Evolutionary Creationism (AKA theistic evolution)

who doesnt believe in the evolution should have paid attention in schoolwhoody12

[QUOTE="elmo90"][QUOTE="DeeJayInphinity"]

[QUOTE="elmo90"]What's funny is that in the long process of scientifically explaining life without God, they are always forced back into admitting a sort of "scientific force/law" from which order is found from chaos and life is found without cause. This, of course, is also the concept of a higher power. God is somewhat inescapable to those who think clearly.DeeJayInphinity

Scientific law is not "god." It's a set of rules which govern the universe and led to the creation of the universe.

1. 1. A being conceived as the perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe, the principal object of faith and worship in monotheistic religions.
   2. The force, effect, or a manifestation or aspect of this being.
2. A being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people, especially a male deity thought to control some part of nature or reality.
3. An image of a supernatural being; an idol.
4. One that is worshiped, idealized, or followed: Money was their god.
5. A very handsome man.
6. A powerful ruler or despot.

You argue that they are not intelligent, yet you admit that they are the reason behind intelligence. If these laws are in order to create order, then what created them? If you say that nothing created them- they always were and always are- you say that everything is ruled by this "order".

You argue that they are not intelligent, yet you admit that they are the reason behind intelligence. If these laws are in order to create order, then what created them? If you say that nothing created them- they always were and always are- you say that everything is ruled by this "order".

elmo90

You are looking too deeply into the laws of space and time, which were created during the big bang, when space and time itself were produced.

The laws did not willingly create intelligence, that's what seperates them from a higher being. A higher being, or god, would have created everything itself, including us, and it would have done so intentionally using his or her own free will.

The laws of space and time didn't come together and agree to create humans. They are there but they don't care if we exist or not. It doesn't matter to them.

[QUOTE="DeeJayInphinity"][QUOTE="Total-KO"]

Wrong. :|

Religion & Spirituality is meant to be believed, not proved. so fail.

Also, drawings in a book, or fossils do not constitute for the billions or even trillions of different types of organisms that are out there. You'd have to link up each one to make it proof.

Silver_Dragon17

You mean blind faith? :lol:

I don't worship something that can't be proved.

Rationality is the foundation of genius. Only rationality is the foundation of foolishness.

nice quote

[QUOTE="Silver_Dragon17"][QUOTE="DeeJayInphinity"][QUOTE="Total-KO"]

Wrong. :|

Religion & Spirituality is meant to be believed, not proved. so fail.

Also, drawings in a book, or fossils do not constitute for the billions or even trillions of different types of organisms that are out there. You'd have to link up each one to make it proof.

druglord6

You mean blind faith? :lol:

I don't worship something that can't be proved.

Rationality is the foundation of genius. Only rationality is the foundation of foolishness.

nice quote

I made it up, actually.

You are looking too deeply into the laws of space and time, which were created during the big bang, when space and time itself were produced. DeeJayInphinity

The laws of space and time that allowed for our self-creation were created in a massive explosion? Nice.

The laws did not willingly create intelligence, that's what seperates them from a higher being. A higher being, or god, would have created everything itself, including us, and it would have done so intentionally using his or her own free will. DeeJayInphinity

Willingly or not isn't the question. It really doesn't make much of a difference. The point is that when you ****fy these laws, or fundamentals as an order which works to create intelligence, you're past the athiestic viewpoint that there is no order in the universe. Now I'll ask again, do these laws create order?

The laws of space and time didn't come together and agree to create humans. They are there but they don't care if we exist or not. It doesn't matter to them.

DeeJayInphinity

Now that we know that the laws did create humans (however, unintentionally), I'll ask this- did they also create the Earth and the cycles of life that govern it? What about the orbits of the planets and the perfect distance of the sun?

I have to go for now. It's been a pleasure talking with you.

Guys, the laws of physics are just human made formulas to explain how things work in the universe....

To not believe in Evolution at all is totally absurd even if you do follow the Bible. Plenty of pieces of biological evidence including genetics, plenty of pieces of astrological evidence including the age of the Earth and the Universe, and plenty of pieces of geological evidence including fossil records. You see, in science a theory isn't just a guess about something, it takes plenty of facts, studies, observations and experiments to create a scientific theory. A school district in Georgia put a stamp on the inside of every biology textbook saying "Evolution is only a theory." Well of course it is! It's just that the people saying this don't understand what a theory is and think by putting that in the textbooks it's somehow undermining its validity. The Earth rotating around the sun is also a theory and is contradicted in the bible. One step at a time right?

