Fulfilling last wishes.

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#1 AND1SALTTAPE
Member since 2015 • 861 Posts

This had me thinking : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make-A-Wish_Foundation

First thing first, why do we feel obliged to fulfill someone's last wishes? Common folk say that it's because they won't go out with any regrets. Well, when death do occurs, will they be able to regret? or the regret they experience in their last moments really that significant to warrant a fulfillment of all their unfulfilled wishes?

Now I understand that this 'wish foundation' has got nothing to do with the irrationality of this whole scenario and that it's sole purpose is to spread goodwill but the real topic at hand is, 'what's the importance of last wishes and why should we fulfill them?'.

Suppose that I'm dying and my last wish is to have sex with my neighbor's daughter (I swear to God, I don't want to). Should they grant it? Or is it necessary that one must bear such wishes that the society feels no reluctance in fulfilling? Well, that would defeat the purpose of going out with 'no regrets'.. so?

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DaVillain

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#2  Edited By DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 58716 Posts

While it's kinda hard for me to explain it in full details but call it, something good for yourself and the person who is going to passed away. Fulfilling a last request is a given, I I wouldn't mind doing something for that person but it really depends on what it is and how to do what's necessary. Now this is not me saying that I will do it to a stranger I don't know, I could do it to a close friend who's been there thick and thin for you.

Now then, there is no shame if you don't want to fulfill that person's last wish, it is a choice and that is all. Why should we do it? Well like I said, it's up to you but to some, it makes you feel good about yourself that you requested someone's final wish or not.

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bmanva

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#3 bmanva
Member since 2002 • 4680 Posts

Most of make a wish foundation wishers are underage kids with terminal diseases, so having sex with neighbors daughters aren't exactly common requests.

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Archangel3371

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#4 Archangel3371  Online
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For me it just seems like it's a decent thing to do for someone who may have very little time left in their life.

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#5  Edited By Allicrombie
Member since 2005 • 26223 Posts

@bmanva said:

Most of make a wish foundation wishers are underage kids with terminal diseases, so having sex with neighbors daughters aren't exactly common requests.

There's a version of adult make a wish too, for adults with chronic conditions.

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#6 Riverwolf007
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I always thought of it as something survivors do to comfort themselves. They get to look back and feel good about at least one little thing. For the actual dying person dying is obviously its own reward.

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#7 Catalli  Moderator
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I guess if we applied the same reasoning with last wishes you used just now to everything, there would be no point in granting anyone anything, or close to it. We all die, and we'll all stop giving a flying **** about everything after death (under the assumption there's no afterlife :P) so... what's the point? Of course given that life is the only thing we'll ever experience (duh), it's kinda worthwhile to make it as enjoyable as possible. Given that usually people have opportunities to fulfill their wishes (or most of them) during their lifetime, it makes sense in my view to prioritize those people who have lost that opportunity due to illness.

Also if we were to look at it from a utilitarian point of view, the happiness of others usually does give us some utility, so it's perfectly rational to increase their utility (again under the assumption that there's no afterlife and life is the only opportunity we have to maximize utility).

Everyone feel free to tear apart my arguments as you see fit if you see any holes in them :P

Also I enjoy the existential questions, I must say.

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#8 Archangel3371  Online
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No one actually knows what happens after we die so we really don't know if one's regrets in life will or will not have any bearing in death.

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DaVillain

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#9 DaVillain  Moderator
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@Archangel3371 said:

No one actually knows what happens after we die so we really don't know if one's regrets in life will or will not have any bearing in death.

This is true indeed but we all know that death is part of life, so I have no regrets.

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#10 AND1SALTTAPE
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@ianhh6 said:

I guess if we applied the same reasoning with last wishes you used just now to everything, there would be no point in granting anyone anything, or close to it. We all die, and we'll all stop giving a flying **** about everything after death (under the assumption there's no afterlife :P) so... what's the point? Of course given that life is the only thing we'll ever experience (duh), it's kinda worthwhile to make it as enjoyable as possible. Given that usually people have opportunities to fulfill their wishes (or most of them) during their lifetime, it makes sense in my view to prioritize those people who have lost that opportunity due to illness.

Also if we were to look at it from a utilitarian point of view, the happiness of others usually does give us some utility, so it's perfectly rational to increase their utility (again under the assumption that there's no afterlife and life is the only opportunity we have to maximize utility).

Everyone feel free to tear apart my arguments as you see fit if you see any holes in them :P

Also I enjoy the existential questions, I must say.

