Indy Car Driver Dan Wheldon, Deid In A Fiery Wreck At Las Vegas Speedway.

RIP, only in his early 30's. A real shame.

As far as quality, whatever. Surround the driver with an extra ton of sheetmetal and you've got better collision protection. But you can't go around a corner half as fast. That's not "quality", it's just a different type of racing.

Race In Peace, you're sharing a circuit with the legends now.

[QUOTE="one_plum"]What I like about Indycar is that the drivers usually overcome that "certain-death danger" through timing and precision: that's what makes them skilled. Granted, oval racing venues in Indycar do have horrible safety records.MissLibrarian

The deal with stock cars is that they have to be tweaked to turn one direction only. Whereas an open wheel car might turn both left and right (and there are road courses that NASCAR series do race on) and can be set up in more of a neutral set up, stock cars have to be set up to turn just one direction (it can still turn the other direction, but the idea is to get the contact patch of a tire to be flat against the track in the corner).

Stock cars also run on a 9.5 inch wide tire while open wheel cars run on tires up to 15 inches wide, a bigger contact patch for a 2000 pound lighter car verses a 3500 pound card on a smaller patch (take the restrictor plates off at Daytona (2.5 miles) and Talladega (2.66 miles) and Cup cars will do more than 210 MPH). At some of the 1.5 mile tracks, those 3500 pound cars are hitting speeds over 200. Stock cars are engineered to specifically turn left.

One thing to remember, when Indianapolis was built (early 1900s), cars barely reached 50 MPH for street cars, specially made race cars were not much faster. As aerodynamics and bigger and better engines came into play, speeds increased. Most tracks were built before cars would reach the 200 MPH mark (including F1 cars). Indy and F1 cars also ran on narrower tires compared to what they used today.

Here is a Panoz Indy car from 2009:

Ferrari F1 Race Car from 2010:

It looks as if Indy cars also sit lower than F1 cars. I do recall that they use tire heaters in F1, while Indy car or NASCAR racing series do not.

I will say that at least with the current Indy Car series, the racing is closer than what it used to be and they are having finishes similar to what one would find in NASCAR racing where thousands of a second can mean a win or a loss. I don't ever recall that in F1 racing where I know that team mates of a racer would and have been told to let a star pass him to win the race instead of a lesser known or famous racer. I wont touch the parade aspect of F1.

Now, lets see F1 cars like this:

What was the point of locking the thread that actually had posts? -.-

What was the point of locking the thread that actually had posts? -.-

DigitalExile

The mods typically lock multiple threads on the same subject.

Some people should do some research on American Open Wheel Racing....

[QUOTE="DigitalExile"]

What was the point of locking the thread that actually had posts? -.-

worlock77

The mods typically lock multiple threads on the same subject.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"]RIP [QUOTE="jediknight52501"]http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/10/16/sports/main20121120.shtml]link 2 time Indy 500 winner Dan Wheldon died today in what was the worst crash i have ever seen in Racing since 2000. i watched him win the Indy 500 on TV. with the speeds the cars get, this proves NASCAR has the best cars in racing since they have a lot more safety in the cars then in Indy Car.jediknight52501

Open cockpit is inhernetly more dangerous.

Yet I think the "engineering" is a little more sophisticated for F1 and Indy cars than it is for Nascar. You see some massive wrecks in both leagues, and it's rare someone dies these days. There were 3 or 4 cars that were catostrohpically damaged, yet those guys walked away. With Wheldon I think it was because the way his car spun up into the FENCE, rather than bouncing off the wall. With the open cockpit his head probably got tangled up in the fencing as all the debris was flying around up there.

[QUOTE="jediknight52501"][QUOTE="BranKetra"] Are you serious? There's more to car quality than safety, comrade.2Chalupas

Open cockpit is inhernetly more dangerous.

