is alcoholism a disease? also, what do you think of the twelve steps?

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.BlueTimber

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.chelenitos

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Keyword, ADDICTION. You said it yourself.

addiction is a disease alcohol is an addiction

(inductivism)

alcohol is a disease

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.chelenitos

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Keyword, ADDICTION. You said it yourself.

addiction is a disease alcohol is an addiction

(inductivism)

alcohol is a disease

Addiction is not a disease.

The Journal of the American Medical Association defines alcoholism as "a primary, chronic disease characterized by impaired control over drinking, preoccupation with the drug alcohol, use of alcohol despite adverse consequences, and distortions in thinking." [1]

The DSM-IV (the standard for diagnosis in psychiatry and psychology) defines alcohol abuse as repeated use despite recurrent adverse consequences.[2] ; further defining alcohol dependence as alcohol abuse combined with tolerance, withdrawal, and an uncontrollable drive to drink.[2] (See DSM diagnosis below.)

According to the APA Dictionary of Psychology, alcoholism is the popular term for alcohol dependence.[2] Note that there is debate whether dependence in this use is physical (characterised by withdrawal), psychological (based on reinforcement), or both.

(wikipedia)

Google addiction. It isn't a disease.BlueTimber

The Journal of the American Medical Association defines alcoholism as "a primary, chronic disease characterized by impaired control over drinking, preoccupation with the drug alcohol, use of alcohol despite adverse consequences, and distortions in thinking."

The DSM-IV (the standard for diagnosis in psychiatry and psychology) defines alcohol abuse as repeated use despite recurrent adverse consequences. ; further defining alcohol dependence as alcohol abuse combined with tolerance, withdrawal, and an uncontrollable drive to drink. (See DSM diagnosis below.)

According to the APA Dictionary of Psychology, alcoholism is the popular term for alcohol dependence Note that there is debate whether dependence in this use is physical (characterised by withdrawal), psychological (based on reinforcement), or both.

(wikipedia)

chelenitos

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.Mumbles527

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.BlueTimber

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.Mumbles527

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.

Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.

An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

american heritage dictionary

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.mig_killer2

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.

Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.

An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

american heritage dictionary

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.Mumbles527

Sure, wiki it. The wiki will give the opinions of those who fill it is an addiction, and the opinion of those who think it isn't. Google it. The American Medical whatever consist of a very, very, very, very ,very ,very, very, very, very small fraction of doctors. I say it isn't, you say it is.

Just like everything else in America, no one wants to take responsibility. Alcholism, being fat, being lazy, restless leg syndrome, etc, etc, etc.

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.Mumbles527

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.

Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.

An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

american heritage dictionary

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]Through will power you can keep yourself from going to the store, buying alcohol, taking it home, opening the bottle, poor it in a glass, and putting it to your lips and drinking it. You don't fight off cancer through will power.Mumbles527

this whole idea of alcoholism, or any addiction for that matter, being a disease is just a way to say that you are not accountable for your own actions

Dude, how difficult it will be to fight addiction isn't the topic. Its where or not alcoholism is a DISEASE, and I think we've established that it isn't. It's an addiction. And like EVERY addiction, its very hard to stop it.

Addiction....addiction, is not a disease, so no, a addiction cannot be a disease. Look..it..up.

Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.

An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.

An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

american heritage dictionary

If disease is not in the definition....then it isn't a disease. That's like saying, being lazy isn't a disease, because disease isn't in the definition of it. Look up any REAL disease, and in the DEFINITION, there will be the word DISEASE.

it doesn't say that it is a diseasemig_killer2

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseMumbles527

Hmmm, the fourth word when I wiki'd Cancer was...get this, disease.

And HIV/AIDS is technically a Virus I think, but its also an STD so whatever. I guess thats just a matter of semantics. Is that the right word? Semantics?

Hmmm. Either way, saying alcoholism is an excuse for weak willed people. No one said it is easy to get away from it, but a DISEASE!? No, no, an addiction, like eating, drugs, exercising, gaming, sex, gambling, etc etc.

