Do we have free will?

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br0kenrabbit

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#51  Edited By br0kenrabbit
Member since 2004 • 18078 Posts

@mjorh said:
@davillain- said:

"Ohh yes, I been meaning to comeback and ask this question"

As I said, I am by no means of a Religious person but I'm more of a spiritual guy however if that's what you wanna put it that way. I believe in God but not in a religion way as you think. I don't attend Church, I mean, God is everywhere in my opinion, I don't need a building and go worship, I can do that at my home or anywhere else.

As far as Free Will goes. If Humans have free will as we may think, why can't we go out and do some of the things that other people may seem evil? Have you ever watch one of The Purge Movies? In the Purge, you have free will for during one night, Humans can go kill, steal, and do anything that doesn't have restrictions from our moral Laws. In any case, I don't believe in Free Will, in Human case but in the Animal Kingdom do, they have free will if you know what I mean by that. Does this answer your question so far?

Edit: In games like Grand Theft Auto, it's as close to being free will as it comes cause I can do anything and toss my morals out the window.

I respect your belief, and no i haven't watched the Purge movies.

Now that I think about it, the videogame example is kinda convincing, I mean we don't go out killing ppl because of our morals but we do it in videogames, so it's not a matter of not wanting, I mean if we really didn't want to do it, then why we do it in the videogames? Hmmm ...

@br0kenrabbit: What's your take on the videogame example?

People do have the ability to go all Purge on others. Look up Ted Bundy. Most of us don't do it due to a combination of being scared of the consequences and disgusted by the idea.

Video games remove the real consequences of violence and despite their realistic graphical portrayal come nothing close to the personal horror of actually taking another life. It's interactive Hollywood; you leave the screen and whatever seeming events just transpired are instantly non-relevant.

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themajormayor

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#52 themajormayor
Member since 2011 • 25729 Posts

@br0kenrabbit said:
@themajormayor said:

That doesn't mean that the "randomness" of that system truly is random. That's your method of prediction being flawed.

I mentioned Quantum indeterminacy before. I'm also going to suggest Bell's theorem.

As for a layman example of distribution, think of political polling: all the information in the world cannot predict how the next respondent will poll, therefore there is an intrinsic value of randomness in the system being measured.

Ok, well those things are quantum mechanics, which is random in some sense at least(although there are views that it is not). It doesn't mean that the normal distribution indicates any kind of randomness.

Well, if we had all the information in the world, then we would probably be able to predict how the next respondent would vote by a certainty of 99.999999...lots of nines...%. And why it would not be 100% would be due to the possibility of quantum fluctuations making atoms in the respondent's brain rearrange so that he would vote something else, or something like that. If quantum mechanics was deterministic we would be 100% sure. In both these cases, in absence of that information, we could make curves of distribution to imperfectly predict the next vote. It says nothing about whether the there is any true randomness in the system.

There is no randomness in classical physics.

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deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d

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#53 deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d
Member since 2005 • 7914 Posts

@mjorh: how about having the free will to get something behind a wall but being unable to get it. We have the will to do impossible things. The possible things we can do is very predictable.

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MirkoS77

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#54 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 17966 Posts

@hillelslovak: Hitchens is missed.

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skipper847

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#55 skipper847
Member since 2006 • 7334 Posts

Nope just been down to bookies and lost.

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KOD

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#56 KOD
Member since 2016 • 2754 Posts

@MirkoS77 said:

@hillelslovak: Hitchens is missed.

Isaac Bashevis Singer was the one who said this, Hitchens merely quoted it.

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deactivated-5cf0a2e13dbde

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#57 deactivated-5cf0a2e13dbde
Member since 2005 • 12935 Posts
@kod said:
@MirkoS77 said:

@hillelslovak: Hitchens is missed.

Isaac Bashevis Singer was the one who said this, Hitchens merely quoted it.

And Hitchens attributed that sentence to others whenever he spoke it.

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KOD

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#58 KOD
Member since 2016 • 2754 Posts

@hillelslovak said:
@kod said:
@MirkoS77 said:

@hillelslovak: Hitchens is missed.

Isaac Bashevis Singer was the one who said this, Hitchens merely quoted it.

And Hitchens attributed that sentence to others whenever he spoke it.

Was i correcting Hitchens or the poster?

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MirkoS77

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#59 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 17966 Posts

@kod said:
@MirkoS77 said:

@hillelslovak: Hitchens is missed.

Isaac Bashevis Singer was the one who said this, Hitchens merely quoted it.

Ah. Good to know who originally stated it.

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Skarwolf

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#60 Skarwolf
Member since 2006 • 2718 Posts

@mjorh said:

Yep, this is gonna be about Determinism Vs Free Will.

I'm not sure, I like to think that I do have free will but sometimes life forces you into some direction, the direction that you have no choice but to follow, except for, of course, suicide.

I'm only 23 years old so not experienced enough and I'm still struggling with the question, so I was wondering what you guys think of the matter.

I suspect this idea is common among millennials who require instant gratification in all things. Oh no I can't get what I want when I want it now. Suicide. Like you said you're young and stupid and worry about things you don't really need to.

1. employment

2. no credit card debt

3. don't waste time at university/college in humanities courses and absolutely don't get student loans for these. These courses should be free. How can professors mark you on your opinion on some guys opinion of something that happened in history.... what to be a parrot and just regurgitate what the prof wants to hear ?

4. do not spend more then you make.

5. Network & meet people. Sitting around on the computer lamenting about how your life sucks to a video game forum won't make things better. Who cares what people think. Be strong & decide to make your life better.

6. You do not need religion. You have willpower use it. You don't need the approval of some arbitrary make believe being. Anyone who follows religion is automatically exempt from determinism or free will.

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heguain

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#61 heguain
Member since 2007 • 1461 Posts

I think we have free will, it's our mind. God didn't give us brain, so He could control our actions too. I get to choose whether to be good or bad, even when I love, it's because I want to deep down.

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thehig1

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#62 thehig1
Member since 2014 • 7553 Posts

@davillain- said:
@mjorh said:
@davillain- said:

Our will is God's will. And no, I am not a religious person.

That raises an interesting question: Can you believe in God yet not be religious?

We need another thread for that :D

Anyways, so basically, you don't believe in free will, right?

"Ohh yes, I been meaning to comeback and ask this question"

As I said, I am by no means of a Religious person but I'm more of a spiritual guy however if that's what you wanna put it that way. I believe in God but not in a religion way as you think. I don't attend Church, I mean, God is everywhere in my opinion, I don't need a building and go worship, I can do that at my home or anywhere else.

1- What does spiritual even mean, Its always seemed a nonsensical term, the meaning of the word varies dramatically depending on who you ask.

2 - What makes you believe in a God or Gods ?

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ycdeo

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#63 ycdeo
Member since 2004 • 2841 Posts

Normally , a rich person have more free will. such as having a million.

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#64 AND1SALTTAPE
Member since 2015 • 861 Posts

We may or may not have free will, but we will always experience reality as if we do. The question is not whether we have free will or not but whether the world is determined or not.

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chrisfire77

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#65 chrisfire77
Member since 2002 • 106 Posts

Yes absolutely you do, although you may choose to believe you don't.

When you exercise your free will it causes a collapse in the wave function, in other words, you make a choice.

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dave123321

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#66 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts

@mjorh: yes