Yet I think the "engineering" is a little more sophisticated for F1 and Indy cars than it is for Nascar. You see some massive wrecks in both leagues, and it's rare someone dies these days. There were 3 or 4 cars that were catostrohpically damaged, yet those guys walked away. With Wheldon I think it was because the way his car spun up into the FENCE, rather than bouncing off the wall. With the open cockpit his head probably got tangled up in the fencing as all the debris was flying around up there.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="DigitalExile"]

What was the point of locking the thread that actually had posts? -.-

DigitalExile

The mods typically lock multiple threads on the same subject.

And? This is still pretty standard proceedure for the moderators.

I think people should just do research on American Open Wheel Racing in general. At one point it started to become a threat to Formula One.

I think people should just do research on American Open Wheel Racing in general. At one point it started to become a threat to Formula One.

PandaTrueno86

In what way did it start to become a threat to F1? Not many really paid attention outside the US, and Formula 1's never been real huge inside the US to begin with.

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

Since the other thread got locked I'll just repost what I said there.

I feel really bad for his friends and family, but who the hell didn't see that coming? Those cars should not be racing that damn fast. It's common sense that people are going to get killed doing that.

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

theone86

All things considered it's actually pretty safe. Far safer than the average person driving to work every day in fact. Watching a Nascar race and seeing a 15 car pile-up at 185 miles-per-hour where the worst injury sustained is a bit tongue shows you have relatively safe they are. Try a 15 car pile up on the highway at 50 miles-per-hour and count the number of bodies you're hauling away in bags.

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

I think people should just do research on American Open Wheel Racing in general. At one point it started to become a threat to Formula One.

worlock77

In what way did it start to become a threat to F1? Not many really paid attention outside the US, and Formula 1's never been real huge inside the US to begin with.

Nigel Mansell, A defending F1 World Champion came to CART in the 1993 season after winning the title the year before. Ayrton Senna tested out a Penske car, It started to branch out internationally creating some curiousity/interest. Bernie Ecclestone knew how the sport was growing and did things to make sure that American Open Wheel Racing wouldn't go to F1 tracks and appeal to teams and drivers.

Then...The Split happened.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

worlock77

All things considered it's actually pretty safe. Far safer than the average person driving to work every day in fact. Watching a Nascar race and seeing a 15 car pile-up at 185 miles-per-hour where the worst injury sustained is a bit tongue shows you have relatively safe they are. Try a 15 car pile up on the highway at 50 miles-per-hour and count the number of bodies you're hauling away in bags.

Yes, but driving to work has a purpose.

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

theone86

"Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racings important to men who do it well. When you're racing it's life. Anything else that happensbefore or after is just waiting." -Steve McQueen

The people who race get a high unlike any other.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

theone86

All things considered it's actually pretty safe. Far safer than the average person driving to work every day in fact. Watching a Nascar race and seeing a 15 car pile-up at 185 miles-per-hour where the worst injury sustained is a bit tongue shows you have relatively safe they are. Try a 15 car pile up on the highway at 50 miles-per-hour and count the number of bodies you're hauling away in bags.

Yes, but driving to work has a purpose.

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

PandaTrueno86

"Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racings important to men who do it well. When you're racing it's life. Anything else that happensbefore or after is just waiting." -Steve McQueen

The people who race get a high unlike any other.

So do crack addicts.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

All things considered it's actually pretty safe. Far safer than the average person driving to work every day in fact. Watching a Nascar race and seeing a 15 car pile-up at 185 miles-per-hour where the worst injury sustained is a bit tongue shows you have relatively safe they are. Try a 15 car pile up on the highway at 50 miles-per-hour and count the number of bodies you're hauling away in bags.

worlock77

Yes, but driving to work has a purpose.

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

You know, I don't think I'll ever get risking your life for a stupid race, just like I'll never get people who talk about that dude on the deep sea fishing show who died as if he was some kind of hero. Oh, you died so someone in a restaurant could eat a lobster, how noble. It reminds me of that Tool song, "I like to watch things die, from a good, safe distance."

theone86

"Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racings important to men who do it well. When you're racing it's life. Anything else that happensbefore or after is just waiting." -Steve McQueen

The people who race get a high unlike any other.

So do crack addicts.