Also people interpreting the Bible literally don't understand what the Bible really is. You're undermining the message of the Bible by taking everything literally. they are stories with messages and lessons to take with you not hard truth historical accounts. If you do think the bible is all literal you're a moron. There's no possible way Noah could build an Arc and fit the 10 billion species in there and then distribute them all back to their respective habitats so perfectly. There is also no proof of Moses existing or any proof the Egyptians had Jewish slaves and there's certainly no evidence of the 40 years wandering in the desert not to mention the plagues and parting the Red Sea. Also at the time of Jesus there were a large number of people claiming they were the Messiah and could pull all these miracles. There is also no evidence that Jesus was resurrected from the dead other than a supposedly empty tomb.

Do I believe in God? I think He exists. (I switch between agnostic-theist over time)

Do I believe in evolution? Duh. It explains the diversity of life (evolution doesn't mean origins of life)

Do I believe in a certain religion? I have some views and am very interested in religion, however, I'm not really in a religion (born Sikh, we believe in One God, but that's it, I don't do religious deeds)

My views:
Christianity: if you can waste your life believing in a book that says the Earth is flat and 6000 years old and that the world was covered in a flood around 4000BC, then I pity you. Why pick & choose, if you're in a religion follow everything.

Islam: most convincing because of alleged scientific facts in Koran, which either are true, or are interpreted to seem true, though having many of those is either a really good fluke or really divine, I don't know, I'd like to, but I seriously don't know. However, the educated Muslims are the most "normal" since they don't believe the earth is 6000 years old or that evolution is fake,etc.

Hinduism/Greek Gods/Egyption Gods/etc (polytheism) - some old guy most likely made up stories that got passed down lol

There's many other religions of course. Buddhism is more-so a philosophy than a religion, however, Buddha is said to have fore-told (prophecised) the coming of the ruler Asoka (Indian Ruler) who would spread Buddhism and do other stuff that he did do (Asoka is on India's national emblem)

My personal opinion goes back and forth between theist - agnostism. I will never follow something I think is "partially the truth" for the rest of my life, that's ridiculous. If I'm going to dedicate to something, I must believe in it 100%.(do Christians believe Earth is flat or do they ignore that part of Bible?).

Concerning atheists, I think being agnostic is better, it's always better to be open-minded. However, these atheists have done more for the world in the past few centuries than the others. They've been working hard to know more about the world while religious freaks have been busy argueing over which religion is the truth, and why atheists have a tail & 2 horns LOL.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. - Buddha

That's what everyone needs to do. Stop believing something just because it's in a book, investigate in the matter, and if you have enough reason to believe in something, then do so.

Reasonable faith > blind faith.

Science = reasonable faith.

Most of religious people = blind faith

Some of religious people = reasonable faith

I don't want to be mean but I need to say there is no way for Christianity to be considered a source of "reasonable faith" for ANYONE simply because the only place that makes you believe the world is 6000 years old, is because it's written in the Bible, there's no outside source.

The Koran depends. Some verses may be a fluke, and if you believe them only because it's in the koran = blind faith.

But if you investigated into the matter and think too many flukes are unjustifiable = possibly reasonable faith.

They worshipped Hindu Gods of the Seas and Moon. They worshipped the Sun God, the Greek Gods. They worshipped idols such as Kings. And now they worship Jesus.

Difference = none.

If Jesus exists, Islam saying he's a prophet is more likely than Christianity saying He's God. Yah, let's all believe that in this whole Universe where our Solar System has one star, there are trillions of stars in our galaxy, and there are hundreds of billions of galaxies, "God" manifests in flesh and comes to Earth in Jesus. LOL

I apologize for the ridicule of Christianity.

I understand why educated Muslims believe Koran is Truth.

I understand why people like Stephen Hawking are agnostic.

I understand why many important figures and educated geniuses are atheist.

But I don't understand how you believe in a Book that says the World is Flat and that the Earth is 6000 years old.

Doesn't matter if it's because of being corrupted over time or it was a fairy tale at the start, the present Bible containing two girls having a 3some with their father, and other nasty stuff, as well as saying the world is flat, is the #1 religion in population in the world.

I think it's funny that people accept evolution and not astrophysics.CptJSparrow

Wahhtt?? And what does that have to do with this...:P