Is the USA time of greatness coming to a end

When you look at the USA today.

The many signs of downfall is looking right at the USA.

The finical system is on the brink of collapse, the housing market is crap.

The education system is heading down hill. When cuts need to happen that seems to be one of the first to be cut.

We are inwars all across the world.

The poor are getting poorer.

There still is so much violence

We have a government that can barely keep us from defaulting, let alone run the country.

We waste money left and right.

The country has a whole as gotten more lazy.

that would all depend on the government and if they decide to continue to go down this welfare state path, it would be easy to go back to a free to prosper free to fail society, in that case we would continue to be number one.

main reason why america did so well is everyone els was bombed into dust. the world is changing fast now america wont be number 1 forever.

main reason why america did so well is everyone els was bombed into dust. the world is changing fast now america wont be number 1 forever.

dontshackzmii

so what you are saying is that america will fall from its number 1 status when it in turn gets bombed into dust. i think extra terrestrials will inevitably be responsible for this and i for one welcome our alien overlords.

A lot of the points you are making are somewhat unsubstantiated. People are getting lazier? If anything, people work longer hours in this country than they used to do.

The hell are you talking about.. Americans work longer and are paid less (spending power wise) than way back.. Where are you getting these claims that people are lazy WHAT so ever? Do you realize Americans have less vacation days, and less health carecoverage than the majority of the West, yet you suggest Americans need to work more?

that would all depend on the government and if they decide to continue to go down this welfare state path, it would be easy to go back to a free to prosper free to fail society, in that case we would continue to be number one.

surrealnumber5

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

I'm sure the US will still be around, just not as influential as it was. Still, given its geography, population, and size of economy, I'm sure it will always be a significant player.

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

main reason why america did so well is everyone els was bombed into dust. the world is changing fast now america wont be number 1 forever.

ItalStallion777

so what you are saying is that america will fall from its number 1 status when it in turn gets bombed into dust. i think extra terrestrials will inevitably be responsible for this and i for one welcome our alien overlords.

aliens are not real and how the hell did you get that from what i said? I did not say american will be beaten in some war.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

that would all depend on the government and if they decide to continue to go down this welfare state path, it would be easy to go back to a free to prosper free to fail society, in that case we would continue to be number one.

sSubZerOo

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

[QUOTE="dontshackzmii"]

main reason why america did so well is everyone els was bombed into dust. the world is changing fast now america wont be number 1 forever.

ItalStallion777

so what you are saying is that america will fall from its number 1 status when it in turn gets bombed into dust. i think extra terrestrials will inevitably be responsible for this and i for one welcome our alien overlords.

Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.MushroomWig

That is about what i'm trying to say.

On the lazy thing, we have people living on wellfare, and people who don't need it using federal system.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

that would all depend on the government and if they decide to continue to go down this welfare state path, it would be easy to go back to a free to prosper free to fail society, in that case we would continue to be number one.

surrealnumber5

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.MushroomWig

[QUOTE="MushroomWig"]Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.James161324

That is about what i'm trying to say.

On the lazy thing, we have people living on wellfare, and people who don't need it using federal system.

[QUOTE="MushroomWig"]Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.James161324

That is about what i'm trying to say.

On the lazy thing, we have people living on wellfare, and people who don't need it using federal system.

:| I see so every one one wellfare are in fact lazy? What about corperate wellfare? Are you aware the US gives billions in subsidies to the Oil industry every year? Companies like GE last tax cycle with a record profits and paid 0%.. Thats right 0% in taxes.. The US got where it came to be through these systems that help promote the creation of the Middle class.. Right now we are seeing Middle class and poor losing their net worth and becoming even poorer.. Yet the US worker is one of the most overworked worker, with the least amount of vacation days in the entire west.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

sSubZerOo

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

Why don't you go be a Negative-Nancy somewhere else? I think the people of this country that are informed are well aware of these problems and how they are progressively getting worse.22Toothpicks

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] so you like where the government is going, because it is doing so for your ideology, it is also the only thing bad about this entire nation. the people are productive and hard working, sadly their wages are stale because the government keeps increasing employment cost and increasing the barriers to entry so people are stuck without the ability to prosper. this nation is now everything you espouse and it is a toilet where there are few industries that do not have government granted monopolies/oligopolies. i'd rather live in a world where i can make my own than in a world where i dont have a choice to call my own.

