I think we're going to war with Syrian rebels guys.

Obama get the fvck out!

JUST GETTHEFVCKOUT!

GrayF0X786

*sigh* So do I unfortunately, and I really really don't want to do so. For once I would like to see the decision left to congress precisely because they can't seem to get anything done.

I think they should wait for the UN investigators to collect evidence. The last chemical attack their evidence pointed to the rebels. I have no idea if they did it this time but why not at least wait until they report? The UN inspectors are apparently being told to get out of the way by US officials according to CNN. I remember well Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq but at least then they waited for him to report back to the UN with some findings. A completely different situation of course but similar in how UN investigators were not given enough time.

Testimony from victims strongly suggests it was the rebels, not the Syrian government, that used Sarin nerve gas during a recent incident in the revolution-wracked nation, a senior U.N. diplomat said Monday.

Carla del Ponte, a member of the U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria, told Swiss TV there were strong, concrete suspicions but not yet incontrovertible proof, that rebels seeking to oust Syrian strongman Bashar al-Assad had used the nerve agent.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/

Warships armed with cruise missiles plow the waters of the eastern Mediterranean Sea. Cabinet-level officials hold a National Security Council meeting at the White House Tuesday night. And U.S. officials all but tell U.N. inspectors in Syria to get out of the way.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/08/28/world/meast/syria-civil-war/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

AllanLane

agreed. Considering how Iraq went down waiting for evidence is what everyone should actively be wanting to do.

I was probably being a bit alarmist thanks to the tone of the media at the moment but the prospect of getting involved another war makes me uneasy or maybe I just drank too much coffee before reading all this stuff. This is the one I agreed with the most during my coffee fuelled reading. It makes a number of excellent points.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/08/28/opinion/syria-husain-opinion/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

[QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"][QUOTE="OrkHammer007"]

Yeah... because that worked out so well for us in Libya and Egypt.:roll:

Let the rebels win on their own terms. That way, if they are linked to al Qaeda like the Muslim Brotherhood, it will weaken them to a point where a gentle sneeze will push them out of power.

There are no nice options in this one. The US needs to stay the hell out.

OrkHammer007

That appears to be the case but stuff like this does make people wonder. The CIA formally acknowledged its role in the 1953 Iran coup just the other day. I will probably still be alive in 60 years to find out what did or did not happen in Egypt with regard to the CIA. Or maybe not since I wasn't exactly born yesterday :)

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/iranians-invoking-cia-s-1953-iran-coup-say-us-still-interfering-egypt

[QUOTE="Person0"][QUOTE="Sir_Graham"]

Iran isn't going to do anything and the idea Russia or China would is even more laughable. They will make a speech about the evil imperialists to win political points with their own populations and then where applicable enjoy the oil profits and weapons sales in private. People shouldn't make the mistake of thinking what they tell the public they want is what they want. 

theone86

Seriously, dude, they're not going to kill shit, they're not going to do shit, they're a bunch of F*CKING AMATEURS!

at this point, i don't think it really does matter which side used the chemicals. letting the whole situation continue like this would be way more inhumane than getting involved. imo the intervention is absolutely necessary, i just think the US shouldn't take the lead.

Murrica

Seriously going to war over of chemical use? Poor excuse. 

This is pissing me off beyond belief.  This is a war no one wants; likely the least popular war in US history.  There is no credible proof that Assad is the one who actually used the weapons; even from a logical stand point it makes no sense.  We are risking an outright war with Russia rather than a proxy war with an over all risk of starting world war 3.

Make no mistake this isn't going to be an 'Iraq' or 'Afghanistan'. There are whole other countries who are willing to come to the aid of Syria and they are the ones who are in the right because we have absolutely no business bombing that place.

junglist101

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="Person0"] Well Russia and China don't want Assad to lose, but they ain't gonna do anything about the U.S/Nato air striking Syria.muscleserge

Seriously, dude, they're not going to kill shit, they're not going to do shit, they're a bunch of F*CKING AMATEURS!

Lots more people gonna die :(.

[QUOTE="muscleserge"][QUOTE="theone86"]

Seriously, dude, they're not going to kill shit, they're not going to do shit, they're a bunch of F*CKING AMATEURS!

Person0

Obama get the fvck out!

JUST GETTHEFVCKOUT!

GrayF0X786

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"]

Guess shooting and bombing more people is slightly better than using chemical weapons.

theone86

Are you really proud of this line?  Did it actually sound good to you when you were typing it up?  I mean, I get that we disagree on the issue and probably will for the forseeable future, but come on, is this really the sort of logic you feel deftly proves your point?

Kill 90 000 people by shelling their apartments and shooting them in the street = no big deal

kill a couple hundred by gassing them = oh bro, now you crossed the line.

The U.S. will always be at war against something.

Excellent! Yet another example of our government believing it should interfere in the business of others. Our so-called leaders will wonder when someone decides to attack us as retribution. We are so screwed as a society.Solaryellow

Our country can not solve every problem out there and Syria isn't the only country to slaughter its own people. North Korea kills its own people and what have we done? People die. Life is terrible at times but we can not be responsible each and every time an injustice is done.

Military bases across the world are irrelevant because even w/o them our leaders would still interfere in messes like this. At the end of the day these schmucks don't have the slightest idea why practically every country out there hates America. It couldn't be the fact how the "leaders" of the United States have a Napoleon Complex.Solaryellow

Explain to me which areas of the world hate America the most and why? BossPerson

[QUOTE="BossPerson"]Explain to me which areas of the world hate America the most and why? Solaryellow

Ask people in Libya, Kuwait or Kosovo if they hate America and you'll get a different answer than if you ask people in Iraq or Chile.

