Do you think the healthcare bill will raise or lower Obama's approval?

I have no idea so I won't be commenting. I doubt it will help, but I don't know which way the numbers are going.

who gives a crap? what can anyone do? nothing

depends entirely on the what is actually inducted for the healthcare bill

I wish it would raise it, but with all these redneck libertarians getting all this media coverage I dunno what's going to happen.

Of all the impacts the bill could bring... you wonder about approval ratings?

Of all the impacts the bill could bring... you wonder about approval ratings?

Oleg_Huzwog

depends entirely on the what is actually inducted for the healthcare bill

z4twenny

The cynic in me says the general population won't bother learning about the details of the bill, therefore the content of the bill will have no bearing on approval ratings

i don't know only time will tell!

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

Of all the impacts the bill could bring... you wonder about approval ratings?

Pyro767

[QUOTE="z4twenny"]

depends entirely on the what is actually inducted for the healthcare bill

Oleg_Huzwog

The cynic in me says the general population won't bother learning about the details of the bill, therefore the content of the bill will have no bearing on approval ratings

the realist in me says the cynic in you is on to something. the major problem i have with the universal healthcare is pretty simple : not everyone in america deserves healthcare. there are millions of illegal immigrants and my tax dollars shouldn't have to go to the injuries they got breaking into my country (yes it is MY country, i was born here, i'm a naturalized citizen and if someone legally gets a green card and/or legally becomes a citizen then its THEIR country too) but thats a different rant

thing is no ones gonna read the bill until after the fact, then it's going to be too late. the wording of it is so lengthy and vague that it could easily be interpreted 3 different ways by 2 different people (cwatididthar?)

I think when it is finally passed it will raise his approval, if indeed that does happen.

I think there will be a slight dip, which is why I think Obama was smart (once again) to insist on tackling it early. Let it dip, then in a year or two when everyone realizes it was a good idea (and see's the economy turned around as well, regardless of if it had anything to do with him), he'll be a superstar again. Just in time to start ramping up for re-election.

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

[QUOTE="z4twenny"]

depends entirely on the what is actually inducted for the healthcare bill

z4twenny

The cynic in me says the general population won't bother learning about the details of the bill, therefore the content of the bill will have no bearing on approval ratings

the realist in me says the cynic in you is on to something. the major problem i have with the universal healthcare is pretty simple : not everyone in america deserves healthcare. there are millions of illegal immigrants and my tax dollars shouldn't have to go to the injuries they got breaking into my country (yes it is MY country, i was born here, i'm a naturalized citizen and if someone legally gets a green card and/or legally becomes a citizen then its THEIR country too) but thats a different rant

thing is no ones gonna read the bill until after the fact, then it's going to be too late. the wording of it is so lengthy and vague that it could easily be interpreted 3 different ways by 2 different people (cwatididthar?)

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

[QUOTE="z4twenny"]

depends entirely on the what is actually inducted for the healthcare bill

z4twenny

The cynic in me says the general population won't bother learning about the details of the bill, therefore the content of the bill will have no bearing on approval ratings

the realist in me says the cynic in you is on to something. the major problem i have with the universal healthcare is pretty simple : not everyone in america deserves healthcare. there are millions of illegal immigrants and my tax dollars shouldn't have to go to the injuries they got breaking into my country (yes it is MY country, i was born here, i'm a naturalized citizen and if someone legally gets a green card and/or legally becomes a citizen then its THEIR country too) but thats a different rant

thing is no ones gonna read the bill until after the fact, then it's going to be too late. the wording of it is so lengthy and vague that it could easily be interpreted 3 different ways by 2 different people (cwatididthar?)

But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

pyromaniac223

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

The meaning of fair in this country is gone. Is it fair that I have to pay higher taxes AND my own health insurance just so others can have health coverage?

[QUOTE="pyromaniac223"]But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

Oleg_Huzwog

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

[QUOTE="pyromaniac223"]But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

Oleg_Huzwog

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

[QUOTE="pyromaniac223"]But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

Hot-Tamale

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

[QUOTE="pyromaniac223"]

But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

Memberino

Its not 50 million who cannot afford the healthcare, its only about 7-10 million who just cannot afford it. The other 40 chose not to have insurance. There is a big difference.

To some people in America, cable TV is more important than health insurance.

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

[QUOTE="pyromaniac223"]But then the question comes up, are you willing to screw over 50 million AMERICANS to spite some illegal immigrants?

Wasdie

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Equality and the free market are not mutually exclusive.

