Are Obama's Chances Over?

As long as Obama continues to stand firm on ihs opposition to offshore drilling, he will be fine. His recent decision to change his mind on public financing, however, has me a little skeptical.Colbert_Nation

May I ask you why you support Obama? I'm stationed in Hawaii, and out here he's got supporters who I can't even talk to, I've been called racist and every name in the book when I voiced opinion against him it was insanity. I don't want to start a flame war, I just honestly want to ask what makes you interested in the guy.

I'm stationed in Hawaii

MarineJcksn

What are they having you do in Hawaii?

Sorry for going off topic, I'm just curious...

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"]

I'm stationed in Hawaii

Darth_Tyrev

What are they having you do in Hawaii?

Sorry for going off topic, I'm just curious...

his job is to keep people from drowning

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"]

I'm stationed in Hawaii

Darth_Tyrev

What are they having you do in Hawaii?

Sorry for going off topic, I'm just curious...

No problem at all Darth! I'm with a Marine Heavy Helicopter Squadron, we fly the CH-53D Sea Stallion Helicopter. Heavy lift capabilites, external cargo operations, passenger movements and stuff like that. Heading to Iraq this weekend.

[QUOTE="Darth_Tyrev"][QUOTE="MarineJcksn"]

I'm stationed in Hawaii

MarineJcksn

What are they having you do in Hawaii?

Sorry for going off topic, I'm just curious...

No problem at all Darth! I'm with a Marine Heavy Helicopter Squadron, we fly the CH-53D Sea Stallion Helicopter. Heavy lift capabilites, external cargo operations, passenger movements and stuff like that. Heading to Iraq this weekend.

Wow, good luck man.

[QUOTE="Colbert_Nation"]As long as Obama continues to stand firm on ihs opposition to offshore drilling, he will be fine. His recent decision to change his mind on public financing, however, has me a little skeptical.MarineJcksn

May I ask you why you support Obama? I'm stationed in Hawaii, and out here he's got supporters who I can't even talk to, I've been called racist and every name in the book when I voiced opinion against him it was insanity. I don't want to start a flame war, I just honestly want to ask what makes you interested in the guy.

I support Obama because I feel we need an outsider in Washington. I think Obama is intelligent enough to qualify for President. He has an impressive academic record. As much as I have nothing but respect for McCain, I just can't trust him. Before he was against the Bush tax cuts, and now he supports them. Before McCain called the lunies both on the left and right "Agents of intolerance", now he has united with them. On top of that, I think we should get out of Iraq

But... it isn't a long-term solution. :| I don't see the problem with what he said. We absolutely have to get off of oil at some point or another; drilling for more oil just serves to put it off to the next generation.GabuEx

No offense but this way of thinking is incredibly irresponsible IMO. What IS the solution? Alternative fuels? Yes, of course we need alternative fuel sources. But face it, we have an OIL based economy, and that isn't going to change in the next 10-20 years at a minium. Why can't guys like Obama actually be adult and LISTEN to those who advocate drilling in our own country everywhere we can, as long as it's done extremely clean and efficient, while at the same time pushing full speed towards alternative sources as well? Eventually, SOMETHING will replace oil. But until we get there (and we're not close, BTW. Not yet) we NEED more oil and it makes so much more sense to use our own supply then buy it from a part of the world who hates us.

In the 1970s, when Jimmy Carter advocated the creation of the Synthetic Fuels Corporation to create our own synthetic oil and not rely on OPEC the price was over 34 bucks a barrel. After SFC was created, in less then 6 MONTHS OPEC cut the cost of oil down to 16 bucks. You think that was just a coincidence?

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"][QUOTE="Colbert_Nation"]Colbert_Nation

I support Obama because I feel we need an outsider in Washington. I think Obama is intelligent enough to qualify for President. He has an impressive academic record. As much as I have nothing but respect for McCain, I just can't trust him. Before he was against the Bush tax cuts, and now he supports them. Before McCain called the lunies both on the left and right "Agents of intolerance", now he has united with them. On top of that, I think we should get out of Iraq

I really appreciate your response on this. I've got a few rebuttals for the reasons you stated, take them how you will they're just my personal opinions:

Obama isn't an outsider in Washington. Repeatedly, he's proven to me that he is a typical politician we've come to expect as corrupt. His extremely suspicious personal relationships with Tony Rezko showed me how dirty he really is. It's only one example from which I could name a lot more.

Academic wise, I haven't looked into his school record but I'll be willing to bet he did great in school, he speaks like a man who has had a good education. However, I think he's extremely lacking in common sense and out of touch with the common man.

