Factory Farmers are worse than Nazis, where do I go wrong?

I believe that factory farming is worse overall than the total results of the holocaust. My argument goes as follows:

Assumptions:Humans are animals

The number of animals who have suffered due to factory farming is far greater than the number of Jews who suffered during the holocaust. Even if you value an animals life as incredibly unimportant, even a small level of value multiplied by the number of animals who have suffered is far greater than that of the value of the humans who died in the holocaust.

Conclusion: Factory farming is something which is worse than the holocaust, and it is the worst horror in our society.

For the record, I'm not at all trying to diminish the effects, or the magnitude of the holocaust. I'm simply using it as a tool to try and demonstrate how horrible factory farming is.

Did you just compare human lives to animals*?

Did you just compare human lives to people?JigglyWiggly_

Are you a vegetarian?

Plants are also living beings, why are they unimportant but animals are important? You have to kill one or the other to survive.

So you're comparing a way to raise livestock for farming to one of the worst events in human history?

Are you a vegetarian?

cheesyjon

So you're comparing a way to raise livestock for farming to one of the worst events in human history?

Legendaryscmt

[QUOTE="linkthewindow"]You're assuming that animals have the same intristic "value" as humans, which is wrong (not that I'm saying factory farming's okay, it's not.) And yeah, Godwin's law by default.SeanDog123

[QUOTE="linkthewindow"]You're assuming that animals have the same intristic "value" as humans, which is wrong (not that I'm saying factory farming's okay, it's not.) And yeah, Godwin's law by default.SeanDog123

Did you once think about the families of those affected in the holocaust, the suffering they had to go through? Even today, people with numbers burned into their skin suffer from the memories of being treated even worse than animals. Animals might have physical suffering in farms, but human suffering is far, FAR greater, especially in an event such as the holocaust.

This threads making me hungry.

*Drives off to Burger King*

[QUOTE="SeanDog123"][QUOTE="linkthewindow"]You're assuming that animals have the same intristic "value" as humans, which is wrong (not that I'm saying factory farming's okay, it's not.) And yeah, Godwin's law by default.linkthewindow

[QUOTE="SeanDog123"][QUOTE="linkthewindow"]You're assuming that animals have the same intristic "value" as humans, which is wrong (not that I'm saying factory farming's okay, it's not.) And yeah, Godwin's law by default.Legendaryscmt

Did you once think about the families of those affected in the holocaust, the suffering they had to go through? Even today, people with numbers burned into their skin suffer from the memories of being treated even worse than animals. Animals might have physical suffering in farms, but human suffering is far, FAR greater, especially in an event such as the holocaust.

Although you have a very well-constructed argument, the lone fact that America loves it's BBQ negates any points made in your post.

Although you have a very well-constructed argument, the lone fact that America loves it's BBQ negates any points made in your post.

Miyomatic

If the animals that I enjoy eating every day come from these so-called 'factory farms' then I have no problem with them whatsoever... some grievously misguided people do place animal life on the same level as human life (lolwut?) and that's fine - if you don't want to eat meat, by all means don't... but by the same token, don't draw parallels between meat packing plants and NAZI death camps - it's an affront to the people who suffered there and their survivors...67gt500

Raise your hand if you consumed the flesh of Holocaust victims. Keep them up so I could count.

[QUOTE="Miyomatic"]

Although you have a very well-constructed argument, the lone fact that America loves it's BBQ negates any points made in your post.

linkthewindow

If the animals that I enjoy eating every day come from these so-called 'factory farms' then I have no problem with them whatsoever... some grievously misguided people do place animal life on the same level as human life (lolwut?) and that's fine - if you don't want to eat meat, by all means don't... but by the same token, don't draw parallels between meat packing plants and NAZI death camps - it's an affront to the people who suffered there and their survivors...67gt500

[QUOTE="linkthewindow"][QUOTE="Miyomatic"] Godwin's Law. [QUOTE="67gt500"]If the animals that I enjoy eating every day come from these so-called 'factory farms' then I have no problem with them whatsoever... some grievously misguided people do place animal life on the same level as human life (lolwut?) and that's fine - if you don't want to eat meat, by all means don't... but by the same token, don't draw parallels between meat packing plants and NAZI death camps - it's an affront to the people who suffered there and their survivors...SeanDog123

[QUOTE="SeanDog123"][QUOTE="linkthewindow"] That's exactly why I hate Nazi analogies. Comparing Obama/meat packing plants/your local DMV to the Nazis diminishes the suffering of those who really suffered under Hitler I'm sure they appreciate suffering so modern people can draw stupid analogies to them.linkthewindow

[QUOTE="linkthewindow"][QUOTE="SeanDog123"] Just because you don't like Godwin's law doesn't mean I can't use Nazi analogies while making a valid and sound argument. SeanDog123

Raise your hand if you consumed the flesh of Holocaust victims. Keep them up so I could count.

entropyecho

They did use their hair, skin, bones, and salvaged gold teeth...

