Are you a creationist or and evolutionist

or in between, where ytou beleive God set evolution in motion

i am an evolutionist, i am taking human origins at my College, and it is just so much easier to understand, and there is more realism to it.

Evoltuion is testable, while creationism is not.

there are fossils, gene pools and what not to show that evoltion existed.

but there is nothing to show how creation happened.

As in the creator made all, but who created the creator and how did he come about.

And if God created us, then why is there so many technical flaws with the human antatomy.

theres way too many points to mention on both sides, so ill leave it to you guys.  

How many times do we need to go through these threads before it ends?II_Seraphim_II

Ends? Are you mad? THERE IS NO END!

YEa i have an open mind to everyones opinion, but to the guy thats complaining about this thread dont come in here and leave a comment! 

Creationist. Examining the structure of the universe, solar system, the earth, our bodies; it's hard to believe we came from random events that just somehow magically came together perfectly. The law of Entropy, things go to disorder, not order.SupraGT

Creationist. Examining the structure of the universe, solar system, the earth, our bodies; it's hard to believe we came from random events that just somehow magically came together perfectly. The law of Entropy, things go to disorder, not order.SupraGT

With infinite possibilities, all scenarios are explored. Imagine with the size of the universe and the amount of time that has passed. The universe has had infinite possibilities to bring about life. Yes it may seem like alot of things had to click for life to work, but thats like finding a needle in the entire world. If you keep searching, eventually you will find the needle.

 

YEa i have an open mind to everyones opinion, but to the guy thats complaining about this thread dont come in here and leave a comment! 

jerkface96

Im not complaining, im seriously curious. I want to know what it is that people are trying to accomplish. What are they looking for? Is there a magic answer that will satisfy them? :P

[QUOTE="jerkface96"]

 

YEa i have an open mind to everyones opinion, but to the guy thats complaining about this thread dont come in here and leave a comment! 

II_Seraphim_II

Im not complaining, im seriously curious. I want to know what it is that people are trying to accomplish. What are they looking for? Is there a magic answer that will satisfy them? :P

haha o ok i understnad, haha, i just wanted to see what the majority of Gamespot users think.  

[QUOTE="SupraGT"]Creationist. Examining the structure of the universe, solar system, the earth, our bodies; it's hard to believe we came from random events that just somehow magically came together perfectly. The law of Entropy, things go to disorder, not order.II_Seraphim_II

With infinite possibilities, all scenarios are explored. Imagine with the size of the universe and the amount of time that has passed. The universe has had infinite possibilities to bring about life. Yes it may seem like alot of things had to click for life to work, but thats like finding a needle in the entire world. If you keep searching, eventually you will find the needle.

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane. Matter cannot be created nor destroyed. So according to this, it always existed. In the same way, i can say God always existed. People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane. Matter cannot be created nor destroyed. So according to this, it always existed. In the same way, i can say God always existed. People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

SupraGT

Please, though, explain to me how the 2nd law of thermodynamics is applied to the fact that allele frequency in a population changes over time. 

[QUOTE="SupraGT"]

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane. Matter cannot be created nor destroyed. So according to this, it always existed. In the same way, i can say God always existed. People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

zakkro

Please, though, explain to me how the 2nd law of thermodynamics is applied to the fact that allele frequency in a population changes over time. 

The earth can be thought of as a system and energy is realeased through various means through whatever molecular structure that make up the earth. That's the best i can do.

[QUOTE="zakkro"][QUOTE="SupraGT"]

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane. Matter cannot be created nor destroyed. So according to this, it always existed. In the same way, i can say God always existed. People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

SupraGT

Please, though, explain to me how the 2nd law of thermodynamics is applied to the fact that allele frequency in a population changes over time. 

The earth can be thought of as a system and energy is realeased through various means through whatever molecular structure that make up the earth. That's the best i can do.

[QUOTE="II_Seraphim_II"]

[QUOTE="SupraGT"]Creationist. Examining the structure of the universe, solar system, the earth, our bodies; it's hard to believe we came from random events that just somehow magically came together perfectly. The law of Entropy, things go to disorder, not order.SupraGT

With infinite possibilities, all scenarios are explored. Imagine with the size of the universe and the amount of time that has passed. The universe has had infinite possibilities to bring about life. Yes it may seem like alot of things had to click for life to work, but thats like finding a needle in the entire world. If you keep searching, eventually you will find the needle.

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane. Matter cannot be created nor destroyed. So according to this, it always existed. In the same way, i can say God always existed. People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

Where did this point of mass come from? Where did god come from? If you can believe that god always existed how about that that mass always existed? And about probability, I understand that the mathematical probability must be insane, but you dont truly grasp the size of the univers (infact I dont think either of us do :P). The Universe is a massive place, and I mean MASSIVE. Each second that passes by infinite amounts of experients are occuring in this ever growing universe. No two seconds are ever the same, and every single second that passes brings about the possibility of the first step in the arduos process of the creation of life. If life is a possibility (and we know it is because we exist) then it stands to reason that given infinite attempts, one is guranteed to arrive at life.