John McCain, he's not what I want in a president either. He's a war hero and I respect him tremendously for this and would proudly salute him. But you're right about him changing sides WAY too often.

Getting out of Iraq, I'm all for it. I'm a US Marine, I go back to Iraq this weekend. I'm excited to be back with my unit getting things done out there, but I also know we need to get out. However, I'll never advocate a strict firm pullout that risks all the progress we've made, it would tarnish the memory of all the friends I've had die over there, and I can say without a doubt that we in the Military (at least the Marines I'm close to) WILL NOT tolerate another Vietnam.

In the beginning, I liked hearing Obama. He finally sounded like a REAL politician I could take pride in and get behind. But the more I looked into his backround and who he really was, the more I saw just what kind of person he really was.

Obama's a great candidate IMO if you want Socialism in America. McCain's a great choice if you want a guy who doesn't seem to know where he really stands. It's like that South Park season 8 episode where they have to choose between a Giant ***** and a turd sandwich.:?

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]But... it isn't a long-term solution. :| I don't see the problem with what he said. We absolutely have to get off of oil at some point or another; drilling for more oil just serves to put it off to the next generation.MarineJcksn

No offense but this way of thinking is incredibly irresponsible IMO. What IS the solution? Alternative fuels? Yes, of course we need alternative fuel sources. But face it, we have an OIL based economy, and that isn't going to change in the next 10-20 years at a minium. Why can't guys like Obama actually be adult and LISTEN to those who advocate drilling in our own country everywhere we can, as long as it's done extremely clean and efficient, while at the same time pushing full speed towards alternative sources as well? Eventually, SOMETHING will replace oil. But until we get there (and we're not close, BTW. Not yet) we NEED more oil and it makes so much more sense to use our own supply then buy it from a part of the world who hates us.

In the 1970s, when Jimmy Carter advocated the creation of the Synthetic Fuels Corporation to create our own synthetic oil and not rely on OPEC the price was over 34 bucks a barrel. After SFC was created, in less then 6 MONTHS OPEC cut the cost of oil down to 16 bucks. You think that was just a coincidence?

Ir isn't easy it switch our primary energy source. The US has so many things built arround gas that it would take about a decade to implement a new primary energy source (and it will still be a very rough transition).

I also can't disagree with you on the oil companies. To put it in perspective: Which is the largest company based upon revenue? Exxon
The world? Exxon
The past 10 years? Exxon

Just an oil company.

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"][QUOTE="GabuEx"]Luminouslight

Ir isn't easy it switch our primary energy source. The US has so many things built arround gas that it would take about a decade to implement a new primary energy source (and it will still be a very rough transition).

I also can't disagree with you on the oil companies. To put it in perspective: Which is the largest company based upon revenue? Exxon
The world? Exxon
The past 10 years? Exxon

Just an oil company.

You see that the transition will be a rough one like I do. But eventually, it will happen and that's what so many people seem unable to understand, that while we need cleaner, more efficient energy we also need oil to allow us to power our lives while we research and develop better energy sources.

ExxonMobile is a huge oil company, no doubt about it. What always makes me laugh though is just how little people really understand about Exxon. While their profits are large, in the billions every quarter, they control less then 6% of the world's total oil. Barely a drop in the bucket.

Side note, if anyone reading this has a gas station near them called CITGO, never do business with them. You're supporting Hugo Chavez, and I think anyone with common sense who reads knows what a monster that lunatic is. Even if windbags like Sean Penn and Danny Glover love the guy. :roll:

http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/Obama_on_oil_drilling_Not_a_long_term_solution Based on his comments to "Not lift the moratorium on coastal drilling" and "That drilling for more oil will not affect gas prices in any way", it really seems like Obama might've blown his shot at becoming the next president. Currently, he's about 15 points ahead in the National Polls but I feel that number will dwindle and die by November. Think about it; the Massive crowds he currently draws, large groups of college age individuals and students, will they REALLY go vote in November? Some will, and I feel it'll be a larger number of young voters then anytime in recent memory. But realistically, if you look at the historical evidence on who REALLY comes out to vote, the numbers generally increase in accordance with the age of the person voting. Sounds crazy, but look it up. And I think we all know that an older crowd will draw a much more diverse lineup of voters, who place a lot of importance on the STAGGERING current price of energy. Make no mistake, I'm not saying that drilling more Oil is the only thing we need. We need to research and develop multiple sources of energy, such as Coal, Nuclear, Wind, Solar, Hydrogen, Ethanol (FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, GET RID OF CORN BASED ETHANOL ALREADY) , hydroelectric, etc. etc. etc. But to merely say we wont drill, when the REST of the world is drilling is not only incredibly stupid, it's a policy that will guarantee failure. Barry really isn't a very bright guy. Face facts, you know it's true. What do you think?MarineJcksn

Not at all, now if I'm not sure the public will see if this offshore drilling is a ploy, and will have no real effect for at least 8-10 years, and we need to be spending our resources on R&D on other energy. But will the public be smart enough to see this. If they are I think his numbers climb even higher.

obama will be president. You can quote me on that.freshgman

I'll do it!

