Cat who boarded same bus every day for four years killed

MrGeezer:

You can go and walk on the street and be aware of the things around you, then all of a sudden some guy comes up to you, shoots you. Sure, you can look after yourself, but not when a guy comes and does that to you.

The cat can look after itself, it is aware of the things surrounding it, it will be aware of a bus that's 100 times the size of it. If the cat sees it coming, it will try to avoid it the best they can, cats are not stupid, it was just caught out. YOU was caught out, off your guard, should of had more sense and worn a bulletproof vest, ay MrGeezer?

I rest my case.

Our only choice really is either to accept that these things can and do happen, or to deprive ourselves of the ability to enjoy life.

GabuEx

Do you need pet cats in order to enjoy life?

MrGeezer:

You can go and walk on the street and be aware of the things around you, then all of a sudden some guy comes up to you, shoots you. Sure, you can look after yourself, but not when a guy comes and does that to you.

The cat can look after itself, it is aware of the things surrounding it, it will be aware of a bus that's 100 times the size of it. If the cat sees it coming, it will try to avoid it the best they can, cats are not stupid, it was just caught out. YOU was caught out, off your guard, should of had more sense and worn a bulletproof vest, ay MrGeezer?

I rest my case.

CBR600-RR

Yeah, except that that's not what happened. :|

It didn't die because it got shot in the back, it died because it went into the street and got hit by a car.

While you're at it, you'd might as well compare Kurt Cobain to JFK, since they both got shot.

[QUOTE="magicalclick"]Cat can be trained. Some cats got hurt by cars and survived are totally scared of cars. The point is you have to let them know that car = pain. It is same as kids. You yell at tell them say that's dangerous. I don't see people yelling at their cats when cats are doing dangerous stuff. The problem is, you don't believe they can be trained. While they don't speak human language, they can be trained or at least understand what is a threat and what is not.MrGeezer

Uh...WTF?!

Sorry, but I intend on teaching my kids that cars are dangerous BEFORE they get hit by a car.

Cats get "trained" to avoid cars by getting hit by cars and realizing "wow, this really ****ing hurts". Then, if they're lucky enough to survive, they pay more attention to the ****ing cars.

You CAN'T train cats like you train kids. Kids know what you're saying, cat's DON'T. So...not having the ability to preemptively tell cats that cars are dangerous leaves really only one option: trusting that they learn from experience, and manage to be lucky enough to survive the experience. And if that's your attitude on teaching kids, then all I have to say is "wow".

Well this is obviously Obama's fault. Damn goverment not making a safe kitty sidewalk and traffic light..

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

[QUOTE="magicalclick"]Cat can be trained. Some cats got hurt by cars and survived are totally scared of cars. The point is you have to let them know that car = pain. It is same as kids. You yell at tell them say that's dangerous. I don't see people yelling at their cats when cats are doing dangerous stuff. The problem is, you don't believe they can be trained. While they don't speak human language, they can be trained or at least understand what is a threat and what is not.AzzoLovesBirdy

Uh...WTF?!

Sorry, but I intend on teaching my kids that cars are dangerous BEFORE they get hit by a car.

Cats get "trained" to avoid cars by getting hit by cars and realizing "wow, this really ****ing hurts". Then, if they're lucky enough to survive, they pay more attention to the ****ing cars.

You CAN'T train cats like you train kids. Kids know what you're saying, cat's DON'T. So...not having the ability to preemptively tell cats that cars are dangerous leaves really only one option: trusting that they learn from experience, and manage to be lucky enough to survive the experience. And if that's your attitude on teaching kids, then all I have to say is "wow".

Like I said before...If my child wasn't capable of being safe in the streets, then I wouldn't let my child out of my sight.

If your child is UNABLE to learn how to safely walk to school unattended, then you don't let him/her do it. Same way that you don't leave your toddler unattended in a supermarket, yet it's fine to rip the grocery list in half and send your 13 year old son to grab half of the supplies.

Yeah, except that that's not what happened. :|

It didn't die because it got shot in the back, it died because it went into the street and got hit by a car.