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] so you like where the government is going, because it is doing so for your ideology, it is also the only thing bad about this entire nation. the people are productive and hard working, sadly their wages are stale because the government keeps increasing employment cost and increasing the barriers to entry so people are stuck without the ability to prosper. this nation is now everything you espouse and it is a toilet where there are few industries that do not have government granted monopolies/oligopolies. i'd rather live in a world where i can make my own than in a world where i dont have a choice to call my own.

surrealnumber5

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

:lol: Ah yes I Am a communist when I have consistently said that the government and free market need to be balanced.. Your the extremist here not me.. You want government to play as minimal role as possible.. I want government to stay in a healthy balance with free market.. The majority of our social issues and success as a nation have come from this.. That both have glaring problems when it comes to economics that a fine balance can create the most profitability.. And really? Rockfeller oil, Carnagie steel.. And numerous others.. And the majority of those government monopolies have been created through lobbying by the said corporations.. In the end I can't take you seriously.. Are you seriously recommending we go back to the early 1900s where people were black listed, unions were banned.. Worker conditions sucked? I mean really? These things did not change until the Progressive movement under men like Teddy Roosevelt.. Are you trying to tell me that things like the CLean Water Act after the Chattanooga river caught fire from all the polution dumped into there was completely unnecessary? Are you willing to trust the water you drink and the food you eat based on a companywhere profitibility comes first?The middle class did not come from this period.. Our country became the super power during the 1950s to 1970s.. You seem not to get it.. The US wasn't a super power by 1900 it was a weak nation.. Going by your logic thanks to FDR, Great Society legislation, and numerous other things.. The US should have never became a super power.. BUTTT.. It did.. Imagine that.

This isn't the worst times our great country has been through. We will push on...

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

BrianB0422

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

[QUOTE="MushroomWig"]Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.BrianB0422

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

that would all depend on the government and if they decide to continue to go down this welfare state path, it would be easy to go back to a free to prosper free to fail society, in that case we would continue to be number one.

surrealnumber5

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

[QUOTE="BrianB0422"][QUOTE="MushroomWig"]Just like the soviet union, America will no longer be able to afford to the upkeep of it's military, within 20 years the country will no longer be a superpower.bluetadomonk

I am sorry but that is historically WRONG.. The United States became what it is today due to a healthy middle class as the back bone.. If you seriously think that its stable or a good idea to have crushing poverty with a very few holding the majority of the money.. Perhapes I should point you to a few countries with this said layout of wealth...

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

-Sun_Tzu-

Careful Sun or he will start claiming that your spewing communist propaganda.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

I never said itwas perfect there is much improvement.. But what you want to do is strike down a 100 years of policies and regulations to what has made our country great.... And would rather have a free world? Perhapes you should read a LITTLE HISTORY of the early 1900s and late 1800s.. To see how your "free world" was like for the average person in the US.. Your only trading one form of "tyranny" for another.. Your free world consists of a highly military private sector that beats down its workers.. Where monopoly and cartels destroy teh competition or buy them out..

sSubZerOo

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

:lol: Ah yes I Am a communist when I have consistently said that the government and free market need to be balanced.. Your the extremist here not me.. You want government to play as minimal role as possible.. I want government to stay in a healthy balance with free market.. The majority of our social issues and success as a nation have come from this.. That both have glaring problems when it comes to economics that a fine balance can create the most profitability.. And really? Rockfeller oil, Carnagie steel.. And numerous others.. And the majority of those government monopolies have been created through lobbying by the said corporations.. In the end I can't take you seriously.. Are you seriously recommending we go back to the early 1900s where people were black listed, unions were banned.. Worker conditions sucked? I mean really? These things did not change until the Progressive movement under men like Teddy Roosevelt.. Are you trying to tell me that things like the CLean Water Act after the Chattanooga river caught fire from all the polution dumped into there was completely unnecessary? Are you willing to trust the water you drink and the food you eat based on a companywhere profitibility comes first?The middle ****did not come from this period.. Our country became the super power during the 1950s to 1970s.. You seem not to get it.. The US wasn't a super power by 1900 it was a weak nation.. Going by your logic thanks to FDR, Great Society legislation, and numerous other things.. The US should have never became a super power.. BUTTT.. It did.. Imagine that.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

One of the main things that made US great were the programs you want gone.. You don't like unions, or government regulation in the US.. Well guess what they were brought upon by the Progressive movement and FDR's presidency.. You don't like welfare, and numerous other safety net programs? Those were brought upon by the Great Soceity.. During those times the US became the most powerful and successful country out there.. Not before them.. They are a part to what makes this country great... You can have your 1800's US :| because most here wouldn't want it.