You do realize that the 'death panels' that the regressionists are talking about already exist in insurance companies, right? They will deny individuals coverage. Congress' plan makes it illegal to do this (but the corporations have 5 yrs. to comply...:roll:).

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Wasdie

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

I live in Canada but can't you just drop your current health insurance and opt to use the public one considering it will be cheaper?

It's a no-win situation -- either the "correct" plan (whether it's a NHI, regulated-private or free market system) is passed and ends up pissing off the ~50% of the American population that oppose the particular philosophy behind it, or they end up passing a compromised bill that simply won't work, pissing off 100% of the population further down the road.

health care is a p.o.s. in U.S. >_>

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Wasdie

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

It's not even ALL about "getting healthcare to those who don't have any", although that is a big and important part. Its also about lowering premiums and stopping insurers from telling you after you have had surgery that they think you had a pre-exsisting condition and refusing to pay the hospital, who then sends YOU the bill. And about stopping them from saying "we will only cover 80% of this condition", and because the hospitals are charging you so much (in part because they are doing stuff to you that is not needed and charging you for it) you STILL end up with a $100,000 bill despite having insurance.

I think you will benefit from these changes like everyone else.

[QUOTE="Wasdie"][QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Hot-Tamale

Equality and the free market are not mutually exclusive.

You do realize that the 'death panels' that the regressionists are talking about already exist in insurance companies, right? They will deny individuals coverage. Congress' plan makes it illegal to do this (but the corporations have 5 yrs. to comply...:roll:).

[QUOTE="Wasdie"]

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

TBoogy

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

It's not even ALL about "getting healthcare to those who don't have any", although that is a big and important part. Its also about lowering premiums and stopping insurers from telling you after you have had surgery that they think you had a pre-exsisting condition and refusing to pay the hospital, who then sends YOU the bill. And about stopping them from saying "we will only cover 80% of this condition", and because the hospitals are charging you so much (in part because they are doing stuff to you that is not needed and charging you for it) you STILL end up with a $100,000 bill despite having insurance.

I think you will benefit from these changes like everyone else.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Wasdie

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

Buddy, you have health insurance, so you are obviously one of the more privileged individuals in this country. I do not have insurance, and I honestly cannot afford it right now. I've done the math, and I have the first-hand experience, not you. I'm the one who grew up in Santa Ana, CA, just south of Compton, and have met thousands who live in literal squalor and filth. If I got 3 jobs then perhaps I could afford hc, but I also would like to have a high standard of living. I don't want America to turn into a 3rd world country, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let some holier-than-though libertarian ideologues take care away from 63 million poor Americans. So go back to reading the lopsided data that your think tank of choice churns out. In the meantime, I'm going to be letting my voice be heard. I've gone to 4 townhall meetings on this issue so far, and I'm not even 20. I'm very passionate about this cause, and the reality is, we as a nation need to be more engaged as a people, and this can only be done if we stop be rugged individualists and make some sacrifices once in a while in the form of $20 more per year to help those in need. We need balance in our lives, and helping others can help to counter the fierce self-interest that so many Americans feel. Shame on you for assuming that these poor people, who you obviously know nothing about if this is indeed your opinion, have all these resources available to them. They do not.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Wasdie"] Yeah this is the truth that the democrats don't want you to know. The number of really chronically uninsured people is around 7-10 million. Even then, if they go to the hospital they can get basic treatment. Is it fair? No. Is it a free market? Yes. ferrari2001

Equality and the free market are not mutually exclusive.

You do realize that the 'death panels' that the regressionists are talking about already exist in insurance companies, right? They will deny individuals coverage. Congress' plan makes it illegal to do this (but the corporations have 5 yrs. to comply...:roll:).

European countries have perfected this by focusing more on preventative treatment instead of making pacts with drug countries so they can peddle their expensive new pills. If more people are able to prevent their diseases, then there will be shorter lines, and fewer expensive procedures.

but I also would like to have a high standard of livingHot-Tamale

Translation: you choose to spend your money on things besides healthcare.

[QUOTE="ferrari2001"][QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

Equality and the free market are not mutually exclusive.

You do realize that the 'death panels' that the regressionists are talking about already exist in insurance companies, right? They will deny individuals coverage. Congress' plan makes it illegal to do this (but the corporations have 5 yrs. to comply...:roll:).

Hot-Tamale

European countries have perfected this by focusing more on preventative treatment instead of making pacts with drug countries so they can peddle their expensive new pills. If fewer people are able to prevent their diseases, then there will be shorter lines, and fewer expensive procedures.