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

Yes, but driving to work has a purpose.

theone86

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

It's a job. It's how they make their living. They don't do it for free.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

"Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racings important to men who do it well. When you're racing it's life. Anything else that happensbefore or after is just waiting." -Steve McQueen

The people who race get a high unlike any other.

PandaTrueno86

So do crack addicts.

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described.

How is one feeling that can't be described different from another that can't be described? And honestly, it's the same effect, increased release of endorphins. You can also get the same rush from a lot of extreme activities, skydiving for instance.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

worlock77

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

It's a job. It's how they make their living. They don't do it for free.

Yes, and they can only make a living from it because people will pay to watch it, and people will pay to watch it because...I don't know.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

Yes, but driving to work has a purpose.

theone86

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

And driving in an auto race has a purpose.

BranKetra

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

The number of cars on the raod grows each year, why would the auto industry need help?

[QUOTE="BranKetra"][QUOTE="theone86"]

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

theone86

The number of cars on the raod grows each year, why would the auto industry need help?

safety features on the race cars go to the road cars.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"][QUOTE="theone86"]

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

theone86

The number of cars on the raod grows each year, why would the auto industry need help?

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

"Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racings important to men who do it well. When you're racing it's life. Anything else that happensbefore or after is just waiting." -Steve McQueen

The people who race get a high unlike any other.

PandaTrueno86

So do crack addicts.

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

So do crack addicts.

theone86

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?

[QUOTE="BranKetra"][QUOTE="theone86"]

Yes, driving around in circles has a purpose.

theone86

The number of cars on the raod grows each year, why would the auto industry need help?

A lot of the things we take for granted on our cars are first developed in auto racing. "Run flat" tires, for one example off the top of my head.

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

BranKetra

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?

Yeah, found it pretty meh, most memorable part was Wsley Snipes losing his mind, don't remember most of it. Anyways, don't see the relevance, if you're defending racing purely on the endorphin rish the racers get I really don't think it's much of an argument.

[QUOTE="BranKetra"][QUOTE="theone86"]

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?

theone86

Yeah, found it pretty meh, most memorable part was Wsley Snipes losing his mind, don't remember most of it. Anyways, don't see the relevance, if you're defending racing purely on the endorphin rish the racers get I really don't think it's much of an argument.

First, racing cars takes talent and technique which are improved through real situations (racing). It also feels good. Crack drugs a person at the cost of their mind and body. My next point is that while it is very risky, a person who puts himself or gets put by chance into physical danger can increase their physical and mental abilities. It pushing the threshold of how much stress they can handle. When you smoke crack, it's like taking a hammer to a glass mirror.

My two points are similar two each other because you mentioned a specific point about the two: endorphins and the prospect of death. So, I decided to focus on those.

Go to your local track & smoke a crack pipe. I'm sure there's a difference.

Go to your local track & smoke a crack pipe. I'm sure there's a difference.

PandaTrueno86

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

Go to your local track & smoke a crack pipe. I'm sure there's a difference.

BranKetra

No I'm serious. Experiment.

Man that was such a awful thing that happened. I just got back from Las Vegas to see this. I felt so bad seeing his car being on fire for so long. The entire stadium went from cheering because of the start to sad from the crash. After the race it felt exactly like a funeral. My dad took me and this was going to be my first big race I saw other than the Long Beach Grand Prix

This is also wierd because only 13 people crashed, on the 13th lap. The news said that the last driver that died during a race back in 2006 they continued the race, Dan Wheldon won that race.

I thought everything was going great until I saw half of the racers crash. RIP Dan Wheldon

I'm sorry that a person died, but why does it always seem to come as a shock when someon who drives race cars, dies in a race car?

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

So do crack addicts.

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?

[QUOTE="PandaTrueno86"]

[QUOTE="theone86"]

So do crack addicts.

theone86

drugs and motorsport are two different things. If you don't care for it then that's fine. But for the people who love to compete behind the wheel, it's a feeling that can't be described. Motorsport is amazing, it's the most diverse sport out there. Oval tracks are just a taste of thegreat history it has.

Both of them increase the production of endorphins, both of them carry the prospect of death, what is the difference?