The 'we all die so stop caring' argument is not my argument. I'm merely saying that if the purpose of fulfilling someone's last wishes is to make them go out with no regrets, then the fact that we cannot fulfill the many types of 'wishes' people hold just eliminates that purpose. Someone may want to ride a unicorn, what would you do then? In that case, it becomes an ethical issue: That you can only fulfill certain types of wishes of people who share the same mentality. For example, I want to see my country progressing whereas my brother just wants to see some movie. Now, my wish is almost impossible to fulfill and my brother's easier. And then it is common sense that my wish altruistic and my brother's selfish. So, the people who'll have selfish wishes that concern only them and include only the acquirement of material things (small in scope) are the only people who will see their wishes fulfilled. Not the people whose wishes go beyond themselves. Surely one can point that I can also wish that my mother gets a $500 paycheck before I die. So she would get that. But then, the problem is: We can only fulfill material wishes and material wishes are usually held by people with a certain mentality/personality. It's an ethical issue that is loosely based on Psychology so think in that vein.

As for utilitarianism, the only utility that reaches its maximum is the utility of the individual dying. Fulfilling the wish of the dying person can only be beneficial to him/her only.


@davillain- said:
@Archangel3371 said:

No one actually knows what happens after we die so we really don't know if one's regrets in life will or will not have any bearing in death.

This is true indeed but we all know that death is part of life, so I have no regrets.

We do know that the brain turns off and from the 'brain dead' people, we have acquired that they experience no emotions.

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Archangel3371

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#11 Archangel3371  Online
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@and1salttape: Well when someone dies we can prove that the body stops functioning we can't prove that there is anything that happens outside of the body like some kind of spirit or soul if you will where our emotions may still exist.

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#12 AND1SALTTAPE
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@Archangel3371: Emotions exist in the 'mind'. The mind exists in the 'brain'. So, theoretically, if the brain dies, so does the mind - and hence, the emotions.

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#13 Archangel3371  Online
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@and1salttape: Yeah but we don't know what, if anything, happens outside of the physical flesh of the body. The emotions that occur in the brain may or may not continue to happen outside of the body after death if one is to believe in a spirit, soul, etc.

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deactivated-5e90a3763ea91

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#14 deactivated-5e90a3763ea91
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I remember reading this news article a few weeks ago, where this very frail man who is dying from cancer wanted to see all of his kids get married before he dies. So his family organized things and bought dresses and tuxes for his young kids, and he got to walk his daughters down the aisle and they played out sort of a mach wedding for each of the kids. And at first it sounded kind of creepy to me, but I think it was a really beautiful idea. It's sad because this guy will never get to see his little girls or boys grow up and marry, but at least now he can die knowing that he was there to experience something like that with his children, and he was able to give them words of advice and encouragement, and to tell them how happy he is for them in advance.

I think everybody has at least one big thing they would like to do before they die. I don't think it's wrong to grant some of these requests, if they're possible and within reason. After all, we should strive to make life unforgettable for each other.

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#15 MrGeezer
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@and1salttape said:

This had me thinking : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make-A-Wish_Foundation

First thing first, why do we feel obliged to fulfill someone's last wishes? Common folk say that it's because they won't go out with any regrets. Well, when death do occurs, will they be able to regret? or the regret they experience in their last moments really that significant to warrant a fulfillment of all their unfulfilled wishes?

Now I understand that this 'wish foundation' has got nothing to do with the irrationality of this whole scenario and that it's sole purpose is to spread goodwill but the real topic at hand is, 'what's the importance of last wishes and why should we fulfill them?'.

Suppose that I'm dying and my last wish is to have sex with my neighbor's daughter (I swear to God, I don't want to). Should they grant it? Or is it necessary that one must bear such wishes that the society feels no reluctance in fulfilling? Well, that would defeat the purpose of going out with 'no regrets'.. so?

Uh...wtf? Dude, if your last wish is to bang your neighbor's daughter, then your neighbor's daughter sort of has to be cool with that. No one's gonna force her to have sex with you just because it's your last wish.

This is the case with ALL last wishes. If your last wish is to have a clown show up and dance for you, then a fucking clown has to actually AGREE to show up and dance for you. I mean, people aren't slaves. If you can't get anyone to willingly fulfill your last wish, then **** your last wish.

Are you seriously somehow under the impression that fulfilling people's last wishes is some kind of absolute obligation, even if it forces someone to get raped? Dude, no one has to fulfill anyone's last wish. The only reason last wishes get fulfilled is because people want to.