I agree with the OP that factory farms are an abomination. They shouldn't be allowed to exist.

And no, I am not a vegetarian but I do get my meat and dairy products from local farmers who run their farms ethically.

Animals don't suffer in the same way as humans (or at least, not to the same degree.)linkthewindow

Wait, what? What is your evidence for that?

Anyway, I'm going to bed. If I'm lucky my post will still be up in the morning, and I will gladly continue answering your questions then. SeanDog123

A = animal's "worth"

B = human's "worth"

Given:

A is strictly less than B (more specifically A is much less than B)

n is greater than y which are both greater than zero

Then:

A*n is greater than B*y

;)

[QUOTE="SeanDog123"]Anyway, I'm going to bed. If I'm lucky my post will still be up in the morning, and I will gladly continue answering your questions then. entropyecho

A = animal's "worth"

B = human's "worth"

Given:

A is strictly less than B (more specifically A is much less than B)

n is greater than y which are both greater than zero

Then:

A*n is greater than B*y

;)

Well, that would be true if A > (y / n) B

So just figure out in your head how many animals you think a given human is worth. :P

[QUOTE="Legendaryscmt"]

So you're comparing a way to raise livestock for farming to one of the worst events in human history?

SeanDog123

A [ig is not capable of the same amount of suffering and emotional pain as a human can suffer due to varying mental capacity.

Suffering changes from animal to animal, and since a majority of animals are not sapient they have few rights outside of unnecessary suffering.

For example the beaks are cut off chickens when they are rounded up to be taken in for slaughtering. Yes it looks horrifying but the chicken only feels acute pain, and this keeps them from hurting each other which would cause sever pain. Over long term this would cause great discomfortfor the chicken but since they will be killed in a short period of time it's a mute point.

Farming methods are designed to kill animals with as little pain, and suffering as possible. Many of these methods have been improved over the years, and are much more humane than traditional methods. Also pain, and suffering work differently for different animals so that comes into play also. What would cause severe pain in a human may only cause discomfort in another animal due to the type of neurological system, and mental capacity. Humans tend to suffer much more which gives us motivation to be more active to change our surrounding environment.

You are comparing a human being to a farm animal?

Yeah but the Nazi's did not eat the Jews that they killed... well I mean as far as i know they did not eat them.

I eat animals, not human animals.

Did you just compare the horrendous MURDER of over 6 million people to factory farming? Did those tiny baby chickens have families and homes and aspirations like the Jews that were carted off to be slaughtered? I mean no offense, but that's simply disgusting.

The Holocaust was the systematic annihilation of millions of people because of their religion, sexuality, or simply because they got in the way (e.g. anti-socials). This is a little different than factory farming, unless you are trying to tell me that its purpose is to eliminate livestock from the face of the earth.CodingGenius

Did the chicken have a mother he loved, a brother? A home to return to? These farm animals are not human. Comparing the two is absurd, to say the least.

Its quite horrible indeed. Hopefully someday soon an equal alternative can be mass produced instead of slaughtering animals.

[QUOTE="Legendaryscmt"]

So you're comparing a way to raise livestock for farming to one of the worst events in human history?

SeanDog123

You are fundamentally wrong there. A pig's emotional complexity is that of a pebble compared to the earth. We're not diminishing the pig, you're diminishing the holocaust victims by putting them on the same level or even close level.

Are you really comparing the most despicable chapter of human history where millions upon millions of people were tortured and killed to chickens? I'm sorry but that is laughable.

Hey, I'm going to start up People for the Ethical Treatment of Plants. Because if we put one organism over another, that is the basis of Nazism (that a superior race deserves to live while the inferior race dies). And then we'll live happily ever after off a vitamin supplement that are extracted from pebbles.

If the animals that I enjoy eating every day come from these so-called 'factory farms' then I have no problem with them whatsoever... some grievously misguided people do place animal life on the same level as human life (lolwut?) and that's fine - if you don't want to eat meat, by all means don't... but by the same token, don't draw parallels between meat packing plants and NAZI death camps - it's an affront to the people who suffered there and their survivors...67gt500

Oh snap. He broke Godwin's Law right off the bat!

That is where he went wrong. His whole argument is thereby nullified.

Did you just compare human lives to animals*?

JigglyWiggly_

Did you just compare human lives to animals*?

JigglyWiggly_

The ironic thing is that you're lowering the lives of those who perished in the Holocaust to those of animals, which is precisely what the Nazis did in order for them to justify their killings.

Woohoo, Godwin's Law!

Are you really comparing the most despicable chapter of human history where millions upon millions of people were tortured and killed to chickens? I'm sorry but that is laughable.

Hey, I'm going to start up People for the Ethical Treatment of Plants. Because if we put one organism over another, that is the basis of Nazism (that a superior race deserves to live while the inferior race dies). And then we'll live happily ever after off a vitamin supplement that are extracted from pebbles.

Vesica_Prime