While you're at it, you'd might as well compare Kurt Cobain to JFK, since they both got shot.

MrGeezer

You're missing the point.

Getting hit by the vehicle was unexpected. Getting shot was unexpected. You're just as vulnerable as the cat.

So anyway, I've always wanted a pet anaconda. Of course, I am completely incapable of taking care of a full grown anaconda, I just find the babies to be cute.

So here's the plan. I'll keep the anaconda in a cage for a year or two. Once it gets larger than about 4 feet long, I'll set it loose in my backyard so that it can "be happy", then I'll just trust that it comes back for its weekly feeding. And if it suddenly stops coming back (either due to freezing to death, or because it decided to simply eat the neighbor's puppies), then at least my conscience is clear. Because it would be cruel to keep it caged. So the only choice for me is to buy an anaconda and then release it into the wild.

You're missing the point.

Getting hit by the vehicle was unexpected. Getting shot was unexpected. You're just as vulnerable as the cat.

CBR600-RR

Dude, even the lady's OWNER said that the cat had no sense in the street, and she had no problem letting it run around in the street for four ****ing years because the cat's dangerous habits were getting her noticed.

I've known people who routinely had sex with hookers, and then described it as "unexpected" when they were diagnosed with AIDS.

YOU'RE missing the point. The point is that she had every ****ing reason to expect this outcome, and the cat was simply lucky to have lasted as long as it did.

So anyway, I've always wanted a pet anaconda. Of course, I am completely incapable of taking care of a full grown anaconda, I just find the babies to be cute.

So here's the plan. I'll keep the anaconda in a cage for a year or two. Once it gets larger than about 4 feet long, I'll set it loose in my backyard so that it can "be happy", then I'll just trust that it comes back for its weekly feeding. And if it suddenly stops coming back (either due to freezing to death, or because it decided to simply eat the neighbor's puppies), then at least my conscience is clear. Because it would be cruel to keep it caged. So the only choice for me is to buy an anaconda and then release it into the wild.

MrGeezer

Actually snakes prefer not to roam and enjoy being caged if properly cared for -- especially the ones caught in the wild. Being ectothermes they prefer expending as little energy as possible and you only really need a cage about half as long as the snake for it to have enough room to be happy in their environment. If you were to release it in your backyard it would most likely die very quickly from exposure unless you live in a very hot and humid environment.

Dude, even the lady's OWNER said that the cat had no sense in the street, and she had no problem letting it run around in the street for four ****ing years because the cat's dangerous habits were getting her noticed.

I've known people who routinely had sex with hookers, and then described it as "unexpected" when they were diagnosed with AIDS.

YOU'RE missing the point. The point is that she had every ****ing reason to expect this outcome, and the cat was simply lucky to have lasted as long as it did.

MrGeezer

We've gone off track here of what we were talking about, but I do agree that the woman was not capable of looking after it.

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

So anyway, I've always wanted a pet anaconda. Of course, I am completely incapable of taking care of a full grown anaconda, I just find the babies to be cute.

So here's the plan. I'll keep the anaconda in a cage for a year or two. Once it gets larger than about 4 feet long, I'll set it loose in my backyard so that it can "be happy", then I'll just trust that it comes back for its weekly feeding. And if it suddenly stops coming back (either due to freezing to death, or because it decided to simply eat the neighbor's puppies), then at least my conscience is clear. Because it would be cruel to keep it caged. So the only choice for me is to buy an anaconda and then release it into the wild.

Lord_Daemon

Actually snakes prefer not to roam and enjoy being caged if properly cared for -- especially the ones caught in the wild. Being ectothermes they prefer expending as little energy as possible and you only really need a cage about half as long as the snake for it to have enough room to be happy in their environment. If you were to release it in your backyard it would most likely die very quickly from exposure unless you live in a very hot and humid environment.

Okay, then. I've also wanted a crocodile monitor. Large, vicious, likes to move around and explore a lot, and has dangerous serrated blades for teeth, with septic saliva to go along with it.