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Master_Live

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#16 Master_Live
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@and1salttape said:

The 'we all die so stop caring' argument is not my argument. I'm merely saying that if the purpose of fulfilling someone's last wishes is to make them go out with no regrets, then the fact that we cannot fulfill the many types of 'wishes' people hold just eliminates that purpose. Someone may want to ride a unicorn, what would you do then? In that case, it becomes an ethical issue: That you can only fulfill certain types of wishes of people who share the same mentality. For example, I want to see my country progressing whereas my brother just wants to see some movie. Now, my wish is almost impossible to fulfill and my brother's easier. And then it is common sense that my wish altruistic and my brother's selfish. So, the people who'll have selfish wishes that concern only them and include only the acquirement of material things (small in scope) are the only people who will see their wishes fulfilled. Not the people whose wishes go beyond themselves. Surely one can point that I can also wish that my mother gets a $500 paycheck before I die. So she would get that. But then, the problem is: We can only fulfill material wishes and material wishes are usually held by people with a certain mentality/personality. It's an ethical issue that is loosely based on Psychology so think in that vein.

As for utilitarianism, the only utility that reaches its maximum is the utility of the individual dying. Fulfilling the wish of the dying person can only be beneficial to him/her only.

Some people derive pleasure out of fulfilling others wishes and that's a benefit for the good doer.

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#17 Transk53
Member since 2015 • 564 Posts

My last wish would be cremate me and scatter my ashes in a dense woodland or if possible, a forest. Or if I had any choice in the matter, walk up to a top of a mountain and just fade into the background. I would take natural delirium over being pumped full of drugs lying in a hospital.

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#18 TheHighWind
Member since 2003 • 5724 Posts

This 14 year old was dying and his last wish was to have sex with a nurse, he got it.

I think if it's within reason they'll try to fulfill it.

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#19 Transk53
Member since 2015 • 564 Posts

@Ovirew said:

I remember reading this news article a few weeks ago, where this very frail man who is dying from cancer wanted to see all of his kids get married before he dies. So his family organized things and bought dresses and tuxes for his young kids, and he got to walk his daughters down the aisle and they played out sort of a mach wedding for each of the kids. And at first it sounded kind of creepy to me, but I think it was a really beautiful idea. It's sad because this guy will never get to see his little girls or boys grow up and marry, but at least now he can die knowing that he was there to experience something like that with his children, and he was able to give them words of advice and encouragement, and to tell them how happy he is for them in advance.

I think everybody has at least one big thing they would like to do before they die. I don't think it's wrong to grant some of these requests, if they're possible and within reason. After all, we should strive to make life unforgettable for each other.

Agree.

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#20 AND1SALTTAPE
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@MrGeezer said:

Uh...wtf? Dude, if your last wish is to bang your neighbor's daughter, then your neighbor's daughter sort of has to be cool with that. No one's gonna force her to have sex with you just because it's your last wish.

This is the case with ALL last wishes. If your last wish is to have a clown show up and dance for you, then a fucking clown has to actually AGREE to show up and dance for you. I mean, people aren't slaves. If you can't get anyone to willingly fulfill your last wish, then **** your last wish.

Are you seriously somehow under the impression that fulfilling people's last wishes is some kind of absolute obligation, even if it forces someone to get raped? Dude, no one has to fulfill anyone's last wish. The only reason last wishes get fulfilled is because people want to.

Fucking take a breath first dammit! argh, all this spit on my face *rubs face*

You missed my question.

@Master_Live said:

Some people derive pleasure out of fulfilling others wishes and that's a benefit for the good doer.

You're the only one who got close to answering my question. But what if the one closest to you demands something in his/her deathbed that is usually frowned upon?

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#21 MrGeezer
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@and1salttape: If you're not comfortable doing it then you don't do it. Same as pretty much any kind of request. What you seem to missing here is that a "last request" is "a request". I'm sure people have requested things from you. Are you just completely confused about why you did or did not honor the request? All it boils down to is "do it if you want to, don't do it if you don't want to." That's not an issue with "last requests", that's how requests work period. I mean, you'd might as well rephrase this is "why would anyone do anything that someone asks them to do?"

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AND1SALTTAPE

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#22 AND1SALTTAPE
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@MrGeezer: Well, it's settled then.

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#24  Edited By Archangel3371  Online
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@thegerg: You can't disprove it either.

Edit: What do you mean by "a lot of things happen outside the body".

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#26 DaVillain  Moderator
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@Archangel3371: Decompose dead bodies when we die?

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Archangel3371

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#27 Archangel3371  Online
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@thegerg: Well there's more things that lead people to believe in some kind of existence after death then there is about you're silly little invisible giraffe quip. I don't care if it's something that you believe in or not, that's not the point I'm making. The point I'm making is that someone can't definitively say one way or another that someone may not carry any regrets with them after death.

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Archangel3371

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#28 Archangel3371  Online
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@davillain-: Not sure I follow.

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#30 Archangel3371  Online
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How do we know there to be existence after death to be a fact? If you believe that to be true then how can you say that there would be no emotion or conciousness after death. Of course no one can definitively say Phil does or does not exist but you missed my point that the concept of life after death has occurrences that have been experienced by people that can actually be used in a discussion of life after death.