the two timelines Ganondorf is now dead, in WW he got turned to stone and in TP he got stabbed in the chest... So maybe Nintendo could follow the Majora's Mask Link to another adventure in a new land and make a cool new villain and introduce new characters and stuff instead of having Zelda get kidnapped by Ganondorf. I mean, the same has been happening with Mario were PEach always gets kidnapped but at least with Mario it doesnt get too old.

By the way, voice acting is a must. Online multiplayer or some kind of versus or split screen or whatever would work like perhaps having an arena were you could go in-game and fight other people online to get new items and stuff or something.

Also, Nintendo could stop doing such a linear story games. I dont mean removing the dungeons since they are the core to Zelda but perhaps add more segments with lots of action and surprise boss battles or something. There is also a lot of potential with the horse battles so Nintendo could really expand on that.

So yeah, my number one suggestion is to get ridd of Ganondorf and have a completely new original and un-linear story

They should make it so that if you make a certian decision in the game it reflects the outcome of the game and has alternate endings and stuff.

And I think Ganondorf should stay, but i'm also pretty new to the series, my first Zelda game was Phantom Hourglass and a I borrowed TP from a friend. Really looking forward to the next one.

[QUOTE="Durhamster"]

The new Zelda will have to be alot different then Twilight Princess IMO. I got bored with Twilight Pricess and I had to force myself to finish it. The first Zelda game I've had to do so by the way.

Voice acting worked great for Metroid. Samus didn't speak, but everyone else did.So why not do that same in Zelda? Let Link stay everyone's favorite mute but don't make him in a world of mutes.

Nintendo_Ownes7

Nintendo never listened to them. TP was going to be very different from OoT, but as they needed it to sell the Wii, they changed the game in order to play "safer".

Darkman, im glad you said it.

Honestly, the Zelda franchise does not need to be "reinvented" or overhauled, even though i completely see the point of this thread, being that the series was not perfect and recent entries could be "not as charming or immersive" as past entries of the series.

I don't know if this was anyone else's experience, but I had a hard time completing the two last Zelda games. Not because they were difficult. Reassuringly not. But because they were so 'tired', unchallenging, and completely uninspired.

I have NO IDEA where poor Nintendo is getting their latest game designers from, but I can only hope the artistic directors of Twilight Princess or Phantom Hourglass were not the directors of any previous Zelda games. For that would mean the series is 'doomed'.

These directors are basically taking past concepts, and rehashing them. What the hell? Look at former Zelda games. A Link to the Past, followed by Link's Awakening, followed by Ocarina of Time, followed by Majora's Mask to name the big ones. Are any two of these games SIMILAR to one another? Heck, add Oracle of Ages and Oracle of Seasons. Are any of the successors necessarily 'sequels'?

You will notice, unless I am mistaken, that NONE of the successors to the previous titles are direct obvious sequels.

Take Nintendo's latest entries in the series. Nintendo has told us over and over again with their relentless enthusiasm: Twilight Princess will be a 'true sequel' to Ocarina of Time. We're gonna give you more of Ocarina of Time, of the masterpiece, of the best of Zelda. But honestly, all we got was an uninspired world. Was this the Hyrule of Ocarina of Time? No. Twilight Princess-Hyrule is to OoT-Hyrule what a 70+ year old woman with plastic surgery is to a naturally young girl.

Do what you do best, Nintendo: INNOVATE. And we're not JUST TALKING ABOUT GAMEPLAY INNOVATION. We're talking about making innovative worlds. Heck, go back to the A-button sword slashing if you want to. But go the route of:

- New stories: no more Light-Dark worlds please. It's been done in OoT. And LttP. Only reason it worked a second time was because visually, Zelda was 3-D, so technically the setting was refreshing.

- New settings: Go the way of Majora's Mask or Link's Awakening. We like Lost Kids with heart-shaped masks, angry moons, and being stuck in the nightmares of a Giant sleeping Egg. Create NEW worlds.

- And stop making the latest entries so shallow. Be warned, this is one direction you want to avoid, especially if you want to maintain your hardcore fanbase. It's insane how completely boring the open worlds of Phantom Hourglass and Twilight Princess were in terms of exploration depth.

Just be original. You're Nintendo after all.

moujaes, I think you're missing a bunch of things...

Of course TP art direction was nothing new: Nintendo, for a few reasons, wanted it to be close to OoT. Nintendo deliberately made it so to play safe and guarantee TP would sell the Wii. As for PH, I don't see anything wrong with the art direction. It's the WW sequel, and it focused a lot more on the stylus use, with great success, so we can accuse PH of everything but not being innovative.

Thus, it has nothing to do with the competence or incompetence of the producers. If you think about it, TP is the only Zelda to date to have shocked us for not trying to innovate. Every major 3D Zelda before it tried its best to stand on its own.The producers are perfectly capable, but they made a wrong choice with TP which was enough to start "omg Zelda is dying" talk...