Our offshore oil reserves are a drop in the bucket- they would add about 2% to our global supply. So the price would drop a similar amount.

No offense, but $3.92 gas is just about the same price as $4.00.

Obama is right, this solution won't solve anything. For now, all we can do is what we've been doing, which is tighten our belts and drive a little less.

Sorry OP, but I absolutely agree that we shouldn't drill. It'll temporarily bring gas prices down a few cents 10 years from now... who cares? It's a terrible idea. I would much rather see that money spent on a nuclear plant. Wind and solar farms would be nice too.

While I know few share my opinion, I'm actually of the persuasion that high gas prices are good for us in the long run. The higher gas prices go, the more pressure there is on communities to provide adequate transit, automotive companies to develop electric cars, energy companies to diversify their sources, etc...It's also bringing people back to a more sensible, sustainable way of living- it's homeostasis at work! :)

John McCain, he's not what I want in a president either. He's a war hero and I respect him tremendously for this and would proudly salute him. But you're right about him changing sides WAY too often.

MarineJcksn

Just to comment on McCain's stance on the Bush tax cuts:

From what I understand (please correct me if wrong) is that while he did oppose them back in 01, he has always been a no raising taxes guy and getting rid of the cuts would mean raising taxes hence he opposes getting rid of them.

I'll just say this. The Democrats could put a living breathing monkey on stage against McCain, and as long as he is 36 and a US citizen he would win.

The Republican party is so disenfranchised to what the American people want....and ultimately need. Now I am not saying that the Dems will do any better....

I hope his chances are over. He's such an empty suit with no experience.

Most of his supporters are clueless and are just voting for him because he's personable, a good speaker, good looking, black, etc.

I've heard more discussion during his campaign about race than I did about what he'll do for the country.

John McCain doesn't have a snowball's chance in the small of Claudia Cardinale's back.

While I know few share my opinion, I'm actually of the persuasion that high gas prices are good for us in the long run.

dgbiker1

Tell that to people that have to commuit 40+ minutes (one way) everyday to work.

And sorry, "take a bus" doesn't cut it. Electric cars do not eliminate our dependence on forign oil. Drilling now while he find a way to get off oil can only help us in the future.

Isn't there someone budgeting this? Why can't there be a research group that can estimate the cost of oil if we do drill oil and see how long they can sustain us at a constate rate, assuming we continue research on alternative energy sources and we can estimate the time it takes to find the "magic potion"? I certainly don't want to use up oil but why wouldn't a little oil drilling be enough to sustain us in the meantime at the very least.

I'm still a skeptic on this whole issue to be honest. For people like me, we're going to be looking at Obama's stances on other issues, so no, I don't think his chances are over.

John McCain, he's not what I want in a president either. He's a war hero and I respect him tremendously for this and would proudly salute him. But you're right about him changing sides WAY too often.

MarineJcksn

It may be abit dodgy, but remember Winston Churchill, Englands greatest and perhaps most iconic Prime Minister? He kept changing sides from Liberal to Conservative, and arguable he WON WW2 for the allies, without him, Europe might beu nder German domination now!

[QUOTE="dgbiker1"]

While I know few share my opinion, I'm actually of the persuasion that high gas prices are good for us in the long run.

limpbizkit818

Tell that to people that have to commuit 40+ minutes (one way) everyday to work.