Exactly, the american system doesn't even focus on preventive care at all because the hospitals, health insurance firms will just make less money due to less people coming in for care due to preventive medicine. These people don't care about saving lives, they only care about making money. They view sick people as walking cash registers. It's quite shameful tbh.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]but I also would like to have a high standard of livingOleg_Huzwog

Translation: you choose to spend your money on things besides healthcare.

Incorrect. I want to eventually send my kids to college and feed myself and my family. Is that such a crime?

[QUOTE="Wasdie"]

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

Hot-Tamale

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

Buddy, you have health insurance, so you are obviously one of the more privileged individuals in this country. I do not have insurance, and I honestly cannot afford it right now. I've done the math, and I have the first-hand experience, not you. I'm the one who grew up in Santa Ana, CA, just south of Compton, and have met thousands who live in literal squalor and filth. If I got 3 jobs then perhaps I could afford hc, but I also would like to have a high standard of living. I don't want America to turn into a 3rd world country, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let some holier-than-though libertarian ideologues take care away from 63 million poor Americans. So go back to reading the lopsided data that your think tank of choice churns out. In the meantime, I'm going to be letting my voice be heard. I've gone to 4 townhall meetings on this issue so far, and I'm not even 20. I'm very passionate about this cause, and the reality is, we as a nation need to be more engaged as a people, and this can only be done if we stop be rugged individualists and make some sacrifices once in a while in the form of $20 more per year to help those in need. We need balance in our lives, and helping others can help to counter the fierce self-interest that so many Americans feel. Shame on you for assuming that these poor people, who you obviously know nothing about if this is indeed your opinion, have all these resources available to them. They do not.

Sir, I bow to you, and also would like to add that simply repealing the Bush tax cuts which did not affect average Americans and only affected the wealthy elite would pay for a large chunk of the proposed reform. We don't need to raise taxes on average Americans to get this health care proposal to work.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

The overwhelming majority of those 50 million are screwing themselves (i.e. are perfectly capable of affording insurance but choose not to do so for whatever reason).

Wasdie

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]but I also would like to have a high standard of livingHot-Tamale

Translation: you choose to spend your money on things besides healthcare.

Incorrect. I want to eventually send my kids to college and feed myself and my family. Is that such a crime?

You're posting on a videogame website, a site that favors aficionados of a rather expensive hobby. How much have you spent on gaming?

I remember you in other threads demonstrating a thorough knowledge of music, which indicates an extensive music collection. How much have you spent on that?

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Oleg_Huzwog"]

Translation: you choose to spend your money on things besides healthcare.

Oleg_Huzwog

Incorrect. I want to eventually send my kids to college and feed myself and my family. Is that such a crime?

You're posting on a videogame website, a site that favors aficionados of a rather expensive hobby. How much have you spent on gaming?

I remember you in other threads demonstrating a thorough knowledge of music, which indicates an extensive music collection. How much have you spent on that?

I do have an extensive music collection, and I do have an original Xbox (I cannot yet afford one of the 'next-gen' consoles). I'm not in poverty, mind you, but I would have to make extensive sacrifices if I were to take the plunge and get health insurance. Better the wealthy pay for a fraction of it than I break my balls paying for it all.

Considering that a majority of people in the country have health care, and a majority have healthcare paid through an employer many people are worried that the current healthcare bill will mean their employer will drop their health care. Of course his approval is going to go down, but I think it's for the greater good.

With the rising healthcare costs less and less people are able to afford healthcare every day, and right now it's basically to the point where something has to be done. Not sure if Obama's plan will actually work, but it's better than doing nothing.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Wasdie"]

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

theone86

Buddy, you have health insurance, so you are obviously one of the more privileged individuals in this country. I do not have insurance, and I honestly cannot afford it right now. I've done the math, and I have the first-hand experience, not you. I'm the one who grew up in Santa Ana, CA, just south of Compton, and have met thousands who live in literal squalor and filth. If I got 3 jobs then perhaps I could afford hc, but I also would like to have a high standard of living. I don't want America to turn into a 3rd world country, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let some holier-than-though libertarian ideologues take care away from 63 million poor Americans. So go back to reading the lopsided data that your think tank of choice churns out. In the meantime, I'm going to be letting my voice be heard. I've gone to 4 townhall meetings on this issue so far, and I'm not even 20. I'm very passionate about this cause, and the reality is, we as a nation need to be more engaged as a people, and this can only be done if we stop be rugged individualists and make some sacrifices once in a while in the form of $20 more per year to help those in need. We need balance in our lives, and helping others can help to counter the fierce self-interest that so many Americans feel. Shame on you for assuming that these poor people, who you obviously know nothing about if this is indeed your opinion, have all these resources available to them. They do not.