Also, gameplay is not just about "this button does that" or "you have so many options when doing this or that", but everything actually is part of it, from the graphics to the replay value. You're accusing Nintendo of only thinking about gameplay as in "how to control the game", but Nintendo, by gameplay, obviously look at all different levels of it. They're not dumb, they're probably the best devs in the world, they know a sword slash feels totally different if it looks sleeker or if there is an actual reason (=story) for you to being slashing around. They won't just make it control well with the Wiimote and let it be. They take everything in consideration.

And where is there Light/Dark in OoT? :|

Hey, sorry for my wording of 'gameplay', ur right tht it means other things

I think what I mean to say most is that the Zelda 'worlds' they are creating are starting to get repetitive. Of course, there's nothing wrong with that, but that's exactly my point : there's nothing 'wrong' with that, but there's nothing necessarily fresh, you know, that 'fresh' factor that makes a game memorable and thus a classic.

I can be completely wrong in saying this, but in all honesty, I'm not convinced Phantom Hourglass or Twilight Princess will ever share the status of say, other entries like Link's Awakening or OoT/Majora's Mask.

But yeah, you make the very true point that Nintendo has always payed attention to storyplot in their games, thankfully, that's what makes us Nintendo fans.

Hey, sorry for my wording of 'gameplay', ur right tht it means other things

I think what I mean to say most is that the Zelda 'worlds' they are creating are starting to get repetitive. Of course, there's nothing wrong with that, but that's exactly my point : there's nothing 'wrong' with that, but there's nothing necessarily fresh, you know, that 'fresh' factor that makes a game memorable and thus a classic.

I can be completely wrong in saying this, but in all honesty, I'm not convinced Phantom Hourglass or Twilight Princess will ever share the status of say, other entries like Link's Awakening or OoT/Majora's Mask.

But yeah, you make the very true point that Nintendo has always payed attention to storyplot in their games, thankfully, that's what makes us Nintendo fans.

g_moujaes_2000

You're absolutely right: a new world/presentation "triggers" our senses and is the first step to invite the player into new concepts. Of course, it has to go beyond the looks, or we soon realize it's actually the same rehashed concept of before.

As for PH, one thing is fact: as a full Stylus controlled game, it was a major step in game development. It's not a perfect game, but no one can deny its importance.

Nintendo does care about a story, but they're not really used to it. They tried to make comething more fleshed out in TP, but it failed in many ways... I don't think they have to go for heavy storytelling, they just need to know how much of it is needed in each game.

So since TP was a rehash of OoT (although nowhere near as good), what style of game are we looking for? I mean, the basic Zelda formula has worked for years:

-Find a special object in each of the 8+ dungeons

-Look for sidequests and special hidden objects

-Convince you that Ganon/dorf is done for good at the end of the game

We could agree that Zelda is an Action / Adventure game at heart, correct? And we could also agree that it has light-RPG elements laced into it, with occasional platforming in certain dungeons (Link's Awakening, anyone?). And puzzles too.

So.... What exactly are we looking for? A Pokemon-esque RPG with a long adventure and lots of collecting to fight turn-based style? A full-out, rough-and-ready action game along the lines of God of War? Maybe a platformer? Return to 2-D?

What I'm getting at is that the Zelda formula is, in essence, perfect and relatively unique. I've never seen any game that truly reminds me of Zelda besides Zelda games themselves.

A change in Zelda would have to be based more on plot, storyline, and overall artistic vision. A story told by cutscenes (MGS4) combined with a populated open world (GTA) and great controls (SMG) would fit the bill. Honestly, I don't have the faintest idea what Miyamoto might come up with, but it better have the basics down cold.

To close, I think Zelda is great, but I agree - it is beginning to feel a little stale after TP.

well maybe everybody else could talk.but make link the quiet one.SIMIFU

you know before we think of all the sugestions we made, we should think, is the next zelda game going to be about toon link or normal link.

or it's possible that their going to reveal a new model of link. could be interesting.

klarfis,

The alternate universe entries (Majora's Mask/Link's Awakening) were essential and vital to the Zelda classic status because without them, Zelda would have been a tired series filled with quests to beat Ganondorf over and over.

Subtract the Oracle series, Majora's Mask, and Link's Awakening. What do we get?

We get Link to the Past later followed by OoT. Problem with this succession is that we get the Light World/Corrupt world formula repeated twice in a row with the final goal being to defeat Ganondorf yet again. Add Wind Waker and you get three in a row doing that.

So alternative universe Zelda entries are vital because they add the 'fresh' factor to Zelda quite simply.

anyone seen that fake Zelda preview where the next game was taking place in the future? I reckon that would of been a really cool game, especially with the FF kinda art style.

voice acting in zelda is ok with me but keep link silent.but also keep text as well...my parents are deaf and i think it would not be fair to deaf people to keep that out...jist make it an option,nintendo

p.s. future would be cool as well instead of a wood sword,make it a baseball bat.

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

A new item could be a whip, you could use it to whip things(duh), or to grapple(Indiana Jones style), or to make mini tornadoes(Like on the Ghost Rider movie), and some other stuff.

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

BubbyJello

People really have zero notion of the issues/characteristics of what they call 1:1 motion control... :?

[QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

Wintry_Flutist

People really have zero notion of the issues/characteristics of what they call 1:1 motion control... :?