-Sun_Tzu-

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] wait the same early 1900 and late 1800 that saw the greatest increase in living standards for all people including the "poor" in history? why yes that increase was due to free enterprise and not because of the state regulating what widgets from what firm can be used. maybe i need to read up more on your communist propaganda, wait no i am well versed on that too, yea i am solid on the history front.

name me one lasting monopoly that was notgranted by the government.

surrealnumber5

:lol: Ah yes I Am a communist when I have consistently said that the government and free market need to be balanced.. Your the extremist here not me.. You want government to play as minimal role as possible.. I want government to stay in a healthy balance with free market.. The majority of our social issues and success as a nation have come from this.. That both have glaring problems when it comes to economics that a fine balance can create the most profitability.. And really? Rockfeller oil, Carnagie steel.. And numerous others.. And the majority of those government monopolies have been created through lobbying by the said corporations.. In the end I can't take you seriously.. Are you seriously recommending we go back to the early 1900s where people were black listed, unions were banned.. Worker conditions sucked? I mean really? These things did not change until the Progressive movement under men like Teddy Roosevelt.. Are you trying to tell me that things like the CLean Water Act after the Chattanooga river caught fire from all the polution dumped into there was completely unnecessary? Are you willing to trust the water you drink and the food you eat based on a companywhere profitibility comes first?The middle ****did not come from this period.. Our country became the super power during the 1950s to 1970s.. You seem not to get it.. The US wasn't a super power by 1900 it was a weak nation.. Going by your logic thanks to FDR, Great Society legislation, and numerous other things.. The US should have never became a super power.. BUTTT.. It did.. Imagine that.

Wow really? rolling back regulation not eliminating legislation? Your a walking contradiction.. THATS exactly what you meant.. ESPECIALLy when you defended the early 1900s.. The government had little to NO regulation.. SO YES you are extremist if you are seriously defending that as the standard.. No where have I stated that the governmetn should take over everything.. And yet your calling me a communist.. Your talking points are not helping you in avoiding looking like the extremist in the debate when you have shownt ime and time again that you want to eliminate the foundations of the country.. Whether its in Great society regulation.. The numerous acts FDR emplaced.. HELL yousaid it your self you wish FDR never became president in another thread.. So please explain to every one here how this doesn't make you a extremist? That you want to go back tolate 1800 to early 1900s where the government had little to no real regulations what so ever on economics..In teh 1880s they past the anti trust.. That was the closest thing toa regulation they ever did.. It was only til the progressive movement did they started doing things.. So yes you wantthe freemarket with 1900s regulation back in place.. That means no worker rights, no real social systems,possibly no monopoly laws.. No health or safety laws.. No environmental laws.. Yeah. Uh huh.

While you guys go on I just wanna say being an extremist isn't necessarily a bad thing. You can also be extremely good.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

:lol: Ah yes I Am a communist when I have consistently said that the government and free market need to be balanced.. Your the extremist here not me.. You want government to play as minimal role as possible.. I want government to stay in a healthy balance with free market.. The majority of our social issues and success as a nation have come from this.. That both have glaring problems when it comes to economics that a fine balance can create the most profitability.. And really? Rockfeller oil, Carnagie steel.. And numerous others.. And the majority of those government monopolies have been created through lobbying by the said corporations.. In the end I can't take you seriously.. Are you seriously recommending we go back to the early 1900s where people were black listed, unions were banned.. Worker conditions sucked? I mean really? These things did not change until the Progressive movement under men like Teddy Roosevelt.. Are you trying to tell me that things like the CLean Water Act after the Chattanooga river caught fire from all the polution dumped into there was completely unnecessary? Are you willing to trust the water you drink and the food you eat based on a companywhere profitibility comes first?The middle ****did not come from this period.. Our country became the super power during the 1950s to 1970s.. You seem not to get it.. The US wasn't a super power by 1900 it was a weak nation.. Going by your logic thanks to FDR, Great Society legislation, and numerous other things.. The US should have never became a super power.. BUTTT.. It did.. Imagine that.