And sorry, "take a bus" doesn't cut it. Electric cars do not eliminate our dependence on forign oil. Drilling now while he find a way to get off oil can only help us in the future.

http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/Obama_on_oil_drilling_Not_a_long_term_solution Based on his comments to "Not lift the moratorium on coastal drilling" and "That drilling for more oil will not affect gas prices in any way", it really seems like Obama might've blown his shot at becoming the next president. Currently, he's about 15 points ahead in the National Polls but I feel that number will dwindle and die by November. Think about it; the Massive crowds he currently draws, large groups of college age individuals and students, will they REALLY go vote in November? Some will, and I feel it'll be a larger number of young voters then anytime in recent memory. But realistically, if you look at the historical evidence on who REALLY comes out to vote, the numbers generally increase in accordance with the age of the person voting. Sounds crazy, but look it up. And I think we all know that an older crowd will draw a much more diverse lineup of voters, who place a lot of importance on the STAGGERING current price of energy. Make no mistake, I'm not saying that drilling more Oil is the only thing we need. We need to research and develop multiple sources of energy, such as Coal, Nuclear, Wind, Solar, Hydrogen, Ethanol (FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, GET RID OF CORN BASED ETHANOL ALREADY) , hydroelectric, etc. etc. etc. But to merely say we wont drill, when the REST of the world is drilling is not only incredibly stupid, it's a policy that will guarantee failure. Barry really isn't a very bright guy. Face facts, you know it's true. What do you think?MarineJcksn

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like you think he doomed himself by saying he thinks we should not be drilling for oil.

THen you go on to list a bunch of alternatives.

Personally, I think alternatives should be our main focus. The rest of the world is going to look to the US for a solution, and quite honestly I think it is our duty to pave the way for alternate fuels while those that truly need the last bit of gas get it.

Let China get the rest of the gas. When it runs out, our tech will be 20+ years ahead of them. It will be like the Cold War all over again, with the US in the lead and the Chinese decades behind us in tech.

No, I dont think Obama messed up. I just think a lot of people are going to misinterpret or twist his words around. I find his comments almost prophetic in a way.

His chances aren't going to be over over something as insignificant as that. Especially when so many people agree with him. Offshore drilling is not an adequate solution for the short term, or down the road. Neither is something like drilling in ANWR.bman784

Then give me a realistic solution. Present a plan that can elliminate our use of foreign oil other then drilling while continuing to research and produce alternative fuel sources.

Obama doesn't have a plan. Alternatives are the wave of the future, but they wont replace oil in a few years. Barry is without a doubt IMO one of the most lacking in common sense people I've ever encountered. I just can't see how anyone can listen to him and fail to look into who he really is and what he's really done. It doesn't matter to ANYONE his connections to known criminals, not to mention the business deals he did with them? He got his house funding from a guy who's facing life in prison for gods'sake.

Bman, I know you're a socialist and that's why you want Barry. I applaude the fact that at least you admit you're in favor of socialism rather then just follow Obama based on his personality appeal like the rest of the lemmings out there:)

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"]http://digg.com/2008_us_elections/Obama_on_oil_drilling_Not_a_long_term_solution Based on his comments to "Not lift the moratorium on coastal drilling" and "That drilling for more oil will not affect gas prices in any way", it really seems like Obama might've blown his shot at becoming the next president. Currently, he's about 15 points ahead in the National Polls but I feel that number will dwindle and die by November. Think about it; the Massive crowds he currently draws, large groups of college age individuals and students, will they REALLY go vote in November? Some will, and I feel it'll be a larger number of young voters then anytime in recent memory. But realistically, if you look at the historical evidence on who REALLY comes out to vote, the numbers generally increase in accordance with the age of the person voting. Sounds crazy, but look it up. And I think we all know that an older crowd will draw a much more diverse lineup of voters, who place a lot of importance on the STAGGERING current price of energy. Make no mistake, I'm not saying that drilling more Oil is the only thing we need. We need to research and develop multiple sources of energy, such as Coal, Nuclear, Wind, Solar, Hydrogen, Ethanol (FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, GET RID OF CORN BASED ETHANOL ALREADY) , hydroelectric, etc. etc. etc. But to merely say we wont drill, when the REST of the world is drilling is not only incredibly stupid, it's a policy that will guarantee failure. Barry really isn't a very bright guy. Face facts, you know it's true. What do you think?mrbojangles25

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like you think he doomed himself by saying he thinks we should not be drilling for oil.

THen you go on to list a bunch of alternatives.

Personally, I think alternatives should be our main focus. The rest of the world is going to look to the US for a solution, and quite honestly I think it is our duty to pave the way for alternate fuels while those that truly need the last bit of gas get it.

Let China get the rest of the gas. When it runs out, our tech will be 20+ years ahead of them. It will be like the Cold War all over again, with the US in the lead and the Chinese decades behind us in tech.

No, I dont think Obama messed up. I just think a lot of people are going to misinterpret or twist his words around. I find his comments almost prophetic in a way.