Who, me? I thought what I said wouldn't have many issues, if done right. The IR pointer would pick the location of the sword, while the motion/tilt control would do other stuff. Meaning not much waggling. Imagine RE4, but Leon had a sword in his hand instead of a gun, and you could put the sword where ever you wanted.

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

BubbyJello

yeah, that may work, though i still don't think 'control innovation' is what developers should depend on to improve Zelda.

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

BubbyJello

People really have zero notion of the issues/characteristics of what they call 1:1 motion control... :?

Who, me? I thought what I said wouldn't have many issues, if done right. The IR pointer would pick the location of the sword, while the motion/tilt control would do other stuff. Meaning not much waggling. Imagine RE4, but Leon had a sword in his hand instead of a gun, and you could put the sword where ever you wanted.

So basically, you want the camera to be over Link's shoulver while he keeps pointing the sword forward...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTEM_PpI5RE

[QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

g_moujaes_2000

yeah, that may work, though i still don't think 'control innovation' is what developers should depend on to improve Zelda.

Still, in order to improve and innovate Zelda, it has to be done.

[QUOTE="g_moujaes_2000"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

Wintry_Flutist

yeah, that may work, though i still don't think 'control innovation' is what developers should depend on to improve Zelda.

Still, in order to improve and innovate Zelda, it has to be done.

didn't you say earlier it would present alot of technical difficulties?

is it worth the risk and time? shouldn't there be more focus on say, innovating with the Zelda universe itself? we've seen too much of Hyrule already.

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"][QUOTE="g_moujaes_2000"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

g_moujaes_2000

yeah, that may work, though i still don't think 'control innovation' is what developers should depend on to improve Zelda.

Still, in order to improve and innovate Zelda, it has to be done.

didn't you say earlier it would present alot of technical difficulties?

is it worth the risk and time? shouldn't there be more focus on say, innovating with the Zelda universe itself? we've seen too much of Hyrule already.

[QUOTE="Wintry_Flutist"][QUOTE="g_moujaes_2000"][QUOTE="BubbyJello"]

I really want the next Zelda game to have 1:1 sword control. They could just have Link's hand be like the cursor, and you move it around with the Wiimote. And you could twist it to make the sword turn and stuff. Make it so if you put the cursor(aka Link's hand) at the right side of the screen, that's right where Link's hand would be, but make the camera closer to Link. And all of the items would be controlled the same way.

g_moujaes_2000

yeah, that may work, though i still don't think 'control innovation' is what developers should depend on to improve Zelda.

Still, in order to improve and innovate Zelda, it has to be done.

didn't you say earlier it would present alot of technical difficulties?

is it worth the risk and time? shouldn't there be more focus on say, innovating with the Zelda universe itself? we've seen too much of Hyrule already.

Don't put words in my mouth...

I said 1:1 controls are trickier than most people figure. They think it's just about making it work, but that implies issues like preventing impossible animations (Link's arm going through his body), lack of force feedback (what happens if your sword has an obstacle while the actual Wiimote doesn't?), etc...

Sword control is not the main Zelda gameplay, there are plenty of other thinks that can be revisited with the Wiimote in mind. Besides, there are also many controls that can be refined without the motion controls.

Anyway, the point is: if you want to improve and innovate, you can just change the looks or the presentation. More important is the gameplay and the controls. The rest will be changed to fit it, but it has to start with the core.

I don't really mind if everyone in Zelda (Besides Link, of course) had voice acting. I'm just hesitant on one thing.

Ganondorf. Someone said to get rid of him, but it'd be kind of odd. He's supposed to be Link's Bowser, so to speak. Plus, he is pure evil. It'd be kind of odd to do away with the protagonist's main villian. Kind of like how Andross faded out of the scene as Fox's enemy. Sure, he'll have Star Wolf, but he's more of a rival than one of those villians where you think, "He's pure evil" and has no redeeming qualities. However, there are a few games in Zelda where Ganondorf isn't the main villian (I can't remember which ones at the moment, though.)

I don't really mind if everyone in Zelda (Besides Link, of course) had voice acting. I'm just hesitant on one thing.

Ganondorf. Someone said to get rid of him, but it'd be kind of odd. He's supposed to be Link's Bowser, so to speak. Plus, he is pure evil. It'd be kind of odd to do away with the protagonist's main villian. Kind of like how Andross faded out of the scene as Fox's enemy. Sure, he'll have Star Wolf, but he's more of a rival than one of those villians where you think, "He's pure evil" and has no redeeming qualities. However, there are a few games in Zelda where Ganondorf isn't the main villian (I can't remember which ones at the moment, though.)

Admiral_Yuzika

I think the main problem is that he keeps coming back and beind owned the same way. The only way to have him coming back is to make him more related to the plot than just "Ganondorf comes back, unleashes enemies and waits for you sitting on his thrown".

Think Ocelot in MGS games. He's always there, but it's not like it doesn't make sense or gets old, because he's a lot more than just Snake's nemesis.

[QUOTE="SIMIFU"]well maybe everybody else could talk.but make link the quiet one.zeriva

Everyone needs a silent bob.