sSubZerOo

Wow really? rolling back regulation not eliminating legislation? Your a walking contradiction.. THATS exactly what you meant.. ESPECIALLy when you defended the early 1900s.. The government had little to NO regulation.. SO YES you are extremist if you are seriously defending that as the standard.. No where have I stated that the governmetn should take over everything.. And yet your calling me a communist.. Your talking points are not helping you in avoiding looking like the extremist in the debate when you have shownt ime and time again that you want to eliminate the foundations of the country.. Whether its in Great society regulation.. The numerous acts FDR emplaced.. HELL yousaid it your self you wish FDR never became president in another thread.. So please explain to every one here how this doesn't make you a extremist? That you want to go back tolate 1800 to early 1900s where the government had little to no real regulations what so ever on economics..In teh 1880s they past the anti trust.. That was the closest thing toa regulation they ever did.. It was only til the progressive movement did they started doing things.. So yes you wantthe freemarket with 1900s regulation back in place.. That means no worker rights, no real social systems,possibly no monopoly laws.. No health or safety laws.. No environmental laws.. Yeah. Uh huh.

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] so you like where the government is going, because it is doing so for your ideology, it is also the only thing bad about this entire nation. the people are productive and hard working, sadly their wages are stale because the government keeps increasing employment cost and increasing the barriers to entry so people are stuck without the ability to prosper. this nation is now everything you espouse and it is a toilet where there are few industries that do not have government granted monopolies/oligopolies. i'd rather live in a world where i can make my own than in a world where i dont have a choice to call my own.

surrealnumber5

the great social security, the great unfunded social security that pays off less than what is paid in, that sure does sound better than what people would do with that money. sure sounds good, as good as those numerous acts fdr employed that were found to be unconstitutional. great acts that let the federal government burn down farmers crops and kill their live stock so that the government could attempt to control market prices of food, how dare i go against the great polices of FDR, so extreme..... this country was not founded on federal market distortion and political mandates, it was however founded to fight against such things. in the practical case i do agree with a stepped approach much like milton friedman. FDR was a bad president that cause a great deal of harm to this nation, and the prewar press was not shy about this, hell he even played political games with the aid funds giving little to none to the impoverished south that needed it most, but he sent most aid to the north where he polled the weakest.

surrealnumber5

I rest my case... If your logic actually made sense.. The US would never have been a super power.. 1900s would be filthy rich and powerful.. And the 1940s to 1980s we would see the dive into poverty.. Unfortuantely in such debates we have to look at REALITY.. During this time the US became the world super power..

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

the great social security, the great unfunded social security that pays off less than what is paid in, that sure does sound better than what people would do with that money. sure sounds good, as good as those numerous acts fdr employed that were found to be unconstitutional. great acts that let the federal government burn down farmers crops and kill their live stock so that the government could attempt to control market prices of food, how dare i go against the great polices of FDR, so extreme..... this country was not founded on federal market distortion and political mandates, it was however founded to fight against such things. in the practical case i do agree with a stepped approach much like milton friedman. FDR was a bad president that cause a great deal of harm to this nation, and the prewar press was not shy about this, hell he even played political games with the aid funds giving little to none to the impoverished south that needed it most, but he sent most aid to the north where he polled the weakest.

sSubZerOo

I rest my case... If your logic actually made sense.. The US would never have been a super power.. 1900s would be filthy rich and powerful.. And the 1940s to 1980s we would see the dive into poverty.. Unfortuantely in such debates we have to look at REALITY.. During this time the US became the world super power..

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"] The current state of this country is not anything any liberal espouses. There was a time in American history where we had a strong middle ****with little income inequality, and a lot of economic growth, which was after the advent of the modern welfare state and WWII. Everything changed after Reagan though. He started the process of stripping down the welfare state and deregulating the financial markets. And since Reagan, income inequality has shot through the roof, and for the past decade wages have been stagnant. And there has yet to be a change from the Reagan years - if anything we've been going farther and farther to the right as the years go on. You can't blame liberal policies for the country's current state - when liberal policies were at their height in popularity this country was arguably at its highest point in its history. -Sun_Tzu-

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

the great social security, the great unfunded social security that pays off less than what is paid in, that sure does sound better than what people would do with that money. sure sounds good, as good as those numerous acts fdr employed that were found to be unconstitutional. great acts that let the federal government burn down farmers crops and kill their live stock so that the government could attempt to control market prices of food, how dare i go against the great polices of FDR, so extreme..... this country was not founded on federal market distortion and political mandates, it was however founded to fight against such things. in the practical case i do agree with a stepped approach much like milton friedman. FDR was a bad president that cause a great deal of harm to this nation, and the prewar press was not shy about this, hell he even played political games with the aid funds giving little to none to the impoverished south that needed it most, but he sent most aid to the north where he polled the weakest.

surrealnumber5

I rest my case... If your logic actually made sense.. The US would never have been a super power.. 1900s would be filthy rich and powerful.. And the 1940s to 1980s we would see the dive into poverty.. Unfortuantely in such debates we have to look at REALITY.. During this time the US became the world super power..