That highlighted last line scares the CRAP outta me Bo. Obama isn't the messiah, he's another empty product of washington. Look past the fluffy speaches and it just jumps out how dirty this guy is. Unless you're into socialism, then he's your messiah and he'll lead you to the land of Government mandated Milk and Honey.;)

Neither candidate is doing well so far, but Obama still looks like a more appealing candidate to me. Plus he's kinda right. We need to work on hydrogen power already, so our dependence on oil is eliminated. Off shore drilling will only keep prices down for a little while 6-7 years from now, then they will jump way up until gas is a luxury.

MarineJcksn, I like how you're able to voice your opinion fairly and intelligently. I'm being kind of off topic, but you don't see that a lot on the Internet.

(Or maybe I should get away from forums with an age demographic such as this one.)

As far as I'm concerned, Obama has more policies that line up with my personal views than McCain does. There are issues with each of them that I don't favor, but I find a lot more wrong with McCain than Obama.

I'm in no situation to tell either side they're wrong, though, until I do more research. (This'll be my first year being able to vote, so I'm a little new to politics.) So far, though, I don't see myself voting for McCain in November.

And as far as the youth vote being too small, this year has seen record voter turnouts, and I hope the trend continues in November. I'll definitely be at the polls.

If Obama does not win, I will leave this country for ever...oh wait, I'm moving back to the UK on August 2nd for good anyway!...;)CreamBeav

Hey, that sounds fun. I lived there for two years. It's much better than the States. Are you originally from the UK or the US?

Well, if the election is rigged with e-voting machines in a few areas like the last one probably was, it really won't matter how people vote.

At any rate, the last 2 presidential elections have had some sort of controversy surrounding their results, so I won't be highly surprised if the next one does as well. It will make an interesting diversion I suppose at any rate.

Typical neocon thinking though: Short term quick fix solution and the hell with the largely irreversible side effects.

[QUOTE="mrbojangles25"]

[QUOTE="MarineJcksn"]*original text*MarineJcksn

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like you think he doomed himself by saying he thinks we should not be drilling for oil.

THen you go on to list a bunch of alternatives.

Personally, I think alternatives should be our main focus. The rest of the world is going to look to the US for a solution, and quite honestly I think it is our duty to pave the way for alternate fuels while those that truly need the last bit of gas get it.

Let China get the rest of the gas. When it runs out, our tech will be 20+ years ahead of them. It will be like the Cold War all over again, with the US in the lead and the Chinese decades behind us in tech.

No, I dont think Obama messed up. I just think a lot of people are going to misinterpret or twist his words around. I find his comments almost prophetic in a way.

That highlighted last line scares the CRAP outta me Bo. Obama isn't the messiah, he's another empty product of washington. Look past the fluffy speaches and it just jumps out how dirty this guy is. Unless you're into socialism, then he's your messiah and he'll lead you to the land of Government mandated Milk and Honey.;)

ya, I could have phrased that better.

with that said, all heil Obama, savior of the world, speaker for God!

John McCain, he's not what I want in a president either. He's a war hero and I respect him tremendously for this and would proudly salute him. But you're right about him changing sides WAY too often.

MarineJcksn

I have a question for you. You're in the military, right?

Let's say you were held as a prisoner of war for over 5 years, 2 years of which were spent in solitary confinement, the rest of which were spent being severely tortured to the point where you are forced to give a "confession" of anti-American propoganda. If years later, people who are supposed to be your friends turn around and start calling you a traitor who cracked under pressure, you wouldn't stand by those people, would you, let alone keep them as friends?

Because that's what happened to John McCain. And despite the Hell that he went through, despite the fact that he can no longer lift his arms above his head, despite being hailed as a war hero for almost 3 decades, in the year 2000 the Bush Campaign started accusing John McCain of being a war criminal, and a traitor to his country.

And do you know what John McCain did about that? He gladly threw his support behind Bush when Bush won the Repblican Primary.

Sadly, that is the day that I lost all respect for John McCain. How is he supposed to stand up for our country, if he can't even stand up for himself against his own party?

I think what's happening is that drilling has politicized this election unfortunately, now I'm all for it, but reality is, drilling in our coastal reserves, or in anwr will only increase our oil production by 1/2 of 1%, which is basically nothing and will effect the price by no more than a cent or two.

I don't think drilling will help anything, if anything it will be a very short term solution (in the future, it takes a few years to get oil production going) and it is basically the equivalent of treating the symptoms, not the disease. The main focus of our oil crises needs to be on alternatives, not on further drilling, which is what Obama is trying to get across.