Sir, I bow to you, and also would like to add that simply repealing the Bush tax cuts which did not affect average Americans and only affected the wealthy elite would pay for a large chunk of the proposed reform. We don't need to raise taxes on average Americans to get this health care proposal to work.

Very true. I don't see why more people don't listen to Paul Krugman on this one. Didn't he say that we should raise taxes in times of prosperity so that we can safely cut them when times get bad? It might have been Stiglitz who said it, though.

I wish it would raise it, but with all these redneck libertarians getting all this media coverage I dunno what's going to happen.

Hot-Tamale

You sound like such a nice guy :|

[QUOTE="Wasdie"]

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

Incorrect. Only about 5 million uninsured can afford it, and most of them have above average incomes. The 63 million uninsured in this country need to be covered, and we need to cut costs. Obama's plan WILL save money. The ignorant in our nation don't realize this (or won't believe it).

Hot-Tamale

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

Buddy, you have health insurance, so you are obviously one of the more privileged individuals in this country. I do not have insurance, and I honestly cannot afford it right now. I've done the math, and I have the first-hand experience, not you. I'm the one who grew up in Santa Ana, CA, just south of Compton, and have met thousands who live in literal squalor and filth. If I got 3 jobs then perhaps I could afford hc, but I also would like to have a high standard of living. I don't want America to turn into a 3rd world country, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let some holier-than-though libertarian ideologues take care away from 63 million poor Americans. So go back to reading the lopsided data that your think tank of choice churns out. In the meantime, I'm going to be letting my voice be heard. I've gone to 4 townhall meetings on this issue so far, and I'm not even 20. I'm very passionate about this cause, and the reality is, we as a nation need to be more engaged as a people, and this can only be done if we stop be rugged individualists and make some sacrifices once in a while in the form of $20 more per year to help those in need. We need balance in our lives, and helping others can help to counter the fierce self-interest that so many Americans feel. Shame on you for assuming that these poor people, who you obviously know nothing about if this is indeed your opinion, have all these resources available to them. They do not.

You blame other people for having a holier than thou attitude, yet on the first page of this topic you call people who disagree with you rednecks :lol:

I am sure Obamas ratings are dropping. Have you ever noticed it's the ones without something that want the ones with something to support their wants and holler the most about it.

[QUOTE="Hot-Tamale"]

[QUOTE="Wasdie"]

By saving money you mean raising taxes and eliminating the private sector. I have health insurance, why should I pay for those? Also there are only 7-10 million who actually cannot afford any sort of health insurance.

How is raising taxes on people who already pay for healthcare going to save us money? How? That logically doesn't even work. I will now be paying my healthcare costs plus the higher taxes to afford the other healthcare. Its not ignorance, its logic.

limpbizkit818

Buddy, you have health insurance, so you are obviously one of the more privileged individuals in this country. I do not have insurance, and I honestly cannot afford it right now. I've done the math, and I have the first-hand experience, not you. I'm the one who grew up in Santa Ana, CA, just south of Compton, and have met thousands who live in literal squalor and filth. If I got 3 jobs then perhaps I could afford hc, but I also would like to have a high standard of living. I don't want America to turn into a 3rd world country, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let some holier-than-though libertarian ideologues take care away from 63 million poor Americans. So go back to reading the lopsided data that your think tank of choice churns out. In the meantime, I'm going to be letting my voice be heard. I've gone to 4 townhall meetings on this issue so far, and I'm not even 20. I'm very passionate about this cause, and the reality is, we as a nation need to be more engaged as a people, and this can only be done if we stop be rugged individualists and make some sacrifices once in a while in the form of $20 more per year to help those in need. We need balance in our lives, and helping others can help to counter the fierce self-interest that so many Americans feel. Shame on you for assuming that these poor people, who you obviously know nothing about if this is indeed your opinion, have all these resources available to them. They do not.

You blame other people for having a holier than thou attitude, yet on the first page of this topic you call people who disagree with you rednecks :lol:

I tend to differentiate between some lovable hicks and those who actively try to lower the standard of living of our nation's poor. The term 'holier than thou' is usually used to refer to a cynical, uninformed opinion about something, often prejudiced.