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseasemig_killer2

[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseMumbles527

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseBlueTimber

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseMumbles527

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

....you just tried to say alcoholism meets the definition you stated. Kinda like, it meets this requirement to be officially declared a disease eh?

I'm not making stuff up. Just like animals have to meet certain requirements to be classified into the correct order and phylum and class, so do illnesses and general problems.

If being addicted to alcohol is a disease, so is smoking.

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseBlueTimber

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

....you just tried to say alcoholism meets the definition you stated. Kinda like, it meets this requirement to be officially declared a disease eh?

I'm not making stuff up. Just like animals have to meet certain requirements to be classified into the correct order and phylum and class, so do illnesses.

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseMumbles527

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

....you just tried to say alcoholism meets the definition you stated. Kinda like, it meets this requirement to be officially declared a disease eh?

I'm not making stuff up. Just like animals have to meet certain requirements to be classified into the correct order and phylum and class, so do illnesses.

Wiki it. I can't copy and paste for some reason. Some problem with FF. Read the first paragraph of Disease.

We are not debating semantics. If it makes you happy, you win alcoholism isn't a disease. I live in argentina and i help people in villas (most addicts). Try explaining them that "they dont have a disease, they thought lets f*** our lives." You know what, you can't. Not because they will not accept it, because they literally can't understand you, their brain cells are damaged because of alcohol, and the hormones in their body changed so much that they now need the alcohol to live, if a long time alcoholic suddenly stops getting alcohol he dies and that is a fact I've seen it happen chelenitos

Congratulations to them, they are addicts who have developed a depency on alcohol. A disease? No. Diseases are subjective. Its science. Just because some guy ****ed his brain up with alcohol isn't what we are talking about. We're talking about whether he drank because he was addicted, or because some disease took control of his body, and forced him to purchase, and consume alcohol.

It's an activity. Drinking alcohol is an activity. You consciously choose to have a drink. Just because you don't FEEL like putting down the bottle does alcoholism classify as an addiction.

We are not debating semantics. If it makes you happy, you win alcoholism isn't a disease. I live in argentina and i help people in villas (most addicts). Try explaining them that "they dont have a disease, they thought lets f*** our lives." You know what, you can't. Not because they will not accept it, because they literally can't understand you, their brain cells are damaged because of alcohol, and the hormones in their body changed so much that they now need the alcohol to live, if a long time alcoholic suddenly stops getting alcohol he dies and that is a fact I've seen it happen

edit: The point is call it whatever you like but don't say they hide behind the "disease" because they are weak

chelenitos

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseBlueTimber

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

....you just tried to say alcoholism meets the definition you stated. Kinda like, it meets this requirement to be officially declared a disease eh?

I'm not making stuff up. Just like animals have to meet certain requirements to be classified into the correct order and phylum and class, so do illnesses.

Wiki it. I can't copy and paste for some reason. Some problem with FF. Read the first paragraph of Disease.

[QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="BlueTimber"]

[QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Mumbles527"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"]it doesn't say that it is a diseaseMumbles527

So is being clumsy. But that isn't a disease. To be a disease something has to meet multiple requirements, and being addicted to alcohol doesn't meet all of them.

....you just tried to say alcoholism meets the definition you stated. Kinda like, it meets this requirement to be officially declared a disease eh?

I'm not making stuff up. Just like animals have to meet certain requirements to be classified into the correct order and phylum and class, so do illnesses.

Wiki it. I can't copy and paste for some reason. Some problem with FF. Read the first paragraph of Disease.

Did you READ what I said? The AMA is a very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very, very small fraction of doctors who say its a disease. And for every doctor there who says it isn't, there is at least one who says it isn't.

You say it is, I say it isn't. I say its a conscious decision. An activity, that you have control of. You don't have control of your body's cells and can turn cancer on and off. You don't control your body to say "Hey, T cells, can't you see that is HIV, quit going near it".

But you CAN, you CAN, through ENOUGH WILL POWER, choose to say "I don't need this drink". And if you keep that up, bam you're cured of this supposed disease.