So yeah...I meant to say a crocodile monitor lizard. That's a lot more like a cat. They also like to climb trees (like cats), so that's probably a bit more appropriate.

[QUOTE="AzzoLovesBirdy"]That's like someone saying "I love my 16 year old daughter, we adopted her when she was five to take her away from her abusive father. Me and my wife go away often to the store so we can feed ourselves, oh and, of course, her too." For someone then to say: "You love her yet you LEAVE HER UNATTENDED AT HOME!! OMFG, You horrible people!"

MrGeezer

And yeah...if my 16 year old daughter didn't have any more sense than a housecat, then you're ****ing right that I wouldn't let her run around in traffic. She'd be on a short leash. As in, I'd have her in a facility for children who are severely mentally disabled.

Thats going in my sig LMFAO

Okay, then. I've also wanted a crocodile monitor. Large, vicious, likes to move around and explore a lot, and has dangerous serrated blades for teeth, with septic saliva to go along with it.

So yeah...I meant to say a crocodile monitor lizard. That's a lot more like a cat. They also like to climb trees (like cats), so that's probably a bit more appropriate.

MrGeezer

Again being a reptile it wouldn't want to move too far and would most likely keep to the trees and backyard area in order to hunt those pesky birds and rodents that seem to get into everything -- good squirrel hunter now that I think about it and it would be excellent if you have raccoon issues in your neighborhood. Although a reptile, lizards don't tend to be nearly as sedentary as their snake siblings and there's a good chance it might eventually wander if food were to get scarce or there was little to no active water source. At this point due their size their presence would most likely be noticed and they would be rounded up by the animal patrol and if they found out it was yours you would be in some trouble for releasing a potentially lethal and dangerous animal into the public.

It might be handy to release it into your backyard and have it curb your rodent and bird population, but unfortunately reptiles have very primitive brains and unlike dogs and cats and various similar type mammals, have little concept of territory or a sense of "home". Because of this there's a good chance it would eventually wander out and being a creature that, again unlike dogs, cats, ferrets and even birds, don't readily have a sense of a familial connection and even if they were to be fully comfortable around humans and other animals, there's no way they could readily convey this to the public at large and so it would be attacked or hauled off to jail.

I like that idea of having them in the backyard though. Maybe if you had high enough fences to keep them from slowly wandering off.

Actually, many monitor lizards are a lot different than other reptiles in terms of travel. Snakes will largely sit around and wait for food. Many smaller lizards will occupy a smaller area and wait for bugs to get near them. But when it gets into the larger monitor lizards, things change. Once we start looking at the large predatory lizards, they hunt a LOT more actively than most other reptiles. We start getting into mammalian behavior here. In these cases we can see lizards tracking prey over large areas by scent. We also see lizards having wide and regular roaming patterns, designed not only to find food but also to establish its territory. These animals often aren't JUST looking for food, they're literally often simply patrolling their territory in order to defend their patch of land. Much like other predatory mammals such as wolves. And it's not random either. Look at patterns of movement, and you also see monitor lizards patrolling a LARGE and predictable area, regardless of how well-fed they are.

Snakes are one thing. They DON'T tend to move around a lot as long as they're well-fed. Smaller lizards are a lot like snakes too, in that they usually stay in a pretty small area. But many of the larger carnivous lizards are a LOT more active, a LOT smarter, and patrol a MUCH wider area of ground even when they ARE well-fed. Especially in the larger varanids, we start seeing behavior that much more resembles the habits of many larger predatory mammals.

MrGeezer if I recall you used to beat up a goose because it would attack you?

You're my hero bro.

MrGeezer if I recall you used to beat up a goose because it would attack you?

You're my hero bro.

StripTheSoul

Hey, I didn't "beat it up", I just slapped it around a bit.

And seriously, that goose had it coming. It was a ****ing jerkwad. I know that animals aren't as smart as people, but there have been PLENTY of animals that have been known to demonstrate genuine douchebag behavior. And this particular goose was a total douchebag.

