All the bullshit about the Panama canal

1. This does not relate specifically to American politics, but it's a topic about infrastructure and sovereignty so I feel it truly deserves its own thread.

2. Some obviously false statements have been made about this infraestructure project, the end of which is to use the threat of military force to gain preferential transit fees. I believe this sets an extremely dangerous precedent, and risks a return to old fashioned imperialism.

False statements:

1. “We have been treated very badly from this foolish gift that should never have been made,” Trump said during his inaugural speech. “And Panama’s promise to us has been broken. The purpose of our deal and the spirit of our treaty has been totally violated.”

I think this statement is deliberately vague enough to not be subjected to factual analysis. Though obviously he is implying unfair treatment. The opposite is true. The USA is charged the same transit fees as any other countries commercial vessel. The only exception is that American military vessels are actually afforded expedited transit.

2. “The United States, I mean think of this, spent more money than ever spent on a project before and lost 38,000 lives in the building of the Panama Canal.”

Several constructions attempt took place for the canal. During the U.S. period of construction from about 1904 to 1914, about 6,000 people died, almost all of whom were from Barbados. 300 of those were Americans.

3. “China is operating the Panama Canal, and we didn’t give it to China, we gave it to Panama, and we’re taking it back.”

The Panamanian government controls the canal through the Panama Canal Authority, an 11-member board that oversees the waterway’s maintenance and security.

A Hong Kong consortium won a bid in 1997 that allows Chinese companies to operate in ports at the ends of the canal. But U.S. and Taiwanese companies also operate ports along the canal, which is open to commerce from all countries.

Sourced used

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2025/01/20/trump-panama-canal-inauguration-fact-check/77840452007/

I believe this new approach of trump of using threats of military coercion to gain commercial advantages is extremely concerning and can easily escalate to an actual military conflict. We have already seen during the 2020 election that many of his supporters will accept anything he has to say regardless of how illogical it may seem at first sight. A return to 19 century imperialism would be catastrophic for the world and should be taken seriously.

Steve O is going to lock this when he sees it.

Panama owns the canal. End of story. If someone doesn't like it, they can pout.

I say we don't chalk these up as "political" threads, we chalk them up to "current event" threads. It just seems like our dialogue should be open rather than constrained. Especially since that is what everyone wants to talk about.

@DEVILinIRON: But they'll swamp the threads about your favorite pizza toppings!

I would wait until he actually does something. Remember, the guy's first and foremost a weapon of mass distraction; he says wild shit to draw attention to himself and away from what he's doing. My experience with his involvement in North Korea and most recently Israel also suggests the guy likes to promise high, settle for low, then paper over the gaps with PR. At least on the diplomatic stage.

This nonsense also isn't new. Heck, none other than Ronald Reagan bitched about it when the Torrijos-Carter Treaty was signed back in 1977, and there have been multiple efforts to reverse it since.

The fascinating part is what happens if the world no longer believes America can be a guarantor of the Panama Canal's neutrality. Would that reinvigorate interest in constructing an alternate canal through Nicaragua? Doubt it, considering the much steeper engineering challenges, but stranger things have happened.

@nirgal: This is not a made up problem. China has business that control ports of the canal..This is a problem because in times of conflict Chinese business are an extension of the government. If they are asked to block ports that is exactly what they will do.