Your logic woudl dictate with the smallest amount of regulation in 1900 we saw the most growth.. That is in fact incorrect overall with the development of the country.. And if regulations your suggesting are is dibilitating as you claim.. Why has the United States become the most powerful country in the world? It had nothing to do with 1900.. The system collapsed during the Great Depression.. And with your logic one would think that the United States woudl never become the super power economically with all these dibilitating regulations.. Yet it has.. In fact teh country was BUILT upon these regulations after the Great Depression.. the foundations of the country are regulations you oppose.. That you would have us think have led to the collapse of the country.. You see it doesn't work that way.. The coutnry collapsed during the great Depression.. It was built up with those in the foundation.. Here is the difference between you and me.. I am willing to point out that tehre are goo dregulations and bad regulations but they are needed.. You on the other hand want to dismantle the majority of regulations of the past century.. And refuse to acknownledge that not a single one of them has benefited the country in becoming the super power it is today.. Whether thats FDR or Great Society.. Or the numerous ones out there.

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] look up the growth of the growth of the federal register 70's onward, you want to know what killed that time you will find it there and it has everything to do with regulations that only in effect protect existing frims, the bigger they are the more protected. those did not come about by "conservitave" views or theories.

surrealnumber5

You sure sound like one when you want the US to go back to 1900 politics.. And think my call for balance between private sector and government regulation "communist propaganda".. Remember your the one that began throwing around the radical tripe with that, not I.. Which only worsens your position when US politics are quite conservative compared to the rest of the world.. I guess they must all be communists.. Right?

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

I rest my case... If your logic actually made sense.. The US would never have been a super power.. 1900s would be filthy rich and powerful.. And the 1940s to 1980s we would see the dive into poverty.. Unfortuantely in such debates we have to look at REALITY.. During this time the US became the world super power..

sSubZerOo

Your logic woudl dictate with the smallest amount of regulation in 1900 we saw the most growth.. That is in fact incorrect overall with the development of the country.. And if regulations your suggesting are is dibilitating as you claim.. Why has the United States become the most powerful country in the world? It had nothing to do with 1900.. The system collapsed during the Great Depression.. And with your logic one would think that the United States woudl never become the super power economically with all these dibilitating regulations.. Yet it has.. In fact teh country was BUILT upon these regulations after the Great Depression.. the foundations of the country are regulations you oppose.. That you would have us think have led to the collapse of the country.. You see it doesn't work that way.. The coutnry collapsed during the great Depression.. It was built up with those in the foundation.. Here is the difference between you and me.. I am willing to point out that tehre are goo dregulations and bad regulations but they are needed.. You on the other hand want to dismantle the majority of regulations of the past century.. And refuse to acknownledge that not a single one of them has benefited the country in becoming the super power it is today.. Whether thats FDR or Great Society.. Or the numerous ones out there.

also our country did not start in the 1930's, as much as you say the nation was built there, only a dam and abureaucracy was built then.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="-Sun_Tzu-"] What is actually existing conservatism in the US? You might have different views as to what conservatism should be, but what has conservatism come to represent and embrace for the past few decades? It's a very pro-business, anti-regulation ideology - especially in regard to the financial industry. And that's the ideology that's been most prominent in Washington since Reagan, particularly when Alan Greenspan was chairman of the federal reserve. These are not liberal icons by any stretch of the imagination. You can't pin the US' problems on the left when it has been MIA for quite some time now - only the skeletans remain.

sSubZerOo

You sure sound like one when you want the US to go back to 1900 politics.. And think my call for balance between private sector and government regulation "communist propaganda".. Remember your the one that began throwing around the radical tripe with that, not I.. Which only worsens your position when US politics are quite conservative compared to the rest of the world.. I guess they must all be communists.. Right?