Actually, many monitor lizards are a lot different than other reptiles in terms of travel. Snakes will largely sit around and wait for food. Many smaller lizards will occupy a smaller area and wait for bugs to get near them. But when it gets into the larger monitor lizards, things change. Once we start looking at the large predatory lizards, they hunt a LOT more actively than most other reptiles. We start getting into mammalian behavior here. In these cases we can see lizards tracking prey over large areas by scent. We also see lizards having wide and regular roaming patterns, designed not only to find food but also to establish its territory. These animals often aren't JUST looking for food, they're literally often simply patrolling their territory in order to defend their patch of land. Much like other predatory mammals such as wolves. And it's not random either. Look at patterns of movement, and you also see monitor lizards patrolling a LARGE and predictable area, regardless of how well-fed they are.

Snakes are one thing. They DON'T tend to move around a lot as long as they're well-fed. Smaller lizards are a lot like snakes too, in that they usually stay in a pretty small area. But many of the larger carnivous lizards are a LOT more active, a LOT smarter, and patrol a MUCH wider area of ground even when they ARE well-fed. Especially in the larger varanids, we start seeing behavior that much more resembles the habits of many larger predatory mammals.

MrGeezer

Well honestly the giants of the reptile world do tend to exhibit rather unique behavior than is common for most of the their species. I can't say that I'm well-versed enough to know each types particular social, territorial, or lack thereof, characteristics so I'm just stating general qualities of lizards. Even in the snake world I've noticed a rather dramatic intelligence swing from those that feed on water oriented prey (dullards) and those that hunt endothermic prey (smarties). Komodos do a lot of things that most lizards wouldn't typically do such as jogging for miles at a time which is just about the scariest ******* thing that I can imagine! However if they were extinct and you were to suggest that they did so you would labeled an idiot by the scientific community at large.

But yes, I will admit that monitors and the large lizards in general get around more and are quite a bit more active in their hunting. But it does take them a bit longer to get acclimated to their surroundings as again...somewhat simpler brains with quite a few less neurons firing in their wee cortexes so their reasoning abilities are quite a bit slower than a mammals. That being said if it had enough time and had enough food around for it to get used to its surroundings I have no doubt that it would eventually start hunting the neighbors pets as it slowly expanded the area it roams.

But as far as a comparitive betwixt a cat and a large lizard released into your backyard, the cat -- being socially attached to its owner -- would be much more likely to come back very quickly. The lizard...not so likely unless you had really, really worked hard to teach it come to you for food.

[QUOTE="StripTheSoul"]

MrGeezer if I recall you used to beat up a goose because it would attack you?

You're my hero bro.

MrGeezer

Hey, I didn't "beat it up", I just slapped it around a bit.

And seriously, that goose had it coming. It was a ****ing jerkwad. I know that animals aren't as smart as people, but there have been PLENTY of animals that have been known to demonstrate genuine douchebag behavior. And this particular goose was a total douchebag.

:lol:

Actually that's quite a common trait with geese and many large birds. Birds are nature's psychos that basically find it hard to pass up the chance to hurt or kill anything that's active and near them if they are able. For some reason geese seem to think they can challenge humans in areas where they are protected. I can only imagine that many a small child or skittish adult must have actively run from them on a regular enough basis that they think they are the man. I've also backhanded many a goose that thinks he can muscle in on my territory when I'm feeding the smaller ducks.

[QUOTE="StripTheSoul"]

MrGeezer if I recall you used to beat up a goose because it would attack you?

You're my hero bro.

MrGeezer

Hey, I didn't "beat it up", I just slapped it around a bit.

And seriously, that goose had it coming. It was a ****ing jerkwad. I know that animals aren't as smart as people, but there have been PLENTY of animals that have been known to demonstrate genuine douchebag behavior. And this particular goose was a total douchebag.

Doesn't matter man, I idolise you for it. Geese need to know what the **** is up.