.

.

wis3boi

Ask people in Libya, Kuwait or Kosovo if they hate America and you'll get a different answer than if you ask people in Iraq or Chile.

BossPerson

[QUOTE="BossPerson"]

Ask people in Libya, Kuwait or Kosovo if they hate America and you'll get a different answer than if you ask people in Iraq or Chile.

Solaryellow

[QUOTE="BossPerson"]

Ask people in Libya, Kuwait or Kosovo if they hate America and you'll get a different answer than if you ask people in Iraq or Chile.

Solaryellow

I just reading that the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to access whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

I just read the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to assess whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

AllanLane

[QUOTE="AllanLane"]

I just read the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to assess whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

LJS9502_basic

Yet only the NSA got caught doing this at the UN. If the others do it that is only alleged and needs to be proven otherwise you are just guessing and lets face it. You are no Hans Blix.

I just read the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to access whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

AllanLane

[QUOTE="AllanLane"]

I just read the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to access whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

Person0

Yes and I noted that in my original post back much earlier in the thread on this that went into greater detail. What is the same is wanting to rush to war when the UN is asking for more time to investigate.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="AllanLane"]

I just read the Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon said U.N. inspectors need more time to assess whether Syrian leader Bashar Assad used poison gas. This situation is giving me deja vu back to Hans Blix asking for more time before Iraq. Those dudes at the UN should watch what they say though because NSA has them bugged. Hans was right about that suspicion too it was discovered recently.

AllanLane

Yet only the NSA got caught doing this at the UN. If the others do it that is only alleged and needs to be proven otherwise you are just guessing and lets face it. You are no Hans Blix.

[QUOTE="AllanLane"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"] Newsflash.....countries bug each other. True story.....LJS9502_basic

Yet only the NSA got caught doing this at the UN. If the others do it that is only alleged and needs to be proven otherwise you are just guessing and lets face it. You are no Hans Blix.

You are probably right and if you were Hans Blix I would believe you but you are no Hans Blix and never will be! America should think twice before messing with Hans Blix and the UN again.

[QUOTE="AllanLane"]

Yes and I noted that in my original post back much earlier in the thread on this that went into greater detail. What is the same is wanting to rush to war when the UN is asking for more time to investigate.

Person0

Last Wednesday, in the hours after a horrific chemical attack east of Damascus, an official at the Syrian Ministry of Defense exchanged panicked phone calls with a leader of a chemical weapons unit, demanding answers for a nerve agent strike that killed more than 1,000 people. Those conversations were overheard by U.S. intelligence services, The Cable has learned. And that is the major reason why American officials now say they're certain that the attacks were the work of the Bashar al-Assad regime -- and why the U.S. military is likely to attack that regime in a matter of days.Foreign Policy

Well it is a pretty clear case of some type of chemical WMD being used.Government forces are the only ones with the capability to do such an attack and the U.S has intercepted gov't communications about the attack. Person0

What about last time there was a chemical attack and it was suspected it was the rebels? In case you didn't read the post I was referring to. I think weapons inspectors would know if the idea of the rebels being able to use chemical weapons was a fantasy. I'm no expert like these people are but wouldn't you just need a launcher, a rocket and chemical canister? Anyway these people should know because it's their job to know and I really don't see the Swiss (or Swedish in the case of the amazing Blix) as partisan with an agenda personally but whatever. 

Carla del Ponte, a member of the U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria, told Swiss TV there were strong, concrete suspicions but not yet incontrovertible proof, that rebels seeking to oust Syrian strongman Bashar al-Assad had used the nerve agent.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/

[QUOTE="Person0"]

[QUOTE="Person0"] Well it is a pretty clear case of some type of chemical WMD being used.Government forces are the only ones with the capability to do such an attack and the U.S has intercepted gov't communications about the attack. [quote="Foreign Policy"] Last Wednesday, in the hours after a horrific chemical attack east of Damascus, an official at the Syrian Ministry of Defense exchanged panicked phone calls with a leader of a chemical weapons unit, demanding answers for a nerve agent strike that killed more than 1,000 people. Those conversations were overheard by U.S. intelligence services, The Cable has learned. And that is the major reason why American officials now say they're certain that the attacks were the work of the Bashar al-Assad regime -- and why the U.S. military is likely to attack that regime in a matter of days.AllanLane

What about last time there was a chemical attack and it was suspected it was the rebels? In case you didn't read the post I was referring to. I think weapons inspectors would know if the idea of the rebels being able to use chemical weapons was a fantasy. I'm expert like these people are but wouldn't you just need a launcher, a rocket and chemical canister? Anyway these people should know because it's their job to know and I really don't see the Swiss (or Swedish in the case of the amazing Blix) as partisan with an agenda personally but whatever. 

Carla del Ponte, a member of the U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria, told Swiss TV there were strong, concrete suspicions but not yet incontrovertible proof, that rebels seeking to oust Syrian strongman Bashar al-Assad had used the nerve agent.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/may/6/syrian-rebels-used-sarin-nerve-gas-not-assads-regi/

cool

That could be the case. I'm not exactly in any position to know one way or the other. I just think it might be wise to give the UN the time it's asking for to investigate this time if the use of chemical weapons by the Syrian government is what the case for war is being based on.

The government has already bombed Hezbollah buildings in Lebanon and framed rebels. Clearly you can't rule them out in anything. The rebels are no better but I'm going to have to presume the government would do it because it makes more sense.

Just dunk a missile on Assad's palace or w/e hes at and be done with it.