But you know what, Im admitedly not a pro on the subject. Im like you, I follow the theory that I feel seems the most reasonable to me :P I would never come out and say "God absolutely does not exist" because I dont know. Science doesnt know. Im just saying that "chances are evolution is probably more correct than creationism." So if you believe in creationism, then go for it! You probably understand more about creationism than I do about evolution :P

Um... okay. :| Yet I can still have sex with a woman and bring forth offspring that carries our genes. zakkro

This is why I believe that God had a plan for everyone and He designed us this way. It's not an accident. So can you explain to me where that point mass came from? That's the basis from where everything began right?

[QUOTE="zakkro"]

Um... okay. :| Yet I can still have sex with a woman and bring forth offspring that carries our genes. SupraGT

This is why I believe that God had a plan for everyone and He designed us this way. It's not an accident. So can you explain to me where that point mass came from? That's the basis from where everything began right?

Where did this point of mass come from? Where did god come from? If you can believe that god always existed how about that that mass always existed? And about probability, I understand that the mathematical probability must be insane, but you dont truly grasp the size of the univers (infact I dont think either of us do :P). The Universe is a massive place, and I mean MASSIVE. Each second that passes by infinite amounts of experients are occuring in this ever growing universe. No two seconds are ever the same, and every single second that passes brings about the possibility of the first step in the arduos process of the creation of life. If life is a possibility (and we know it is because we exist) then it stands to reason that given infinite attempts, one is guranteed to arrive at life.

But you know what, Im admitedly not a pro on the subject. Im like you, I follow the theory that I feel seems the most reasonable to me :P I would never come out and say "God absolutely does not exist" because I dont know. Science doesnt know. Im just saying that "chances are evolution is probably more correct than creationism." So if you believe in creationism, then go for it! You probably understand more about creationism than I do about evolution :P

II_Seraphim_II

haha. I'm not so knowledgable myself, but I do have my reasons in believing in God. Everyone has their own reason :P

[QUOTE="SupraGT"][QUOTE="zakkro"]

Um... okay. :| Yet I can still have sex with a woman and bring forth offspring that carries our genes. zakkro

This is why I believe that God had a plan for everyone and He designed us this way. It's not an accident. So can you explain to me where that point mass came from? That's the basis from where everything began right?

Yeah, true. But there is no point of saying there is no God when no one knows where the singularity came from.

 in these threads, no one wins anyways :P

Yeah, true. But there is no point of saying there is no God when no one knows where the singularity came from.

 in these threads, no one wins anyways :P

SupraGT

If it's about theology, yes. In light of science, there can be an occasional win.

I suppose you would call me an evolutionist. I also happen to be a gravitationalist and an an atomist.domatron23

[QUOTE="SupraGT"]

Yeah, true. But there is no point of saying there is no God when no one knows where the singularity came from.

 in these threads, no one wins anyways :P

zakkro

If it's about theology, yes. In light of science, there can be an occasional win.

well anyways, sitting through all my engineering and science classes and learning about the complex nature of things, it only makes my faith in God greater.

I am neither. "Evolutionist" implies that there is a set of beliefs associated with it.

Considering the mountain of demonstrable evidence supporting evolution I "know" it to be true. There is no belief at all. It is as much a fact as gravity. Heck, we know more about the mechanics of evolution than we do gravity.foxhound_fox

Hit the nail on head.

evolution has more evidence

creationism is based on myth 

Creationist. Examining the structure of the universe, solar system, the earth, our bodies; it's hard to believe we came from random events that just somehow magically came together perfectly. The law of Entropy, things go to disorder, not order.SupraGT

No Creation means nothing to evolve.A1B2C3CAL

[QUOTE="A1B2C3CAL"]No Creation means nothing to evolve.Funky_Llama

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="A1B2C3CAL"]No Creation means nothing to evolve.A1B2C3CAL

[QUOTE="A1B2C3CAL"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]Why?Funky_Llama

That thing is technically speaking an alien like all of us.  We are the grandchildren of aliens lawl, take that bible belt *thwack* 

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="A1B2C3CAL"]It's the what came first the chicken or the egg theory. Evolution can't happen if nothing exist because it wasn't created. You need to create something first before it can evolve.clembo1990

That thing is technically speaking an alien like all of us.  We are the grandchildren of aliens lawl, take that bible belt *thwack* 

Everything just happened to click right on the money. The probablilties of this are mathematically insane.SupraGT

People bring up the arguement about how God came to be, but they also need to take a look at the scientific theory. Big bang theory states that the universe came to be from a point mass with infinite density. Then it released a lot of energy and exploded. So tell me this, where did this point mass come from?

God makes more sense to me.

SupraGT

Neither.

Everything just happened to click right on the money.SupraGT

[QUOTE="SupraGT"]Everything just happened to click right on the money.foxhound_fox

I'm not taking their side or anything, but I'd just like to point out something. What's considered perfect in human thinking is more a representation of ones culture. We see physical ideals as how our culture teaches us to value them. This being said, what's perfect to us may not always be true in biology. What appears imperfect to us may actually be perfect according to how nature intended it to be.