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

Actually, many monitor lizards are a lot different than other reptiles in terms of travel. Snakes will largely sit around and wait for food. Many smaller lizards will occupy a smaller area and wait for bugs to get near them. But when it gets into the larger monitor lizards, things change. Once we start looking at the large predatory lizards, they hunt a LOT more actively than most other reptiles. We start getting into mammalian behavior here. In these cases we can see lizards tracking prey over large areas by scent. We also see lizards having wide and regular roaming patterns, designed not only to find food but also to establish its territory. These animals often aren't JUST looking for food, they're literally often simply patrolling their territory in order to defend their patch of land. Much like other predatory mammals such as wolves. And it's not random either. Look at patterns of movement, and you also see monitor lizards patrolling a LARGE and predictable area, regardless of how well-fed they are.

Snakes are one thing. They DON'T tend to move around a lot as long as they're well-fed. Smaller lizards are a lot like snakes too, in that they usually stay in a pretty small area. But many of the larger carnivous lizards are a LOT more active, a LOT smarter, and patrol a MUCH wider area of ground even when they ARE well-fed. Especially in the larger varanids, we start seeing behavior that much more resembles the habits of many larger predatory mammals.

Lord_Daemon

Well honestly the giants of the reptile world do tend to exhibit rather unique behavior than is common for most of the their species. I can't say that I'm well-versed enough to know each types particular social, territorial, or lack thereof, characteristics so I'm just stating general qualities of lizards. Even in the snake world I've noticed a rather dramatic intelligence swing from those that feed on water oriented prey (dullards) and those that hunt endothermic prey (smarties). Komodos do a lot of things that most lizards wouldn't typically do such as jogging for miles at a time which is just about the scariest ******* thing that I can imagine! However if they were extinct and you were to suggest that they did so you would labeled an idiot by the scientific community at large.

But yes, I will admit that monitors and the large lizards in general get around more and are quite a bit more active in their hunting. But it does take them a bit longer to get acclimated to their surroundings as again...somewhat simpler brains with quite a few less neurons firing in their wee cortexes so their reasoning abilities are quite a bit slower than a mammals. That being said if it had enough time and had enough food around for it to get used to its surroundings I have no doubt that it would eventually start hunting the neighbors pets as it slowly expanded the area it roams.

But as far as a comparitive betwixt a cat and a large lizard released into your backyard, the cat -- being socially attached to its owner -- would be much more likely to come back very quickly. The lizard...not so likely unless you had really, really worked hard to teach it come to you for food.

That's an interesting note. Which kind of works both for and against the comparison with cats.

For example, the lager and smarter predatory cats will (like cats) have a need to roam around. In the case of both cats AND large lizards, this natural range of territory is likely to extend well beyond the range of the average person's home. Whether you have a cat or a large monitor lizard, they are both likely to WANT to escape. Even if they have ample room to move around, their natural urge to wander is likely going to make them want to get out. You CAN keep them confined, but that'll likely make them bored and cranky, and they'll be more likely to shred your furniture simply because they're bored.

But on the other hand, if you let a cat and a large monitor lizard go, the cat is more likely to come back. The cat doesn't have to eat as often, and that's going to be one of the main things getting the cat to come back. Furthermore, cats are going to be more inclined to actually LIKE you (even though I maintain that most cats DON'T like their owners). Both of these things are going to contribute to the cat at least coming back. Whereas once you release the monitor lizard, you're probably never going to see it again. So in that sense, it's not an entirely fair comparison. Release a cat, and you can still reasonably claim that it's still "your cat" since it'll probably come back eventually (provided that it doesn't die). Whereas once you release the monitor lizard, it's gone. It's not gonna miss you or its home, it's just plain probably not coming back ever.

But yeah, those big monitor lizards are some FASCINATING animals, and just creepily smart for reptiles.

[QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

[QUOTE="StripTheSoul"]

MrGeezer if I recall you used to beat up a goose because it would attack you?

You're my hero bro.

Lord_Daemon

Hey, I didn't "beat it up", I just slapped it around a bit.

And seriously, that goose had it coming. It was a ****ing jerkwad. I know that animals aren't as smart as people, but there have been PLENTY of animals that have been known to demonstrate genuine douchebag behavior. And this particular goose was a total douchebag.

:lol:

Actually that's quite a common trait with geese and many large birds. Birds are nature's psychos that basically find it hard to pass up the chance to hurt or kill anything that's active and near them if they are able. For some reason geese seem to think they can challenge humans in areas where they are protected. I can only imagine that many a small child or skittish adult must have actively run from them on a regular enough basis that they think they are the man. I've also backhanded many a goose that thinks he can muscle in on my territory when I'm feeding the smaller ducks.

Heh, I once recall seeing this youtube video where this dude is riding his bike down a street minding his own business, when a swan comes out of ****ing nowhere trying to kick his ass. Then the dude just casually grabs the swan's neck, throws it towards the river, and then a laugh track starts playing.

I sort of felt bad, because the way he grabbed the swan's neck looked like it could've seriously hurt the swan. Which I don't like to see happen. But on the other hand, it's pretty funny. Just in the way that that swan acted like it was the top dog, even though it was messing with a man who was capable of tossing it around like a rag doll.

In any case, some animals just need to check their egos at the door, especially when they're trying to beat up larger animals that have no problem kicking their asses.

That's an interesting note. Which kind of works both for and against the comparison with cats.

For example, the lager and smarter predatory cats will (like cats) have a need to roam around. In the case of both cats AND large lizards, this natural range of territory is likely to extend well beyond the range of the average person's home. Whether you have a cat or a large monitor lizard, they are both likely to WANT to escape. Even if they have ample room to move around, their natural urge to wander is likely going to make them want to get out. You CAN keep them confined, but that'll likely make them bored and cranky, and they'll be more likely to shred your furniture simply because they're bored.

But on the other hand, if you let a cat and a large monitor lizard go, the cat is more likely to come back. The cat doesn't have to eat as often, and that's going to be one of the main things getting the cat to come back. Furthermore, cats are going to be more inclined to actually LIKE you (even though I maintain that most cats DON'T like their owners). Both of these things are going to contribute to the cat at least coming back. Whereas once you release the monitor lizard, you're probably never going to see it again. So in that sense, it's not an entirely fair comparison. Release a cat, and you can still reasonably claim that it's still "your cat" since it'll probably come back eventually (provided that it doesn't die). Whereas once you release the monitor lizard, it's gone. It's not gonna miss you or its home, it's just plain probably not coming back ever.

But yeah, those big monitor lizards are some FASCINATING animals, and just creepily smart for reptiles.

MrGeezer

Oh, did I mention that I was reading some large lizard behavior and apparently some of the monitors can be taught to count? :| Which is...weird. Also apparently Komodos, despite their tendancy to overly rely on smell much like sharks do, can actively recognize people if they appear with frequent regularity in their lives which is something not normally associated with lizards. Although I must admit that most rattlers that I've taken care of do tend to become quite docile after just a week or two of confinement with occasional feedings.

It's weird that snakes raised in captivity can be so tempermental and grumpy whereas those capture in the wild tend to become docile very quickly and rarely become tempermental unless provoked. I guess it's just that they feel they have been rescued from "the streets" and enjoy their little warm home full of food, water and warmth. Sort of the opposite of mammals which typically hate being confined once they have been wild. I have had much less success with wild lizards though which does point to some similar mindset in terms of ingrained behavior.

Ah sorry I should just stop with the lizard asides at let the cat notices commence. I just get easily distracted by reptilian talk being an old reptile nerd. Although as far as large cats go they do vary quite a bit. Loners like jaguars and lynxes tend to wander quite a bit whereas lions tend to keep a solid smaller territory. Lions are just tied more together socially.

Oh hey I got back to cats again!

I don't understand...

The cat would take the bus by himself alone everyday? What was the owner thinking?

I just realized how horrible of a person I am.

It was bound to happen...people will kill innocence eventually...whether on purpose or by accident...

:cry: naw im a sucker for animals, seemed like a very clever cat, poor thing

Wow. That's terrible. ........|||....darn rocks. =-(

This is sad, poor cat.

I'm going to hug mine when I get home...

Poor little guy.

I hate cats. One less feline.wstfld

That's a bummer.

For some reason I find myself wishing they had pictures of the cat queuing up like they described.