There is a reason everything has apperent flaws, and that's because flaws are necessary. The only thing is.. most humans don't believe so. They'd rather just have everything be the best way. Well, the best way is having apparent flaws. It gives us the ability to compare, and to value. It would be pretty boring if we had nothing to compare anything too. But, of course this to is said as a human perception.

Life is perfect. No matter how it came into existance. I have to be careful here because people may say, well you just said two different things. First you said life is imperfect, then perfect. No, I said by majority of humans life as is imperfect. And always are looking to define what's better than.  And my conclusion was that life is perfect outside of human perception and is working how it's suppose to work.  No matter how we see it.

I'm not taking their side or anything, but I'd just like to point out something. What's considered perfect in human thinking is more a representation of ones culture. We see physical ideals as how our culture teaches us to value them. This being said, what's perfect to us may not always be true in biology. What appears imperfect to us may actually be perfect according to how nature intended it to be.

There is a reason everything has apperent flaws, and that's because flaws are necessary. The only thing is.. most humans don't believe so. They'd rather just have everything be the best way. Well, the best way is having apparent flaws. It gives us the ability to compare, and to value. It would be pretty boring if we had nothing to compare anything too. But, of course this to is said as a human perception.

Life is perfect. No matter how it came into existance. 

EMOEVOLUTION

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"]I'm not taking their side or anything, but I'd just like to point out something. What's considered perfect in human thinking is more a representation of ones culture. We see physical ideals as how our culture teaches us to value them. This being said, what's perfect to us may not always be true in biology. What appears imperfect to us may actually be perfect according to how nature intended it to be.

There is a reason everything has apperent flaws, and that's because flaws are necessary. The only thing is.. most humans don't believe so. They'd rather just have everything be the best way. Well, the best way is having apparent flaws. It gives us the ability to compare, and to value. It would be pretty boring if we had nothing to compare anything too. But, of course this to is said as a human perception.

Life is perfect. No matter how it came into existence.

foxhound_fox

It is perfect. It's working how it's suppose to. Perfection assumes there is an ultimate state of existance where nothing bad can happen. That's silly. Even if an animal developed to a perfect state.. that doesn't mean it's environment would. You could say well it's perfect it could handle any environment. Well, evolution doesn't work that way. Because it knows better than us humans.

Superior... inferior, that's human thinking plain and simple. Everything dies, and that's because it's perfect. I understand it's hard for you to get this concept that death is actually an action of perfection. It creates the energy necessary to sustain all living things.

Let's say you have a perfect predator, and then a perfect herbivore.. Since they would be perfect there is no way the predator could kill the herbivore and so all the predators would die. It doesn't work in the grand scheme of things because then the perfect herbivore population would run rampant and destroy it's environment, which would kill majority of them. So this means the predator was in fact not perfect. This leads to my next paragraph.

So.. are you suggesting the perfect biological entity is in fact one creature? With an ultimate toolset to avoid death? This is not a possibility. IT would mean it wouldn't need to eat. It wouldn't need to sleep. IT would just exist without function. And that goes against how everything works. So that would be imperfect in regards to how life functions now. What appears as imperfect to you or inferior is actualy a necessity for anything to live at all. Without it there is no life.

That is why life is already perfect. Because it's doing what it's suppose to do. There never will be an ultimate form of life created by evolution. It just wouldn't work. And if there was it would have to be supported by an insanely large amount of imperfect entities to keep the environment it lives in functioning. Whether this is the planet, galaxy, or universe.

If you believe evolution seaks to create a perfect, superior thing.. then wouldnt that be a God? Maybe this perfection evolution seaks is actualy just the transfer of energy. Because it's more efficent than creating an ultimate being. No, the more I think about it. Life is perfect as it is. Thing will change, but that's only because the environment changes. Needs change. If anything the only way anything could be perfect is if the environment was.

Life is perfect because it works. If it was flawed there would be no life. It doesn't have room for flaws. IT's not trial an error. IT doesn't have purpose in the sense humans have purpose. All life is concerned about is the transfer of energy. 

the world is more than what it is and honestly i dont see myself in either option. evolution though has been proven so far and everyday we find new deseases and new species.... now i know it may tick off alot of bible thumpers but those are the facts.

That is why life is already perfect. Because it's doing what it's suppose to do. There never will be an ultimate form of life created by evolution. It just wouldn't work. EMOEVOLUTION

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"]That is why life is already perfect. Because it's doing what it's suppose to do.

There never will be an ultimate form of life created by evolution. It just wouldn't work. foxhound_fox

Life has worked for millions of years on this planet. I don't see how you can come to the conclusion that it isn't perfect now. Obviously, it's working how it's suppose to or there would be no life. It doesn't seak perfection in how humans perceive it. It's really that simple. If a species of animal dies out it's not because it was inferior, but because it was necessary for the continuation in life.  There is nothing inferior/superior about it.

Would humans be suited to live in an environment with dinosaurs running around? I can't answer that. Where life is now and where it was.. wasn't a pursuit of perfection. It was a response to the environment. What environment will we live in thousands of years from now? We can't predict that. And neither can evolution.